Communication Help - Married to a male Aspie

[ABICBAS]

Hello! First post, a little nervous. I guess first a little background about my husband and I. we have been together 3+ years, and married nearly two (coming up in June). I love my husband and I know he loves me, but I struggle to feel happy at times. The current issues being faced seems to be going on for the last year or so. My husband has done well learning to communicate important things in a way I understand and, for the most part, don't hurt my feelings. However, when i try to communicate issues, or problems that I would like him to see or work on, he gets defensive and turns the conversation back around on what I need to work on or change, and I don't feel like he hears me. I work hard to remember what makes him more comfortable, etc. becuase he comes out of his head and can be himself. I understand that certain things are hard for him, like cuddling, showing affection, etc. however, lately I keep thinking, when is it his turn to step out of his comfort zone, or his turn to comprimise. I know the problem is lack of clear communication, the biggest part being a difference in definitions. (best example here, when I had trouble at work, he said that sometimes I take things personally. this hurt my feelings as I thought he was saying that I was weak. It took two weeks for us to realize there was a disconnect and he clarified that he saw it as a good quality in me because it made me more compassionate, and recognized/confirmed it wasn't something that I could or needed to change.) From other threads, an idea I had was confirmed as a good possibility and I was wanting advice from other Aspie males. I want to make a 'guide book' for him about me (and hopefully vice versa) as talking about issues doesn't get us anywhere and we both feel hurt. I want to include key words and explanations, an example being 'Be romantic: this does not mean I want something from a movie, it means I want to see you make an effort to do something special for just us that I also enjoy." . Again, I am not saying this is all his fault, as I know we communicate differently and we do both try. Anything i should make a point to include?
thanks a bunch!

 

[Judge]

Are we to presume that your husband is a formally diagnosed autistic? It's not entirely clear to me. I'm assuming as well you are Neurotypical.

Were you aware of his being autistic from the outset of your relationship? It just strikes me as odd to think after three years, you've only begun to notice his traits and behaviors in the last year. We're hard-wired for traits and behaviors...by the time we're adults I don't see them suddenly appearing.

I guess what I'm pointing out is that changes in relationships can sometimes reflect non-neurological concerns. Have you already ruled them out?

 

[purplemezzo]

My daughter has ASD Level 1 (formerly called Aspergers). It runs on my side of the family. My husband is not on the spectrum, yet yours and mine sound very similar, but that is in the past for us. We attended marriage counseling for about a year and learned how to communicate. It's been about a year and a half since we attended. Best money we've ever spent!

 

[ABICBAS]

thank you for the reply. No, he isn't formally diagnosed, and no I didn't know he was before we got together. Yes I am NT, and the reason he believes he is (he is 35 now, I am 25) is becuase he had been missed diagnosed repeatedly when he was younger with OCD and something else. He did a bunch of research and it all kind of clicked why he does what he does, etc. When he found the research and had me read and explained things to me, it actually greatly helped our relationship and communication. As far as non-neuroligcial concerns, for the most part yes I have ruled those out. As for the last year or so we keep having disagreements (we rarely actually fight) about the same things, and I keep feeling the same way. That's why I have come to the conclusion it is a breakdown of communication and I want to try something new. I have found it is easier for me to change the way I communicate with him than expecting him to learn or understand if I just keep trying the same way. ( I have, and it didn't work. lol.) I read in a different post something about an anology with love or affection is currency and NT and AS (I hope I used those right) have different types. I feel, and have been told, that I do a great job making him comfortable and happy. Now i am trying to find a way to correctly communicate my needs.
Purplemezzo, thanks for the reply as well. We may look at that next, but i don't feel like this is an issue so big that we can't work it out.

 

[Judge]

My husband is not on the spectrum, yet yours and mine sound very similar, but that is in the past for us. We attended marriage counseling for about a year and learned how to communicate. It's been about a year and a half since we attended. Best money we've ever spent!

Thank you. Not every communication problem comes down to neurology alone.

 

[Judge]

As far as non-neuroligcial concerns, for the most part yes I have ruled those out. As for the last year or so we keep having disagreements (we rarely actually fight) about the same things, and I keep feeling the same way. That's why I have come to the conclusion it is a breakdown of communication and I want to try something new.

So...in your opinion, what has changed in the last year? What would make communication break down at that point in time based on neurological conditions that have likely existed with your husband since his childhood? What if he really is an Aspie and has simply grown "comfortable" about it in the last year? Might be interesting if you were to ask him that. I think most of us change to some degree when we figure out our own autism. And the process is bound to have some "collateral" effects with relationships. Which can be really good- or really bad.

From my perspective it seems difficult for Neurotypicals to grasp that our ability to modify our behavior is limited- and has no clearly defined boundaries. Some things we can work on, other things are simply not possible no matter how much we try.

You may have an advantage here if this is the case, in that you can ask him to recall how things were earlier. That he does have the capability of those behaviors. However understand this- if he's simply emulating NT behavior to fulfill a relationship, it's a very taxing process for him. A process that as a self-aware Aspie, he may no longer be willing to do to the degree that made you happiest. IMO, it's critical for you to understand this. Probably not what you'd like to hear, but at least you are hearing it from an Aspie male perspective as requested. Unless of course, the reasons for the change in your relationship are grounded in marital strife not related to neurological differences.

 

[Grumpy Cat]

I'm a girl (I know you wanted advice from men), but I'm reading this book called "Asperger Syndrome and Long Term Relationships" by Ashley Stanford because I'm trying to understand Aspies more. I'm an NT, at least I test out as one. One thing that stuck out to me was when she said that an NT and an Aspie are like two different countries that speak different languages and they both have to find ways to communicate with each other. I believe a relationship is a two way street and both parties need to learn about the other. She said that if you (NT) have an important conversation you want to have with your Aspie, then you need to make things more comfortable for your Aspie (because they have a hard time with eye contact) and turn lights down using candles, sit back to back, talk while doing an activity such as walking. Sometimes a to-do list may help it says. It does say that as an NT, you will need to ask for what you want (I'm talking about the being romantic part) - he may not know what you mean by being "romantic". The book says this one woman started to verbalize everything to her husband such as what she wanted (a hug), what she needed him to do (help with taking in groceries), and also would tell him how she was feeling at any given time because Aspies have a hard time recognizing certain facial and body expressions and he also was expected to tell her how he was feeling because his body language was not mirroring his emotions at that time. I'm about half way through the book. I can understand why NT's and Aspies have difficulty communicating - since 85% or more of communication is nonverbal (body language and facial expressions). You as a couple just have to be crafty and find ways around that.

What I want to know is if I did what the book said and told an Aspie everything I wanted and needed, would the Aspie see me as talking down to them? Or think of me as a mother figure trying to tell them what they should be doing?

 

[Ereth]

Okay . . . so I was going to respond to the most recent post made by the OP, but it got deleted or something (?), so I can't quote it.

What I intended to say was that whatever communication problems are present in the marriage, they are probably not exclusively due to an Aspie/NT-specific disconnect. To the OP, I also say that you're definitely welcome here.

 

[ABICBAS]

From my perspective it's incredibly difficult for Neurotypicals to grasp that our ability to modify our behavior is limited- and has no clearly defined boundaries. Some things we can work on, other things are not.

You may have an advantage here if this is the case, in that you can ask him to recall how things were earlier. That he does have the capability of those behaviors. However understand this- if he's simply emulating NT behavior to fulfill a relationship, it's a very taxing process for him. A process that as a self-aware Aspie, he may no longer be willing to do to the degree that made you happiest..

YAY! Yes, that is it. He has expressed that I have made him comfortable, 'fearing it may be too comfortable'. I didn't get it then, I do now. I know he can't change, and I don't want affection regularly becuase I do know it is taxing and see the effects of 5-10 minutes of sitting next to each other touching last for a day or so. What I want to know, to make the most of the times he can show affection in 'my language', what can I do to help him?

 

[ABICBAS]

wow, I can not do forums. I deleted that post becuase i had misread a post and realized i was being irrational in my response. thank you for the responses, now that i have read the posts correctly, i do feel welcome. (still nervous, lol). nurseangie, be careful about the lights and candle thing, for my husband would be more on edge because of unspoken expectations. It has taken me a while to know what is 'his' comfortable. Also, i agree with the body language, i used to cross my arms when i was thinking during conversations, he thought i was mad for the longest time until he told me. I stopped doing it after that. I do know that if I (or we) close our eyes when talking, it helps greatly becuase then we only have voice inflection and the actual words to concentrate on. I have tried to tell my husband what I need directly and logically and literally, but he stilll doesn't get it, so i must assume that i have communicated incorrectly. Judge, this goes back to your reply as well. the ability to modify behaviour reaches into communication too. I have absolutely no problems changing the way i do things because i know it is way easier for me to do than him. I just have run out of ideas on what new to try.

 

[Judge]

YAY! Yes, that is it. He has expressed that I have made him comfortable, 'fearing it may be too comfortable'. I didn't get it then, I do now. I know he can't change, and I don't want affection regularly becuase I do know it is taxing and see the effects of 5-10 minutes of sitting next to each other touching last for a day or so. What I want to know, to make the most of the times he can show affection in 'my language', what can I do to help him?

Since you're both aware of what can potentially be stressful for him, it seems to me those situations that you as a Neurotypical might emotionally "capitalize" on would be at times when you are both most at ease....without any external stress around you. I don't think I could get any more specific than that. I'm afraid it becomes incumbent on you more than him to be able to "read" him...so you know when to back off.

 

[ABICBAS]

Since you're both aware of what can potentially be stressful for him, it seems to me those situations that you as a Neurotypical might emotionally "capitalize" on would be at times when you are both most at ease....without any external stress around you. I don't think I could get any more specific than that. I'm afraid it becomes incumbent on you more than him to be able to "read" him...so you know when to back off.

thank you, I think that answers what I was looking for and what i really need to communicate. Thank you all. oh, I am at work but will check this thread again when i get off work. thank you again.

 

[Judge]

Perhaps the best thing you could do for your husband is to encourage him to join us here online...so he can learn even more about autism. Many of us remain self-diagnosed as well.

 

[ABICBAS]

Hello all! I said i would touch base once i was home. I talked with my husband (who just joined a few minutes ago) and i think we have found a new plan! I feel better already and the conversation was very good! Thank you sooo much Judge, with your comment about Aspie's having a limited amount of room to change or work on things helped me so much. We have decided that when I have an issue, I write down the topic, a short explanation why it bothers me, and what I would like to see. I have to stay short, sweet, and precise. The rest of the sheet (only one page) is for my husband to answer the question: "when it come to _______, what CAN you do, or what is possible in your parameters." He thinks that this may be good option because I will be aware and (hopefully) understand what he can do.
thank you all!!
(I am logging off so my husband can get on.)

 

[Warwick C]

It might be helpful to have a look at Dizzies article on comunication, she is also a member here.

http://ownshrink.com/

 

[Warwick C]

I just feel that I am supporting our members, and a big shout out for HelloDizzy for doing the research for us to learn from.

 

[Loomis]

I read this quote on the blog Barking Up The Wrong Tree

"One often quoted study (Mehrabian & Ferris, 1967) found that of all the information conveyed to another person when we say something that is emotional (not informational), only 7 percent is contained in the actual meaning of the words we use."

I am surprised at the low percentage for meaning conveyed by words: seven percent? That really puts us aspies at an even greater disadvantage than I had assumed. I am somewhat suspicious of the validity of this number since the study is almost 50 years old. You would think a person could find something more recent to confirm the statistic.

At any rate whatever the actual percent may be, there is undoubtedly a vast amount of information conveyed non-verbally.

Since my diagnosis two years ago I try very hard to see and understand as much as I can of the nonverbal communication around me. When I am in a group I watch people and try to get a sense for what information they are projecting non-verbally. You can infer some things from the way they are dressed, how they are groomed, hair style, voice tone, etc. I am not very good at it but I am able to get a feeling about people's personality. When I try to put the "sense" I get it into words I find it very difficult. It is like I have an impression of the person but I can't express or describe it with words.

One of the things I have been doing to improve my ability to understand and describe people is studying enneagrams. This website gives a brief description of the types:

Enneagram Central

Enneagram types are sorta like Myers Brigggs types but different, and I think, easier to understand and see as well as being more descriptive. Sometimes I can categorize a person easily into one of the enneagram types and I can relate to and understand them better.

There are some threads on this site where aspiecentral members identify their enneagram type. For example:

https://www.aspiescentral.com/threads/personality-and-autism-spectrum-tests.232/

What I find curious is that the aspiecentral threads for Myers Briggs overwhelmingly place us into just a couple of the categories such as INTJ, but there is much more variability of aspies spread among the nine enneagram types.

 

[Joel I]

I am so happy I found these thread! I'm an Aspie who is engaged & my partner is an NT. When we got engaged I had never heard about AS. For a while we were very happy but then we started having difficulties mostly with communication that started about the time we got a house together. I can definitely sympathise but we have a no answers yet we have a long road ahead of us.

 

[Judge]

I am so happy I found these thread! I'm an Aspie who is engaged & my partner is an NT. When we got engaged I had never heard about AS. For a while we were very happy but then we started having difficulties mostly with communication that started about the time we got a house together. I can definitely sympathise but we have a no answers yet we have a long road ahead of us.

My greatest challenge with relationships with NTs was usually the same dynamic. The routine need to maintain my personal space. Alone. Apart. All the while being under the same roof. They didn't get it. It's quite a challenge...but then at the time neither was I aware of my own autism either.

 

[Joel I]

Well it got rather bad today I ended up melting down yelling and then leaving. After I left he feel down the front stairs & calling me to rescue him. I ignored my phone for ages because I was still highly stung and hadn't calmed yet.
We sorted out that we love each other to much to stay mad. He just joined the other day so is wanting to learn how to fix things.