Is there a way to not live in an apartment when you suffer with noise sensitivity? (UK only)

[Judge]

Yes, I know that you have posted that before, which is why I mentioned the idea of swapping apartments.
Perhaps you husband does not understand the difference between a sensitivity and an annoyance?

Swapping apartments sounds like an unrealistic request short of the person initiating the proposal willing to pay for both their move upstairs as well as the party existing above to move downstairs. Moving is a very dirty business for most people, apart from the monetary expense. Amounting to a "bridge too far" for both parties, even if acceptable to the landlord.

I'm inclined to think you're describing not just her husband, but that 98.2% of society. When autistic people's wants and needs fall by the wayside, based on a misunderstood perception of intolerance and attitude by a neurological majority rather than any considerations of some very real pathological sensitivities.

Expectations of NTs having a clear understanding of our wants and needs just don't translate well, if at all.

Leaving only a basic understanding of apartment living I learned long ago. Never to pick a unit with another unit above you. A lesson I learned having had to deal with that scenario only once. Beginning with a quiet tenant above, only to see her move and to be replaced by noisy tenants.

 

[Misty Avich]

I know me and my husband will be quiet if we lived in an upstairs apartment, as we're both rather lazy when we're home, and we have jobs that require going out the door during the week, and relatives to see at weekends. If we do have company (which isn't very often) we just sit on the couch with a cup of tea. I know living as quietly as possible can still sound like elephants to the people below if the floor is too thin, I think most people won't really mind, as most people aren't as noise-sensitive as me, unless the noise is persistent of course, such as antisocial behaviour, but I'm not talking about that.

 

[Judge]

I never wear shoes on carpeting, always removing them at the foyer. Though on rare occasion with arthritis acting up in my feet or legs, I've been known to hobble a bit with an aluminum cane that can make quite a racket if I'm not careful. And of course I really do try to walk light-footed on the carpeting.

Though at times I do miss living in a condominium with much thicker walls and no concerns about floors.

 

[Misty Avich]

The tenant who lived up there before had got rid of all the carpets in every room and replaced it with hardwood flooring. So now the tenants that are up there now (the noisy family) stomp around on hardwood floor.
And the floor is very thin. So just imagine how much the noise they make amplifies downwards whatever they do. And then add an energetic 2-year-old to the mix, who doesn't seem to have an ordinary bedtime routine, never gets taken out, and probably has a lot of outdoor toys up there he drags around and throws about. Absolute hell.

I wonder if they'll homeschool him when he gets to school age? If so I'm dreading the Phys Ed lessons.

 

[Mary Terry]

The tenant who lived up there before had got rid of all the carpets in every room and replaced it with hardwood flooring. So now the tenants that are up there now (the noisy family) stomp around on hardwood floor.
And the floor is very thin. So just imagine how much the noise they make amplifies downwards whatever they do. And then add an energetic 2-year-old to the mix, who doesn't seem to have an ordinary bedtime routine, never gets taken out, and probably has a lot of outdoor toys up there he drags around and throws about. Absolute hell.

I wonder if they'll homeschool him when he gets to school age? If so I'm dreading the Phys Ed lessons.

Just a few observations, Misty. You already mentioned that your upstairs neighbors bang on their floor when you play music too loudly in your downstairs apartment; if you and you husband leave your apartment to go to work, then you have no idea whether or not the parents upstairs take their toddler on outings when you are not home; you have never had children and claim you never will have children so gratuitous judgments about "ordinary bedtime routine" carry little weight with those of us who are parents and have survived the terrible two's and three's, and the midnight ear aches, fevers, sore throats, night terrors and a host of other things that are commonplace when you have children. A little empathy and sympathy for the little family upstairs might help you deal with your situation.

You need to move. Get after it, girl! What are you waiting for? No one should suffer like you do over some upstairs tenants in a cheaply built apartment building who have a toddler. Endlessly complaining about it does not help the situation.

 

[Misty Avich]

Just a few observations, Misty. You already mentioned that your upstairs neighbors bang on their floor when you play music too loudly in your downstairs apartment; if you and you husband leave your apartment to go to work, then you have no idea whether or not the parents upstairs take their toddler on outings when you are not home;

I knew someone would point this out sooner or later. Let me explain. I work during the day, my husband works mornings only so is usually home while I'm out at work, and he says they are up there thumping and banging about at any given time of the day. If I'm home I can hear them too, no matter what time of the day it is. Maybe they do go out but they don't have a car and we've very seldom seen them go out (or had peace indicating they are out whenever we're home). Yes we are home a lot too but we still go out more than they do, and for a couple with a baby they seem to be indoors an awful lot.

you have never had children and claim you never will have children so gratuitous judgments about "ordinary bedtime routine" carry little weight with those of us who are parents and have survived the terrible two's and three's, and the midnight ear aches, fevers, sore throats, night terrors and a host of other things that are commonplace when you have children.

Well most people I know have small children, and they all say their little ones are in bed by around 7-8 o'clock. Most families do have a routine. I don't know many families that let their 2-year-olds run around at midnight and even later.

A little empathy and sympathy for the little family upstairs might help you deal with your situation.

Please don't tell me to have ''empathy'' and ''sympathy'' because, in this situation, I don't. I hate them, don't care how nice or innocent they are, I am too exhausted and fed up to feel any sort of kindness towards them. That's why we want to move.

You need to move. Get after it, girl! What are you waiting for? No one should suffer like you do over some upstairs tenants in a cheaply built apartment building who have a toddler. Endlessly complaining about it does not help the situation.

Finally, you get me. The UK doesn't make it easy to just move. We can't get on the council list no matter what, as we have no reason for their support (we have no children nor are homeless). I don't really like renting privately because I worry that the landlords are going to decide to just kick us out for no fault of our own, like I've been hearing so much about lately. We are in privately rented now and I don't feel secure. It's also a racist thing but I won't go into that.
This is another reason I'm jealous of my cousin for getting pregnant. She'll get to leave work and they'll get a nice council house. Two things I've always wanted.

 

[Mary Terry]

I knew someone would point this out sooner or later. Let me explain. I work during the day, my husband works mornings only so is usually home while I'm out at work, and he says they are up there thumping and banging about at any given time of the day. If I'm home I can hear them too, no matter what time of the day it is. Maybe they do go out but they don't have a car and we've very seldom seen them go out (or had peace indicating they are out whenever we're home). Yes we are home a lot too but we still go out more than they do, and for a couple with a baby they seem to be indoors an awful lot.

Well most people I know have small children, and they all say their little ones are in bed by around 7-8 o'clock. Most families do have a routine. I don't know many families that let their 2-year-olds run around at midnight and even later.

Please don't tell me to have ''empathy'' and ''sympathy'' because, in this situation, I don't. I hate them, don't care how nice or innocent they are, I am too exhausted and fed up to feel any sort of kindness towards them. That's why we want to move.

Finally, you get me. The UK doesn't make it easy to just move. We can't get on the council list no matter what, as we have no reason for their support (we have no children nor are homeless). I don't really like renting privately because I worry that the landlords are going to decide to just kick us out for no fault of our own, like I've been hearing so much about lately. We are in privately rented now and I don't feel secure. It's also a racist thing but I won't go into that.
This is another reason I'm jealous of my cousin for getting pregnant. She'll get to leave work and they'll get a nice council house. Two things I've always wanted.

Well, then you have decided to stay where you are and continue to complain about the upstairs neighbors.

 

[Misty Avich]

We're online now looking for a new place.
But I still want to complain here in the meantime, because it helps to vent. If you don't want to read it then you can always unwatch the thread. I'll post how we get on.

 

[Misty Avich]

We have the ball rolling now. So I am doing something about it.

 

[Ken]

We have the ball rolling now. So I am doing something about it.

That's Awesome news!! Looking forward to that working out!

Indeed, having "empathy" for the upstairs neighbors is not even a thing. It's a sensitivity thing. You can bear with a sensitivity, but you can't decide the misery away. Example: Imagine someone has an obsession to pound your toes with a hammer. Should you have empathy for the person and just accept having your toes pounded with a hammer? Having empathy for the upstairs neighbors is a good thing, but it doesn't offer any relief to a sensitivity. Having empathy for the one obsessed with toe pounding is also a good thing, but it wouldn't offer any relief to the pounded toes.

I'm rooting for that rolling ball!! Just hearing that has lifted my day!

 

[Misty Avich]

That's Awesome news!! Looking forward to that working out!

Indeed, having "empathy" for the upstairs neighbors is not even a thing. It's a sensitivity thing. You can bear with a sensitivity, but you can't decide the misery away. Example: Imagine someone has an obsession to pound your toes with a hammer. Should you have empathy for the person and just accept having your toes pounded with a hammer? Having empathy for the upstairs neighbors is a good thing, but it doesn't offer any relief to a sensitivity.

This is exactly what I've been trying to say all along. I don't lack empathy but being told to have empathy for something that is making me anxious instead of being anxious about it is unhelpful and isn't going to make me suddenly change.
Sometimes we have to be a bit selfish, and generally I'm not really a selfish person but maybe in this one situation I might be a little, and that's okay.
Obviously there is some empathy somewhere because if I was really selfish and not understanding, then I would have tried to get them evicted or something. But because I know that their noise can't always be helped and that they're just living, I have left them be. But, like you said, that still doesn't switch off how I feel about the situation. Ordinarily what other people do in their own homes is none of my business, but if I can hear everything they're doing every day then it can become a bother and affect my life when I don't want it to.

Telling me "oh it's just a little kid, he's got to play, he can't help making a noise, just ignore it" is like saying "oh a tornado is just wind, it happens, it can't help it, just ignore it". Even though you KNOW what a tornado is and that there's nothing we can do about it, it still doesn't stop you from feeling anxious or fretful about a tornado happening.
A tornado is probably the best comparison because the kid is like a tornado up there lol.

Having empathy for the one obsessed with toe pounding is also a good thing, but it wouldn't offer any relief to the pounded toes.

I'm rooting for that rolling ball!! Just hearing that has lifted my day!

Thank you!!

 

[Mary Terry]

This is exactly what I've been trying to say all along. I don't lack empathy but being told to have empathy for something that is making me anxious instead of being anxious about it is unhelpful and isn't going to make me suddenly change.
Sometimes we have to be a bit selfish, and generally I'm not really a selfish person but maybe in this one situation I might be a little, and that's okay.
Obviously there is some empathy somewhere because if I was really selfish and not understanding, then I would have tried to get them evicted or something. But because I know that their noise can't always be helped and that they're just living, I have left them be. But, like you said, that still doesn't switch off how I feel about the situation. Ordinarily what other people do in their own homes is none of my business, but if I can hear everything they're doing every day then it can become a bother and affect my life when I don't want it to.

Telling me "oh it's just a little kid, he's got to play, he can't help making a noise, just ignore it" is like saying "oh a tornado is just wind, it happens, it can't help it, just ignore it". Even though you KNOW what a tornado is and that there's nothing we can do about it, it still doesn't stop you from feeling anxious or fretful about a tornado happening.
A tornado is probably the best comparison because the kid is like a tornado up there lol.

Thank you!!

Venting can make someone temporarily feel better but doing something proactive like MOVING elsewhere may obviate the need for venting. Unless, of course, the venting person is the type of person who always has a gripe about others, never takes responsibility for one's actions and blames everyone else for their own shortcomings.

Empathy includes not playing your music so loudly the neighbors bang on the floor to make you stop. It especially includes not playing your music so loudly at the time of night when the parents are trying to get their toddler to sleep. You are shooting yourself in the foot, or pounding your own toes, if you sabotage their efforts to establish a regular sleeping schedule for their child by playing your music too loudly.

Many, many people on this forum are parents. Crude, venting denunciations of parents and a small child with name-calling and other such venting tactics can be triggering for us. Please keep that in mind. You wouldn't like it if NTs vented about the behaviors of NDs even though they know that NDs often cannot control their behaviors.

 

[Misty Avich]

Venting can make someone temporarily feel better but doing something proactive like MOVING elsewhere may obviate the need for venting. Unless, of course, the venting person is the type of person who always has a gripe about others, never takes responsibility for one's actions and blames everyone else for their own shortcomings.

Yes well we're doing that now. This is my thread so if you don't like it then you can always unwatch it. If you do reply then try to be more "empathetic" (since Aspies love using that ugly word) about my side of the story.

Empathy includes not playing your music so loudly the neighbors bang on the floor to make you stop. It especially includes not playing your music so loudly at the time of night when the parents are trying to get their toddler to sleep. You are shooting yourself in the foot, or pounding your own toes, if you sabotage their efforts to establish a regular sleeping schedule for their child by playing your music too loudly.

I hope this is just an example describing what your definition of the E-word is, and not actually accusing me of having loud music on or making other types of noise.

Many, many people on this forum are parents. Crude, venting denunciations of parents and a small child with name-calling and other such venting tactics can be triggering for us. Please keep that in mind. You wouldn't like it if NTs vented about the behaviors of NDs even though they know that NDs often cannot control their behaviors.

I don't see where I wrote anything bad about parents or kids here. Venting about those parents in particular (the ones above me) and their kid is not generalising about ALL parents and ALL kids. I really have no time for people who take everything as a generalisation and get offended.

 

[Aspychata]

I had a family do Zumba at 1:00 am in the last place l lived in. I am thinking this feels pretty weird. It's hard for me to feel emphatic for a family doesn't follow social norms like allowing people to sleep st nite. They all sound hyper, like they are all on meth or drink to much caffeine. Are they working or just live off the government? In most places we have a firewall between the floors in good apartments, and condos. In the shoeboxes, it's thin. Can you ask the landlord to lay a thick pad and a bedroom rug? Anyways, moving out is gotta happen. I hate apartments, that's why l bought a place. It's quieter. It's nothing special, but l love nobody above me.

 

[Misty Avich]

EVERY WORD this guy says describes EVERYTHING I feel and my life living below a family in an apartment. Every word.
Makes me feel better and know that I'm not a selfish, entitled neighbour who has no E-word for darling little children, it's basically just Ground Floor Neighbour Fever getting to me.

 

[Misty Avich]

Oh, by the way, I don't know where Mary Terry got it from that I listen to music loud, I do not, ever. I always listen to music with my headphones on. I can't find where I wrote it here but the only thing I ever did was once listen to an audiobook out loud one early morning but because they bang about I have to use earplugs when lying down, so the audiobook had to be turned up loud enough so I can hear it (it was only off my phone so it was hardly booming). That's when I thought I heard someone bang loudly on the floor above with their foot (that's what it sounded like) and I immediately switched it off and had to do without. This was like after a year of putting up with their banging, so it wasn't like I made the noise first. But they're the reason I have to put earplugs in in the first place. Yet any little noise we make they don't like it at all.

But I guess it's the chicken and the egg situation.

You bang on the ceiling when we make a noise, so we'll do it to you!
You make a noise all the time, so we'll do it to you!

But I do try to avoid this ''I'm getting you back!'' mentality, because it helps no-one and just generates more feelings of anger and frustration.

 

[Mary Terry]

Oh, by the way, I don't know where Mary Terry got it from that I listen to music loud, I do not, ever. I always listen to music with my headphones on. I can't find where I wrote it here but the only thing I ever did was once listen to an audiobook out loud one early morning but because they bang about I have to use earplugs when lying down, so the audiobook had to be turned up loud enough so I can hear it (it was only off my phone so it was hardly booming). That's when I thought I heard someone bang loudly on the floor above with their foot (that's what it sounded like) and I immediately switched it off and had to do without. This was like after a year of putting up with their banging, so it wasn't like I made the noise first. But they're the reason I have to put earplugs in in the first place. Yet any little noise we make they don't like it at all.

But I guess it's the chicken and the egg situation.

You bang on the ceiling when we make a noise, so we'll do it to you!
You make a noise all the time, so we'll do it to you!

But I do try to avoid this ''I'm getting you back!'' mentality, because it helps no-one and just generates more feelings of anger and frustration.

Misty - I understood from some comment you made at some point that you played music so loudly - on at least one occasion - that the neighbors banged on the floor. Thank you for essentially confirming that in your comment. I'm glad you don't engage in retaliatory noisemaking. Hopefully, you will soon move somewhere else, like to your father's new property, and you will no longer suffer from neighbors' noise or feel compelled to complain about noises made by a two-year toddler. I hope that you understand that parents cannot and should not try to silence a toddler who is simply acting normally. That would be cruel and potentially detrimental to the child's wellbeing.

 

[Misty Avich]

Misty - I understood from some comment you made at some point that you played music so loudly - on at least one occasion - that the neighbors banged on the floor. Thank you for essentially confirming that in your comment. I'm glad you don't engage in retaliatory noisemaking. Hopefully, you will soon move somewhere else, like to your father's new property, and you will no longer suffer from neighbors' noise or feel compelled to complain about noises made by a two-year toddler.

I still don't know where you got that from about me listening to loud music because no way have I ever done that.

I hope that you understand that parents cannot and should not try to silence a toddler who is simply acting normally. That would be cruel and potentially detrimental to the child's wellbeing.

That's why we want to move. The noise they make, no matter how innocuous, is having a knock-on effect on my sensory issues and I don't care whether it's made by party-goers or a cute little 2-year-old, noise is noise and we want out for the sake of my mental health. Also if you watch the video I had posted you'd know what I mean, and the guy explains it better than I do.

I guess it's one of those situations where you have to live below a family in a poorly sound-insulated apartment to know how I feel and that the logic of "it's just a kid" does not prevail over emotion.

I still don't know where I posted that I listen to loud music.

 

[Judge]

That's why we want to move. The noise they make, no matter how innocuous, is having a knock-on effect on my sensory issues and I don't care whether it's made by party-goers or a cute little 2-year-old, noise is noise and we want out for the sake of my mental health. Also if you watch the video I had posted you'd know what I mean, and the guy explains it better than I do.

Sometimes such concerns boil down largely to construction standards relative to multi-unit housing. An issue that can be beyond a tenant's control. Thin walls, thin floors and ceilings. In my own case, the difference between my prior location and my present one. Yet both were built in the same year.

Looking back I'm shocked at how inherently noisy the first place was when I moved to Nevada. Though it makes me wonder about much newer constructed complexes here. And whether they are better or worse based on priorities built around cost.

I can't complain too much about where I live presently. Better construction, but also better neighbors. Yet I can go outside and hear quite a racket from the building across the way, which was made for two and three bedrooms. Accommodations for entire families...big, small and noisy or not.

Which taught me one other thing to consider. To live in a unit that is adjacent next to, or above yet another one-bedroom unit. With a possibility of less noise given less people living in cramped conditions. No guarantees...but most of the time it seems to have panned out for me here.

 

[Misty Avich]

Sometimes such concerns boil down largely to construction standards relative to multi-unit housing. An issue that can be beyond a tenant's control. Thin walls, thin floors and ceilings. In my own case, the difference between my prior location and my present one. Yet both were built in the same year.

Originally the apartment building we live in wasn't designed for families. It was supposed to be exclusively and conveniently for key workers who are doing shift work. That's how my husband got offered the place in the beginning, because he was in that group, and it seemed ideal at the time, as nobody really heard each other as neighbours despite the thin floors in between. So it's not really constructed for noisy families, as it's inevitable that the people on the ground floor are going to experience unbearable banging all the time.
It's difficult when you have very little tolerance for certain sounds. Yes, I blame the landlords, not the family themselves, but even so, I still get hate filled inside me whenever I hear their noise.

We're still waiting for a reply from the housing people but we've heard nothing, probably because our reasons for wanting to move are not prioritable.