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Featured Online Dating entirely useless for most men?

Discussion in 'Love, Relationships and Dating' started by Pariah Dog, Nov 26, 2017.

  1. Pariah Dog

    Pariah Dog Well-Known Member

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    I have been trying the online dating thing for a few weeks and have got to a few discussions with some ladies but not a date as of yet. I however looked into some realities of the situation and it started to look pretty grim.

    To start off, I did some research on how to write a message that is likely to catch a ladies interest and make a message back more likely. I have become quite good at it I think when I compare it to what most guys write (I'll get to that later). "Hey" or "What's Up" are not going to cut it, not by a long shot.

    The second point I'd like to make, and I am not trying to be narcissistic with this, just trying to make a point with a scientific mind set. But I am pretty decent looking by traditional standards. I once submitted some pictures to "hot or not" years ago (does that site still exist?) and I averaged a rating of 8/10. Back then I was like a heavy metal sort of nerd that could clean up ok when I had to. I am in far better shape now and better groomed... etc. I have other evidence to support this. It is unusual for me to talk about things in this sort of way as I make a strong effort to live in a humbled way, but again I'm trying to speak in the interest of science.

    The third point. It is apparently an unfortunate truth that all online dating sites have a higher number of men than women using them.

    When I send out messages, I learned I can expect that about 1 in 20 will message me back. This is on a popular paid dating site. I feel like at that rate it might not take too long to get through the whole available pool. Then I read something quite profound under one advice page suggesting to try to make a fake profile as a girl to see what the best guys first messages look like.

    I took the challenge. I was not going to pay for another account so I just did this on "Plenty of Fish" where it is free. I just typed in "pretty girl" on google images and chose one to make this said profile. I wanted one that was attractive but not unrealistically so. She was petite, cute, dressed like a normal girl on a summer day wearing a tank top. I made her 26 years old.

    I made the profile with a paragraph descriptor making her sound like a pretty average and good girl. Then the messages started coming in....

    50 messages in the first hour. And I did this late at night on a week day. The next afternoon there were hundreds upon hundreds of messages. I lost the password after that and I don't really care, i've seen all I want to see. I have heard that some attractive women will make a profile on a dating site and give up after the first day because the volume of messages that come in are ridiculous. I heard about that but I had no idea. The truth seemed much worse that what I have read about.

    What I learned.

    1. The bulk of the messages from the guys were a pathetic "hey" or "what's up?" Does that ever work for any of them?

    2. The few guys that wrote a nice good message and made an effort to show they are probably not some douchebag accounted for about 5% of the messages

    3. Of those 5% of guys, I didn't see that any of them would write appreciably better or more clever than I would to a lady on a first message. They seemed in line with what all the experts agree on. And when I'm talking about expert advised messaging I don't mean anything dishonest, just advice on increasing communications skills.

    4. Reflective of the region I live in, many of the guys who messaged appeared to be redneck douche bags, or...to put this as politically correct as I can... barely literate inner city gang banger type scum bags.

    5. I felt that I basically have seen what goes on behind the curtains. I think that if I were a women I would grow a sense of contempt towards men in general after repeated exposure to this.


    So this was all quite crushing really. There is no wonder I only get a response from a woman 5% of the time. Even if I write a genuine message and have the most honorable intentions, even if I could be seen as in the top 5% of the cut, that still puts me up against maybe... 20 other guys on the same level or better who messaged her that day? Maybe the paid sites don't have nearly as much traffic as "Plenty of Fish" so that might be hard to say.

    To sum this experience up. I message a lady then I have a 5% chance of entering a conversation with her. Of that 5% I have an unknown chance of it resulting in even one date, unknown because it has not yet happened. Lets say a 2% chance maybe from our starting point to be optimistic.


    This compared to how things are changing for me in real life. Since I have been getting in better shape and have lived a very different life since fleeing my abusive ex last spring. My confidence has grown a fair bit. At a recent company Christmas party, which was a large event with many companies in attendance. I sat myself at a table with two very attractive ladies who then wanted to spend much of the evening with me and through some of the activities there. It didn't go beyond that as it turns out they have fella's of their own (who weren't in attendance). But that's a start, it wasn't so long ago I seemed virtually invisible to women. My co-workers were awe struck that I could just sit down with them and generate that much interest.

    To the point I'm getting at to sum this up. If I approach a lady in real life, I am now finding there is a better than 50% chance she wants to carry a conversation with me, and will smile, and laugh, and be genuinely interested. Now she may not be available, or interested enough to want to date me, and being aspie my social skills are somewhat handicapped, but I figure the odds of that leading somewhere are far better than the alternative.

    Thoughts on the matter? How does online dating work out for men at all to end up in a relationship? Does it take thousands of attempts on average? Ironically I met my said abusive ex on plenty of fish back in 2009 I think it was. I had never thought about the statistics behind it before. She told me she liked me because I was one of an extremely rare few guys who didn't seem like a grease ball.

    I think I can do far better in person. I just need to get myself in more social situations. I am considering joining a hiking club in my area for starters.
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2017
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  2. Mr Allen

    Mr Allen Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    I'm on Tinder on my phone, and I've had a few matches in the UK, but I don't think Dad would approve of me going on Tinder dates as a 41 year old Aspie.
     
  3. The Midge

    The Midge Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    Well one thing for sure is that a < 1% chance on a dating site is a lot greater chance than not doing anything at all.
     
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  4. Roy pryer

    Roy pryer Active Member

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    The reason i wouldn't go on a dating site is because i dont need to. women have always made the first move with me all my life. "not so much these days as i am 72. But in my younger days was quite good looking. But when they showed any interest i used to start shaking & make my escape. I would have liked to have married & had two little girls but it wasn't meant to be. I still keep my distance from women.
     
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  5. Ambi

    Ambi Well-Known Member

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    The main issue I had with online dating was this: most of the guys had the same description, and most of the women had the same description (I was interested in men, but of course I checked out the girls out of boredom and curiosity of what all they put down). The men put down some variation of: I like doing outdoorsy things, I like concerts, I like hanging out with my friends but also quiet evenings in, and maybe I like some specific artsy thing. The women put down some variation of: I love joking around, but I can be serious too, I love movies and concerts, but I like a private evening in too. Basically, they were either all the same....OR....they were all using the profile description simply to give out the loud and clear message that they were "normal", relatable, safe, fun, and shared the basic culture as the majority of the population. So they didn't really say a heck of a lot other than how much they valued normalcy - at least the appearance of it. Then what I struggled with was....I honestly wasn't relating to all of that normalcy, I was far more quirky.

    I think the key is to just find someone whose real personality might shine through and might be one you are genuinely really drawn towards, rather than just finding the people you might think are good looking. First moves form guys were always just causal "hey" and a comment on my profile description to start a conversation. But the only kind of quirky I found on those sites was very off-putting. I had some exciting conversations with cute guys I liked, but they never had much in common with me, and they fizzled out - like my real life relationships fizzled out when I could appreciate the guy, but we didn't share a heck of a lot in common so they couldn't really appreciate me. All of those masses of more "normal" girls out there would eventually outcompete me with their promise of shared normalcy :)

    Not sure if any of this is useful - and it was only based on my own experience. Maybe you can avoid my pitfalls!

    When I did meet my husband, it was through a community in which we shared our values and life goals - but we also had an uncanny sharing of personality traits and quirky interests/tendencies.
     
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  6. Sid Delicious

    Sid Delicious Balloon animal safety control

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    I've used online dating sites in the past and met one of my exes online. For a women, they are overwhelming! I can put up a pretty empty profile and within 24 hours I will have over 100 messages. Assuming I don't have a job or anything else to do, I can spend all day going through those messages and (as you pointed out) maybe five will be more than 'Hi babe. Wanna chat x'. On certain dating sites, there will be a number of (sometimes fairly artistic) photographed genitalia to go through as well. So before I even get to looking at profiles, I've spent an entire day going through the rubbish.

    I try to make it very straightforward for men and make it clear about what sort of person I am, what I am looking for and what I'm not attracted to. I don't want to waste someone's time if I know I will never consider dating them. Maybe 2% of men will bother to read my profile. Even the guys who bother writing more than a sentence rarely bother to actually check we are a good match first. So although I try to be poilite and actually respond to those 5%, the ones who I turn down tend to get annoyed. Even when I point out the obvious, e.g. 'my profile states I'm looking for men between 33 and 49 and you are 26' or 'my profile states that I like skinny nerds and find beards a turn off and you are a Hagrid lookalike who loves Eastenders'. Ok, I've never actually called anyone obese or referred to them as Hagrid, but you get my point. It's as if men take the approach of just spamming every single female on the site with the same message without checking that they are a match and then get annoyed with the women because they've wasted their time and effort.

    I do feel bad for the genuine guys on dating sites who bother to fill in a profile honestly, actually read other people's profiles and then write more than two sentences to a woman. A lot of dating sites now make it a bit easier by including a questionnaire that just requires ticking boxes and then match you up with someone else's answers. But people still lie on the questionnaires, so it isn't fool proof.

    This is the first time I've been single in a while and I've pretty much stayed away from dating sites this time, as I don't have the inclination to go through all of that work again. But good luck to anyone who is giving it a go and I hope you find someone!
     
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  7. tree

    tree Blue/Green Staff Member V.I.P Member

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    The conclusion seems to be that most men
    are entirely useless at online dating.
    From what I read here....

    That is to say, the majority of males presenting
    themselves to online dating services apparently
    make the minimum effort while expecting the
    maximum result.
     
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  8. Suiseiseki

    Suiseiseki I can't feel the back of my eyes

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    I've been using dating sites for years and have had no real success.
    Well that's not exactly true, I have hooked up twice. But I've gone on a lot of dates and been ghosted afterwards so, the whole thing has gotten very stale.
    I met one girl who was great but it fizzled out and it hurt.
    No where else to meet girls, so I am stuck with it and I greatly dislike it.
     
  9. Suiseiseki

    Suiseiseki I can't feel the back of my eyes

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    Well if they have aspergers yes, men who have aspergers aren't exactly in high demand lol
     
  10. Jacoby

    Jacoby Well-Known Member

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    I've played around on it, 'likes' were at least a little validation even tho it could just be a mistake by someone. The way girls get flooded on that site make it seem really impossible to get anybody to notice you I think and when that many guys are hitting you up then why the guy with Aspergers? I could show more initiative and try to contact more people more but it seems like a total crap shoot. I'm probably not going to meet anybody IRL so the prospects online are pretty depressing.
     
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  11. Tobs

    Tobs Member

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    I've never been on a dating site nor do I intend to be. People have to get to know you in the real world or they won't give you a second thought, let alone remember you. Not that I'm interested in meeting someone new right now, for reasons explained elsewhere on here.

    Okay, that said. Dating sites are about coverage. You can -see- a lot more women from a hot air baloon than you can walking on the street. But you can reach less of them. You can throw notes or calling cards from your baloon, but I can walk up and ask for the time. Or offer an umbrella. Scarier, but more real. You just try to connect for a moment. They either allow that positive connection or reject it on the suspicion that you have ulterior motives.

    In response to Ambi about normalcy. I don't identify with normal either. But those normal folks are just as human as we are. They're just wired differently. ;)
     
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  12. Pariah Dog

    Pariah Dog Well-Known Member

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    I love this hot air balloon analogy. Spot on.

    So it's not just me then. It really is about as bad as I thought. :mask:

    I have heard guys brag about how many women they have hooked up with from tinder or plenty of fish. Often from guys who don't have much going on for them selves. Let me tell you, if their bragging is even half true they must be getting with the women who no one else is messaging. The "dragons" some will call them.

    Sometime's women send me a message first. I'll just say they are the ones that must be doing that because men don't contact them... for a reason.
     
  13. Pariah Dog

    Pariah Dog Well-Known Member

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    A lot of truth to this I find. It gets me how it seems 80% of them say they love to travel. Do they actually travel or just like the idea of it? Most people I know don't actually travel all that much. Most can't really afford it.

    Since I have not entirely given up on the idea of online dating maybe I should make my profile more unique. It is amusing seeing what changes can get you different attention. I just the other day changed my primary profile pic of myself looking all classy in a suit at an event, which replaced one of myself in a mirror selfie looking fit. The suit pic seems to draw an increase in both attention and quality of female. Maybe I have increased my chances of a date from 0.7% all the way up to 1.1%. :laughing:

    I am currently in back and forth communication with a couple of pretty ladies who seem like good people who have a fair amount in common with. I am scheduled to coffee date the one and another said she would like to meet me but we'll see. I don't hold out too much hope. People tend to be so flaky.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2017
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  14. Shiznown

    Shiznown Well-Known Member

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    You must be mistaken. According to some users on here where I've said the same thing, I was wrong. So how, how could this be true?
     
  15. Shiznown

    Shiznown Well-Known Member

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    Well, to be fair a lot of guys can't really be 100% sometimes. Take me for example and I have never done this OR brought any of the topics up ever to women whom I've met online on dating sites, so let us get that out of the way before anyone says anything. Anyway, if I was 100% on a profile and really wrote down all my life views and such, I don't think a profile that states"I think third wave feminism is a fraud used as a tool to damage gender relations.", "Globalist politicians are only globalist for power and are not for the betterment of society.", oh and this one "I am interested in occult knowledge and literature." would go over well. Those all will go over well in a royal blue state. Just putting that I'm a Libertarian on a profile page guarantees no responses.
     
  16. Shiznown

    Shiznown Well-Known Member

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    You're generalizing! I am so triggered!
     
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  17. Shiznown

    Shiznown Well-Known Member

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    What really gets me is the women who say they like to travel and have pictures up of them in France and other foreign countries and act all snobby, when they didn't even pay for the travel expense, their parents did.
     
  18. Tobs

    Tobs Member

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    "Dog with a bone."
     
  19. Roy pryer

    Roy pryer Active Member

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    To me guys who do online dating are very brave. I couldnt do it, just like i couldn't chat up a girl in the flesh. I would be terrified she said yes & i wouldn't be able to show up. More likely to throw up.
     
  20. Shiznown

    Shiznown Well-Known Member

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    My favorite profile I've seen on okcupid was where a girl stated(at least I assume they were biologically a female), stated that "If you aren't attracted to trans people, you're transphobic, plain and simple." So, I guess I need to be attracted to anyone with boobs even if they have a penis, or I'm a bad person.