Aspies and Marriages

[McFinnegan]

I'm in my second marriage. The first one last 4 years, and the second 11 years and is not broken yet, but may be very soon. I don't believe in NTs love, sorry.

 

[Geordie]

Who knows, NT love may be more fiction than truth?

 

[epath13]

Who knows, NT love may be more fiction than truth?

I bet you lots of NTs can say the same thing about Aspies

 

[Geordie]

But then, love seems to be a combination of luck and effort - and each part can't do without each other

 

[2010Dolby]

I don't buy in the idea of being the same in every way. I think you can be completely different, so long as you enjoy each other's company, are respectful and your basic values are in alignment. Beyond that, whether you're NT or not shouldn't make much of a difference.

I completely agree with you. Especially about how couples need their values to line up together. Me and my ex-girlfriend we're very opposite. It seemed to make it interesting most of the time, in a positive way. But whenever the topic of beliefs or morals came up we usually argued because she really didnt have much values. Im a pretty stubborn protestant Christian so our morals (mine are mildly "argumentative" so I wont mention them) conflicted in a very ugly way.

Also, the problem I seem to have in long-term relationships and probably will with marriage is that I can be a social butterfly for a certain number of hours a day. But I absolutly require some time alone. Usually an hour or two every day. I just need it. Iv gotten in fights with girlfriends about that too.

 

[HelloDizzy]

Marriage and kids are very important goals for me; the guy I'm with is very normal, no Aspergers, no disabilities, no mental issues at all.
We do want to get married eventually, and I hope he's willing to accept my oddities forever.

I don't think my Aspergers would make me less of a good wife, or less of a good mother.
Although I do see how it can be...different, what with the lack of empathy.
I can empathize, although only with the few I allow in my "cell."

 

[McFinnegan]

Marriage and kids are very important goals for me; the guy I'm with is very normal, no Aspergers, no disabilities, no mental issues at all.
We do want to get married eventually, and I hope he's willing to accept my oddities forever.

I don't think my Aspergers would make me less of a good wife, or less of a good mother.
Although I do see how it can be...different, what with the lack of empathy.
I can empathize, although only with the few I allow in my "cell."

I wish you happiness with your project. I have no doubt you can be a perfect wife and mother. But, live with a NT is very difficult, once you'll be living together for a while, you'll see if he is prepared to be a good partner, spouse and father. Don't hurry yourself, be patience and be sure of him.

 

[Soup]

If I can do it, HelloDizzy; YOU can do it. ABSOLUTELY!

I'm married, have 2 grown adult healthy sane children, my husband is a successful professional. YOU CAN DO THIS TOO. I'm not a magical person, didn't win a lotto, am not a supermodel & don't have a fairy godmother.

Don't let anyone tell you that you can't. Many NT parents with plenty of empathy sometimes raise screwed up kids & live screwed up lives with screwed up marriages. A smart, sensible, logical Aspie with the right partner CAN live a well-rounded fulfilling married & family life. Empathy CAN be aided by the be intellect. Logic & reason, however, cannot be intuited. You DO have some empathy: you don't need to be Oprah. I've never heard of an Aspie who has absolutely no empathy for anyone whomsoever.

Having that distance from excessive emotionality will make you a BETTER parent to your kids as they become teens. They can come to you to talk about things without fearing that you'll go hysterical & overreact. You won't be the last to know what is going on in their lives & you won't have to spy on them, track their mobiles & hack into their Facebook page. You'll be better able to handle disciplinary issues (if you're not the explosive rages type...) without overreacting due to emotionality or being too permissive due to excessive empathy.

Word to the wise: DO NOT get married or have children until you (or your future spouse) are financially stable & have a solid, reliable career. Nothing can wreck a marriage (already a tough arrangement) than constant economic strain with no improvement in sight.

 

[HelloDizzy]

Thanks, Soup.
I'm not explosive, and I think I'll be able to form attachments to my children. But for now I've got no career so it's just time to focus on myself, which is something I've never done.

 

[Soup]

That's smart. You're young & your whole life lies ahead of you. Taking the time now to focus on yourself is a great idea & it'll save you a lot of confusion & trouble down the road. Too many young women rush headlong into marriage not truly knowing who they even are & what they truly want (NOT what will get them out of daddy's house, make them appear adult, impress their friends, make them think they're joining 'respectable' society etc.) Their husband is often some equally young & unprepared guy who hasn't a clue what he's gotten into.

More good 'woman to woman' advice: Spend much more time planning your MARRIAGE (can last a loooong time) than you do planning your WEDDING (lasts a few hours). Young guys often think of their mother as the ideal model for what a wife is like & what she does. What do you think of your fiance's mother: is she a nut? Is she a subservient door-mat serving some domineering guy hand & foot? Do you admire her? Do you see yourself in her & how does that make you feel? How does your fiance's father act? THAT shows you who the most influential model of a male adult is in your husband's life.

What do you think about your own parents' marriage: how does your dad treat your mother?

What are YOUR beliefs & expectations about how you want your marriage to function? <--- This will help you determine what kind of guy will make for good husband material for you. This list will be entirely unique to you as a person. Don't go into a marriage based on romantic feelings or 'love'. Those things are nice, but marriage is about infinitely more than that & poverty, addictions, a guy with a bad temper, immaturity etc. can erode any love & romance right smartly!

More Soup the Aspie stuff to think about:

What most guys think of as fun & cool in a girlfriend is one thing. What they are looking for to be the mother of their future children is a VERY different thing. A girlfriend is NOT the same as a wife. Many women go into shock when the guy who was their boyfriend turns into someone else altogether & expects a whole bunch of different things from her now that she's a wife. Living with the guy 1st doesn't thwart this because HE knows you're NOT really his wife but his live-in girlfriend he can dump at any time without any obligations. It is a clich? story that a couple who lived together for years & got married wound up divorced a few months later. <----Don't be that wife.

I decided to take a little time in replying because you seem so serious about wanting this as a life goal. Since I too am an Aspie & have achieved it, it makes sense for me to tell you a few things I think might help you get there too. there's more, BUT I won't bug you with it unless you want to hear it.

 

[HelloDizzy]

Thank you. The guy I live with (and his family) now is much older - 27. But I'm not sure if we're going to make it. He's not "infatuated" with me anymore. This kills me to hear, especially since I'm supposed to "fix" it, but, it's the truth.

I'm not a big wedding kind of person. I would actually just get married in a court house or have a very small wedding. Too many people focus on the "biggest day of their lives" and not the "biggest decision of their lives."
No boyfriends mother has ever liked me; I'm actually always hated. I'm never like anyone's mother - especially the recent one who is a religious and emotional nut.
I think I'm a bit old-fashioned sometimes. But not stupid.

Anything else you want to tell me is much appreciated; my own mother died when I was 16 and my father is insane (they divorced when I was very young) so I don't have a lot to go on, or any female to talk to who's been through it.

 

[Soup]

Some mothers of sons resent any girl who catches their son's eye. Before the girlfriend came along, Mommy was the apple of their son's eye & she was the main woman captivating her son's attention. This is dysfunctional & emotionally unhealthy in more ways than I can list but I've seen it more times than I can count: mothers pick their son's girlfriends apart. The mother in law who is a big pain in the @$$ who sabotages, criticizes & interferes with her son's marriage is iconic & recognized as archetypal in virtually every culture on the planet. This probably has nothing to do with you & everything to do with these women's pathetic possessiveness of their sons, their jealousy of the girlfriend's youthfulness & beauty & their own insecurity.

As for being a little old fashioned, if that is who you are then that's fine. The only person you can ever successfully be is yourself. In the absence of dangerous self (or towards others) destructive behaviours, anyone who tries to alter or thwart your ability to grow into yourself as the unique person you are, is NOT your friend & sure as hell isn't boyfriend or husband material.

I have some more personal comments for you so I sent them in a pm rather than broadcast them here. I do have a few questions, though. You posted a photoshoot-type pic of yourself with dark hair playing a dead Bundy victim in a bath tub. In light of how tremulous your relationship with this guy is, the health issues you've mentioned in other threads & the fact that you lack parental guidance, I have to wonder... Was the theme of this shoot conceived of by you or by someone else? Did your boyfriend come up with the idea & take the photo?...just wondering. If so, it is a HUGE RED FLAG that this guy is a misogynist, harbours violent fantasies & could prove to be very dangerous (NOT in a charming bad boy way).

A little info re age differences. When a guy is older than a woman BUT the woman is a grown independent experienced adult, she's old enough & aware enough to make an informed decision. She can also hold her own, she knows who she is, what she wants, what her values are & how she insists on being treated. That is fine.

When a girl is barely out of her teens or still in her teens & a fully adult male comes sniffing after her alleging a 'romantic' interest, that is NOT a boyfriend. As appealing as the idea of having a steady guy who is supposedly 'more mature' than boys her age is, this is NOT a good thing. EVER. I've never seen it & I formally studied this issue. What the heck does a post-adolescent girl have to offer a grown man? Well... they bs the girl about how mature & special she is, so much more mature than other girls their age, how he's never felt that he could communicate so well with any other girl blablabla. So often, their lines go like that. This is GROOMING behaviour. Typically it works very well on lonely girls who lack proper parental support: either an absent father, a hostile father or a smothering controlling father. The guy seems to really listen to her, truly understand her & he takes her side against daddy.

Again, what's in this for him? The lure of a young, innocent, inexperienced, virginal kid who's barely legal. HE HAS ALL THE POWER & CONTROL!!! Who decides when the girl moves in? Who decides where the couple will live? Who probably has the car? Who has the income & makes every financial decision? HE even controls her self-esteem & often subtly (through compliments, suggestions, flattery, taking her shopping etc. <---later this becomes ignoring her, criticising & belittling her, intimidating her, keeping her off-balance, insecure & afraid...) & sometimes directly by taking her out to get her hair 'done' (it WAS done before: just not how HE wanted it done) or telling her tripe like, "You'd look so much prettier if you'd _______." The so-called relationship begins with a fawning flattering guy who plays the 'soul mate' who later becomes disinterested, moody, impossible to please & leaves the girl feeling confused, frightened for their future, unloved & wondering what she did wrong & what she can do to make things return to the way they were. The blunt truth is that things NEVER really were the way they appeared. Those were grooming strategies older predatory men use on young naive girls (usually these girls don't think they're naive) in order to:

- isolate them from their habitual life
- get them sexually involved & emotionally & financially dependant & entangled
- gain control of their life
- re-make the girl by breaking down her confidence, sending mixed messages & manipulating her


If this sounds familiar to you, you've got some serious thinking to do. Please don't freak out & confront him: guys like this are unpredictable. Begin distancing yourself emotionally & mentally (now that you're onto him!) & begin planning your escape & your future.

 

[Arashi222]

Good luck Dizzy. I hope you make whatever choice will make you happy Dizzy. Just know that we are all here to support you. Whatever you need or even just an ear to listen. I hope that you do whatever will make you happy. You can't fix him you can only control your own behavior and I hope that whatever you decide is what is right for you and will make you happy. Good luck Dizzy.

 

[Harpuia]

Some mothers of sons resent any girl who catches their son's eye. Before the girlfriend came along, Mommy was the apple of their son's eye & she was the main woman captivating her son's attention. This is dysfunctional & emotionally unhealthy in more ways than I can list but I've seen it more times than I can count: mothers pick their son's girlfriends apart. The mother in law who is a big pain in the @$$ who sabotages, criticizes & interferes with her son's marriage is iconic & recognized as archetypal in virtually every culture on the planet. This probably has nothing to do with you & everything to do with these women's pathetic possessiveness of their sons, their jealousy of the girlfriend's youthfulness & beauty & their own insecurity.

As for being a little old fashioned, if that is who you are then that's fine. The only person you can ever successfully be is yourself. In the absence of dangerous self (or towards others) destructive behaviours, anyone who tries to alter or thwart your ability to grow into yourself as the unique person you are, is NOT your friend & sure as hell isn't boyfriend or husband material.

I have some more personal comments for you so I sent them in a pm rather than broadcast them here. I do have a few questions, though. You posted a photoshoot-type pic of yourself with dark hair playing a dead Bundy victim in a bath tub. In light of how tremulous your relationship with this guy is, the health issues you've mentioned in other threads & the fact that you lack parental guidance, I have to wonder... Was the theme of this shoot conceived of by you or by someone else? Did your boyfriend come up with the idea & take the photo?...just wondering. If so, it is a HUGE RED FLAG that this guy is a misogynist, harbours violent fantasies & could prove to be very dangerous (NOT in a charming bad boy way).

A little info re age differences. When a guy is older than a woman BUT the woman is a grown independent experienced adult, she's old enough & aware enough to make an informed decision. She can also hold her own, she knows who she is, what she wants, what her values are & how she insists on being treated. That is fine.

When a girl is barely out of her teens or still in her teens & a fully adult male comes sniffing after her alleging a 'romantic' interest, that is NOT a boyfriend. As appealing as the idea of having a steady guy who is supposedly 'more mature' than boys her age is, this is NOT a good thing. EVER. I've never seen it & I formally studied this issue. What the heck does a post-adolescent girl have to offer a grown man? Well... they bs the girl about how mature & special she is, so much more mature than other girls their age, how he's never felt that he could communicate so well with any other girl blablabla. So often, their lines go like that. This is GROOMING behaviour. Typically it works very well on lonely girls who lack proper parental support: either an absent father, a hostile father or a smothering controlling father. The guy seems to really listen to her, truly understand her & he takes her side against daddy.

Again, what's in this for him? The lure of a young, innocent, inexperienced, virginal kid who's barely legal. HE HAS ALL THE POWER & CONTROL!!! Who decides when the girl moves in? Who decides where the couple will live? Who probably has the car? Who has the income & makes every financial decision? HE even controls her self-esteem & often subtly (through compliments, suggestions, flattery, taking her shopping etc. <---later this becomes ignoring her, criticising & belittling her, intimidating her, keeping her off-balance, insecure & afraid...) & sometimes directly by taking her out to get her hair 'done' (it WAS done before: just not how HE wanted it done) or telling her tripe like, "You'd look so much prettier if you'd _______." The so-called relationship begins with a fawning flattering guy who plays the 'soul mate' who later becomes disinterested, moody, impossible to please & leaves the girl feeling confused, frightened for their future, unloved & wondering what she did wrong & what she can do to make things return to the way they were. The blunt truth is that things NEVER really were the way they appeared. Those were grooming strategies older predatory men use on young naive girls (usually these girls don't think they're naive) in order to:

- isolate them from their habitual life
- get them sexually involved & emotionally & financially dependant & entangled
- gain control of their life
- re-make the girl by breaking down her confidence, sending mixed messages & manipulating her


If this sounds familiar to you, you've got some serious thinking to do. Please don't freak out & confront him: guys like this are unpredictable. Begin distancing yourself emotionally & mentally (now that you're onto him!) & begin planning your escape & your future.

Wow, if this is how people think guys my age are like and I've never been in a relationship then I am screwed. :/

Told don't date a girl (significantly) younger than me because of the maturity issues.

Told on the other end don't date a girl a little younger, same age, or older because all she wants is a meal ticket, try to get you married as fast as possible, and divorced with more than half your stuff inside 5 years. :/

 

[Soup]

@ Harpuia

I understand if the above seems harsh. I'm not talking about all & every man your age. I'm talking about the tactics used by a very specific type of predatory man who targets a younger woman with particular vulnerabilities. THAT's the guy I mean: not every single older man. I'm sorry if I didn't make that clear.

I wrote these things because of the very specific concerns that arose as the initial poster, Hello Dizzy, talked about her situation in this & other threads including comments in the shout box. As a mother with kid her age, some of the things she said gave me a start. A young woman should not have to fear that she 'is always on the verge of being kicked out' or 'feel like a huge ball of hate' or feel despondent because 'everyone in the home she's living in hates her'.

Now, I could wax positive & spout a series of comforting but useless platitudes or I can sit her down (here in the forum, of course) & treat her situation with the gravity & respect I'd treat it if this were my own daughter expressing reservations about her living situation & uncertainty about her future.

This guy & his family are treating our friend & fellow Aspie Hello Dizzy in a way that is completely inexcusable & unacceptable. My son knows that he'll be hung out to dry if he ever mistreats a woman.

 

[Kelly]

A little info re age differences. When a guy is older than a woman BUT the woman is a grown independent experienced adult, she's old enough & aware enough to make an informed decision. She can also hold her own, she knows who she is, what she wants, what her values are & how she insists on being treated. That is fine.

When a girl is barely out of her teens or still in her teens & a fully adult male comes sniffing after her alleging a 'romantic' interest, that is NOT a boyfriend. As appealing as the idea of having a steady guy who is supposedly 'more mature' than boys her age is, this is NOT a good thing. EVER. I've never seen it & I formally studied this issue.

I must say I very much disagree with this sweeping statement, not a good thing EVER? It really does depend on both parties involved it's not so black and white as he's older then you therefore he's no good and why would he want to be involved with a younger woman.

I was 19 and my husband 25 when we first met, it's our 8th wedding anniversary this year and we couldn't be happier. I don't see any problem with age gap relationships unless your talking a 35 year old man and 16 year old girl...then what you said may apply but again it depends on the individuals. Some 16 year olds are mature for their age and some men in their 30's haven't really matured much since their teens (so mentally they are on a similar wavelength). When I was 16/17 I dated a few men in their mid-20's and there was nothing predatory about it, it was the guys my own age who ended up hurting me and abusing me so you can't use age gaps as a measure of how suitable a man is.

I think in this instance (with dizzy and her bf) age has nothing to do with the relationship, it's the way in which he is treating her that is wrong and that's what she needs to reflect upon not his age.

 

[Soup]

@ Kelly:

I get what you're saying too. My parents have a considerable age gap as well & they've been together for more than 50 years. The problem here & I acknowledge I should've been more specific) is not just the age difference.

Problems occur when several prominent features are present:

- the girl is barely post adolescent
- She lacks a solid parental bond (mother deceased, or otherwise absent)
- Father deceased, hostile, abusive or negligent
- girl has difficulties of her own (health problems, financial problems, limited education (some have alcohol, drug, mental or psychological problems)

- Guy is older but living in a questionable state (living like a teenager at 30 for instance)
- Guy uses well documented grooming strategies
- Girl's freedom, security & confidence decrease steadily
- guy uses the giving & withdrawal of affection to control, manipulate & destabilize the girl.
- girl begins to feel that she must constantly please & comply in order to avoid unpleasant consequences.

When these factors are present, it is never a good thing.

 

[HelloDizzy]

I'm the serial-killer obsessed one, which also alarms him. So I chose to do the creepy shoot lol don't worry.

I may have presented myself as more mature on the dating site; I didn't lie, but I may have come across as not having any emotional problems. Had no clue I had Aspergers yet. Didn't mention self-injury because I wasn't doing it anymore. Never said I wasn't a 19 year old with 19 year old girl type of issues. But I am sincerely tired of being treated like molding clay and I'm starting to lose interest; I don't want to be in this kind of relationship.


What I wonder is, will he ever ACTUALLY get rid of me, or is this all just to keep me in limbo?

Thanks everyone.

 

[Kelly]

Okay Dizzy I think you seriously need to get out of this relationship asap. Is there anyone you can go stay with? I know things are not great with your dad but is there anyway you can go back and stay with him? just explain to him how bad things are for you, surely he wouldn't want to see you suffer.

 

[Bay]

I'm inclined to agree with Kelly, Dizzy. Maybe you could just go home for an extended visit?