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Both sexes in football/soccer

Magna

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
I don't understand the question. Are you asking why there aren't teams at the professional level that consist of both men and women on the same teams?
 

Forest Cat

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
Do you mean men and women playing against each other? Same reason why men don't fight women in the boxing ring, I think it's to avoid injuring people. I have played soccer, I'm over 6 feet tall and if there had been women on the other team, they could have been seriously injured because the guys would be bigger and heavier. And it just wouldn't be fair, we would have an advantage.
 

Magna

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
The U.S. professional women's soccer team was roundly beat by a boys high school soccer team. I think if I recall it happened on more than one occasion by different boys teams.
 

Slime_Punk

 Please erase
V.I.P Member
Supposedly in the US, the NBA (and other sports teams) weren't specifically gender-specific, although their female counterparts definitely arose to showcase women's talent, etc.

I think a lot of people don't like the idea of genders competing together, but as they become more of a spectrum than a binary, I think there's going to have to be some mixing due to equality issues in the future. Even when it comes to fighting and things like that, it's becoming more of a gray area, so it's only a matter of time before anyone can essentially compete with anyone (and then we achieve oneness with each other at last, right :D?).
 

Judge

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
As both men and women play in soccer aid, why don't both sexes play in domestic leagues and international games?
A huge difference between a mere charity event and a professional level sports team.

One plays to raise funds. The other plays to win. ;)
 
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Forest Cat

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
(and then we achieve oneness with each other at last, right :D?).

I think we will achieve more injuries than oneness. :) There are some issues with size and weight in sports. And of course fairness. Look at that thing the Americans call football. A large group of aggressive 300 pound men over 6 feet tall. People are going to die if we put women into that melee.
 
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Magna

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
I think we will achieve more injuries than oneness. :) There are some issues with size and weight in sports. Look at that thing the Americans call football. A large group of aggressive 300 pound men over 6 feet tall. People are going to die if we put women into that melee.

I'm actually astonished at the difference in strength between the average man and the average woman. Of course there are exceptions (always remember in life that exceptions don't negate the rule). When it comes to professional sports the differences are quite dramatic be it soccer, tennis, baseball, marathon running, weight lifting, wrestling, basketball, etc.
 

Judge

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
Even soccer is considered to be a full-contact sport. Where physical contact is allowed, as long as it isn't excessive. But excessive injuries can and do happen, regardless of the rules. A risky proposition in any contact sport where players come in various shapes, sizes and weights.
 
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Slime_Punk

 Please erase
V.I.P Member
I think we will achieve more injuries than oneness. :) There are some issues with size and weight in sports. And of course fairness. Look at that thing the Americans call football. A large group of aggressive 300 pound men over 6 feet tall. People are going to die if we put women into that melee.

I'm assuming they'd have size / weight classes possibly, though. Who knows what the future holds?
 

Gerontius

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
I wish we'd treat games as games, and not a massive franchised thing. Then maybe if everyone played nicely they could play without hurting anyone. Recreation doesn't have to be televised and a ball game doesn't always have to be a bowl game.
 

Dagan

Well-Known Member
About the best debate I watched on this topic was the underlying tones and legalities that would be assuredly affected. There's a historically worldwide issue (and therefore a stigma) of men hurting women (abuse in many forms), and to start allowing and/or glorifying it as full on equal in major sports (and make no mistake - major sports is always full of social and political fronts that can and do force changes elsewhere)...that would be a major fear of forcing massive changes in the moral and legal systems at hand that classify and protect women as decidedly different from men. The pundits I was watching went through this entire domino effect of what would change, and it lead to worse and worse, including more Supreme Court Rulings getting overturned in the US alone.

Personally, I always just think about Harrison Bergeron when certain equality debates come up. I also feel like complete equality is a utopian myth that will never be achieved, as it can't even be rooted in proper logic...but also because every single day, no matter how much people say and claim they want it...they prove the opposite 24/7. I have a rather Q&A analogy that I use:

What do you do for a living and/or how much do you make for a living wage? Where are you on the ladder for your career and/or quality of life? Do you desire to do better and have more? Do you fear having less or just what you have taken away from you, and you don't get it back? Are you willing to do what it takes to secure your status on the "ladder" to not fall down below others? Are you willing to do what it takes to climb the "ladder" to have more instead of less? Do you understand that this means you will have to climb above others on this "ladder" and therefore continue to fear and do what it takes to not fall below others, still? Then...you don't want complete equality.
 

Misty Avich

I prefer not to be referred to as autistic
V.I.P Member
Yeah but lets say we found a woman the same size and weight as me. I still don't want to compete against her because I have a different build. Men have more muscles and testosterone. Men and women aren't built the same way. So it's just not fair.
I agree. We (both genders) are different, generally.
 

The Pandector

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
Yo, left field over here.

I don’t ever want to learn to see women as I see men, never want to treat women as I do men. I am a nonviolent person and body contact isn’t any part of the equation. (Should a woman strike me, I will respond without discrimination.)

I want civil society to act according to fact; in combat, women have a biological disadvantage against men, and men have a moral responsibility to keep the playing field level. Contrary to millions of press releases, humanity is a single team; women are better at some things, men at others. Exceptions prove the rule.

I enjoy the distinction between men and women. I don’t care a whit what the feminists say… I think women are poorly served by being equated to men physically. I can’t express my disdain for a man who would force his way into the women’s locker room, and a woman in a man’s locker room is worthy of her reputation. I want society to celebrate the distinctions between men and women, not pretend to erase them.

I don’t care to hear the legal arguments, which are simply a distraction.
 

Yeshuasdaughter

You know, that one lady we met that one time.
V.I.P Member
Portland has top notch MLS soccer teams. The men's team is the Timbers, and the women's is the Thorns.

I've been to a Thorns game, and the stadium was packed to the rafters. Thorns fans are psychotic. I was pretty shocked at how into a team a group of people could be. They were like a Viking horde, about ready to jump the fences if the ref called a foul.
 

Misty Avich

I prefer not to be referred to as autistic
V.I.P Member
Although I hold no grudges against feminists, I don't happen to be feminist myself. I used to think feminism was a bad thing because of the way it ends in "-ist" and is often used in political discussions, but after educating myself on the term, I've learnt it's a good thing. But I don't care for it myself. I prefer a world where men were the superior sex. I'm not talking about the era where they accused certain women of being witches, I'm talking more about the 20th century era. Liberal but not so much political correctness. I don't like entitlement, and as a woman myself I'm supposed to be entitled to expect men to serve me some sort of respect as a woman, but I don't.
Some feminists believe things like a man opening a door for a woman is sexist or something, but I think it's very gentlemanly.
 

Au Naturel

Au Naturel
I'm actually astonished at the difference in strength between the average man and the average woman. Of course there are exceptions (always remember in life that exceptions don't negate the rule). When it comes to professional sports the differences are quite dramatic be it soccer, tennis, baseball, marathon running, weight lifting, wrestling, basketball, etc.
On average, a woman has 90% of the leg strength of a man but only 60% of the upper body strength - if they both weigh the same. The average woman weighs less than the average man of the same height. If the two weigh the same and are the same height, the average man will have more muscle mass, and the average woman will have more fat.

This is an evolutionary fact. It happened because bearing children places different demands on the body.

This isn't to say that a strong, fit woman won't blow the sidewalls off an average guy. I've met women who could outrun and outclimb me, and I was pretty fit when I was young. However, the two sexes only have partially overlapping bell curves. The upper tail of the female curve (grey) approaches zero, where the tail of the male curve (blue) remains significant. Imagine muscle mass increasing to the right. The strongest/fastest women will never match the strongest/fastest men (maybe not even with hormone treatment), even if many women can outperform the average guy. Comparing the curves might look like this.

Displaced Bell curves.jpg
 
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mysterionz

oh hamburgers!
V.I.P Member
Some feminists believe things like a man opening a door for a woman is sexist or something, but I think it's very gentlemanly.
I was watching a South Park episode that had a scene in it that went remarkably similar. Albeit, the episode was satirizing PC culture though
 

mysterionz

oh hamburgers!
V.I.P Member
I was watching a South Park episode that had a scene in it that went remarkably similar. Albeit, the episode was satirizing PC culture though
The scene was at the end of the episode “super hard PCness”.

PC Principal comments to his coworker Strong Woman (i can’t with these names, as she’s satire of the “strong independent woman” trope) that there is a door blocking their way out of the gymnasium. She acknowledges this and PC Principal goes on to say:
“I would like to open this door for you. However, I understand the gender-based biases this can imply.”
 

mysterionz

oh hamburgers!
V.I.P Member
The scene was at the end of the episode “super hard PCness”.

PC Principal comments to his coworker Strong Woman (i can’t with these names, as she’s satire of the “strong independent woman” trope) that there is a door blocking their way out of the gymnasium. She acknowledges this and PC Principal goes on to say:
“I would like to open this door for you. However, I understand the gender-based biases this can imply.”
This line is satirizing people that claim that men opening doors for women is “sexist” or “anti-feminist.”
 

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