Pariah Dog
Well-Known Member
I have been trying the online dating thing for a few weeks and have got to a few discussions with some ladies but not a date as of yet. I however looked into some realities of the situation and it started to look pretty grim.
To start off, I did some research on how to write a message that is likely to catch a ladies interest and make a message back more likely. I have become quite good at it I think when I compare it to what most guys write (I'll get to that later). "Hey" or "What's Up" are not going to cut it, not by a long shot.
The second point I'd like to make, and I am not trying to be narcissistic with this, just trying to make a point with a scientific mind set. But I am pretty decent looking by traditional standards. I once submitted some pictures to "hot or not" years ago (does that site still exist?) and I averaged a rating of 8/10. Back then I was like a heavy metal sort of nerd that could clean up ok when I had to. I am in far better shape now and better groomed... etc. I have other evidence to support this. It is unusual for me to talk about things in this sort of way as I make a strong effort to live in a humbled way, but again I'm trying to speak in the interest of science.
The third point. It is apparently an unfortunate truth that all online dating sites have a higher number of men than women using them.
When I send out messages, I learned I can expect that about 1 in 20 will message me back. This is on a popular paid dating site. I feel like at that rate it might not take too long to get through the whole available pool. Then I read something quite profound under one advice page suggesting to try to make a fake profile as a girl to see what the best guys first messages look like.
I took the challenge. I was not going to pay for another account so I just did this on "Plenty of Fish" where it is free. I just typed in "pretty girl" on google images and chose one to make this said profile. I wanted one that was attractive but not unrealistically so. She was petite, cute, dressed like a normal girl on a summer day wearing a tank top. I made her 26 years old.
I made the profile with a paragraph descriptor making her sound like a pretty average and good girl. Then the messages started coming in....
50 messages in the first hour. And I did this late at night on a week day. The next afternoon there were hundreds upon hundreds of messages. I lost the password after that and I don't really care, i've seen all I want to see. I have heard that some attractive women will make a profile on a dating site and give up after the first day because the volume of messages that come in are ridiculous. I heard about that but I had no idea. The truth seemed much worse that what I have read about.
What I learned.
1. The bulk of the messages from the guys were a pathetic "hey" or "what's up?" Does that ever work for any of them?
2. The few guys that wrote a nice good message and made an effort to show they are probably not some douchebag accounted for about 5% of the messages
3. Of those 5% of guys, I didn't see that any of them would write appreciably better or more clever than I would to a lady on a first message. They seemed in line with what all the experts agree on. And when I'm talking about expert advised messaging I don't mean anything dishonest, just advice on increasing communications skills.
4. Reflective of the region I live in, many of the guys who messaged appeared to be redneck douche bags, or...to put this as politically correct as I can... barely literate inner city gang banger type scum bags.
5. I felt that I basically have seen what goes on behind the curtains. I think that if I were a women I would grow a sense of contempt towards men in general after repeated exposure to this.
So this was all quite crushing really. There is no wonder I only get a response from a woman 5% of the time. Even if I write a genuine message and have the most honorable intentions, even if I could be seen as in the top 5% of the cut, that still puts me up against maybe... 20 other guys on the same level or better who messaged her that day? Maybe the paid sites don't have nearly as much traffic as "Plenty of Fish" so that might be hard to say.
To sum this experience up. I message a lady then I have a 5% chance of entering a conversation with her. Of that 5% I have an unknown chance of it resulting in even one date, unknown because it has not yet happened. Lets say a 2% chance maybe from our starting point to be optimistic.
This compared to how things are changing for me in real life. Since I have been getting in better shape and have lived a very different life since fleeing my abusive ex last spring. My confidence has grown a fair bit. At a recent company Christmas party, which was a large event with many companies in attendance. I sat myself at a table with two very attractive ladies who then wanted to spend much of the evening with me and through some of the activities there. It didn't go beyond that as it turns out they have fella's of their own (who weren't in attendance). But that's a start, it wasn't so long ago I seemed virtually invisible to women. My co-workers were awe struck that I could just sit down with them and generate that much interest.
To the point I'm getting at to sum this up. If I approach a lady in real life, I am now finding there is a better than 50% chance she wants to carry a conversation with me, and will smile, and laugh, and be genuinely interested. Now she may not be available, or interested enough to want to date me, and being aspie my social skills are somewhat handicapped, but I figure the odds of that leading somewhere are far better than the alternative.
Thoughts on the matter? How does online dating work out for men at all to end up in a relationship? Does it take thousands of attempts on average? Ironically I met my said abusive ex on plenty of fish back in 2009 I think it was. I had never thought about the statistics behind it before. She told me she liked me because I was one of an extremely rare few guys who didn't seem like a grease ball.
I think I can do far better in person. I just need to get myself in more social situations. I am considering joining a hiking club in my area for starters.
To start off, I did some research on how to write a message that is likely to catch a ladies interest and make a message back more likely. I have become quite good at it I think when I compare it to what most guys write (I'll get to that later). "Hey" or "What's Up" are not going to cut it, not by a long shot.
The second point I'd like to make, and I am not trying to be narcissistic with this, just trying to make a point with a scientific mind set. But I am pretty decent looking by traditional standards. I once submitted some pictures to "hot or not" years ago (does that site still exist?) and I averaged a rating of 8/10. Back then I was like a heavy metal sort of nerd that could clean up ok when I had to. I am in far better shape now and better groomed... etc. I have other evidence to support this. It is unusual for me to talk about things in this sort of way as I make a strong effort to live in a humbled way, but again I'm trying to speak in the interest of science.
The third point. It is apparently an unfortunate truth that all online dating sites have a higher number of men than women using them.
When I send out messages, I learned I can expect that about 1 in 20 will message me back. This is on a popular paid dating site. I feel like at that rate it might not take too long to get through the whole available pool. Then I read something quite profound under one advice page suggesting to try to make a fake profile as a girl to see what the best guys first messages look like.
I took the challenge. I was not going to pay for another account so I just did this on "Plenty of Fish" where it is free. I just typed in "pretty girl" on google images and chose one to make this said profile. I wanted one that was attractive but not unrealistically so. She was petite, cute, dressed like a normal girl on a summer day wearing a tank top. I made her 26 years old.
I made the profile with a paragraph descriptor making her sound like a pretty average and good girl. Then the messages started coming in....
50 messages in the first hour. And I did this late at night on a week day. The next afternoon there were hundreds upon hundreds of messages. I lost the password after that and I don't really care, i've seen all I want to see. I have heard that some attractive women will make a profile on a dating site and give up after the first day because the volume of messages that come in are ridiculous. I heard about that but I had no idea. The truth seemed much worse that what I have read about.
What I learned.
1. The bulk of the messages from the guys were a pathetic "hey" or "what's up?" Does that ever work for any of them?
2. The few guys that wrote a nice good message and made an effort to show they are probably not some douchebag accounted for about 5% of the messages
3. Of those 5% of guys, I didn't see that any of them would write appreciably better or more clever than I would to a lady on a first message. They seemed in line with what all the experts agree on. And when I'm talking about expert advised messaging I don't mean anything dishonest, just advice on increasing communications skills.
4. Reflective of the region I live in, many of the guys who messaged appeared to be redneck douche bags, or...to put this as politically correct as I can... barely literate inner city gang banger type scum bags.
5. I felt that I basically have seen what goes on behind the curtains. I think that if I were a women I would grow a sense of contempt towards men in general after repeated exposure to this.
So this was all quite crushing really. There is no wonder I only get a response from a woman 5% of the time. Even if I write a genuine message and have the most honorable intentions, even if I could be seen as in the top 5% of the cut, that still puts me up against maybe... 20 other guys on the same level or better who messaged her that day? Maybe the paid sites don't have nearly as much traffic as "Plenty of Fish" so that might be hard to say.
To sum this experience up. I message a lady then I have a 5% chance of entering a conversation with her. Of that 5% I have an unknown chance of it resulting in even one date, unknown because it has not yet happened. Lets say a 2% chance maybe from our starting point to be optimistic.
This compared to how things are changing for me in real life. Since I have been getting in better shape and have lived a very different life since fleeing my abusive ex last spring. My confidence has grown a fair bit. At a recent company Christmas party, which was a large event with many companies in attendance. I sat myself at a table with two very attractive ladies who then wanted to spend much of the evening with me and through some of the activities there. It didn't go beyond that as it turns out they have fella's of their own (who weren't in attendance). But that's a start, it wasn't so long ago I seemed virtually invisible to women. My co-workers were awe struck that I could just sit down with them and generate that much interest.
To the point I'm getting at to sum this up. If I approach a lady in real life, I am now finding there is a better than 50% chance she wants to carry a conversation with me, and will smile, and laugh, and be genuinely interested. Now she may not be available, or interested enough to want to date me, and being aspie my social skills are somewhat handicapped, but I figure the odds of that leading somewhere are far better than the alternative.
Thoughts on the matter? How does online dating work out for men at all to end up in a relationship? Does it take thousands of attempts on average? Ironically I met my said abusive ex on plenty of fish back in 2009 I think it was. I had never thought about the statistics behind it before. She told me she liked me because I was one of an extremely rare few guys who didn't seem like a grease ball.
I think I can do far better in person. I just need to get myself in more social situations. I am considering joining a hiking club in my area for starters.
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