Is it possible for an Aspie to attain the social skills of a NT?

[Drake Marino]

What I'm trying to ask is, have any of you gone from being the introverted, quiet person with no friends that us aspies tend to be, to a social butterfly who is extroverted and can make friends with ease? I'm curious to know if it's possible, because I've been trying to do it for quite some time now, and more or less I'm making progress. It seems almost impossible though, because NT people are all over the place.

 

[rhubarbo]

My quick answer would be 'probably' - but I cannot imagine a scenario where it would not take a lot of effort. I don't just mean the effort to learn all the skills - but, more so, the actually effort of pulling it off when you are putting those skills to use. I don't think it would be a fun thing to do over time.

Have there been times that you have been able to socialize effortlessly?

 

[King_Oni]

Well... I guess it can be possible to be similar in terms of social skills. But that means being all over the place as well, being assertive and any other traits one needs to be social.

But there's more to consider though. It's not just making friends. It's keeping friends as well. And quite often keeping friends is hard, especially if there's some aspie traits shining through. Not everyone is too keen to have a friend around who prefers to have some alone time at times.

And honestly, there's more to NT's than being social. I actually think the difference is way bigger than they (psychologists) think it is. Recently I read (and blogged about it on this forum) an article which states that introvert and extrovert behaviour might be neurological as well, so that might even leave it with slightly less room to nudge and adapt.

 

[Drake Marino]

My social life is very hit or miss; sometimes my social interactions go perfectly and I'm super talkative and can always think of what I'm going to add next to a conversation, other times they go awry and either I can't think of what to say or I'm awkward. I'm hoping that if I keep practicing I'll be good enough at socializing to where making friends and being gregarious will be easy.

 

[Ste11aeres]

Ironically, as I have become more and more socially skilled, I have also become more reclusive and people-avoiding.

Previously I was socially weird, but I did not know it, so I was social. Now I know the rules of social things, but with that knowledge has come a knowledge for how out of place I really am, and a distaste for interacting with most persons.

My male best friend who is probably an Aspie, and who's older than me, is in his forties, has by now attained great social skill.

 

[Judge]

What I'm trying to ask is, have any of you gone from being the introverted, quiet person with no friends that us aspies tend to be, to a social butterfly who is extroverted and can make friends with ease? I'm curious to know if it's possible, because I've been trying to do it for quite some time now, and more or less I'm making progress. It seems almost impossible though, because NT people are all over the place.

Social butterfly? Never, ever. But enough to get by without appearing too awkward? I can fake that, unless it involves social interactions that have high stakes...such as anything employment related.

But even under the most optimal circumstances I am only faking it on the outside. On the inside I'm hoping not to lose it and physically manifest my Aspie traits.

 

[Sparticus]

Yes it's possible to get better. But it might be temporary & I'm not sure how far an Aspie can go. Like an athlete who trains, learning the ropes of socializing like say thru volunteering in activities you are interested in helps. Reading Dale Carnegie, positive motivational books, practicing socializing, forcing yourself to attend events in town [I had an excuse-I was a photographer] exercising and being in excellent shape to help raise self esteem all helps. But I wasn't able to maintain friendships long term so it was elusive.

Perhaps if things had turned out differently, I might have been able to have maintained my social output...it took years, lots of effort, constant advice from a girlfriend at the time or my ex-wife, advice from my brother etc, advice from mentors & a BURNING DESIRE TO NEVER QUIT no matter how many times I failed in public. Plus I was under so much pressure from being married & having to become more successful in business. For awhile I was able to fit in appearance wise [a lot of the other men were WW2 Vets & that made it was easier for me] for awhile but it had a huge effect on my nerves. As I said above, reading motivational quotes, exercising daily & hiking in the forest on weekends kept my sanity.

Once I decided to divorce my ex-wife I quit all my volunteering & socializing activities. Bottomline-however I was sad that all I had attained, was temporary. Sh*t happens. Depending on your severity of autism, you can go far in life. At least that is my theory. But then again I was forced to via threats from my ex-wife "if you don't make more money I will leave you and take our son" etc. So I was highly motivated.

Good luck.

My social life is very hit or miss; sometimes my social interactions go perfectly and I'm super talkative and can always think of what I'm going to add next to a conversation, other times they go awry and either I can't think of what to say or I'm awkward. I'm hoping that if I keep practicing I'll be good enough at socializing to where making friends and being gregarious will be easy.

 

[Ste11aeres]

Are we actually worse socially? Or do we just not socialise in a way that NTs can appreciate or understand?

 

[Judge]

Are we actually worse socially? Or do we just not socialise in a way that NTs can appreciate or understand?

Good question. This is the sort of thing I'm just beginning to ponder. That the difference between us and them is no more profound than being in one culture than another. The real difference being that neurology defines us more than any social conformity of a majority.

 

[Loomis]

Are we actually worse socially? Or do we just not socialise in a way that NTs can appreciate or understand?

I believe you are exactly right. For us socializing is hard work where a social butterfly type NT does it effortlessly. We can get good at it if we are highly motivated and willing to tolerate lots of discomfort. I think the reason is that we do it differently using neural mechanisms that center on logic, empirical evidence and trial and error.

 

[Licorice]

I think that introversion and extroversion are innate, and neither is anything to be ashamed of. I have significantly improved my people skills over the years, though.

 

[paloftoon]

Are we actually worse socially? Or do we just not socialise in a way that NTs can appreciate or understand?

I think it depends on the person, the situation, and the context.

 

[paloftoon]

Ironically, as I have become more and more socially skilled, I have also become more reclusive and people-avoiding.

Previously I was socially weird, but I did not know it, so I was social. Now I know the rules of social things, but with that knowledge has come a knowledge for how out of place I really am, and a distaste for interacting with most persons.

My male best friend who is probably an Aspie, and who's older than me, is in his forties, has by now attained great social skill.

I feel I fit this profile well too. I think I got socially better because I made a lot of mistakes and slowly figured out what I did wrong. Also, as an adult, I was more free to do things, so I was not always imprisoned and always told by my parents how everything was my fault and how I wasn't normal enough and so difficult to live with basically. I learned as an adult that people are so selfish that they take advantage of my mother and I to the point that we stopped taking people out being hospitable for people that we were "well acquainted" with.

 

[rhubarbo]

Ironically, as I have become more and more socially skilled, I have also become more reclusive and people-avoiding.

paloftoon reminded me I wanted to comment on this some time ago.

There's a kind of equation here. The more you learn the social skills means you are more aware of what you should be doing in a social settings. In other words: the list of things to keep in mind and tasks to do gets larger. So, it seems to me, the more social skills one learns the more that socializing becomes exhausting and the more exhausting socializing gets the more, understandably, reclusive and people-avoiding we'd get.

So it makes sense to say that before diagnosis I thought I socialized a lot better. I socialize better now but avoid it more.

Does that makes sense?

 

[Judge]

Ironically, as I have become more and more socially skilled, I have also become more reclusive and people-avoiding.

I also definitely identify with such a dynamic. Perhaps because the more skill we accrue, the more the effort is required because what we are attempting is contrary to our baser instincts. In terms of self-survival I've done ok in consistently emulating some Neurotypical behaviors.

However it's always been emotionally and mentally exhausting without any real payoff. Being reclusive does nothing for my loneliness, but it does have a nominal degree of comfort as opposed to pushing myself in a Neurotypical world. I'm just not sure this is a dynamic that can or will ever change for me personally.

 

[paloftoon]

It does make perfect sense. As the old adage goes, "Ignorance is bliss." However, once you are smart enough to fend for yourself, I doubt you'd really want to go back to that kind of quality of life where you are a slave to everyone else if you know how to deal with things more.

paloftoon reminded me I wanted to comment on this some time ago.

There's a kind of equation here. The more you learn the social skills means you are more aware of what you should be doing in a social settings. In other words: the list of things to keep in mind and tasks to do gets larger. So, it seems to me, the more social skills one learns the more that socializing becomes exhausting and the more exhausting socializing gets the more, understandably, reclusive and people-avoiding we'd get.

So it makes sense to say that before diagnosis I thought I socialized a lot better. I socialize better now but avoid it more.

Does that makes sense?

 

[walkerbretm]

My previous career demanded I be social. I could fake it pretty well. This was largely just an act. It was very hard to keep it up. Eventually the real me would start to come out. I am learning that the act is no fun and I need to be happy being me. Yes, I am different. I will try to get better at socializing, but it will be me. Not some character I try and be. I don't think I can be truly happy any other way.

 

[Nolan1971]

I can do it really well (socialize) as I was in the so called in crowd in high school but just have my
limits on how much I can tolerate though it is high for an aspie.
I reached the plateau of Captain of challenge (adventure) group, missed being student VP by 1 vote and elected to being in charge of fund raising for all school events.

 

[Soup]

Firstly, since the term 'social skills' itself was defined by & for NT societies & encompasses different behaviours depending very much upon everything from historical period to nationality, customs, social norms, faith community, class & environment, I find it difficult to extract a universally acceptable scientifically sound & definition of what social skills are. The line between Aspies who are sociable, communicative, friendly & extroverted and NTs who are introspective, introverted & on the quiet side is vague.

IF being able to function in a social setting as necessary to secure one's existence is a measure of social skills, many of us here are wives, fathers, husbands, parents, friends & workers of many different kinds. We are able to go buy food (either in person or online or both) we socialize regularly here online & have jollied each other along over the years. Some of us are able to work with the public in retail settings ( I could never do that).

We HAVE excellent Asperian social skills. Most of us seem to have a different level of interest in unrelenting face to face socializing. We seem to value and require more alone time on average than most NTs. Also, some of us are simply not motivated to have a bunch of friends (me). This doesn't make us unskilled; it makes us different. There are also a great many Aspies who express deep loneliness & long for friendships or a relationship but cannot find suitable people. For what it is worth, many NTs feel the same way & many are hanging out with people they do not truly feel a connection to or even like very much. They are faking it in order to not be alone or look like an outcast. Many of us are not willing to do this for very long because our logical nature tells us that it is fake, insincere unsatisfying & exhausting.

I have witnessed the sorry spectacle of NTs who are sociable to the point of obnoxiousness: do they have greater social skills than the quiet Aspie in a hoodie & reading a book? So long as their sociologists & shrinks get to define the terms & their parameters, most conveniently, with the assumption that their understanding & behaviours are the 'normal & correct' ones, smacks of pseudoscience such as scientific racism & other absurdities.

 

[Aspie@60]

What I'm trying to ask is, have any of you gone from being the introverted, quiet person with no friends that us aspies tend to be, to a social butterfly who is extroverted and can make friends with ease? I'm curious to know if it's possible, because I've been trying to do it for quite some time now, and more or less I'm making progress. It seems almost impossible though, because NT people are all over the place.

I can operate in a social setting really well, given enough time to prepare, AND if I'm the speaker or guest of honor. It takes me a day or two to recover, however, and any promises I may have made to "keep in touch" or to follow up are very likely to be broken. Now, after 60 years and I know what the problem is, I don't beat myself up over and over and over again.

One-on-one I'm fine because in that setting I'm usually listening and providing input, problem-solving ideas. That's a good thing, right? Put me in a group of women discussing the latest fashions and celebrities, and I'm outa there!