Sensitive Topic Are Aspies prone to be emotionally abused?

[nofu2603]

I would say, ?Yes.? I grew up in a household where emotional abuse was part of daily life. After that, I seem to draw emotional abuse. I suspect that is one of the reasons why I have a distrust of people and tend to avoid relationships.

Hello, I was looking at this thread as I have a dilemma in my marriage. My childhood like yours was emotionally damaging and as an adult I have always found myself drawn to people with difficult personalities ( I read somewhere that as adults we do this as we are still trying to resolve issues from childhood relationships), but I suspect also that these kind of personalities target us because we are easy to manipulate. My husband was definitely a manipulative bully, from very early in our relationship he threatened suicide and used every emotional blackmail in the book when I tried to leave the relationship. He wore me down but I have never been happy, he is never violent but threatens it all the time. I am sure he has borderline personality disorder and possible schizophrenic tendencies. (I am no expert but he talks to voices in his head). I have been his crutch all through our married life taking care of him like a child as he tried to self medicate with alcohol, cigarettes and junk food. He now has serious health problems as well as an expensive smoking and drinking habit that has ruined our finances. I stayed for a long time for the sake of our children however I am now in a position that I can just walk away. What stops me is that I know he will descend into drunken chaos and that this burden will fall onto our children, I know they will understand but he is still their dad and I don't want them to have to do this. He refuses to seek help and we are barely on speaking terms any more. Has anyone else been in this position, I would appreciate any advise?

 

[Turk]

Hello, I was looking at this thread as I have a dilemma in my marriage. My childhood like yours was emotionally damaging and as an adult I have always found myself drawn to people with difficult personalities ( I read somewhere that as adults we do this as we are still trying to resolve issues from childhood relationships), but I suspect also that these kind of personalities target us because we are easy to manipulate. My husband was definitely a manipulative bully, from very early in our relationship he threatened suicide and used every emotional blackmail in the book when I tried to leave the relationship. He wore me down but I have never been happy, he is never violent but threatens it all the time. I am sure he has borderline personality disorder and possible schizophrenic tendencies. (I am no expert but he talks to voices in his head). I have been his crutch all through our married life taking care of him like a child as he tried to self medicate with alcohol, cigarettes and junk food. He now has serious health problems as well as an expensive smoking and drinking habit that has ruined our finances. I stayed for a long time for the sake of our children however I am now in a position that I can just walk away. What stops me is that I know he will descend into drunken chaos and that this burden will fall onto our children, I know they will understand but he is still their dad and I don't want them to have to do this. He refuses to seek help and we are barely on speaking terms any more. Has anyone else been in this position, I would appreciate any advise?

Id have to agree with sportster on this. If your husband is unwilling to get help, then divorce is the only option. If your kids have grown up, you need to get out of there. That type of behaviour tends to take others down with it. I'd like to offer advice, but marriage is a partnership and requires work by both. I think itd fair to say your husband, wont be part of any salvage mission

 

[nofu2603]

It is a very difficult situation. I am not an advocate for divorce (you can see that from my other posts), but I cannot see how one could remain in a relationship as you described. Any change has to come from within, so your husband, based on what you've shared, is not looking to change. You're not responsible for his happiness or whatever course of manipulative action he chooses to take. You didn't mention how old your children are, but if they're gown and out of the house, then you may want to discuss your decisions. As adults, if they choose to assist their father, then you should not concern yourself with it. Like I said, it's a very difficult situation. You're not going to be free of it until you decide to be and take the necessary course of action. As you said, he won't seek help, so he won't change.

With the exception of the drinking, what you shared could be an apt description of my mother. I hate to say it, but when she died at the hospital (with me standing next to her bed), I felt a sense of relief and freedom. I didn't want her dead, but I was relieved that I no longer had to deal with the bullying and manipulation. I had to put up with it until I was 43-years-old.

I think you have hit the nail on the head 'I am not free until I want to be' , my difficulty is that I don't hate him so can't walk away in anger, I just feel sorry for him, he is mentally fragile and physically wrecked, we have been together for 33 years and to turn my back on him now would be like turning my back on one of my children which I could never do. I know the day will come when I simply can't take any more..

I am sorry to hear about your mother, I have the same kind of relationship with mine, only she is still with us. I have to confess that when she goes I will shed no tears, for a long time I felt like some kind of monster to have thoughts like that for my own mother but as I get older I am forgiving myself a bit more, I have always believed you reap what you sow in relationships so she only has herself to blame.

 

[Steph06]

. My husband was definitely a manipulative bully, from very early in our relationship he threatened suicide and used every emotional blackmail in the book when I tried to leave the relationship. He wore me down but I have never been happy, he is never violent but threatens it all the time. I am sure he has borderline personality disorder and possible schizophrenic tendencies. (I am no expert but he talks to voices in his head). I have been his crutch all through our married life taking care of him like a child as he tried to self medicate with alcohol, cigarettes and junk food. He now has serious health problems as well as an expensive smoking and drinking habit that has ruined our finances. I stayed for a long time for the sake of our children however I am now in a position that I can just walk away. What stops me is that I know he will descend into drunken chaos and that this burden will fall onto our children, I know they will understand but he is still their dad and I don't want them to have to do this. He refuses to seek help and we are barely on speaking terms any more. Has anyone else been in this position, I would appreciate any advise?

First, I'm so sorry you're in this position and that you've had to put up with this for so long. You deserved better in the past and you deserve better now.

Second, I was a child with a dad like that growing up. My brothers and I prayed every day that our mom would take us and leave. We spent our childhoods waiting for the next eruption, the next crisis, the next night of disastrous drunkenness.

While two parent households are great for lots of people, arguably a lot of kids out there would rather have a stable one parent household than a stressful dramatic unpredictable two parent household.

I don't know the details of your situation enough to advise obviously, but my 2 cents is if you think leaving is better for you mentally and emotionally it likely is for your kids as well.

 

[GallacticGorilla]

Im sorry, that is rough. This topic is one i think about often. I think the answer is yes we are easier targets. I dont have any advice, just something I've learned.

My crazy story:
I dated a girl that ended up having severe borderline personality disorder. She was hell bent on killing herself and blaming it on me, and i refused to let her. Not just sucidal, but stalking, lies, threats, faked having cancer, faked being pregnant. Faked medical and legal documents. I wont even get into anymore details, but it was unbelievable what happened. Imagine the movie Single white female, and Fatal attraction combine those two movies and multiply it by 10. I had a very real nervous break down after, and didnt leave the house for like a year or so. To this day im still not totally healed.

I'm all man, but can be such a gentle puppy dog, like Im very caring and im very bad at dealing with confrontation and conflict so i will go to great lengths to avoid it. I dont think that is entirely an Aspie thing, so much as just the way i was raised and my temperament.

Anyways- in hindsight, I think my handling of the situation was not the way an NT would would have at all. I have had several other abusive type situations i have been in, and in hindsight, i dont know how i attract this in my life, but clearly i do. Its not just coincidence. I think it does have to do with the fact that I just dont handle situations the same way an NT would.

 

[Spinning Compass]

I would say, yes, we tend to be targets for abusers. I don't know about how kids with autism are brought up today but back in the 1960's the behavior modification training I and the other kids in my special education class went through couldn't have been better suited for a predator's goals if it had been designed for that purpose. It never crossed the experts' minds that not everyone we came into contact with had as lofty motives as they. So we were just ripe for the picking.

Parents--if you are reading this, you need to be aware of what your child is being taught and whether he or she is given adequate information on how to identify and defend themselves against people who do not have their best interest in mind. That means you need to know yourselves how to spot these kinds of people and how they operate. Things to look out for are an emphasis on submissiveness, blind obedience, docility, and generally discouraging the child to stand up for him or herself. What you want is a program that will bring out the best in your child, while teaching him or her the skills necessary to function in the world, not a program whose emphasis is on control.

 

[theduckrabbit]

Yes we are easy targets. Abusers are very good at picking their victims. It is much easier to take advantage of someone on the fringe with little social support.

 

[Loomis]

Sorry to hear this happened to you. I know exactly how you feel. Recently I've learned these toxic women and men might have NPD-Narcistic Personality Disorder.
[/QUOTE

I have noticed that I get along well with people who have narcissistic personality disorder or who have sociopathic tendencies. I believe this is because along with autistics people with these disorders tend to have low empathy.

I married a woman who is NPD and am now finishing up a messy divorce. We were married over 20 years so it was not a complete failure. Ultimately, however, it was unsustainable.

Being aware of my attraction to these personality types is a big help because I have learned to spot them and hopefully avoid exploitation.

 

[CupcakeQueen]

the answer is simple...only if we allow ourselves to be. having aspergers doesn't cause people to emotionally abuse you in and of itself....people treat you how you allow them to treat you.

 

[Ste11aeres]

the answer is simple...only if we allow ourselves to be. having aspergers doesn't cause people to emotionally abuse you in and of itself....people treat you how you allow them to treat you.

But you have to know how to "allow" or not allow people to treat you in different ways. Not everyone knows how to elicit correct behavior from others. I can influence certain persons to treat me well, but I have no idea how to influence certain others.

 

[theduckrabbit]

the answer is simple...only if we allow ourselves to be. having aspergers doesn't cause people to emotionally abuse you in and of itself....people treat you how you allow them to treat you.

Victim-blaming feel-good nonsense. In theory, sure, we are all captains of our own ship. Hooray for existentialism, it works out great on paper. Communism is also totally awesome in the abstract. In the real world, however, unless you happen to be independently wealthy, you generally have to give in to the demands of the powers that be on a daily basis as a matter of survival. Powers which, btw, are not exactly distributed equitably among all people, but rather tend to be somewhat concentrated in the hands of wealthy, white men who are not disabled. Going about one's business of following rules as defined by parties greater than oneself, you will almost assuredly find you have been taken advantage of. It hurts, with or without your consent.

Aspergers makes it extremely difficult for me to pick up on the subtle red flags of an abuser that others might instinctively recognize. Its a thing.

 

[Jordan]

I have been victim to abuse from others. Not sure if they see my behavior as over-the-top or sadistic. Some aspies don't like to show their own emotions so they are then open to abuse from others. It can be a horrifying thought. And when we often have troubles reading the mental states of others we can't pick up on the tone of voice. Therefore we can perceive some situations as over the top, which other people that aren't aspies tend to think of a minor issue.

Relationships have been an issue with me. I can never stay in one and it's almost impossible for me not to say anything bad due to my way of thinking. I have for now, given up on relationships. Remember, let love come to you, don't look for it yourself.

It could just be a case of the clashing of Aspie-NT. I could be wrong, but I've experienced people taking advantage of me and also telling me what to do. Otherwise, they could only just be having my best interest at heart.

Also some aspies can be prone to anti-social behavior, and they can create the abuse themselves. But it could be just the statement of them not understanding the social situation that they are in.

 

[I am that which I am]

Hello nofu,

Like others said it is a difficult situation. I am wondering what your children's opinion on the matter may be as you mentioned it may leave them in a difficult situation. I am partly coming at it as an adult that wished my parents would have divorced earlier throughout my entire childhood.

It may send him into drunken chaos but he should not be your responsibility. I gather that you still have a heart like all of us, so maybe try to force him to go to therapy or get other kind of help before breaking up? I am also coming out of a difficult relationship with someone that likely has borderline personality disorder and at least when we were together I could see he had schizophrenic traits. My ex-beloved and I did live together for an amount of time and it was exactly like taking care of a child, he went to university (when he was not too depressed) and I worked, paid for everything, had my own studies, and took care of the house, cooking, and him. I accidentally gave him an ultimatum saying that he had to get help and I could not be in a relationship with him because we were both too unstable and he nearly ruined my life and sent me to prison. It is similar to your story Gallactic Gorrilla except it went a bit more both ways and I took the blame and responsibility to protect him. Anyways he took it as: if he gets help (which I now hear he is doing) we may get back together in a healthy relationship. I understand that it is difficult to do emotionally. I am in the rut that I still love him and hope he is happy and want him to be happy. He was not happy in the relationship with the huge ups and downs, arguments, and depression. I hope that this forces him to take care of his issues and that he will be happier in the future, even without me. I did not help him I probably just encouraged the behaviour because I am used to being abused, abandoned, and let him manipulate me into whatever he wants. Because we had a very close relationship and emotional connection it is really hard for me to let go and imagine that maybe in the future we will never see each other again, despite the fact that I still love him. It kills me to have done this, but I did not have a choice because of how taxing this is on me and I have my own issues to deal with (that I am just starting to deal with). I am younger than you are and in a different situation, but I thought I would share anyways. Maybe giving him an ultimatum and some time will make him realize what he needs to do, call it a separation instead of a complete divorce.

This is more a general comment to the thread.
I am at a hard point at the moment. Legally I am not allowed to talk to him unless he signs a piece of paper saying that he approves of contact/communication (I spent upwards of $25K to get that). The law got into it because he accused me of trying to kill him, while in the psych. ward of the hospital where I called to have him placed because he was threatening suicide. I am not blameless I have been depressed and suicidal for several years and we talked openly about it and doing it together. I usually found the means and thought of many plans. Nevertheless he was very emotionally abusive, blamed me endlessly for everything that went wrong, he was manipulative, kept me up until 2am to complain about his depression or abuse me emotionally or physically for a month straight. He had huge mood swings and went from idolizing to devaluating me and hating me. I allowed him to move in with me, but he would run back and forth between his parents and myself whenever there were problems with either one of us, to the point where he felt unsafe at both places. Overall he fits the criteria for BPD. I decided not to accuse him of the same thing and give the police the complete picture because I saw no use in getting him in the same legal problems, which he may not know how to defend himself from. This also nearly ruined my academics and I had to stop my research. After nearly a year of legal battle and going to jail (twice, last time on my birthday thanks to him) I was able to get an agreement where I admitted I breached and talked to him when I was not supposed to and if he approves of communication I can talk to him, but only if. He still has not signed it. He seems to expect me to talk to him and breach, as I have done in the past. All he has to do is sign a *insert swear words* piece of paper. Last I talked to him was before the ruling (again taking risks) and that is when I told him that I cannot stay with him unless he gets help. Last week my probation officer accidentally initiated a slew of text messages and emails from him asking for us to see each other again, saying that he is better and went to get help, accepts part of the blame, etc. But he still expects me to give him a sign or tell him to sign the piece of paper, which is not something I can do. That or breach entirely and who cares if he signs or not. I would rather not loose everything I had to fight to regain after the horrible mess he put me through. Oddly last Wednesday I had an exceptionally strong dream about him where I was almost up and going on sites we were both on. Then that day is when he started asking to see me again. Then he asked again on Saturday and I could not go to bed until midnight (I usually go to bed at 8:30/9). He pretty much sent me back 3 months in the therapy I was doing and accepting that I cannot be in a relationship with him. When I do go to sleep I have an exceptionally vivid and detailed nightmare, much worse than the others I had about him when I first separated from him (I had nightmares about him every night for a few weeks). I did not sleep at all last night, hurray! The meds did not work. -I've had sleeping problems and severe migraines since I was a child, finally found something that helped me sleep and helped with depression/anxiety (buspirone) without knocking me out like most sleeping medications and make me feel groggy like most antidepressants and anxiolitics.- I noticed I can identify emotions through music and actually feel through music, so again and again I still hear the songs I associated with him and being forcibly separated by the courts. I had no idea what to do even if he signs the paper. I talked to my therapist and we agreed that I could talk to him and see if he is better, but let him know my boundaries and not start to see him again as neither one of us are healthy enough. I could not live with myself if I simply ignored him or brushed him off.

It is like cupcakequeen mentioned "we allow ourselves to be". I had a very abusive childhood and probably seek out a partner that is similar to my parents and so one that is likely to be abusive. I was in other relationships before but I felt nothing for the other person, where i was in a surprisingly healthy relationship with. Due to the abusive childhood I nearly think it is normal. In a way having Aspergers may make things worse as we may have a harder time noticing the social cues and depending on our upbringing because we are quirky we are ostracized from society and are more sensitive than NTs to that. I used to call myself an alien and wondered where the hell I came from as I did not belong and still do not belong (save by "acting", wearing a mask, faking being normal) in society. I noted I tend to feel emotions more strongly and for longer, but cannot easily identify them or show them compared to most other people. We also have difficulty showing emotions which can lead to a great deal of misinterpretation with anyone. That is a less existentialistic way of explaining the tendency but we still have to relearn what is a normal relationship and notice social cues.

Sorry long reply. I hope it helps someone and maybe someone has some recommendations?

 

[arthousesalem]

First off, I'm alarmed by the awful experiences you guys have lived through. Hopefully, the next partner will be someone emotionally stable, supportive & worthy of your time & attention. As for whether or not Aspies are 'prone to being emotionally abused' I'm not certain. I think some Aspies may be more vulnerable & sensitive & have trouble wading through the emotional signals of the NT world. also, some Aspies feel acutely lonesome and/or very trusting & may inadvertently attach themselves & become bonded to the wrong person: someone with bad intentions...BUT, this same situation happens to NTs all the time as well. I think it is probably more accurate to state that predatory people (Narcissists, those with Borderline Personality disorder or people who are just rotters) are good as vetting a crowd of people & targeting those whom they've determined would be most vulnerable to their particular con. Helping personalities may be more vulnerable to someone who appears to be in need, those who value their ability to pay for thing, earn a lot of money & provide may be vulnerable to someone who wants to exploit them financially. Scammmers & deceptive people are good at tailoring their fake personas to suit their agenda. Uncovering their scams may be very difficult: some of these types end up bilking many people out of their life savings & these victims are NOT all or even mostly Aspies: the con artist has practiced hos or her shtick & is a practiced liar. Most of us Aspie & NT just are who we are & nothing in our up-bringing or education has prepared us to confront & manage or even possibly recognize a crafty & skilled deceiver.

I went to a lecture where they discussed Asperger's female and abuse. Apparently it is very common especially in relationships and also in teenage years. I can relate as I seem to attract controlling and at time narcistic people in my life.

 

[rollerskate]

Some time ago I came across this excerpt from a book on dealing with manipulative people.
Psychopaths In Sheep's Clothing

This summary provides a break down on the behaviors employed when an emotional abuser is at work. I found this very interesting and informative. I can’t always identify what’s going on as it happens, but reflecting later on a conversation I find this list helpful as a checklist to see if they used any of these tactics on me.

It is quite long, but it is well worth the read!

I note it is written with the assumption that emotional abusers are male. I find this unfortunate as women are just as adept at this in my personal opinion (or perhaps even more so given their lack of physical strength).

It was not written with aspies in mind, but the way it has been broken down and explained particularly suits the way I think. I hope it is of use to you too.

Wow I went down thias list and realized my ex used all of these tactics, not just during the lifespan of the relationship, but often ALL AT ONCE ALL THE TIME. No wonder I had a hard time pinning him down. Most only use a few at a time when it's most convenient. He waged a serious all out war, probably because he knew I was quite astute from past experiences. Had he dropped the ball for one minute I would have immediately been able to confirm the rest was just a game.

 

[Ereth]

Sorry long reply. I hope it helps someone and maybe someone has some recommendations?

You need a good lawyer and also a mental health expert or two on your team. Tell the lawyer everything. Don't hide a single detail. Print your posts if you have to. And don't worry about getting your husband into legal trouble. Frankly, he's done nothing to deserve such concern, and he clearly doesn't worry about you in the same way.

 

[rollerskate]

You need a good lawyer and also a mental health expert or two on your team. Tell the lawyer everything. Don't hide a single detail. Print your posts if you have to. And don't worry about getting your husband into legal trouble. Frankly, he's done nothing to deserve such concern, and he clearly doesn't worry about you in the same way.

Just a small note, make sure the mental health professionals are capable of testifying in court... If they're under contract not to participate in court cases, it'll be a waste of effort.

 

[I am that which I am]

s

Just a small note, make sure the mental health professionals are capable of testifying in court... If they're under contract not to participate in court cases, it'll be a waste of effort.

You need a good lawyer and also a mental health expert or two on your team. Tell the lawyer everything. Don't hide a single detail. Print your posts if you have to. And don't worry about getting your husband into legal trouble. Frankly, he's done nothing to deserve such concern, and he clearly doesn't worry about you in the same way.

Hello, Thanks for the replies. I did end up paying the best lawyer in town to get me out of the heap of crap he put me in and get that agreement. I am lucky that I have good contacts (who know good contacts) and can afford it now that I worked really hard to make my own life without my parent's help. I had another one of the best lawyer before him, but she was too emotional and controlling. The one I found after her was straight forward and knew what to do. I also got a few health care professionals to write assessments (a psychiatrist, social worker, and therapist). It really bothers me how he cannot even sign the damn piece of paper. He contacted me again tonight making up excuses as to why he is not signing it, these are primarily to comfort himself. Such as "the detective has to approve of it first"; not according to what I have he doesn't. He fears that I might reject him if he signs. I broke up with him as clearly as possible and also nicely but firmly three months ago. Then he tells me the passwords of several of his accounts and wants to chat on there . It sounds like manipulation and entrapment. He even tries to get me to respond by whether or not I read his texts, I did not know you could tell. Oh and I found out he re-made an account I had after deleting it, using a similar alias last summer and tried to find dates when we were separated. This is overwhelmingly creepy. I recall that at the beginning of our relationship when we had a philosophical disagreement he produced a message supposedly from someone else that had emailed him just to show me that he could find someone else if he wanted to. I bent and let him win the argument. In the back of my mind I always wondered if he wrote the message himself just to get me to do that, it has bothered me ever since. I still do not think it would be any use to harm him, I doubt he is a psychopath. Him being or not being a psychopath is complicated by the fact that he (at least around me) has multiple personalities. One seems a bit psychopathic, I talked to a prof I had that specialized in psychopathy and she said it sounds quite possible but because of the other mental health issues (like the multiple personalties) it is hard to say anything for sure. He seems to have a more human personality and a few others. He used to have statues for all of these until he destroyed them in one of his mental breakdowns, before I checked him in the hospital. I wonder if these were a really cleaver act though and I just saw too much of myself in him. I admit one of my imaginary friends (Morganstern) was a bit too vivid sometimes and it was a way for me to escape without feeling any pain (good old dissociation). I let that part of me go (or banished it rather) years ago, I still think of it but I see it very differently now. I know Morganstern is me and is just like another mask I can wear or part I can play. I think I am over complicating things and thinking my ex is far too much like me.

I am saddened by how ill he is, my therapist is right he does not sound any better he sounds worse. Really if I get him charged with abuse, entrapment, or some other odd thing what will it do. He will go to jail will have a hard time getting himself out of that heap of crap and if he is lucky they may force him to get the psychiatric help he needs. He will probably not benefit from it much. I will give him a week (ending next Tuesday). If he signs I guess I meet with him, but that will just be to tell him its over again and explain my thorough reasoning. If not then I will block his number on my phone.

 

[Ereth]

He fears that I might reject him if he signs. I broke up with him as clearly as possible and also nicely but firmly three months ago. Then he tells me the passwords of several of his accounts and wants to chat on there . It sounds like manipulation and entrapment.

It sounds like it's manipulation and entrapment because it is manipulation and entrapment.

He even tries to get me to respond by whether or not I read his texts, I did not know you could tell. Oh and I found out he re-made an account I had after deleting it, using a similar alias last summer and tried to find dates when we were separated. This is overwhelmingly creepy. I recall that at the beginning of our relationship when we had a philosophical disagreement he produced a message supposedly from someone else that had emailed him just to show me that he could find someone else if he wanted to.

More manipulation. In a healthy relationship, neither party feels the need to prove something like that to the other.

I still do not think it would be any use to harm him, I doubt he is a psychopath.

Nobody's advocating this, especially given the presence of mental illness (though if you mean that getting help for his mental health is harmful, then that's another story).

I am saddened by how ill he is, my therapist is right he does not sound any better he sounds worse. Really if I get him charged with abuse, entrapment, or some other odd thing what will it do. He will go to jail will have a hard time getting himself out of that heap of crap and if he is lucky they may force him to get the psychiatric help he needs. He will probably not benefit from it much.

I'm not necessarily saying he needs to go to jail. But the manipulation, legal or otherwise, has to end. I understand you are concerned for his health and overall well being, but every time you give him another chance, you give him another chance to exploit your kindness. That's one way abusers maintain control over their victims. He keeps saying he's sorry and wants to do better by you, but has he? No. He's gotten you in legal trouble because he claimed you threatened to kill him (yes, I know he was suicidal and ill). Honestly, he's in no shape to be in a relationship with anybody right now. His mood swings and threats have made you feel miserable and exacerbated your depression. You need to be your own advocate, not his. You've done so much for him, but it has only brought both of you more pain. So find a lawyer who can help you with the contract issue and start working for what's best for you.

 

[theduckrabbit]

Why Does He Do That? Is a great book to help you understand patterns of abuse in relationships. It was incredibly eye-opening for me.
I know that my Aspergers has made me an easy target for abuse, in my family and with partners. Abusers are very perceptive as to who is easy to manipulate.