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Addressing double standards in dating/love/sex

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That's for her to worry about and for you to qualify. That's the problem here, you're playing along with the narrative. You shouldn't. What DO you want from a partner? List it out, you get to choose, you're not obliged to go along with the first person who likes you. But if the only standard you have is that they like you, well then yeah, it's all down to what you bring to the table. What that woman did on the second date would, to me, be a red flag large enough to soft-cancel any thoughts of a relationship. But then again I'm pretty much done with drama, so maybe I'm a bit intolerant.


Regardless of the sort of person they are, what they've done, their opinions, their experiences? I mean if you're up for a few flings, fair play, but you want to marry them, right? So how do you think it's going to feel, as that potential life partner, to know the only thing that mattered about you was that you had a vagina? Reckon that feels like you matter?

Get some standards for yourself and this problem goes away too. It doesn't have to be crazy standards, but things like: looks after themselves and their hygiene, curious about the world, not overly defensive or argumentative, etc..


Don't even bother. One thing I've learned is that many(most?) people will use every scrap of evidence or leverage to portray themselves as deserving something. You are utterly free to size people up as you see fit. They're not obliged to find you a great guy, but you do you. If you want to go for women based on whether you find them attractive in 2 seconds, you can. You might find you don't get the type of partner you're looking for, so might need to re-evaluate your approach, but it doesn't come from a rule book on how you must think. That book doesn't exist. Who cares if some random woman thinks you are shallow? You do you.


I don't find this a good idea at all. Sorry.

Then don't donate sperm and you won't have to worry about what people who give and receive sperm think about.


Take advantage? Why would they do that? I mean if that's what you're into, fine....

There is no rule book. There are no "standards" to have double. These women are looking for their partner, they are as packed with biases and weird stuff as all the guys. They post-hoc rationalise this by grasping on a bunch of sociological memes about what should happen and what they are entitled to as a way of making sense of things. Decide what you want, screen for that, disqualify people. If you want to be "shallow" go ahead, you're not obliged to be super thoughtful. Of course, make sure it's consensual, but free yourself from this feeling of playing a role.
So, I do get to have standards, then?

What I’d like in a partner

- Good person

- At least modestly attractive

- Best friend

- Loyal

- Someone whom I can spoil and pamper

- Common interests are not a requirement, but would help

- No smoking or doing drugs

- I don’t like piercings (ear piercings are fine) or tattoos

- Can’t be a trump supporter, MAGA, Q’Anon, conspiracy theorist.

There’s a part of me that’s been hurt by her so much that it changed my outlook of women and whom I can trust, then there’s another part that misses her and would give it another shot if she was willing. It’s like I’ve been hurt so many times, but it also gets exhausting constantly putting myself out there to women from apps.


You took the second point out of context. I said I don’t want anything from her of monetary value. I’m not looking to marry for money, for status, for class, any of that stuff. I want my person and I want a peace of mind when I died to say marriage was something I did. That’s what I mean by that. I want her, but the only gift I want her to give me is her love.

I’ve gone for women society would not deem conventionally attractive and have gone on dates and seen women whom society would claim are not conventionally attractive. What man wouldn’t love to have a drop dead gorgeous partner? Though it’s also possible they become drop dead gorgeous when getting to know and spend time with them. That’s happened to me a couple times, too.

May I ask why you don’t think donating sperm is a good idea? If I can’t have kids the more conventional route, again, this is about peace of mind.

Take advantage, take me up on, whatever terminology is best with you in regards to women reaping the rewards of whatever good qualities I might have, if semantics are important to you.

Everybody I think shallow to an extent, but if you think I’m just putting myself out there to swimsuit models, I’m sorry to say that you’re wrong.
 
Apologies if you've already mentioned this, but are there any groups for autism or your special interests in your area? Or maybe you could.look for zoom groups. Seems like neurological compatibility and similar hobbies are very important to you
 
Apologies if you've already mentioned this, but are there any groups for autism or your special interests in your area? Or maybe you could.look for zoom groups. Seems like neurological compatibility and similar hobbies are very important to you
Not that I know of. It’s a small area.

That would be pretty nice, yes, but as long as you don’t do hunting and fishing, it doesn’t bother me what your hobbies are.

I am, however, attracted to brains and intellectual women, yes.
 
Same, a switched on woman is very attractive. So is physical beauty which is why objectification theory is so alienating to me. So what if a woman in a magazine is attractive.
 
But I do. Do I need validation from everyone? No. But do I need validation from others? Absolutely. It is through others that I feel good about myself and I feel validated much of the time. Sure, I can feel self validation, but I have to get it from others, too.
Sorry to hear that. You are doing yourself no favor by seeking external validation.

When people reacted positively to me and in the relationships I have had and still have, I see it more as confirmation of the good things that I think of myself.
 
Sorry to hear that. You are doing yourself no favor by seeking external validation.

When people reacted positively to me and in the relationships I have had and still have, I see it more as confirmation of the good things that I think of myself.
Then what do you say when I do receive external validation, when I get it, which I have gotten in my life?
 
I sometimes give up on good people
Because I know too and have seem women be shallow with men and not even think their husbands attractive unless he is some Brad Pitt.
I mean I have heard women online use language that implies they do not think their husbands are attractive
And then they do not love themselves.
I mean I do not know these people but I do think that some women value physical appearance in a man more than a loving heart.
I do not care who validates them, I just speak whst I see.

Do you think it's more being well groomed and smartly dressed or just genetically attractive, eg handsome and fit body?
 
That you are fundamentally an immature person with no self discipline. And you wonder why you are failing at relationships?
There’s no one way to receive validation, and if you think I have no self discipline or maturity, I don’t know what to tell you, because I think it takes a lot of maturity and self discipline to have successfully worked toward some goals in my life and to fulfill the responsibilities and obligations I have.
 
So, I do get to have standards, then?
Of course you do. No one (with any credible ability to stop you) ever said you couldn't. Like I said, people jostle for advantage the whole time. OF COURSE women are going to use tropes that demand more of others whilst letting themselves off the hook. Everyone does. The issue you have is reading these things like they are rules, rather than recognising them as people trying to gain a bit of leverage.
What I’d like in a partner

- Good person

- At least modestly attractive

- Best friend

- Loyal

- Someone whom I can spoil and pamper

- Common interests are not a requirement, but would help

- No smoking or doing drugs

- I don’t like piercings (ear piercings are fine) or tattoos

- Can’t be a trump supporter, MAGA, Q’Anon, conspiracy theorist.
I don't think it would hurt to be more specific on things like "good person" and "best friend". But this is a pretty good start. Nothing wrong with doing this as long as we're a) not absolutely shutting the door (i.e. dealbreakers) to being surprised and b) maintain the understanding that this is simply about compatibility, not good/bad or right/wrong. I think on both you're playing fair so all good IMHO.



There’s a part of me that’s been hurt by her so much that it changed my outlook of women and whom I can trust, then there’s another part that misses her and would give it another shot if she was willing. It’s like I’ve been hurt so many times, but it also gets exhausting constantly putting myself out there to women from apps.
I can imagine you do. I can't tell if she made a genuine error or this is something else, but can fully respect that she hurt you. Whether you are prepared to give it another shot is up to you, as long as it's eyes wide open and it's not done with a begrudging "well I guess you'll do; I can't be bothered searching any more".

You took the second point out of context. I said I don’t want anything from her of monetary value. I’m not looking to marry for money, for status, for class, any of that stuff. I want my person and I want a peace of mind when I died to say marriage was something I did. That’s what I mean by that. I want her, but the only gift I want her to give me is her love.

I’ve gone for women society would not deem conventionally attractive and have gone on dates and seen women whom society would claim are not conventionally attractive. What man wouldn’t love to have a drop dead gorgeous partner? Though it’s also possible they become drop dead gorgeous when getting to know and spend time with them. That’s happened to me a couple times, too.
Understood.
May I ask why you don’t think donating sperm is a good idea? If I can’t have kids the more conventional route, again, this is about peace of mind.
I'm not sure on your local laws regarding being a part of the kids' lives but would suggest that this would be a very challenging situation. Let's assume that the parents would be prepared for this relationship, it would be very emotionally complex for you, the parents, the children. Don't take this the wrong way, but I do wonder if that's something you'd be up for.
Take advantage, take me up on, whatever terminology is best with you in regards to women reaping the rewards of whatever good qualities I might have, if semantics are important to you.
Understood
Everybody I think shallow to an extent, but if you think I’m just putting myself out there to swimsuit models, I’m sorry to say that you’re wrong.
No, I'm saying you're well within your rights to do so and with no shame at all. You may have trouble finding that loyal, best friend type if you do, but please do not for one second believe that there is anyone preventing you from doing so. That language of "women can do x....but men have to do y" speaks of rules that just don't exist. If you see that in girls mags, etc. you're actually reading a publisher trying to make money by printing what girls want to read to make themselves feel special. Don't take it seriously. That doesn't mean your values have no impact. If you WERE going for "don't care what they say as long as they look like a model" you might find that you don't get on with their "six pack, 6 foot plus and a fat wallet only" values.
 
I think is for the degradation of family values, that women are looking for the 15% top percent of men, and they get them, problem is lot of times these 'winner men' don't settle, but they still perceive those men are for them and don't want anything 'lower'. And there are guys who would want a family and fidelity, but are not those top 15 percenters.
As a result now you have lots of single women with kids, broken families etc.
All this for having bad values, men and women.

If someone else has a different perception i listen.
 
I’m not looking to marry for money, for status, for class, any of that stuff. I want my person and I want a peace of mind when I died to say marriage was something I did. That’s what I mean by that. I want her, but the only gift I want her to give me is her love.

You previously indicated that love isn't important to you.

Am I a bad person, per se, if I am indeed looking for a solution to my problem? That I don’t care what the basis of the relationship is, that I don’t care if we love each other or not, all so I can have a wedding I can’t stop idealizing about and have to have?

I need a wedding where I’m the star of the show and I’m the center of attention and it’s all about me with all eyes on me. I want to DJ my own music and give a speech gloating about how great I am and how I won by finally getting married.

Have things changed perhaps?

Are you (now) interested in a relationship for the sake of a relationship, or are you (still) looking at a relationship as a potential means for a wedding?
 
You previously indicated that love isn't important to you.





Have things changed perhaps?

Are you (now) interested in a relationship for the sake of a relationship, or are you (still) looking at a relationship as a potential means for a wedding?
I’d have to think it would have to depend on the person.

In an ideal world, love, relationship, etc. I think when I actually talk and connect with a woman I chat with on a dating app, and if things go well when I meet her, then I will want her for her.
 
I need a wedding where I’m the star of the show and I’m the center of attention and it’s all about me with all eyes on me. I want to DJ my own music and give a speech gloating about how great I am and how I won by finally getting married.
<record scratch sound effect>

What the what?

I don't think I have any value to add here.
 
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Of course you do. No one (with any credible ability to stop you) ever said you couldn't. Like I said, people jostle for advantage the whole time. OF COURSE women are going to use tropes that demand more of others whilst letting themselves off the hook. Everyone does. The issue you have is reading these things like they are rules, rather than recognising them as people trying to gain a bit of leverage.

I don't think it would hurt to be more specific on things like "good person" and "best friend". But this is a pretty good start. Nothing wrong with doing this as long as we're a) not absolutely shutting the door (i.e. dealbreakers) to being surprised and b) maintain the understanding that this is simply about compatibility, not good/bad or right/wrong. I think on both you're playing fair so all good IMHO.




I can imagine you do. I can't tell if she made a genuine error or this is something else, but can fully respect that she hurt you. Whether you are prepared to give it another shot is up to you, as long as it's eyes wide open and it's not done with a begrudging "well I guess you'll do; I can't be bothered searching any more".


Understood.

I'm not sure on your local laws regarding being a part of the kids' lives but would suggest that this would be a very challenging situation. Let's assume that the parents would be prepared for this relationship, it would be very emotionally complex for you, the parents, the children. Don't take this the wrong way, but I do wonder if that's something you'd be up for.

Understood

No, I'm saying you're well within your rights to do so and with no shame at all. You may have trouble finding that loyal, best friend type if you do, but please do not for one second believe that there is anyone preventing you from doing so. That language of "women can do x....but men have to do y" speaks of rules that just don't exist. If you see that in girls mags, etc. you're actually reading a publisher trying to make money by printing what girls want to read to make themselves feel special. Don't take it seriously. That doesn't mean your values have no impact. If you WERE going for "don't care what they say as long as they look like a model" you might find that you don't get on with their "six pack, 6 foot plus and a fat wallet only" values.
So, good person - kind heart, giving/generous, having good values, being faithful to their partner, having compassion and warmth for others and believing in equal rights and social justice.

Best Friend - Someone for me to confide in, to trust, someone who will be there for me as I will for them, someone who will support me and have my back as I will for them, where we do things together and just enjoy being around each other, while realizing the other person has flaws, but accepting them anyway.

Well, she has to also be on board, too, since I haven’t heard anything from her since Wednesday. On one hand, she hurt me, but on another, I legitimately find common ground between us and just enjoy talking to and spending time with her.

I just hope there’d be some way I could have a relationship at some point in our lives, if not when they’re young, then when they get older. If I father just one child through the sperm bank, I’d be over the moon.

Really, my person could look like a model, or she could not.
<record scratch sound effect>

What the what?

What is it you actually want from a partner, because that doesn't fit in with the laments you've been pouring out for the past few days.
I know I want to get engaged and get married. Ideally, my next relationship will be the last one I’ll ever have to have.
 
I wonder why only female humans and whales go through menopause. No other mammals are known to do it. Whether we women act consciously and/or subconsciously, we are looking for committed men who will stay with us throughout our lives, protect and provide for us and our offspring.
I think you may have stumbled across this article: Do Animals Have Menopause?

Speculating but it be the fact that, as humans, we don't have a "breeding season" associated with environmental changes and food supply, or perhaps because the ovaries are on an accelerated schedule of producing an egg, or eggs every month, versus other animals, which may only be once per year.

Your second comment, which is more of a traditional social construct, something that I think older generations and perhaps more mature adult women might buy into. I am not sure this is the case for this latest generation of women who have this dysphoria that they don't need men, at all, in terms of being part of a family and personal support. There has been a shift, perhaps because of misplaced feminist views that treat masculinity, in general, as toxic, when of course, toxic is toxic, male or female, and there is no such thing as "toxic masculinity" per se. The end result is a long list of behaviors that feminize males from early childhood, drives men away from their female partners, and results in a generation of young men who have been told they aren't needed, nor do they have a strong, masculine father figure in their life to constantly remind them of responsibility, honor, respect, self-discipline, etc over their feelings. You have a generation of young men who filter their actions through their feelings, which sets them up for a life of failure in the real world. So, it has become sort of a self-fulfilling prophecy. Of course, these same young women are quick to forget the car they drive, the home they live in, the roads they drive on, the places they shop, the electric, water, sewer, internet they enjoy is there primarily because of men building and maintaining them. So far, we haven't women, in mass, wanting these sorts of jobs to replace men and making men totally useless. In other words, basically, men are not needed for the family anymore, but they can be relegated to doing the manual labor in society and maintaining the infrastructure, which is a very twisted and destructive view to have.
 
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