Do You Feel Invisible?

[Cerulean]

Slipping out of such gatherings is also easier since nobody there is interested in seeing me & my absence won't be noticed.

I remember in high school when I first noticed that no one would notice or care if I left, and it made me sad because I really wanted some friends. Now I look forward to those situations because I know if it gets too much it won't be a big deal for me to duck out. How things change, eh?

 

[Christian T]

I remember in high school when I first noticed that no one would notice or care if I left, and it made me sad because I really wanted some friends. Now I look forward to those situations because I know if it gets too much it won't be a big deal for me to duck out. How things change, eh?

Yes, that is rather ironic. Funny story: one time when I'd lost my voice and still went to school, I was expecting my classmates milling about at the start of the day to notice how silent I was, but they weren't at all. Than I realised that I was always this silent. Hah!

 

[Dara]

Being misheard or ignored is my worst nightmare, it makes me incredibly angry, and they know it. A lot of us on the Autism spectrum hate to be ignored and not acknowledged I'm sure.

So, back to the question up top, do you ever feel like no one can hear you? Do you get frustrated when they don't acknowledge that you said something or asked a question? Do you feel like it is pointless to speak sometimes? I know I do.

I feel like this all the time at home.
My parents act as if they didn't hear me or get distracted all the time while I talk to them. I drives me crazy.
I don't even think they do it on purpose, it's just the way they are. So frustrating!

 

[Christian T]

I feel like this all the time at home.
My parents act as if they didn't hear me or get distracted all the time while I talk to them. I drives me crazy.
I don't even think they do it on purpose, it's just the way they are. So frustrating!

My parents do the same, but not just to me, to my younger brother and sister to. That might just be a parents thing of being too preoccupied to pay attention, and still tuning out of their children's words like their cries from when they were a baby. Still, it is very frustrating.

 

[Scaramouche]

I feel invisible often. My parents often seems not listening to me and distracted. They even can talk with each other while I tries to say something like I just not present in the room! The same situation with my colleagues: I often don't give a answers on my questions and my last sentence often remains unanswered or the conversation interrupts on my last sentence. Same things happens in public places - for example in malls and shops when sellers simply don't put their attention even when I answer something or stay close to them.

 

[Soup]

Hi Scaramouche! Hope all is well for you in Novosibirsk.

That is something I've seen happen to Aspies (or more accurately people I've suspected of being Aspies) in the NT culture. People will talk over them, ignore what they've said & cut them off mid-sentence. There's a popular tv show in the west called Criminal Minds featuring an Aspie type character. Whenever he begins explaining something in detail, the others condescendingly cut him off. This happens all the time. The occasions when I've watched the show, the only times I become truly engaged is when this character begins explaining something he knows a lot about. When he's cut off, I want to scream at the others to shut up & let him finish!

Strange, though how NT culture views these very behaviours as rude & disrespectful BUT only if someone does it to them. If they do it to any NDs, it's acceptable- even funny! Since double standards make me sick, I don't do well with such people.

 

[Scaramouche]

Hi Scaramouche! Hope all is well for you in Novosibirsk.

Hi, Soup! It's all right, I had a wonderful week

Whenever he begins explaining something in detail, the others condescendingly cut him off. This happens all the time.

I think this happens because neurotypicals doesn't like attention to details and such format of the conversation considered boring and abstruse by them. I often see this when I try to explain something more accurately.

Strange, though how Neurotypical culture views these very behaviours as rude & disrespectful BUT only if someone does it to them. If they do it to any NDs, it's acceptable- even funny!

This is not strange for me as I know that neurotypicals mostly conformal and doesn't likes "special" people. And I think that any neurodiversity have several subtle features which are easy recognizable by neurotypicals. These features could be recognized as unhealthy and unviable and this may be main reason for such behavior against ND.

But I always wondered why people may be tolerant to physical disabilities but completely intolerant to mental disabilities? When they see somebody with amputated limb they could say: "Yes... This may be so difficult to live with such hard disability". But if they see somebody with strange behaviour they could say: "Huh, another ridiculous freak!" I think this is pretty unfairly.

 

[Soup]

I'm glad your week was wonderful. Did it include a lot of library time?

True that the NT world in general is very conformist. In monolithic & homogeneous cultures, this is even more apparent. There's great pressure on people to just be like everyone else. As with NTs, some types of NDs can seem scary (such as Bi-Polar people whose moods change rapidly for no apparent reason). In the case of Aspies, we can be 'special' in a way that makes NTs feel intimidated. Some of us have accumulated vast & detailed knowledge about certain things & when we appear to know more than they do, they become resentful. In other words, their insecurity & comparative ignorance becomes our problem. We may appear arrogant & like we think we're smarter than they are. Even if you ARE smarter, you are not allowed to have it show.

As for physical disabilities, they are more acceptable because they're visible & they don't usually affect personality or behaviour much. A guy who loses a leg to an accident remains much the same person (once he has healed & adapted). I find that NTs often see these people with some empathy as you said BUT also there's an element of derisive pity. This is more true when the person's physical disability affects their appearance too much & the NT sees them as ugly or disfigured.

Strange behaviour, like when a schizophrenic suffers a psychotic episode, can be terrifying because the person is seeing & hearing things nobody else does. He can become paranoid & aggressive so people are afraid. Last year in Montreal, a schizophrenic man with no history of violence suddenly leaped out & stabbed a strange guy on a bicycle to death. He didn't know the man & the guy hadn't bothered him. THe schizophrenic had been feeling well so he'd decreased his medication on his own & he had a paranoid delusional episode as a result.

These cases are rare, but sensational when they do happen. More often, a schizophrenic is harmed by a NT. We Aspies can look & behave oddly so many NTs don't know the difference between us & other ND types. They may thing we'll go nuts & harm them or become otherwise a behaviour problem.

 

[Christian T]

I think this happens because neurotypicals doesn't like attention to details and such format of the conversation considered boring and abstruse by them. I often see this when I try to explain something more accurately.

I actually think NTs love details, but only ones about them and their own lives or those of celebrities. They're extremely happy to rattle off trivial facts about themselves, and can listen to it from a fellow NT, but only an NT. Many NTs only know how to interact with other NTs, so they cocoon themselves.

Again, this is double standards. I often feel as if no one is willing to learn anything from me, but will happily lecture me on what they know. A few months ago at school I was telling my classmates about Judy Garland, pitching her as a potential subject for our drama performance. They had no idea who she was, so I led them into the topic by telling them she played Dorothy in the Wizard of Oz. Then, as I started telling them about her life, one boy said "Oh, well, I'm just gonna think of her as Dorothy because that's all I know." mmm... or you could learn something from me and expand on what you already know. I was telling them about how she was exploited by her monster stage mum and the money-grubbing Louis B Mayer, head of MGM, and of how she eventually was killed by the deadly drug cycle she'd been put under, and got little response.

The day after they said they'd looked her up on Wikipedia and found out all of this incredible information, and all of it was what I had told them yesterday, but they were presenting to me as new. Huh, I guess they're just too proud to be educated by an aspie freak, but are happy to lecture the clueless weirdo on topics that they are familiar with.

Still, they did accept my idea to use her as the subject of the performance, so I wasn't entirely invisible to them, but still...

Oh, and one last thing. Does anyone else find that whenever they're in the middle of an in-depth explanation that requires more concentration than with listening to lunch choices, something always happens to distract the person, and leaves you there feeling stupid and negligible. At school, someone will always be tackled, see someone else being tackled, suddenly be shown a funny photo, or receive some other stimulus that takes them ages to get over. I can never get the attention of anyone under 30 more than ten seconds before something like this happens, and I'm pushed aside.

 

[Scaramouche]

I'm glad your week was wonderful. Did it include a lot of library time?

Yes - a lot of time in a quiet environment, one-by-one with my music

As for physical disabilities, they are more acceptable because they're visible & they don't usually affect personality or behaviour much. A guy who loses a leg to an accident remains much the same person (once he has healed & adapted). I find that NTs often see these people with some empathy as you said BUT also there's an element of derisive pity. This is more true when the person's physical disability affects their appearance too much & the Neurotypical sees them as ugly or disfigured.

I agree. Although I can't easily recognise the derisive pity. But I noticed that some physically disabled people takes not very good mention among many people (especially disabled women).

We Aspies can look & behave oddly so many NTs don't know the difference between us & other ND types. They may thing we'll go nuts & harm them or become otherwise a behaviour problem.

Many people even don't make difference between psychotic and autistic states and calls both schizophrenic and autistic people just "crazies".

I actually think NTs love details, but only ones about them and their own lives or those of celebrities.

Yes, I noticed that too. Neurotypicals can communicate "just for communication" - not for informational exchange. I still can't understand why so interesting to to know who was born or married in some celebrity's family - for me this information seems useless. And yes, neurotypicals likes talking a lot about themselves. I red Dale Carnegie's books and knew that better way to being liked by somebody - talking a lot about them. This is strange, but when I tried to do this several times, people turned off the conversation quickly - maybe because I made some communication mistakes as usual (but neurotypicals never say you what mistakes you made - that's pity).

Oh, and one last thing. Does anyone else find that whenever they're in the middle of an in-depth explanation that requires more concentration than with listening to lunch choices, something always happens to distract the person, and leaves you there feeling stupid and negligible. At school, someone will always be tackled, see someone else being tackled, suddenly be shown a funny photo, or receive some other stimulus that takes them ages to get over. I can never get the attention of anyone under 30 more than ten seconds before something like this happens, and I'm pushed aside.

This happens for me - although today not so often (just because I prefer to stay silent when being in a company now). Sometimes I feel myself annnoyed due to many distractions around and people focusing on them but not on the subject of my explanation.

 

[Margaretha]

People ignore me all the time. Even if I'm talking one on one with someone, they often reply as if they as if they hadn't heard a word I said. This has always baffled me, but I was beginning to wonder if it has something to do with improper social approach, such as not making proper eye contact to get someone's attention while speaking.

 

[Deno]

People ignore me all the time. Even if I'm talking one on one with someone, they often reply as if they as if they hadn't heard a word I said. This has always baffled me, but I was beginning to wonder if it has something to do with improper social approach, such as not making proper eye contact to get someone's attention while speaking.

I may be wrong of course, But I think it's just because people need to start paying more attention.. I don't mean to insult, but most NT I talk to pretty much remind me of this..

Like seriously, they HAVE TO bring something up that is COMPLETELY irrelevant and in my opinion boring as ****, right in mid sentence as I try to explain or say something. It's so irritating...

 

[Soup]

You're an interesting person, Scaramouche. I hope you choose to post more often!

The derisive pity comes in when NTs encounter someone with a physical disability (sitting in a wheelchair for ex.) & speak to them very slowly using simple language as though they're not too bright. Sometimes, they'll speak too loudly as though the person is deaf when they're simply missing an arm or paraplegic. They also assume a physically disabled person is a lot more disabled than they truly are & want to do everything for them when the person is capable of doing many of those things for himself.

I also read Dale Carnegie's How to Win Friends & Influence People. It is similar to Machiavelli's "The Prince" in its shameless insincere manipulative strategies. It is certainly a manual about how to be a brown noser. Useful in some contexts but I'd make myself sick using these strategies!

@ ChristianT: It must've been very frustrating dealing with your classmates' condescension. I remember you discussing condescending people months back in another post! There's a kind of resentment that they feel when one of us so-called 'retards' turns out to be much smarter than they are. The kid back in my driving class I write about was a really odd looking diagnosed Aspie. He was on scholarship in an exclusive private college getting unheard of grades. In class, he knew all the answers immediately. Since we were both odd-balls, we sat sort of together. I, however looked normal (good NT drag!) so people would ask me what the hell I was doing sitting with 'that weirdo'. They'd laugh when he spoke (thick Chinese accent, funny voice) BUT then raise their hand & make the same point HE had & think they sounded clever. At least the teacher NEVER treated this guy like a freak & would say, "That's exactly what ______ just said, too bad you were too busy laughing to listen" He didn't let them get away with it. This guy also had Narcolepsy & would abruptly fall asleep for brief spurts. this embarrassed him & he said as much but there was nothing he could do to prevent it.

When we had to go to the DMV to take the big written test, he beat me by 1 point by getting a perfect score. The thing is that HE was in the middle of his health sciences mid terms (100% pure hell) on top of everything else! they used to whisper about him being an idiot savant. I agreed with the savant part (photographic memory + understanding with it!) BUT I never saw anything resembling idiocy at all. He was awkward BUT more far more sociable than I was. People would just assume shyness with me since I'm a pipsqueak & a woman. He just had one of those crooked looking Aspie guy nerd hair cuts & he dressed funny. He's now at Uni doing a double major in medicine & engineering. I bet that the real idiots (without the savant part!) who laughed at him are all flunking out of bubble blowing 101.

 

[umbrellabeach]

I struggle to be heard, but I think it's mostly because I have an extremely soft voice. It sounds normal volume to me but I guess it's a lot quieter to other people. I said this in another thread but sometimes even if I yell, people either don't hear me or they just ignore me.
Maybe I should write what I have to say on a piece of paper and pass it around the group... :rolleyes2:

 

[Christian T]

Same here, umbrellabeach. Whenever I try to ask a group a question, they usually turn away from me and take me as seriously as they would a child, but they're always incredibly curious to hear what they're fellow NTs are saying. So, usually when I speak to them, I have no idea if they:

a) didn't hear me
b) misunderstood me and didn't care
c) found me boring or
d) found what I said offensive and tried to ignore it

their reaction is always the same! And they talk about aspies being expressionless, unresponsive, hard to read and hard to get through to. Well! It works both ways!:banghead:

Just needed to get that out of my system!

 

[Kelly]

Umbrella & Christian I'm exactly the same (particularly the volume of my voice), the thing that really upsets me is when I say something nobody reacts or responds and a few minutes later someone else(usually someone more popular/mouthy/whatever) will say the exact same thing (but worded differently) and all of a sudden it's a great idea/comment/whatever, I've even had it happen on internet forums, it's baffling!

 

[Christian T]

I've even had it happen on internet forums, it's baffling!

It is! What on earth is up with that. Does your aspieness leak through your syntax and vocabulary choices to subconsciously tell the neurotypicals that you're not worth listening to, or something like that?:S

 

[Kelly]

It is! What on earth is up with that. Does your aspieness leak through your syntax and vocabulary choices to subconsciously tell the neurotypicals that you're not worth listening to, or something like that?:S

Nah, I think I'm just so bloody boring and waffle on and on that most people tune out eventually and think it best to ignore me / my posts :bounce:

 

[Laura]

I definitely understand how people feel about feeling invisible. I get it all the time, when I go out with friends, I'll pipe up with something really relevant to the conversation, and it'll just go ignored, SO annoying! Most of the time I try to deal with it, but sometimes it just gets so upsetting when people act like you're no more of a person than the average sofa that I have to walk out of the conversation and sit somewhere quiet. I get told to speak up more, and I do and still get ignored, so I end up shouting, which never helps lol! People tell me I have a wicked sense of humour, but it makes you think "if you think that, then why not give me the chance to use it?"

 

[imagesbyholly]

You know, my husband used to do this with me. It was a bad habit he picked up from having some psycho family members and acting like they didn't exist when they were raving, because ignoring them was the most efficient soloution. But it carried over into whenever he was feeling selfish or annoyd with a comment or question, and I was easy to do this to. Now, he has grown up big time and we have a very good relationship. He doesn't do this to me any more. Unfortunately, I've been selfish lately and have done it to him a few times for the first time in my life- I never had the audacity to do something like that before. I always felt ignoring someone was so rude I couldn't do it. I felt like a rude, silly fool afterward and intend not to do it again, but part of me is like yeah, now he knows how it feels and he cares because he's not a jerk anymore. I'm assuming that's why people do that- just ignore and maybe the nuissance will shut her mouth. But it's their problem, not yours. People should be kind, respectful, and patient when another is speaking, even if they are annoying. If people won't give you this courtesy, at least you can give it to others, and try to choose to spend time with kinder people.