Looking for astrology study participants

[Judge]

Hi Judge,
First off, I would like to sincerely apologize if anything I've said has led you to believe I am interested in exploiting you or others in this forum.

No need to apologize any more than anyone else soliciting the same thing. It's just that in your case your primary focus appears to be with astrology. A subject viewed as a pseudoscience by the scientific community at large. The same scientific community that determines medical protocols and diagnostic processes pertinent to autism.

I have no problem with anyone who wants to challenge the scientific community over the use and credibility of astrology. However IMO that's a fight that should not include the autistic community in the process. We have a very different struggle in comparison that impacts real people who cannot afford being potentially compromised over fundamental interpretations and applications of astrology for better or worse.

In essence, this is "a boat you may afford to rock", but it's one we can't.

The stakes are very high for so many of us as human beings in a Neurotypically dominated society. Can you honestly say the same for your dissertation?

 

[Raphael Outcast]

The language you use betrays your naïveté

True: keeps occurring to me maybe she could be on the Spectrum herself?!

I myself have frequently been accused of naïveté so extreme it bordered on the offensive, or indeed rolled an entire Panzer division at full revs straight into the territory of the offensive.

Dr Freud is said to have said there are times when a cigar is just a cigar.

 

[Nervous Rex]

... or indeed rolled an entire Panzer division at full revs straight into the territory of the offensive.

That beautifully written imagery is now my favorite part of this thread.

 

[Autistamatic]

True: keeps occurring to me maybe she could be on the Spectrum herself?!

I myself have frequently been accused of naïveté so extreme it bordered on the offensive, or indeed rolled an entire Panzer division at full revs straight into the territory of the offensive.

Dr Freud is said to have said there are times when a cigar is just a cigar.

The attacks we face as individuals and as a community on a daily basis are frequently bouyed up by quotations from sources which include student dissertations sometimes. Those attacks have led people to take their own lives multiple times. That is not trivial.

The OP has stumbled into a minefield which could hurt their own future as well as ours but has an opportunity to back out. Being autistic doesn't make one an expert on autism though if one wishes to become an expert it's a good start. If they should be on the spectrum as you suggest then I would hope they would wish to avoid harming any of us, even indirectly, and would choose a less risky topic.

 

[Nitro]

I feel it is time for me to step in and remind everyone once again, that we will not tolerate bashing of any member here for any reason.

If you disagree with this request, then please bow out and say nothing.

 

[Sunsprawl]

I will make no comments about the validity of any form of astrology any more than I would someone's religion, but I do believe that you are treading in murkier waters than you know @Sunsprawl and I would counsel you to think very carefully about what you are asking of us.

Before you can ask the questions you suggest you require a much more comprehensive understanding of autism than you currently have. The language you use betrays your naivete and you risk doing harm to an already threatened and marginalised community.

I'm sure you are right. I've never spoken to adult autists about Autism, although I have interacted extensively with a couple of children. These children in my life are some of the people I relate best with. I appreciate your advice and I am doing my best to educate myself. My primary strategy, rather than going to the DSM-5 and all the studies and descriptions is to listen to people's stories who are willing to tell them. I would like to avoid putting an individual's experience into a preconceived box I construct from the scientific community. Not because its bad or wrong, just because my primary interests are the individuals and their subjective experience. If there are any publications that are worthwhile, I want to hear about them from this community and not my random internet searches.

I recognize I have approached this in a careless way and have upset intelligent, reflective and concerned people who live with marginalization like the air we breathe. I had to start somewhere, and yes, in my awkward and maybe even offensive way, I have started here and in this way. Fortunately, as has been mentioned, my research will only be reported to a small group in a very specific field. The important detail here is to treat the individuals who approach me with the same care and respect I like to receive, and that I try to give to anyone, regardless of how their nervous system functions. I don't foresee any harm being done. If these are indeed murkier waters than I've suspected, I would appreciate any guides or lights to help me on my way.

What I hope to gain aside from maybe a deeper understanding into how the planets manifest for this specific population is a change in my own heart, a more illuminated understanding about the depth and breadth of human experience in all its diversity, neurological and otherwise. I know I have said it all wrong, but these are my primary goals. The more we see ASD as one of the infinite manifestations of human experience, the more normalized and included the individuals who experience this condition will be. The more I understand, the more I can communicate that to the world and be a part of the solution that @Judge referred to. I'm very excited to get to know the people who have approached me.

 

[DuckRabbit]

I have huge sympathy for both sides of the discussion being expressed here: (1) those who fear that any association with astrology will further damage ASC individuals' already tenuous connection with society and (2) those who view astrology as a useful therapeutic tool with the potential to 'reassure' ASC individuals that they too have a place in the cosmos; they too are part of the design.

I'm not sure what the answer is, but this discussion reminds me of another thread on here asking 'Do you care what other people think of you?' and a response I felt affinity for was one that said something like: I care to the extent that other people have a certain amount of control over the resources I get access to (e.g., employment, income, reputation, social capital etc). Yet I don't feel that shunning astrology is going to change appreciably the predicament of marginalisation in society that most ASC individuals face. There are NTs who peddle astrology and they too face scorn and ridicule from society. Conversely there are some charlatans in science who falsify data and lead people astray, often with horrific consequences. There is as much projection in astrology as there is in science: both are focusing on certain aspects of this universe to the exclusion of others. My stance is to be open to both and not view them as mutually exclusive.

Don't we all face this conundrum on a daily basis: (1) Ought I to tighten my screws further to minimise my idiosyncrasies so as to better pass for normal in this NT-dominant society? cf. (2) Beyond a certain minimum level of convention (hygiene, prosociality, as much independence as possible), nothing I do is going to turn me into a NT to the point that I ever start being treated as normal; nothing is going to change my fate and suddenly make me accepted on this planet; I may as well embrace what I am and try to reshape society a little in MY image, rather than constantly haemorrhaging energy trying to bend myself into society's image.

Unless you have independent family money or the luck to have a skill, profession or expertise that society happens to reward, a F-Y attitude towards society and other people is unaffordable to most of us. I think the views being expressed on this thread ought to foster compassion for both sides - those going each way around the mountain, for I cannot choose between them; I tack between both, responding as best I can to whatever comes up - and probably depending on what my stars are like that day!

Perhaps we need to have the faith that both tactics ------ (1) trying to pass for normal and (2) trying to change society ------ are serving ASC evolution and societal evolution, so we should express gratitude when someone chooses (1) and equally we should feel gratitude when someone chooses (2). Neither path is easy.

 

[Ken S.]

My hypothesis of autism, for what it's worth is that people with the SPD sensitivity that is common in ASD in earlier times when there wasn't so much artificial light and noise (Which can be a big part of the problem for people with ASD in modern times) were the ones that kept the tribes safe. While I don't have data to back it up it is a logical assumption. To the OP since you have been respectful If you would like a participant with an opposing view PM my inbox. You can see my birth date in my profile to confirm my eligibility.

 

[Judge]

I don't foresee any harm being done. If these are indeed murkier waters than I've suspected, I would appreciate any guides or lights to help me on my way.

Let this be your guide relative to the understanding, acceptance and tolerance of autistic people:

1) There will be a few who will attempt to understand and succeed.
2) A few more who will attempt to understand and fail.
3) With a vast majority of those who default to suggesting or demanding that we as a neurological minority, should fundamentally conform to the thought processes of the neurological majority.

A grim reality that we on the spectrum of autism are likely to face any time we attempt to explain ourselves in whole or in part. Where factoring in an additionally controversial subject (astrology) amounts to compounding an already precarious situation. - That which is the potential harm being done in this instance.

Where hopefully you will give up your own perceptions to more clearly see our own.

 

[Sunsprawl]

My hypothesis of autism, for what it's worth is that people with the SPD sensitivity that is common in ASD in earlier times when there wasn't so much artificial light and noise (Which can be a big part of the problem for people with ASD in modern times) were the ones that kept the tribes safe. While I don't have data to back it up it is a logical assumption. To the OP since you have been respectful If you would like a participant with an opposing view PM my inbox. You can see my birth date in my profile to confirm my eligibility.

Very interesting hypothesis! It would be interesting to search the scientific, historical and literary record pre-20th century to look for evidence of people and characters manifesting the signs of ASD. I'm sure someone has been doing this??