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Do you believe in IQ?

Discussion in 'General Autism Discussion' started by Louie, Jun 7, 2021.

  1. Louie

    Louie Member

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    I got a high punctuation in a IQ test applied by an neuropsychologist, but I'm dumb as hell.
    What do you think about IQ?
     
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  2. Fino

    Fino Alex V.I.P Member

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    Believe in it as what? It exists and measures certain abilities, that's a simple matter of fact. I don't know if you mean for it to be more.
     
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  3. ForestGumpett

    ForestGumpett Well-Known Member

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    Same here, high IQ and I’m dumb as crap. I don’t get it, if I got it then I’d be rich and not here typing at my kitchenette on a 10.2” ipad.
     
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  4. Au Naturel

    Au Naturel Au Naturel

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    It is a measurement of specific sets of abilities. There are different kinds of intelligence, which I define as problem-solving ability. IQ only measures one. I know people of average IQ who are very wise about life but fall flat on their face during a standardized test.

    So if you have a high IQ you are smart at some things but could be a moron in different things. Nobody's perfect. Except for Erza Scarlett. She is perfect.
     
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  5. unperson

    unperson Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    High IQ, but dumb as a box of rocks socially. Largely due to poor face recognition and poor mindreading skills.
     
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  6. Thinx

    Thinx Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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  7. Raggamuffin

    Raggamuffin Well-Known Member

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    The studies and statistics show that they are reliable. However, some would question whether they are entirely valid. The tests will focus on certain aspects of a person's intelligence, but they don't help measure other aspects of human intelligence such as creativity or social intellect etc. Sometimes IQ tests validity becomes overstated and somewhat bias.

    Ed
     
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  8. Progster

    Progster Gone sideways to the sun V.I.P Member

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    No, not really. I don't think that intelligence is a thing that can be measured or quantified, it's too complex, and anyway, how does one even begin to define it? I think that IQ, if it can be quantified, should be expressed as a spectrum graph like the Aspie Quiz one, rather than a points system.

    I have no idea what my IQ is, it's just a number and doesn't really matter. What does matter though, is identifying one's strengths and weaknesses in various areas, and adjusting oneself accordingly.
     
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  9. watersprite

    watersprite inadvertent vagabond V.I.P Member

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    No.

    I was tested a few times over the years & I scored high. This surprised some people, I’m guessing.

    The high score caused even more anxiety for my mother, & subsequent pressure on me to get high grades in advanced placement classes.

    The classes were great - I love learning - but the pressure backfired. I do not do well under pressure, to put it in polite terms.

    IQ tests measure how well I do on tests. The scores vary with my mood, blood sugar, stress, etc.
     
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  10. SDRSpark

    SDRSpark Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    As a former "gifted" student I find this relatable. I was bored as heck in school, and excelled academically (after I was identified as "gifted" - before that I was failing many classes).

    There was a definite pressure to succeed - it was assumed that, because I'm smart, I *could* do it, so if I weren't succeeding, I must not WANT to. I was also under a lot of pressure to follow an academic track (I wanted to go into a trade, and eventually, did). My parents encouraged me to get into a trade, the school actively discouraged it. They wouldn't allow me to attend VoTech because I was "too smart" and basically seemed to think that not going to college would be a "waste" of academic abilities like mine. Never mind what I was actually interested in and enjoyed doing. (I'm a machinist now and they can kiss my butt lol).

    I still remember my mom being upset that I didn't make honor roll - at some point, making honor roll (or high honor roll) was expected - so when I brought home my report card my mom said "aw man, you didn't even make regular honor roll this time!" (My grades weren't bad, I just didn't have enough A's that marking period.)

    As for the IQ test, if my mother remembered correctly I scored 153. I barely remember the test, though, and I have no idea what I would score now. (I was tested in 3rd grade). I do know that I'm an excellent test taker, but being able to pass a test tells absolutely nothing of my abilities in a particular area (I remember one standardized test where, when the results came in, my mother exclaimed with delight that I had scored "full mastery" of trigonometry. I responded "what's trigonometry?" because I had no idea. Full mastery my butt LOL.) I hate multiple choice tests (unless I want to have an easy day lol) because they're just too easy to pass with flying colors when you know almost nothing about the subject. My deductive reasoning skills are out of this world, so I can deductive-reason my way through almost any multiple choice test. Once I actually have to demonstrate REAL knowledge of a subject, I fall on my face (if it's not a subject I happen to have real knowledge of).
     
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  11. Neonatal RRT

    Neonatal RRT Well-Known Member

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    A few points here when discussing "IQ", as many do not understand how these values are created. When someone says, "I have an IQ of 150", what does that mean? First of all, what kind of testing was performed? There are many different types of tests, some are very specific such as reading comprehension or pattern recognition, and some are comprehensive that include several different areas,...the later giving far more information about the person. Personally, I score very high in some specific areas and average in other areas,...and likely below average in others. I would have the tendency to believe this is true of most of us,...especially autistics,...who characteristically have asymmetrical intelligences due to how our brains develop. A comprehensive "IQ test" will typically take hours to perform, usually with professionals present evaluating time of responses (in seconds), body language, and accuracy. These so-called IQ tests you see on social media sites and on the internet often do not evaluate the time it takes to achieve an accurate answer and are so limited in scope to be of any accuracy what-so-ever. An IQ score achieved via a professionally done, broadly comprehensive regimen will be broken down and scored individually. For example, 98 in this area, 143 in another, 123 in another, 103 in another, and so on. Now, my testing that was done,...that didn't give me an IQ value, but rather put me into a percentile.

    Some other variables effecting testing could include memory ability, knowledge of the subject matter, as well as mental state (sleepiness, medications, etc.). Intelligence testing, ideally, will have a bias towards ability and performance, not memory and knowledge,...but test design can vary.

    So, the question remains, is there any such thing as IQ? I believe there is in the sense that there is variation in mental abilities and performance between individuals within specific areas (verbal/sensory/physical learning and problem solving). However, I believe there are inherent limitations in how we test and the accuracy of the results.

    So, to be tested within a specific area,...score high as compared to others,...and still interpret yourself as lacking intelligence,...I don't think this is so unusual. It is a rare thing to be highly intelligent in multiple areas,...likely more so within the autistic population given how our brains develop. Furthermore, recognizing a lack of intelligence and/or knowledge within oneself, is often, in and of itself, a characteristic of an intelligent person,...as many people who are not intelligent, generally do not recognize their situation.
     
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  12. watersprite

    watersprite inadvertent vagabond V.I.P Member

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    A somewhat apt quote:
    “Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge.”
    - Charles Darwin
     
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  13. BoltzmannBrain17

    BoltzmannBrain17 Member

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    I think IQ tests do a respectable job of measuring a broad mental capability ( the g-factor) that is a reasonable proxy for intelligence. And I think intelligence is an important thing to have and can be advantageous if you have lots of it. Especially in today's tech filled world. Ultimately though there is more to life than intelligence and it is possible to lead a successful happy life with average or even below average intelligence.
    Screenshot_20210608-093518~2.png
    I'd also like to point out that Full Scale IQ scores are not generated by averaging index or subtest scores. They are generated by summing the Scaled Scores of certain subtests and looking at what score that corresponds to on age appropriate norms.
     
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  14. Nervous Rex

    Nervous Rex High-functioning autistic V.I.P Member

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    A friend in school once told me I was "smart in school, dumb in life."
     
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  15. Nervous Rex

    Nervous Rex High-functioning autistic V.I.P Member

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    100% agreed. The traditional IQ test just measures your ability to remember vocabulary, trivia, and do simple puzzles. I scored very well on an IQ test as a teenager.

    More and more, modern science is embracing the idea of multiple-intelligences. There are emotional, logic/mathematical, interpersonal, musical, and bodily intelligences, and others.

    The bodily intelligence is interesting to me, because coordination is in the brain. That means that the stereotypical "dumbs jocks" in school are just as intelligent as the stereotypical "geeks", but in a completely different way.
     
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  16. watersprite

    watersprite inadvertent vagabond V.I.P Member

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    a funny quip-y thing to say at least on the surface, that.
    It is far from being a universal truth though.
     
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  17. Nervous Rex

    Nervous Rex High-functioning autistic V.I.P Member

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    I had a similar experience. They said I had to have an IQ test in high school as part of getting into Honor Society. I now think that was a shallow excuse for them trying to figure out what was up with me.

    The guy giving the test didn't know if he should give me the children's test (for ages 16 and under) or the adult test (for ages 17 and up), since it was two weeks until my 17th birthday. So he gave me the kids test. All during the test, he kept muttering, "I should have given you the adult test." Then, at the end, I asked jokingly, "So, did I pass?" He explained that the IQ test gives you progressively harder questions until you start getting them wrong, so they can measure exactly how far you can get. He then said, "So, you're not supposed to get them all right." From that, I assume that I got them all right in at least a few topics of the test.

    They never told me my IQ, but I assume it's fairly high. That was 30+ years ago. I have been tempted to get an IQ test just to find out what my IQ really is, but I always stop myself because:

    A) What am I going to do with it? Get a card like Wile E. Coyote that says "Super Genius" on it? I would probably go on a massive ego trip if I knew my IQ, so I think I'm better off not knowing.

    B) I hated the pressure to succeed that I felt from everyone when I was in school. I don't want another reason for pressure. I was valedictorian in high school, voted most likely to succeed, graduated college with honors. But I've never felt an internal drive to succeed. I just want to get through life quietly and calmly, earn a paycheck and then go home and relax. Can that be successful enough?
     
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  18. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

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    This is sad..

    I am not sure what you mean by "high punctuation" but I assume it is safe to say you received an I.Q. score that is much higher than average.

    Why is this sad.. well..self-depreciation is often used to attempt to make others feel better at the cost of oneself.. but i find this to be immoral. Think about this another way. Say the results are indeed accurate and true, if you call yourself "dumb as hell" with a high score, what are the adjectives you would use to describe everyone who has scores below you?

    ..it just doesnt help.
     
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  19. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

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    The measurement of intelligence..well ...

    A test attempts to constrain some aspect of reality and measure your current performance against those constraints.

    An I.Q. test attempts to simulate all aspects of reality that require abstraction to solve and measure your performance. The overall result is your "g-factor". That is really all it is.

    The argument is your "g-factor" is the quantified ability for one to abstract and abstracting is the fundamental cognitive process for solving all the problems one faces in life.

    Intelligence is really an all-pervasive trait that is expressed in everything we do and testing is only required because of the general lack of knowledge/understanding required to make objective observations of ones intelligence based on behavior.
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2021
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  20. Gerald Wilgus

    Gerald Wilgus Well-Known Member

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    IQ tests are a social construct and highly biased. For a good discussion, see Stephen J. Gould's, The Mismeasure of Man. He discusses how IQ measures are an underlying assumption of biological determinism where worth is assigned through the measure of intelligence as a single quantity. (We Neurodiverse know the fault in that.) He discusses two basic fallacies that create biases in measuring intelligence as a single quantity. There have been critiques of his book, but overall I would rather follow his argument than any idea that IQ is a substantive measurement.

    Personally, I resent it that my peers somehow learned of my score and thought that I must be normal in other aspects of my life when my social skills were severely retarded. Perhaps Dunning-Kruger in reverse where people make attribution for skills that one does not possess.
     
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