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I found this interesting

Alaric593

Well-Known Member
Research shows that those with ASD treat good, bad and neutral people the same. Neurotypicals invest in people who behave kindly, punish people who behave badly and behave neutrally to people who are neutral to them.

main-qimg-481878bb8faffba8f081379e2b994476-pjlq


Those with ASD give roughly the same amount of resources to all in a particular interaction. This is different than psychopaths and narcissists who look for people that they can take advantage of and because those with ASD give the same, they can easily be taken advantage of by these personalities.

Those with ASD generally respond to the person the way that they are being in the current moment—they describe not being able to respond in practical way to the past behaviour of people.

This leaves the most practical solution for most with ASD as to keep their distance from people to avoid this dynamic.
 

Aspychata

Serenity waves, beachy vibes
V.I.P Member
To me this shows that human interaction has no pay off value to me as a ND person. I can treat any social interaction as the same. And then l say, so? Your point is? Because l am ND.

And this is nothing offensive towards you. This is how l respond to social interaction. It's a chore, it's masking, l receive no gratification from it. This is the most difficult thing for NT to accept or understand about ND peeps.

And this made me crawl out of my turtle shell to set the world straight. Lol
 
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Gerald Wilgus

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
To me this shows that human interaction has no pay off value to me as a ND person. I can treat any social interaction as the same. And then l say, so? Your point is? Because l am ND.

And this is nothing offensive towards you. This is how l respond to social interaction. It's a chore, it's masking, l receive no gratification from it. This is the most difficult for NT to accept or understand about ND peeps.

And this made me crawl out of my turtle shell to set the world straight. Lol
And, I eventually recognized the characteristics of accepting people. With them, I could relax and be myself. They all have seen my rare meltdowns and are still good friends.
 

tree

Blue/Green
Staff member
V.I.P Member
Research shows that those with ASD treat good, bad and neutral people the same. Neurotypicals invest in people who behave kindly, punish people who behave badly and behave neutrally to people who are neutral to them.

main-qimg-481878bb8faffba8f081379e2b994476-pjlq


Those with ASD give roughly the same amount of resources to all in a particular interaction. This is different than psychopaths and narcissists who look for people that they can take advantage of and because those with ASD give the same, they can easily be taken advantage of by these personalities.

Those with ASD generally respond to the person the way that they are being in the current moment—they describe not being able to respond in practical way to the past behaviour of people.

This leaves the most practical solution for most with ASD as to keep their distance from people to avoid this dynamic.

Where's this from?
What's the source?
 

Aspychata

Serenity waves, beachy vibes
V.I.P Member
And, I eventually recognized the characteristics of accepting people. With them, I could relax and be myself. They all have seen my rare meltdowns and are still good friends.

To me it means it's a compliment. If l enjoy hanging out with someone, that's the biggest compliment l can pay you. Because l prefer entertaining myself. I am not programmed to hang with other people. I don't need to find validation from others, l don't care if they accept meltdowns. That's not my issue or my goal to find others to make me feel comfortable in my skin. Maybe l am truly autistic. I am not a sociopath, l care about people just as much as the next person. BUT l don't base my value on the number of friends l have. Maybe that's why l have life long relationships. People accept me at face value. They like my honesty. They know l support them, especially when they feel weak. I can say- l am a true friend in the world of fake social media.

I flipped your storyline. I see that you feel safe with those that accept you. I have no need to feel safe. Lord knows l have stepped outside of my comfort zone many times. I don't look for safety. I look for individuals that have always stepped out of their comfort zone their entire life. I am most comfortable with those people. I thank you so much for helping me understand myself. Lol
 
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Alaric593

Well-Known Member
Where's this from?
What's the source?

Dr. Natalie Engelbrecht a psychotherapist and certified autism clinical specialist posted it on quora. She didn't post the source information unfortunately.

 

VictorR

Random Member
V.I.P Member
Original source paper was Andari E, Duhamel JR, Zalla T, Herbrecht E, Leboyer M, Sirigu A. Promoting social behavior with oxytocin in high-functioning autism spectrum disorders. Proc Natl Acad Sci U S A. 2010 Mar 2;107(9):4389-94. doi: 10.1073/pnas.0910249107.

Abstract
Social adaptation requires specific cognitive and emotional competences. Individuals with high-functioning autism or with Asperger syndrome cannot understand or engage in social situations despite preserved intellectual abilities. Recently, it has been suggested that oxytocin, a hormone known to promote mother-infant bonds, may be implicated in the social deficit of autism. We investigated the behavioral effects of oxytocin in 13 subjects with autism. In a simulated ball game where participants interacted with fictitious partners, we found that after oxytocin inhalation, patients exhibited stronger interactions with the most socially cooperative partner and reported enhanced feelings of trust and preference. Also, during free viewing of pictures of faces, oxytocin selectively increased patients’ gazing time on the socially informative region of the face, namely the eyes. Thus, under oxytocin, patients respond more strongly to others and exhibit more appropriate social behavior and affect, suggesting a therapeutic potential of oxytocin through its action on a core dimension of autism.
 

Aspychata

Serenity waves, beachy vibes
V.I.P Member

I take offense with this study. Who determines what is socially acceptable behavior? I have friends. I don't need to look at their faces or eyes. Big deal. I have friends that don't depend on eye or physical contact. My socially acceptable behavior suits me fine. But then l am not NT. I don't need to look at your eyes or your face to be your friend. Again, it's NT's rules determing the parameters.

We need to quit relying on NT to determine how we as unique valuable people live our life. Kick the NT's definition of social acceptance to the curb.
 
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Luca

charm & chaos
V.I.P Member
Not true for me at all. I’m neutral/indifferent to most strangers, very friendly with kind and good people, and I can quickly become not very patient, polite, or tolerant with bad people, bullies, and narcissists, and will remove them from my social circles.
What you put out there is what you get back, for the most part.
 

Aspychata

Serenity waves, beachy vibes
V.I.P Member
More importantly, l don't feel the need to be socially acceptable. That's a NT thing. I do follow rules of society. I am polite when l go out. So l follow enough social norms to exist in society. Being civil isn't difficult. But society as a whole no longer seems to practice civility. So all l can do is show by example.
 
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Luca

charm & chaos
V.I.P Member
I take offense to that study too, it’s BS in my opinion, although I’ll point out and clarify that it’s not Victor’s fault for quoting it and he seemed to agree with @Aspychata ’s post since he gave it a winner rating.

Was the person who did this study an ABA therapist? It sounds like the kinds of things that ABA therapists said to me.
 

Judge

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
Not true for me at all. I’m neutral/indifferent to most strangers, very friendly with kind and good people, and I can quickly become not very patient, polite, or tolerant with bad people, bullies, and narcissists, and will remove them from my social circles.
What you put out there is what you get back, for the most part.
This is much closer to my social reality as well. But then clearly I wasn't one of Dr. Natalie Engelbrecht's test subjects either. My bad...
 

VictorR

Random Member
V.I.P Member
Well, this escalated quickly LOL.

To clarify, yes, I provided the citation for informational purposes only (and not as an endorsement) since as @tree noted, it wasn't present in the article being cited.

Two things I'd like to address:

1) In regards to the writer of the Quora piece.

It's regrettable that they didn't actually include the source, and in my opinion, with all due respect to them as someone who holds a graduate degree (the MSc Psychology, and not the ND, which is a designation for natropaths similar to what CPA is for accountants, and is not an actual degree, unlike a MD, DMD, or DVM), they should also be doing better than to quote a study out of context and without providing any citation, even if (but perhaps especially so) it's for what is supposed to be an commentary piece where they are representing themselves in a professional capacity.

2) In regards to the original article

The sample size (13 autistic individuals, 7 additional autistic individuals, control of 13 presumably allistic individuals) is far too small to draw any statistically sound conclusions from, regardless of what they were trying to prove or disprove.
 

Aspychata

Serenity waves, beachy vibes
V.I.P Member
Well, this escalated quickly LOL.

To clarify, yes, I provided the citation for informational purposes only (and not as an endorsement) since as @tree noted, it wasn't present in the article being cited.

Two things I'd like to address:

1) In regards to the writer of the Quora piece.

It's regrettable that they didn't actually include the source, and in my opinion, with all due respect to them as someone who holds a graduate degree (the MSc Psychology, and not the ND, which is a designation for natropaths similar to what CPA is for accountants, and is not an actual degree, unlike a MD, DMD, or DVM), they should also be doing better than to quote a study out of context and without providing any citation, even if (but perhaps especially so) it's for what is supposed to be an commentary piece where they are representing themselves in a professional capacity.

2) In regards to the original article

The sample size (13 autistic individuals, 7 additional autistic individuals, control of 13 presumably allistic individuals) is far too small to draw any statistically sound conclusions from, regardless of what they were trying to prove or disprove.

But this was an excellent resource to list, because it points out how we can't be held to NT standards. We aren't better or worse then NT, it's like comparing apples to computers. And again l always appreciate you as a forum member @VictorR . I think you would be a great person to meet. Thank you for your contributions. And l just wish for our tribe to find acceptance with who they are, and not hold themselves to standards that don't accommodate their uniqueness. Then l feel l found my holy grail. I just try to refine my comedic ability along the way.

I may be more computer logic board but it doesn't mean that l don't have feelings. I am just more logic based then NT. How l determine my choices in life isn't up for debate much to the dismay of NT who use guilt trips to guilt us. That isn't a double negative. Lol. :)
 
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Au Naturel

Au Naturel
Research shows that those with ASD treat good, bad and neutral people the same. Neurotypicals invest in people who behave kindly, punish people who behave badly and behave neutrally to people who are neutral to them.

main-qimg-481878bb8faffba8f081379e2b994476-pjlq


Those with ASD give roughly the same amount of resources to all in a particular interaction. This is different than psychopaths and narcissists who look for people that they can take advantage of and because those with ASD give the same, they can easily be taken advantage of by these personalities.

Those with ASD generally respond to the person the way that they are being in the current moment—they describe not being able to respond in practical way to the past behaviour of people.

This leaves the most practical solution for most with ASD as to keep their distance from people to avoid this dynamic.
LOL! Or to start taking oxytocin. Might need to up the dosage a bit from that experiment.
 

Knower of nothing

Well-Known Member
The idea of legit categories labelled "good people" and "bad people" on a graph is making me crack up. There's a limit to how far you can reduce ideas for the sake of simplicity. Reminds me of this graph I love that has an axis called "standards in art". At least I'm confident it's clickbait article writers creating these and not real professionals.
 

Au Naturel

Au Naturel
Dr. Natalie Engelbrecht a psychotherapist and certified autism clinical specialist posted it on quora. She didn't post the source information unfortunately.

It creates more questions than answers.

The problematic aspects of this are that we don't have a clue who was included and how they were selected, how the experiment was designed, or how the outcome was measured. The sample size is very small, small enough that a couple of anomalous could have thrown the results. Was it randomized? Was it double-blind? Where's the non-placebo group, the guys who got nothing in order to create a baseline? (Placebo effect matters.)

The real question here is: Why was there a group taking oxytocin? If the objective was to test the effects of oxytocin on autistic behavior, then they had to select only autistic people who don't make distinctions between good and bad people. I'm sure there are plenty of autistic people who make that differentiation.

And the lack of any sources to look up means you can't get at the original data or investigate the study design. Without that information, the study tells us nothing useful.
 

Tom

Well-Known Member
V.I.P Member
I was ready to sign up for testing, but in the doped up 'unhealthy' group only. But then I realized it was oxytocin not oxycotin.

Not being serious. I used Oxy when I had A.L.L. (Leukemia) and was very thankful for the pain relief. But it was scary addictive and went off it as soon as I could.

This is an older study actually. From 2010 and still had Aspergers as a diagnosis. I wonder if there have been any followup studies. The lack of those always makes me wonder about the significance of the original. It's interesting. It reminds me a little of how some have reported drinking does something similar for them (more social). Kind of gives a new meaning to 'social drinking'. But that too has the big addiction drawback. Addictions are bad news. I have managed to avoid some but am still hooked on nicotine (vape) and caffine I guess. Addicted is not even a strong enough word. 'Enslaved' to it is more accurate. I used to joke in the military about being no hero and wanting to hide in the bunker... unless I was out of smokes. Then, literally, I would crawl into enemy lines at night trying to steal cigerettes. Oh and maybe the secret plans too if I happened to stumble accross them.

;)
 

Darkkin

Lioness of Spoons
V.I.P Member
I hate the way certain medications can make my brain feel, as if there is a barrier between my consciousness and my body.

(I'd rather deal with pain than be out of absolute control of my senses. I've experienced both bone and cardiac infarction pain, so my tolerance levels, aided and abated by limited interoception, are atypically high. I get crabby, but I'm not weirding out about a buffer sensation.)

And it isn't hard to be reasonable to people who reasonable themselves.
 
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