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“The longer you wait, the harder it gets.”

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Storm Hess

Permanent Spaceman
There maybe liability issues with that, so perhaps this forum choses not to go there. But he can always pm and try to strike up a conversation that way.
Most likely. I didn't think about the legal aspect. I know there's dating sites for people with ASD and disabilities...so that would probably be best. :)
 

tree

Blue/Green
Staff member
V.I.P Member
:)

Maybe in the members section, there can be a 'Dating' section where people try to get to know each other? Maybe this forum should try to fill that need? Just a thought.
There maybe liability issues with that, so perhaps this forum choses not to go there. But he can always pm and try to strike up a conversation that way.
 

Neonatal RRT

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
When the movie The 40 Year Old Virgin came out, I remember seeing the tagline “The longer you wait, the harder it gets.” on the movie posters and ads. I am 34 years old and I don’t even date due to my social as well as cultural isolation and discouragement from past failures in attempts to get a date. It feels like opportunities for romance are getting fewer and fewer because most people in my age range are in long term relationships or are married. Are observations like that the root of that movie’s tagline? Am I just going to my grave single?
I think you found two things you need to overcome. You can not find a partner,...nor they find you,...if you are isolated. Past failures are common,...and there are two thoughts to this. One, you only improve your odds if you make yourself available,...keeping in mind,...you will fail again, no doubt, before the right person connects with you. Two, you have to be open to taking the risk of failing again,...and again,...before you find a partner. Instead of failing and being devastated,...use it as a learning opportunity. Sometimes it can be a bit of a "trial and error" cycle until you get it right. I think you have to be mature enough to give yourself some "grace" with all of this,...but clearly isolating yourself will not yield a potential partner,...nor will giving up out of frustration after a handful of failed attempts. Understand that realistically,...statistically speaking,...a "love connection" is quite rare. You might interact with several people each day, every day,...for months or years,...and then, "out of the blue" someone connects with you.

I understand my personal situation,...I dated a fair amount,...made my mistakes,...but ultimately, my wife "found me" when I really wasn't looking. This all within the context of me being surrounded by thousands of young women on a university campus. Then, years of mistakes, learning, patience, understanding,...meanwhile the relationship evolves,...so I am still learning and changing. It's not a passive endeavor.
 

chameleonov

Well-Known Member
The worst advice I've ever gotten has been from random people on the internet. Reading most of these posts is painful, because I know this type of advice wont help you in any way, even though I'm sure they mean well. All of these people are amateurs in dating, you need a professional who understands autism really well and can help you appropriately with your anxiety/isolation. Sadly dating coaches only now slowly start to realize that their core customers are probably on the spectrum. It will take time to adjust their strategy properly, and when that time comes, we'll be senior citizens or dead.

I don't want to sound negative, but I have to sound realistic. I don't want to give you false hope and sugar coat some fairytale future. Dying alone and single is a very high probablity for many autistics. And forget about movies like that, they're making a mockery out of the whole subject.(I haven't seen it, and don't plan to either)
 

Aspychata

Serenity waves, beachy vibes
V.I.P Member
I think you found two things you need to overcome. You can not find a partner,...nor they find you,...if you are isolated. Past failures are common,...and there are two thoughts to this. One, you only improve your odds if you make yourself available,...keeping in mind,...you will fail again, no doubt, before the right person connects with you. Two, you have to be open to taking the risk of failing again,...and again,...before you find a partner. Instead of failing and being devastated,...use it as a learning opportunity. Sometimes it can be a bit of a "trial and error" cycle until you get it right. I think you have to be mature enough to give yourself some "grace" with all of this,...but clearly isolating yourself will not yield a potential partner,...nor will giving up out of frustration after a handful of failed attempts. Understand that realistically,...statistically speaking,...a "love connection" is quite rare. You might interact with several people each day, every day,...for months or years,...and then, "out of the blue" someone connects with you.

I understand my personal situation,...I dated a fair amount,...made my mistakes,...but ultimately, my wife "found me" when I really wasn't looking. This all within the context of me being surrounded by thousands of young women on a university campus. Then, years of mistakes, learning, patience, understanding,...meanwhile the relationship evolves,...so I am still learning and changing. It's not a passive endeavor.
True dat x100

Just didn't want to scare @Markness away.
 

Misery

Amalga Heart
V.I.P Member
The worst advice I've ever gotten has been from random people on the internet. Reading most of these posts is painful, because I know this type of advice wont help you in any way, even though I'm sure they mean well. All of these people are amateurs in dating, you need a professional who understands autism really well and can help you appropriately with your anxiety/isolation. Sadly dating coaches only now slowly start to realize that their core customers are probably on the spectrum. It will take time to adjust their strategy properly, and when that time comes, we'll be senior citizens or dead.

I don't want to sound negative, but I have to sound realistic. I don't want to give you false hope and sugar coat some fairytale future. Dying alone and single is a very high probablity for many autistics. And forget about movies like that, they're making a mockery out of the whole subject.(I haven't seen it, and don't plan to either)

Trust me, advice from "professionals" can be plenty bad, or worse... like some of us here, including myself, already know first-hand. And I dont mean just with dating.

Besides, not all of this advice is even meant for that in the way that you're thinking.

That being said... it's really not helpful to go into a post like that and point out how "dying alone is a very high probability". Like, that's the opposite of helpful when someone is in a low state. That's like going up to someone who wants to be a professional artist yet is finding themselves stuck (as many artists will experience) and telling them "dude, these stats I read somewhere say you'll never use those paints right, and stats are always right in all situations, people in your situation always end up being terrible at art forever, you may as well just drop the brush and go find a different hobby/profession".

THE thing I'm always telling people on here about basically every topic ever, and the thing I've experienced firsthand in so many situations (and I dont mean about dating, I mean in general), is that you've gotta stay positive even in the face of really rough odds. If you go into a battle thinking you ABSOLUTELY cannot win, then indeed, you've already lost. You shot yourself in the foot before the enemy even saw you. OF COURSE you're going to lose now. In that situation, after doing that to yourself... how could you not?

And telling someone "the stats say most of us never win" is a spectacular way to get them to point that gun at their own foot before the fight.
 

Rodafina

Hopefully Human
Staff member
V.I.P Member
The worst advice I've ever gotten has been from random people on the internet. Reading most of these posts is painful, because I know this type of advice wont help you in any way

We are not random people to Markness. Some people here have known him for a very long time and we listen to him. I have only known him since the summer, but still, we are not random, we have all met here with intention and purpose, and we try to help each other because the experts cannot always help us.

It is perfectly fine to have a different opinion than anyone else, but disregarding everybody else’s advice would be damaging to Markness.

Dating coaches are actually taking your money in exchange for advice. People here offer it freely, because they care about Markness, and because they have experienced similar things to him.

All perspectives are valuable. Having multiple perspectives is even better.
 

Aspychata

Serenity waves, beachy vibes
V.I.P Member
Trust me, advice from "professionals" can be plenty bad, or worse... like some of us here, including myself, already know first-hand. And I dont mean just with dating.

Besides, not all of this advice is even meant for that in the way that you're thinking.

That being said... it's really not helpful to go into a post like that and point out how "dying alone is a very high probability". Like, that's the opposite of helpful when someone is in a low state. That's like going up to someone who wants to be a professional artist yet is finding themselves stuck (as many artists will experience) and telling them "dude, these stats I read somewhere say you'll never use those paints right, and stats are always right in all situations, people in your situation always end up being terrible at art forever, you may as well just drop the brush and go find a different hobby/profession".

THE thing I'm always telling people on here about basically every topic ever, and the thing I've experienced firsthand in so many situations (and I dont mean about dating, I mean in general), is that you've gotta stay positive even in the face of really rough odds. If you go into a battle thinking you ABSOLUTELY cannot win, then indeed, you've already lost. You shot yourself in the foot before the enemy even saw you. OF COURSE you're going to lose now. In that situation, after doing that to yourself... how could you not?

And telling someone "the stats say most of us never win" is a spectacular way to get them to point that gun at their own foot before the fight.
Totally agree with this. Sometimes l feel like everything is doubling hard for us on the spectrum.
 

Slime_Punk

 Please erase
V.I.P Member
Maybe try online dating. Use FaceTime or Scype as a tool to get to know someone. Once you're comfortable, move it to the real world. It's worth a shot. :)

I always suggest this! I feel like you can really get to know somebody before you even meet face-to-face, it's like the ultimate advantage over just asking somebody out based on looks or something superficial at a bar.

Plus, people will just write out their interests a lot of the time so you can skip the ones who aren't into the same stuff as you. It's so much better than finding out mid-date that you have nothing in common.
 

foliodoe

I'm living my whole life at once.
As an autistic person who's 33 years old who watched that movie as a teenager and took it all seriously...
That movie is a mess. It's a misogynistic, pigheaded comedy devoid of any humanity or reality.

It's not a guide to life. I had so many bad sexual experiences in my 20s because of insecurities from that sort of thing... I WISH I could take those back. I WISH I could have grown up to be a 40-year-old virgin lol Even though that used to scare the hell out of me. The grass is always greener. And movies aren't reality.

You're good and valid just the way you are!
 

paloftoon

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
As an autistic person who's 33 years old who watched that movie as a teenager and took it all seriously...
That movie is a mess. It's a misogynistic, pigheaded comedy devoid of any humanity or reality.

It's not a guide to life. I had so many bad sexual experiences in my 20s because of insecurities from that sort of thing... I WISH I could take those back. I WISH I could have grown up to be a 40-year-old virgin lol Even though that used to scare the hell out of me. The grass is always greener. And movies aren't reality.

You're good and valid just the way you are!

My first time ever was when I was 36 or 37, and I wish I had reasonably comfortable experiences before this age. I love the feel of the closeness and physicality personally, but I can understand your point of view too. People are not and don't know how to be kind enough.
 

paloftoon

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
There maybe liability issues with that, so perhaps this forum choses not to go there. But he can always pm and try to strike up a conversation that way.
Good idea, but I'd add to try to have more context. Don't just PM someone saying you want to date someone. There needs to be some kind of context- some post that attracted you and why and why a person might be interested in you. Try not to force things and make them as natural as possible- not and easy things and sometimes, it's good to balance that out with educated risks too.
 

Jordy

Well-Known Member
I don't want to sound negative, but I have to sound realistic. I don't want to give you false hope and sugar coat some fairytale future. Dying alone and single is a very high probablity for many autistics. And forget about movies like that, they're making a mockery out of the whole subject.(I haven't seen it, and don't plan to either)
You are right about everything you said here, but people don't like the uncomfortable truths. I would also add that i doubt dating coaches are ever going to be able to help man with autism, not in a hundred years.
 

Misery

Amalga Heart
V.I.P Member
You are right about everything you said, but people don't like the uncomfortable truths here. I would also add that i doubt dating coaches are ever going to be able to help man with autism, not in a hundred years.

Depends on what you mean by "truth".

In far, far too many cases when it comes to subjects like this, "truth" can be replaced with "assumption" and the end result will be the same. Or, it can also be replaced with "biased idea". Either, really. Sometimes also "frustrated biased idea" which I rather suspect is informing some of this one, but I digress...

This, I think, is one of those cases where "truth" isnt quite the accurate word. 'Tis foolish to attempt to apply blanket statements to anyone, particularly someone you dont know, which is why "these stats say you'll do THIS or do THIS definitely surely, really I'm right this time" doesnt really work.

And if you REALLY think about it, the entire idea starts to come apart at the seams when you think about the group it's being applied to. I mean, really... a giant pile of "accurate" stats, related to an intensely personal aspect of a person (relationships/romance) about a subset of people who are bloody notorious for NOT wanting to communicate with those they dont know? And that's what this is based off of? Really? I dont believe it for a second. Gonna take a wild guess and say that the data aint based off of as much as it probably sounds, as most on the spectrum arent likely to A: tell anyone their status even if asked, and B: allow their status to be recorded in such a way.

And all of that is entirely separate from actual relationship status. And that's all considering the idea that there even IS any such "data". I rather suspect this is all actually based on the simple myth that "autistic people never meet anyone or have friends or interact", which frankly is getting a bit old in my opinion. I mean good grief, even I meet people... which says something, considering how much I try to avoid that.

People are too wildly different for this concept of it being an "uncomfortable truth" to make even the slightest bit of sense.

...Also there are plenty here even just on this specific forum who are in a relationship of some sort, or who have been, and so on. It's not like they're some rare legendary critter that we only see on this forum once every 500 years during a blue moon on Friday the 13th. And that's JUST this forum. Imagine how many more there must be.

One way or another, Markness' situation is his own, and there's little point... or logic... in attempting to apply this blanket statement to someone you barely know, when considered alongside the simple fact that people are all so wildly different from one another. And so wildly complicated.

Sorry, I dont mean to sound too agitated, but if there's one thing that's gonna irk me real fast it's having to hear "you wont manage that, because [insert dubious and almost guaranteed to be biased negative data here] says so" about anyone.
 

Jordy

Well-Known Member
Depends on what you mean by "truth".

In far, far too many cases when it comes to subjects like this, "truth" can be replaced with "assumption" and the end result will be the same. Or, it can also be replaced with "biased idea". Either, really. Sometimes also "frustrated biased idea" which I rather suspect is informing some of this one, but I digress...

This, I think, is one of those cases where "truth" isnt quite the accurate word. 'Tis foolish to attempt to apply blanket statements to anyone, particularly someone you dont know, which is why "these stats say you'll do THIS or do THIS definitely surely, really I'm right this time" doesnt really work.

And if you REALLY think about it, the entire idea starts to come apart at the seams when you think about the group it's being applied to. I mean, really... a giant pile of "accurate" stats, related to an intensely personal aspect of a person (relationships/romance) about a subset of people who are bloody notorious for NOT wanting to communicate with those they dont know? And that's what this is based off of? Really? I dont believe it for a second. Gonna take a wild guess and say that the data aint based off of as much as it probably sounds, as most on the spectrum arent likely to A: tell anyone their status even if asked, and B: allow their status to be recorded in such a way.

And all of that is entirely separate from actual relationship status. And that's all considering the idea that there even IS any such "data". I rather suspect this is all actually based on the simple myth that "autistic people never meet anyone or have friends or interact", which frankly is getting a bit old in my opinion. I mean good grief, even I meet people... which says something, considering how much I try to avoid that.

People are too wildly different for this concept of it being an "uncomfortable truth" to make even the slightest bit of sense.

...Also there are plenty here even just on this specific forum who are in a relationship of some sort, or who have been, and so on. It's not like they're some rare legendary critter that we only see on this forum once every 500 years during a blue moon on Friday the 13th. And that's JUST this forum. Imagine how many more there must be.

One way or another, Markness' situation is his own, and there's little point... or logic... in attempting to apply this blanket statement to someone you barely know, when considered alongside the simple fact that people are all so wildly different from one another. And so wildly complicated.

Sorry, I dont mean to sound too agitated, but if there's one thing that's gonna irk me real fast it's having to hear "you wont manage that, because [insert dubious and almost guaranteed to be biased negative data here] says so" about anyone.
What he said about dating for man with autism is true. A large portion of man with autism die alone without having dated. You are going on some tangent about epistemology and methodology just because you don't like the results of the statistics. You are also misrepresenting what @chameleonov said and tagging extra meaning on his statement.

What exactly do you think are the requirements before someone can say that X is true about group Y? You personally make statements about the group of autistic people all the time.
 
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Misery

Amalga Heart
V.I.P Member
What he said about statistics on dating for man with autism is true. You are going on some tangent about epistemology and methodology just because you don't like the results.

What exactly do you think are the requirements before someone can say that X is true about group Y? You personally make statements about the group of autistic people all the time.

My point is that the statistics are merely being used as a blanket statement for an individual's situation...

You're trying to apply something statistical to someone you dont even know, have barely interacted with, and so on, and... yeah that makes no sense.

Like I said: Markness's situation is his own. Any "data" and "stats" that you can apply in this position can only be pushed forward as an assumption, because that's what it IS. An assumption based on stats/data is still an assumption. You have no idea what will or wont happen any more than he does. Again, to believe otherwise makes no bloody sense. You barely know anything about him, you've never met him outside of this forum (and barely met him ON it) and I cant figure out how I can be more clear about why that's a problem in this context. And I could say that about any other individual you're trying to push this towards.

People are not just stats, they are not just data. They can GENERATE stats and data (though that's awkward at best), but they are not those things. Nor are they driven or controlled by whatever recorded stats have come before them. It really is that simple.

The only one who can find out what'll happen in this situation is Markness himself, by taking (or not taking) action himself. That's the one and only way to know what'll happen... period.

I tell ya one thing though, sitting around here and saying "dude you definitely cant do it because of STATS" is a great way to get someone to give up, though. Then that person has ZERO chance, as opposed to having a non-zero chance. So... anyone posting might do well to consider that in the future. This is a freaking support forum...


As for myself making statements about autistics as a whole or whatever... of course I do. I'm bloody contrary. I think THAT has been made clear enough on this forum more than a few times. Even I cant make sense of me sometimes. Who knows what baffling/ridiculous thing I might do next? I sure dont. But that just goes into the fact that: Neither do you. Nor do you know what Markness... or anyone else... might do or accomplish next. Stats or no stats. That's my point.

That's about all I have to say on it for now though (I've hit the point where I'm likely to simply start repeating myself, which'll just waste everyone's time, particularly mine) so I'll pipe down for now. Besides, this is a romance/relationship sort of issue, which is... not my realm, even if I try to assist a bit regardless. I can rail against "stats" all day or try to provide positivity and moral support, that sort of thing, but the concept of romance itself is one I personally avoid at all costs (complete with garlic, a crucifix, and a wooden stake), so this might be a good point to leave it to some of you guys. Lest I end up just making this worse somehow.
 

Markness

Young God
V.I.P Member
I honestly thought the tagline had its origins in a more serious saying and that it got twisted into a sarcastic joke for the movie. I also remember Talmer Shockley, the author of The Love-Shy Survival Guide, saying in a video interview (I can post it if anyone wants.) that both social and romantic opportunities get fewer and fewer as you get older. He also said trying to hang out with younger people marked him as “weird.” I fear that’s happening to me.
 

VictorR

Random Member
V.I.P Member
I honestly thought the tagline had its origins in a more serious saying and that it got twisted into a sarcastic joke for the movie. I also remember Talmer Shockley, the author of The Love-Shy Survival Guide, saying in a video interview (I can post it if anyone wants.) that both social and romantic opportunities get fewer and fewer as you get older. He also said trying to hang out with younger people marked him as “weird.” I fear that’s happening to me.

See @Misery's post above.

Stats do not define you or your destiny. You do.
 
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