I think my partner of 8 years has undiagnosed ASD/PDA

[Artemis]

Also; just want to say ... I so appreciate how thoughtful and truly helpful you all are. I'm so lost at the moment and trying so hard to objectively understand the situation so I know what to do. I am so grateful for all of your perspectives. Thank you, thank you.

 

[LucyPurrs]

Sounds like you need to identify what your needs are then establish some boundaries and ground rules and limits. But yes, for sure put your life jacket on first!!!

 

[Autistamatic]

"Lack of responsibility" as you put it, is more likely to be related to Executive Function than PDA/DAP if he is on the spectrum. That IS directly related to autism as opposed to the other which is a co-occurring condition.

To clarify, co-occurring conditions are those which are not directly related to autism but have a higher incidence amongst autistic people than those not on the spectrum. A good example is alexithymia. About half of autistic people are alexithymic but there are still ten times as many non-autistic people who are alexithymic.
PDA/DAP is the same - you are more likely to find non-autistic people exhibiting it than those who are on the spectrum.

Assuming he is autistic then I think your research would likely bear more fruit if you looked into Executive Function Deficit rather than anything to do with demand avoidance.

It may well be worth finding out more about his senses. You've said he appears hypersensitive to bright lights, but he could also be hyposensitive in other respects, i.e. his sensory reception may be lesser than yours in certain areas rather than greater.

Overall though, if he IS on the spectrum, he needs to be doing the research or seeking the help that currently you are doing. You can't fix a troubled relationship alone - he must do his bit too.

 

[Brit]

Hi Artemis,

Im probably not the best person to answer your question since I don't have Aspergers myself. But much of what you've written does indeed sound like ASD behaviour to me. I have an ASD partner, and spent the last year reading everything I could find about ASD. This community has helped me so much.

My advice from the NT side would be to truly educate yourself about it, it's far more complex that you may first realise. Secondly, from my experience emotional behaviour even if your reasons are 100% valid is always counterproductive. And thirdly, even though your situation sounds very tough, don't despair, if you really love him you will find a way through it.

Sending you strength and courage.

 

[AloneNotLonely]

He sounds first and foremost like an entitled mooch to me. Whether he is an entitled autistic mooch or just a garden variety entitled mooch I wouldn't know.

You kissed a mooch, but he didn't turn into a prince. And now you are stuck with a mooch, which is what usually happens.

 

[unperson]

is schizoid personality disorder a possible? the selfishness and lack of ambition is something you get in schizoids, they have NO impulse to help others in fact they resent it.

 

[Cazelle]

He says he wants help, but he doesn't tell me how to help him and only criticizes me saying I'm an awful partner because I don't know what he needs or how to help. Then when things die down he'll say he's grateful for all I do and that it's not me, it's him. But, still no action really happens, no steps taken. That's our pattern. Tension > Fight > Silence > Normalcy > Love > Repeat.

It is not just YOUR job to figure out how to help him - he needs to help himself. At the moment it sounds like you are doing everything and are responsible for everything. That is not how relationships work.

My partner seems content (i guess?) knowing he's on the spectrum, and I don't think he cares about therapy, he says he does but does nothing about it. He just wants his life to be easier.

I hate to sound nasty but how can his life get much easier?? Surely he will find life much more rewarding and fulfilling if he just pulls finger and does something to make a change?

Artemis, what are you getting out of this relationship?

 

[Kyou Nukui]

ASD and or PDA isn't lack of trying hard enough to fit in, it isn't selfishness, it isn't sociopathic personality, and it isn't fun.
I don't know why there's so much judgement here.

I think you'll find out if he has PDA if you give him the list of demands so many are advising! Hey, you can even make it in order of priority and see if he (eventually, when he returns) does something from the bottom of the list of demands instead of the top.

 

[Artemis]

Surely he will find life much more rewarding and fulfilling if he just pulls finger and does something to make a change?

This is awful. Truly awful. I'm having a really hard time, and this is not helpful at all. Makes me actually feel more misunderstood. Agree with @Kyou Nukui — I don't know why there's so much judgement here. Came to this forum for advice from ASDs, Aspie's, and NT's who love them. I am love first, and yes, I have work to do on myself and not over-giving, some great valid points there, but he is in pain and hurting. I am wise enough to know that he's nasty and selfish because he's lost and hurting inside.

 

[Artemis]

Hi Artemis,

Im probably not the best person to answer your question since I don't have Aspergers myself. But much of what you've written does indeed sound like ASD behaviour to me. I have an ASD partner, and spent the last year reading everything I could find about ASD. This community has helped me so much.

My advice from the NT side would be to truly educate yourself about it, it's far more complex that you may first realise. Secondly, from my experience emotional behaviour even if your reasons are 100% valid is always counterproductive. And thirdly, even though your situation sounds very tough, don't despair, if you really love him you will find a way through it.

Sending you strength and courage.

I saw this post earlier today while on a break and it made me cry, felt understood by someone and I thank you so very much for that. I feel so lonely and so sad about the state of things. Today is our anniversary. He forgot. I reminded him this morning, he was apologetic and we had a nice morning. I came home, expecting—what, I don't know really. Had the opportunity to come home early and thought he may take the opportunity to I dunno, but flowers, make a dinner suggestion, even just do nothing but be extra sweet. He told me, in a nice way, but still, that he was tired and wanted to be in bed by 9:30pm and I told him that hurt my feelings because I felt he didn't care. Then he said I use my feelings as weapons. Now HE's the one mad at ME. It's totally insane. It's our 8 year anniversary.

This is all so hard to grasp because it really feels like I can't be me, I can't expect anything or communicate when I'm unhappy. Any complaint is treated as an attack. @Brit do you feel that way often?? Is this what I have to accept? I agree with you it's really hard to understand the nuance between pathology and personality and so I don't know what I have to accept and what is stuff we can work on in our relationship.

 

[Brit]

Artemis! Happy anniversary firstly. 8 years is an incredible feet in any relationship, it’s really wonderful. you two have made it so far. There’s so much I could say to you on the subject, but as this forum often reminds me - I don’t know the specifics of his behaviour and therefore I’m only instinctively reacting to your call for help because i felt the way you do not so long ago.

I get the impression you want to save the marriage. That’s so commendable, so much more difficult than walking away (even though if that were your choice it would be perfectly ok too) so I just want you to know that there is hope. I was so lost too, so I turned to books, I’ve read every aspergers book on Amazon, a hell of a lot on autism in general, and read anything I can find (everyday) just to remind myself that our experiences (NT vs ASD) are so profoundly different. When I began to understand that, I felt so relieved that i wasn’t going mad, but also sad that I had pressed someone so much, trying to trigger a response I would never get.

In my experience, I have never received words or affection that was expected. But what I did get, was spontaneous and much more powerful (not words, but gestures) that meant so much more to me. As they say, Aspergers is really different for each individual, so it’s very difficult to glean what relates to your partner from all the information there is out there, especially if he finds it difficult to express what he’s thinking, or rather how he’s thinking about it.

I made a kind of list of things or behaviours I found upsetting or bewildering, and much to my surprise I found discussions about every one of those behaviours online in forums like this. The experiences of this wonderful bunch here for example! What I found most astonishing of all from all that anecdotal evidence was that the intention of those behaviours was NEVER meant to be hurtful. And whenever I pointed out “hey that’s awful” or “you really don’t give a damn” - he found it impossible to say anything in response, because it was all too much, too emotionally charged.

Perhaps that’s your experience too? I had to be so defiant and trust my instincts that this was a very pure and sweet man I was with- despite much of what was on show. My short term advice would be to start slowly reading (without getting overwhelmed), but also take a step back. Explaining/ forcing him to understand your struggles right now will not be possible, instead rest, sleep more, get your energy back. And when you’re back to life- you’ll see these discussions will take place- and you will find a solution.

 

[Artemis]

And when ever I pointed out “hey that’s awful” or “you really don’t give a damn” - he found it impossible to say anything in response, because it was all too much, too emotionally charged.

Brit, wow... you totally get me. Everything you write sounds exactly the way I think about things, except I'm still coming to terms with all of this, I still don't understand the limitations, I still have moments where I just want to talk about emotions. And last night was one of those nights... I was hurt he forgot our anniversary, (even though he was being very sweet and I don't know why I had to push things?) and I told him I felt like I was the only one that cared and it started World War 3, I won't get into how it just spiraled out of control, but basically now he says he's not going with my son and I on a trip we've had planned and will be taking some time on his own to figure things out. This morning I apologized, ESPECIALLY after seeing your reply last night I thought... what have I done. It's the things that are normal fights in normal NT relationships that become crazy in an ASD/NT relationship. He did not accept my apology, says I;m abusive and difficult for being upset last night. I'm certainly oversimplifying, because I did act emotionally last night, but I guess it feels like I'm never allowed to mess up without it being the end of our relationship. I'm so very sad and feel so misunderstood.

I have to ask Brit, do you also have problems with taking too much of the responsibility / mental load on in the relationship? While my partner is sweet and a good person deep down, and I do know this, he also isn't motivated to find work and financially we need the money, and he should contribute anyway, right? I think that is the one area where I get lost... I know he's a great person, a great father, but he doesn't seem to care about providing for us. Not that I expect men to do the providing, but I do expect balance and I've been supporting us for too long now. He can be very selfish and immature about day-to-day responsibilities and it leaves it all on me.

 

[Brit]

I guess so yes, but indirectly it made me much stronger. Whilst I feel like embraces or nice words can be so nice, that's all they are - comforting words. It would feel infinitely more comforting to me to know that 8 years on he was still there for me. Being a good father, a kind and loving man do not come as standard, I know from experience sadly. I get the impression that a lot of Aspies really believe that you alone are responsible for your health and happiness - and that no one owes it to you... it may sound sad in ways, but ultimately its actually a very liberating and positive realisation, for me anyway, though it took time.

I also suspect that moving house and having a baby are far more significant transitions for him than you may realise. It really seems like these are often major issues for Aspies, which cause changes in behaviour such as being cold or retreating. Having a baby as an autistic parent is such a common and major challenge that there a whole books devoted to it. Perhaps he can't explain to you how difficult it has been for him, so going to museums and spending time on his art is the only way he can create routine and calm (just a guess), something that seems to be so integral to the wellbeing of Aspies.

Also, his stinging words.. about you being abusive - ignore those. In my experience, in moments of conflict a whole load of things are said which mean nothing (same as for NTs actually - but the conflict resolution part i.e. talking it out is absent, which makes it so much more challenging) It would be completely different if during a period of total peace he said those things - then I would take them seriously.

I imagine one of the reasons he's being so defensive is precisely because he knows he needs to change how he's doing things - but he doesn't know how. "Find a job" may seem so simple - but perhaps its much more of challenge for him that he lets on. My advice, again - for the short-term is to care for him as you do your young child. So much love - and forgiveness. He's obviously capable of finding good work, he just needs the right motivation to do it. ie. love and understanding as opposed to pressure and feeling of inadequacy. Those will just make him retreat.

Hope I'm not overstepping it, wishing you all the best.

 

[Artemis]

He's obviously capable of finding good work, he just needs the right motivation to do it. ie. love and understanding as opposed to pressure and feeling of inadequacy. Those will just make him retreat.

Hi again Brit, maybe should take this offline, or just see if I can hire you as my therapist because your advice and perspective is some that I feel like I haven't been able to get at all from therapists, friends, family, etc.

Your comment quoted above is difficult, because yes, I feel like I do that for the most part, but we all have our thresholds and when I'm providing for all of us and we are going into debt each month the pressure and stress is really tough on me too. Plus, when there is no pressure to change at all it seems like he's happier to not have to deal with it. And that's when I get really stressed.

Reading your note makes me so sad as it almost feels too late. He has completely retreated. Told me that now I am the "enemy" and that he can't be around me to get better. He is not going with my son and I on a trip we were all supposed to take starting tomorrow, which is fine, maybe the time apart is good. I just hate leaving on these terms and I don't know how to get through to him or if I even can. He seems dead set on us not being together. I have a feeling if I leave as things stand he won't be here when I get back. This is definitely the worst it's ever been.

So desperately wish I would have come across you a while ago. It's only been 2 years since I've really started to accept that he has ASD and in that time we had a baby and I've been working full time to support us and keep us going. I love him and truly hate to lose him. Is there hope that we could come back stronger?

Would also love to know more about your story, how long have you been with your partner and when (and how) did you learn all of this??

 

[Artemis]

It would feel infinitely more comforting to me to know that 8 years on he was still there for me. Being a good father, a kind and loving man do not come as standard,

And also, yes... for all the people that tell me to leave him... there is what you said above...plus, he's an excellent father.
I fell in love with him so hard 8 years ago and when things are good, I feel so fortunate, I truly love him, and I've been in relationships not worth fighting for.