What is love???

[Yucca]

Hi you!

I´m not really at home in this forum yet. I have a lot of work and not so much time. This is why I normally postpone reading and writing here. But sometimes I´m really restless in my mind. One of these days is today and I wonder if you could answer me some questions?

I have/ had or never had a boyfriend for six years now. I am diagnosed, he is not but I think he has a lot of Aspergers. He loves to have sex with me but he always said that he is not in love with me, that he cannot love. But he shows a lot of feelings when we are together. It is just like afterwards he forgets about me. Now I want to stop the relationship because I want to be loved. I love him dearly. He says that it is normal for a man to have great sex for years (and great other time as well, at least in my opinion) and to feel nothing deeper than this. His father told him, that he should feel that he want to be together with me a big deal, if not, it is definately not love. And he sais that he does not feel like spending time with me. But WHEN we are together I feel that everything is great. I don´t want to be impatient with him, sometimes I think he just needs a lot of time due to his Aspergers but recently a friend told me to leave him NOW (I see my boyfriend several times a week) because if he does not love me until now, he just does not love me. But could it be that he loves me and does not know it?
How can he/ I distinguish between lack of love and commitment fear??? (I think that he has enormous commitment fear.)
How are your experiences? Can you love? How is love to be defined for Aspies? Is there something I can do apart from leaving him? I have my head full of things I don't understand or maybe don´t want to understand.
Maybe you know answers...

Thank you for reading this. I´m really sad, you know...

 

[StephF]

My opinion ? Love is a feeling induced by a mixture of neuro transmitters. Greatly overrated.

 

[Yucca]

But if you feel it...
If you want to be with a person...
Never happened to you???

Do you know how to extinguish it?
I would like to don't feel it...

Would this mean to have sex with whoever? Or with nobody at all???

 

[StephF]

You can have sex without loving someone, I'm sure lots of people do it. Similarly some people love without sex.
I'm not interested in sex. It's icky IMHO.

 

[Yucca]

Yeah. Than it´s easier. I envy you. Or not? Sex is a lot of fun, at least to me. But it has a lot to do with trust. If I can´t trust a person I could never relax, I guess. ( I didn't have many different partners.) And if i can´t relax, why should I do it??

 

[Harrison]

Sex has nothing to do with 'love', if it did and was dependent then prostitution couldn't exist.

Love is initially a chemical reaction, you can duplicate it with chocolate.

This guy is using you to vent his sexual tension. You need to really look into why you think you love him, what are the reasons?

Relationships are based upon sharing, compassion, affinity, and a host of other things that get mis-labelled as 'love'.

No it doesn't mean you should go off and have sex with whoever. Having respect in yourself is the first rule of looking for a relationship, sex is not coinage that can buy you love, and long term it will only buy you sadness. Find someone who is just happy to be with you and vice versa, someone who gives into the relationship as much as you do, offers you the comfort of a good heart, who is there when there is no sex. Never lower your standards, just fish in a different pond and let that guy go.

 

[AsheSkyler]

How are your experiences?
So long as the instinctual attractiveness does not get in the way, I've got a clear idea how I feel. What I mean by that is while some girls go by the butterflies in the stomach, dizzy feeling, jitters, and other physical symptoms of being attracted, I find them annoying and avoid guys that spark that in me.
There's been plenty of guys I've had a crush on, a few I've been infatuated with, but only one or two I've loved and longed for.

Can you love?
Aye. My emotions are a lot weaker than they used to be, but what's left of them says I can still feel it. Mostly I just feel a strong sense of loyalty and protectiveness.

How is love to be defined for Aspies?
As with nearly every question I seem to answer, "depends on the person". Either I'm lacking creativity these days or I've figured out something.

Is there something I can do apart from leaving him?
I'm afraid not... Like that one ol' song "Love Stinks" used to haunt my status with people I liked, "you love her, and she loves him, and he loves somebody else, you just can win". It did help me to set priorities and cut some people loose. Some folks just aren't meant to be together. It's not easy getting over somebody, especially if your body starts releasing those chemicals that cause classic broken heart pains, but it can be done. I usually took an escapist kind of route and buried myself in an obsession for a few months.
He may have a change of heart or in his own way care about you deeply, or he could just be enjoying a few romp sessions.

 

[Plumeria]

Hi Yucca,
I am NT but I love someone who I think may have AS but I thought I might have some things to share with you…

It is just like afterwards he forgets about me. Now I want to stop the relationship because I want to be loved.

I'm sure you know that Aspies need a lot of space and often times that space WILL make you feel as if he's forgotten about you but if he is spending time with you 3x a week then it means he wants to spend time with you. Does that mean he loves you? No. As so many people tell me here, you will never know if he loves you, even if he says it to you, you will not know the extent of that love. I think the focus should not be on him now, the focus should be on yourself especially if you are at a point where you are unsure and confused about things. I know it's cliche but its true, you cannot find love outside of yourself. If you are looking for someone to give you love to complete you, then there is a lot of work you need to do to find love in yourself. If, however, you are at a point where your needs are not being met in this relationship (i.e.. time, attention, concern, etc), then that would be the reason to end the relationship, NOT because of him, because of YOU, because YOU want more and this person is not able to give you what you desire in a relationship. Unfortunately, we cannot change anyone but ourselves. Now, if you want to continue the relationship then understand that he may love you or he may not but either way, you need to be okay with the relationship exactly as it is, if you aren't… then you've answer your own question about ending it.

How are your experiences? Can you love? How is love to be defined for Aspies?

I was with my Aspie partner for one year, not once did he tell me he loved me but I knew he did through his actions. I think love is defined differently for every individual. The best thing I've ever read is the two types of love as defined by the Greeks:
1. Eros Love: Eros is probably what most people mean when they announce with a smile, "I'm in love." This type of love covers everything from queasy stomachs and warm fuzzy feelings to strong sensual passion. There are a couple of very interesting characteristics about eros. First, in order to exist eros is dependent upon the situation and circumstances. As long as a couple is enjoying a romantic situation, eros can thrive. But, as soon as hurtful words or actions appear, eros simply evaporates.

Second, eros is also held captive to each person's perception. For example, if someone perceives a particular quiet evening dinner with candles to be romantic, eros will thrive. However, passion becomes squashed for someone whenever he or she interprets the current situation to be undesirable. Eros thus grows strong and then wastes away based upon our perceptions.

Although eros at times might make us feel like we are on cloud nine, it can not provide a reliable basis for building a deep and meaningful relationship since it is so fickle and dependent upon perception and circumstances. Because of such things as accidents, diseases, and the fact that someone can choose to doubt or despise you regardless of your actions, it is clear that we can not determine how others will perceive us nor are we masters of our own circumstances. Although eros is exhilarating, this is not the Biblical word used for love.

In short, Eros is fleeting.

2. Agape Love: Unlike Eros, agape is not limited to being held hostage by its environment and someone's perception. The reason why agape can soar above these is because it is based upon the commitment of a decision. It entails the decision to proactively seek someone's well-being. Since it is not a knee jerk reaction nor just a responsive feeling to how I've been treated, agape is capable of acting in a hostile environment where there are no warm fuzzy feelings. Agape love is unconditional love.

The price of Eros love is fear, the price of Agape love is boredom. Romantic love always starts at Eros and move into Agape love but unfortunately, when the transition is made, people think that they are not "in love" anymore and terminate the relationship before it can even move into Agape love. Agape love is rare, it is something self-sacrificing and unconditional.

Is there something I can do apart from leaving him? I have my head full of things I don't understand or maybe don´t want to understand...But could it be that he loves me and does not know it?

That's a decision YOU have to make. Again, I suggest you switch your focus from him to YOU. Ask yourself, am I getting what I want out of the relationship without trying to change him or the situation? What DO I WANT from a committed relationship? What does a committed relationship feel like to me? Finally, I know the sex is great but if that's all you wanted from the relationship, I don't think you would be confused and wondering if he loves you. It sounds like you've tried to discuss it with him and he's given you an answer

I know it's hard. I'm in a similar position myself but in the end, you must love yourself first. Hugs.

 

[Yucca]

Thank you for your answers.
I think that they are very wise. I´ll read them over again to memorize them properly. May there be a mix between the Eros Love and the Agape Love?
And may it be that I need suffering( for example, in order to feel enough)?? The few relationships I had were all coming along with a big deal of distance and suffering.
I am sure, their is something wrong with me...

 

[Plumeria]

Thank you for your answers.
I think that they are very wise. I´ll read them over again to memorize them properly. May there be a mix between the Eros Love and the Agape Love?
And may it be that I need suffering( for example, in order to feel enough)?? The few relationships I had were all coming along with a big deal of distance and suffering.
I am sure, their is something wrong with me...

You are very welcome. I guess there could be a mix between Eros and Agape love. I think if your relationships in the past came with a great deal of distance and suffering, then it may be time to think about the questions I posted earlier. What do you really want from a relationship and when you decide to go into one, are you and your partner able to fulfill each others needs? If there is suffering then it is likely that someone is not getting their needs met. For me, I had to really define my needs. What can I fulfill myself and what do I need from another person to be happy in a relationship with them? Again, it's all back to you because only you can control your thoughts, emotions and feelings… nobody else.

I always thought something was wrong with me too but it wasn't until I really took a good look at myself that I decided to change the things I didn't like and I accepted and embraced all the things I do love about me. Let me tell you, the love list only gets longer as the dislike list decreases. Learn to love yourself because you are unique and special and you deserve your own love!

 

[Cali Cat]

This is a very complicated issue, and others have provided many good points for you to think about.

Just from reading your original post, I would tell you to leave the relationship. If after six years he has not developed a feeling of love for you, he is either incapable of the feeling, or you're making it too easy for him to have what he wants without making a commitment.

Love is a chemical reaction in the brain. Therefore, if he does not have the physical ability to produce that reaction, he may never love anyone in a romantic sense. You have to ask yourself if you're going to be happy with this for a lifetime if you choose to stay with him.

If he's simply taking advantage of your willingness to have sex with him without love, maybe taking that away will do something to change his mind. Even if it does, however, I can see the potential for him to fall back into his old ways if he wins you back. You've got be ready for that possibility.

Most of all, romantic love is initially built on a fantasy that you create around another person. It encompasses all your hopes and dreams and plans for your future with this person. This fantasy cannot be realized if both parties do not share it. The feeling of pain you have when a relationship ends is the mourning of all those things you had hoped the relationship would be. What you miss is the moments in the relationship that gave you hope. When you realize it just isn't meant to be, then you can start to get over that feeling of love for that person. You can begin to see that person as the individual they are, instead of the person you hoped they were, or could someday be.

Best of luck to you, and I hope you will look out for your own best interests in this.

 

[clg114]

Thank you for your answers.
I think that they are very wise. I´ll read them over again to memorize them properly. May there be a mix between the Eros Love and the Agape Love?
And may it be that I need suffering( for example, in order to feel enough)?? The few relationships I had were all coming along with a big deal of distance and suffering.
I am sure, their is something wrong with me...

There is something wrong with everybody, Aspie or NT. Remember, not many NT's understand your Aspie ways and having someone that understands you is vital for a good relationship. If you were my daughter, I would tell you the same thing that Harrison & AsheSkyler did, move on.

 

[Etzelaire]

I feel the same about love as steph... But when I feel deeply attracted to a woman and she doesn't reciprocate that feeling I cut the relationship. If we both agree in a realtionship based solely on sex then it's ok. Don't love anyone who does not love you, you can find someone who does and you deserve it.

 

[nowwhat]

...baby don't hurt me. Don't hurt me, no more.

 

[blue_bird]

Who knows? I'm no expert on it, for sure. Is it not being able to let go of someone, even when it makes more sense to do so? Or is that just infatuation? Is it being prepared to spend your life on your own, and then someone comes along and makes you willing to have s person in your life? Or is that just desperate loneliness? I can't tell... Sometimes love is best left for those who can endure with its ups and downs, whatever it may be.

 

[Yucca]

Yes... Thanks a lot. First (past months) I was writing (not very much) in an german Aspie- forum, but they (not all of them!!!) are not as open minded as you here, afterwards I was writing in an spanish one, but they (not all of them!!!) seemed very depressive to me. I like your answers. They cause me a lot new questions, though.
Some of them, randomly:
How can I know if it is Eros-love or Agape-love or if I simply need someone. And Sex? Does desire exclude Agape-love? Or how do I imagine a reationship that combines desire and Agape? Does desire cause fear and is automatically Eros? Or its only hormones, finally ??? Or will my brain explode one day???
How can Agape-love, love sin conditions, exist? Let´s say I want the best for somebody. By default I have to imagine what is the best. This would be a condition...

 

[Plumeria]

Yes... Thanks a lot. First (past months) I was writing (not very much) in an german Aspie- forum, but they (not all of them!!!) are not as open minded as you here, afterwards I was writing in an spanish one, but they (not all of them!!!) seemed very depressive to me. I like your answers. They cause me a lot new questions, though.
Some of them, randomly:
How can I know if it is Eros-love or Agape-love or if I simply need someone. And Sex? Does desire exclude Agape-love? Or how do I imagine a reationship that combines desire and Agape? Does desire cause fear and is automatically Eros? Or its only hormones, finally ??? Or will my brain explode one day???
How can Agape-love, love sin conditions, exist? Let´s say I want the best for somebody. By default I have to imagine what is the best. This would be a condition...

Hi Yucca,
I don't think that applying the definitions I gave you to your situation is going to resolve it. I gave you the definitions because you asked for the definition of love and that was the best definition that I've ever read. Still to answer your questions, I think Agape love is something that is rare, if you are Christian then it's the type of love Jesus had for everyone. There is no expectation, wanting/needing from that type of love, it is unconditional. And yes, desire in love is definitely Eros love and the desire itself causes fear and suffering. So, wanting the best for somebody is not enough, wanting the best for them without anything in return is Agape love.

Anyway, if we focus on your OP, your question was if you should end the relationship because your boyfriend said he does not love you. Defining the type of love you share will not help you make that decision. Again, focusing on what you are getting out of this relationship is more important. If you were happy in the relationship, you would not be asking these questions… IMO you have two choices:
1. Stay with him and accept the relationship exactly how it is (yet you seem to be unhappy)
2. Leave him and open yourself to a more fulfilling/rewarding relationship ( by defining what you really want from a relationship and sticking to those values)

I say choose #2.

 

[zylon]

I use the word "love" for the most wonderful, deeply satisfying thing there is. I have felt this love for
certain type of people all my life; the special people I was born to love. When I was seven years old, to be with Sandra (also seven) was by far what I wanted most of all in life. It is exactly the same now. It is entirely non-sexual. There is absolutely no demand on that person; however, if I cannot be with that person, I feel depressed; when I am with that person, I feel the greatest, deepest joy, beyond anything else, far beyond anything else.
Along with the joy of being with them, there is also a profound caring for them, for how they feel, even more than the caring for myself. My love for them is unconditional; the love is there whether she loves me back or not. However, my joy is just that much greater if she loves me too. Once I love someone like that, it is permanent; it can never fade. The love is not grown; it is there from the beginning. When with her, all I care about is that she is happy. If she wants me to be happy, all she has to do is be with me.
The only behavior inherent in this is that I always have a warm, deep hug for her whenever she wants it, and the words "I love you".

 

[SlytherinDixon]

My past relationships have... Sucked. But I've finally made it right this time.

Love for me, is well...

When I wake him up in the middle of the night just to say I'm lonely. When he stays up until seven am with me because I forgot to take my Seroquel and can't sleep. When I go into a fit and yell and say hurtful, cold things to him and twenty minutes later he's teaching me to apologize. When my mind says I'm falling out of love but my heart races when he steps out of the shower. When he smells like pure garbage but I can't stop holding him. When he has stayed through all my flaws and mistakes, and loves me just as much as the day before.

That... That's love to me.

 

[Spiller]

Love hurts sometimes!
If it hurts sweetly sometimes, it needs open, honest communication, co-operation and refinement.. and it'll just get better!
If it hurts painfully a lot, seriously consider stopping it because it's not good for you!
Seriously consider that you have a whole lifetime to find someone who will respect you for.. You, the gorgeous, beautiful person that is you, Aspie and all!
Someone who carries your feelings in their own heart, alongside their own feelings, who feels for you before they feel for themselves.. and when it's reciprocal, that's what makes love love!
No matter how hard you try, it doesn't work one way.. you can't provide enough love for the both of you!
Many have tried, all have failed!