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Toxic workplace

phantom

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
What is the point of even going to uni and getting a degree, when you are just going to get ostracized, scapegoated or abused at almost every workplace anyway. It's not worth the money, I would rather just stay at home and try to get some kind of disability benefits.
 

Forest Cat

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
Maybe you could use your degree and knowledge to build a business, make your own workplace and become the boss? No one is going to abuse the boss.
 

Neonatal RRT

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
Obviously, you are very frustrated and angry about your situation. Perhaps elaborate on what the core issues are that seem to be consistent. Obviously, you've experienced this at different work places, so what do you think are the main issues that are creating these behaviors? Are there any "work arounds"? Are there other ways of creating some "cash flow" that might be better suited to your talents or aptitudes? Not all jobs require a lot of "people skills".

You have every right to "vent", but perhaps some better information might allow someone to give you some different and more constructive ideas and perspectives.
 

Magna

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
I don't think that's an accurate way to think about workplaces. Not all workplaces are toxic. I would assume that most are not toxic.

I have been working for for over 35 years and in that time I've worked at a lot of different jobs. True, some of the workplaces were "toxic" environments but most were not.

In that time after having that much experience in the workplaces I do have an observation that is germane to this topic: Through the years I have noticed that there are loosely, two different kinds of people in the workplace: 1) Those that have a strong need and desire to be accepted by, liked by and even become friends with all of their co-workers. 2) Those that don't care that much if at all about becoming friends with those they work with.

Those in the first group seem to have a very hard time in the workplace if they're not "part of the group".

I've always been in group #2 and maybe to an extreme, but it's helped with my work longevity. I don't exaggerate when I say that I don't give a rip about being friends with co-workers and in fact I'd not because I prefer to keep my work-life separate from my "real" life. If my coworkers were also my best friends I'd feel like I'd never really get a break from my work-life and I'd hate that.
 
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phantom

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
Obviously, you are very frustrated and angry about your situation. Perhaps elaborate on what the core issues are that seem to be consistent. Obviously, you've experienced this at different work places, so what do you think are the main issues that are creating these behaviors? Are there any "work arounds"? Are there other ways of creating some "cash flow" that might be better suited to your talents or aptitudes? Not all jobs require a lot of "people skills".

You have every right to "vent", but perhaps some better information might allow someone to give you some different and more constructive ideas and perspectives.
I have only had two short lived jobs, people weren't toxic to me, but no one interacted with me. I am going off of what i read other people with autism very commonly experience, statistics and my experience with group projects in college. These people that i had to work with in college are the same type of people i will also share a workspace with.
 

Mr. Stevens

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
I currently work in a very supportive workplace. And I've been in a few. I've definitely dealt with terrible coworkers, but I don't cause drama and do a good job. So I think that helps.

Bill collections had some really toxic behaviors, though. I'm glad I could see that, and glad I got out.
 

Knower of nothing

Well-Known Member
Workplaces seem like a bad scene even for many without autism. It gets silly once that's involved. Toxic is a strong word, but the standard for cooperation is abysmal. Many accounts of people feeling like they never left middleschool with the mentalities present.
 

Angular Chap

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
I agree with @Forest Cat, ever thought about self-employment? That's what I've been doing for many years now and it's been great, and I don't even have a degree. I don't make a massive amount of money, but I was able to put something together to have an income.
 

Outdated

I'm from the other end of the spectrum.
V.I.P Member
Being a skilled tradesman was a good life for me, most employers know exactly where their money is coming from and protect their best workers. When I tried other things I really struggled, working for retailers and in office jobs really was like being back in high school again and I didn't cope very well.
 

phantom

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
I wanted to do a graduates in control theory, it's not really something that you can be self employed at, and setting up a business wouldn't be something that i am skilled at.

I don't think that's an accurate way to think about workplaces. Not all workplaces are toxic. I would assume that most are not toxic.

I have been working for for over 35 years and in that time I've worked at a lot of different jobs. True, some of the workplaces were "toxic" environments but most were not.

In that time after having that much experience in the workplaces I do have an observation that is germane to this topic: Through the years I have noticed that there are loosely, two different kinds of people in the workplace: 1) Those that have a strong need and desire to be accepted by, liked by and even become friends with all of their co-workers. 2) Those that don't care that much if at all about becoming friends with those they work with.

Those in the first group seem to have a very hard time in the workplace if they're not "part of the group".

I've always been in group #2 and maybe to an extreme, but it's helped with my work longevity. I don't exaggerate when I say that I don't give a rip about being friends with co-workers and in fact I'd not because I prefer to keep my work-life separate from my "real" life. If my coworkers were also my best friends I'd feel like I'd never really get a break from my work-life and I'd hate that.
I would also be in group 2, but i suppose its safer to have at least a couple friends or people that like you, just to avoid being too easy of a target.
 

1ForAll

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
What is the point of even going to uni and getting a degree, when you are just going to get ostracized, scapegoated or abused at almost every workplace anyway. It's not worth the money, I would rather just stay at home and try to get some kind of disability benefits.

I sort of relate I admit, so I am not going to be a hypocrite and tell you about the positives of working as in my teen through thirty years I could not work short-long duration much less long, saw no benefit in it, and as my health deteriorated with such regardless the job for some of the reasons you mentioned. However, I felt I needed the degree to use that six years of full time reduced to part-time study time to figure out things further and to have at least some feeling of success, knowledge or self-esteem that may have helped me elsewhere in life.

So, I puttered along in college and university, picking the lesser of two evils in my mind then. I focused just on getting the best grades I could, learning about myself and others through the process, despite thinking I would never fit in anywhere at work, if I was luckily able to get some job after graduating, but feeling through past attempts I could not concentrate and function at any employment setting anyway if any social contact was attempted, having understood through time my desires, needs and limitations well, and expectations from others.

So, after I graduated university, I found out through subsequent attempts at working it was useless then for me to try further. I could not change how others viewed or treated me, as I hated myself those years and as other atypical differences showed on the surface, too, and I could not work near persons. So, I found a loophole where I could get all my student loans cancelled if I could document a total and permanent disability through a doctor, if the onset of that disability occurred after my loans were taken out.

Getting those loans cancelled was easy as I quit or was fired from all jobs, soon after they started, and as it took me six years to get a 4 year university degree, and as that doctor detailed accurately all my functional limitations and daily living difficulties in his report after I detailed things well about my failures or inabilities there in the various settings to do things in proper ways, timing, frequencies and/or pace. And then I applied for disability benefits and knew exactly what to do there, based on knowing there six step process for evaluating such cases.

Anyway, as I do not know you and your educational and work history well, I cannot push you either to continue with your education, tell you to try to quit that to get some more suitable job, nor could I recommend you quit your university to try to get disability benefits. Each case would be different, and each person has different tolerances, desires, limitations, abilities, needs and situations. Each of us will be held accountable for the choices we make. Sometimes our decisions work out, sometimes not.

In my case, I got stronger through a more isolated life alone for twenty years, through my targeted efforts, and I learned to do everything at home and in public on my own before getting married and having kids. I may be a rare case though there. And who knows though what would have happened if I had quit my schooling and/or had found some more isolated job. I may have felt less stress, remained single, felt more happiness or pride, or I could have felt weaker, less functional or less happy. Nobody knows as so many variables and chance comes into play.

For my situation, I feel the good far outweighed the bad from my decisions; for others more or less able than I those teen and early adult years, things may not always be greener though if they chose similar paths. We here can only give our experiences, opinions, and have things for you to consider when you decide on such important matters. Often there will be good and bad though in any such decision you make, so it will be up to you to sift through things to make an informed decision best for you. For those having difficulties with making informed decisions, talk it out with others that could understand better the situation with you more. We often cannot take back rash decisions. Only when I reached my breaking point did I know I had more to lose by staying the course.
 

Rodafina

Hopefully Human
V.I.P Member
What is the point of even going to uni and getting a degree, when you are just going to get ostracized, scapegoated or abused at almost every workplace anyway. It's not worth the money, I would rather just stay at home and try to get some kind of disability benefits.
Are these the only two options? Uni or disability benefits?

I for one did attend university, but I have found it difficult to use my degree in a workplace that I can manage. Instead, I have found work that is extremely pleasing to my social and sensory needs, but does not utilize any of my degrees.

University and grad school were great experiences for me, but I understand what you say about it not being worth the money. But there are many jobs that may interest you that would not require a degree where you could have autonomy and freedom from a toxic workplace.

In my job for example, I essentially work alone except for 30 minutes or so spent in the presence of coworkers each morning. Additionally, it seems that my current place of work attracts a good amount of loners and people that did not fit in elsewhere. Together, we fit quite well. It is the least toxic place I have ever worked.
 

YabbaDabba

Apprentice Person
V.I.P Member
I remember how hard it was to get a start in the world. No one wants to be the first to hire someone. It’s frustrating.

Today I’m not really worried about my job because I have experience and I’m good at my task. I’m profitable. I’m hard to be around. I’m also profitable to the company. As long as I don’t bother the boss off too much I help him look good.

These days the hardest part of keeping my job is keeping a lid on the nonsense in my head. I have had crappy jobs where my life improved because I quit. Like most of us, I’m sure you will have a crappy job too. I hope you talk about it when it happens. There are also good employers who are happy to hire someone who helps the company succeed.

I don’t know where you fit on the spectrum. I don’t know what you should do. There is no shame because of disability. It’s normal for anyone at your age to question how to start a career. I hope you don’t make a decision based on fear.
 

Neonatal RRT

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
I would never wish to minimize a situation like a "toxic" boss or co-worker situation. I know from both my son's, and my father's experiences, that there are people in positions of authority that are, let's say, sociopathic in nature, with total disregard, disrespectful, and dishonest behaviors. Co-workers, in my experience, will sometimes create "cliques", these small groups of 2-4 that are just plain mean to everyone else, they gossip, they undermine reputations, etc.

In those situations, there isn't much anyone can do but leave the situation, even if the job, itself is good. You can't subject yourself to that sort of behavior and be manipulated.

Having said that, certainly, this is not the norm. Many people work with a group of genuinely good people and good management. However, even in these situations, if you are one that has difficulties with communication, socialization, or exhibit "different behaviors", you risk being marginalized in one way or another. Even in my situation, my main difficulties usually fall under the category of understanding other people's motivations, perspectives, and how to "tap into that" in order to work with someone towards a goal. It's that "disconnect" with people that I struggle with that inhibits my ability to work with people in a truly effective manner.

Granted, I am working on this. I am quite aware of myself now. However, at 56 and only being diagnosed at 52, I got on this path very late. Now, my autism experience is not yours or anyone else's, but being young, even with your current level of frustration, I think you have some advantages that I never did with regards to learning skills.

Now, whether you "need" an advanced degree is certainly up to the job description. There are many high-demand, skilled labor jobs that pay very, very well, even more than those with 4-6 year university degrees. The training for these jobs are more "hands on" and often companies will pay for training if you contract with them for a few years afterward. Many of these jobs you work by yourself or in small groups 2-3 people, something a bit more "socially manageable".
 

VictorR

Random Member
V.I.P Member
What is the point of even going to uni and getting a degree, when you are just going to get ostracized, scapegoated or abused at almost every workplace anyway. It's not worth the money, I would rather just stay at home and try to get some kind of disability benefits.

I have only had two short lived jobs, people weren't toxic to me, but no one interacted with me. I am going off of what i read other people with autism very commonly experience, statistics and my experience with group projects in college. These people that i had to work with in college are the same type of people i will also share a workspace with.

If you don't mind me asking, how were you "ostracized, scapegoated or abused" when people weren't toxic to you?

Did your jobs normally involve interacting with others? Did you take steps to try to interact with others?

It's possible that you're being intentionally excluded. It's also possible that maybe you're inadvertently sending signals that are being interpreted as "leave me alone".
 

phantom

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
It's possible that you're being intentionally excluded. It's also possible that maybe you're inadvertently sending signals that are being interpreted as "leave me alone".
I have considered that, but its something that is out of my control for the most part.
 

Progster

Grown sideways to the sun
V.I.P Member
Yes, workplace environments can seem just like an extension of high school, but it very much depends on that specific environment, as each workplace has its own culture.

Each employment situation has it's own issues, there's not perfect job, and that's true for everyone, one has to accept there will be challenges and issues to overcome as part of the package.

Being self-employed is often a better solution for those on the spectrum, as one can work independently without the added complication of coworkers. But it does mean more organisation, paperwork, etc - one needs to be well motivated to make it work.
 

Owliet

The Hidden One.
V.I.P Member
What is the point of even going to uni and getting a degree, when you are just going to get ostracized, scapegoated or abused at almost every workplace anyway. It's not worth the money, I would rather just stay at home and try to get some kind of disability benefits.
My last workplace was one of the more positive experiences I had compared to the last one where it was an extension of the height school Culture. I get the impression that each workplace is different, and depending on how much time and length you want to interact with your colleagues, then I guess there has to be a need for awareness that these people aren’t always friends. I had a similar conversation with my mentor who I met two weeks ago and he was very much inclined to tell me to not bother interacting with people in the workplace like I expect them to be friends. Some are pleasant enough but after being burned and backstabbed and bullied by a former colleague, and not invited to events in the longer job position I was at, then I think I learned the lesson to not expect levels of friendship From work colleagues Because it was not worth the stress. In my job, I have to interact with people, often young people and whilst there are challenges in that, it was never about dealing with them but rather my adult work colleagues.
 

Neonatal RRT

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
This morning, I walked into the breakroom and overheard a conversation. One of my co-workers has a large dog and he and his wife were planning on going on a vacation. Then he stunned us with this "little nugget" of information. His dog has had "issues" at the local kennels, so, his wife found this man who takes dogs into his home, pampers them, exercises them, and charges $90/day US. We were stunned at the price, but he's been doing this for years, I guess. Will usually take in a few dogs per day. If anyone is in a position to do something like this, it seems like a good way to make some extra cash. Obviously, there are people with the money to pay for pampering their pets while they are away from home.

One of my father's friend's had a small welding shop in a small town. Well, at some point, someone tipped him off to the US government contract website. He put a bid on welding a frame for sending a satellite out into space. He got the "low bid" of $1,000,000 US, and it only cost him a few thousand to make. Since that time, he has bid on several other jobs and is a multi-millionaire.

The point being, that sometimes there are money making opportunities that most people just don't think about,...but autistics might.
 

Storm Hess

Permanent Spaceman
Use your inherent talents to help move you forward. Uni is NOT necessary and at the moment, useless. Get an online course of what you want to learn. :)
 

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