Do I have to fake I like humans in order to cooperate with them?

[Magna]

I think I understand what you're asking in your original post @StrayCat

I'm not a "people person" at all. People in general. I most certainly can and do have meaningful relationships with some (very few, which is my desire) people as individuals, but "people" in general frankly I don't have a very high opinion of. Of course there are good, great, kind, etc people in the world. However, in many ways "people", humans as a species, are too often disappointing, misdirected, shameful, shallow, disrespectful, selfish, self-centered, irresponsible, embarrassing and dangerous not only to others, but to the natural world as well. There are good reasons why the animal world fears us.

I can and do like/love individuals for who they are specifically, but I don't have qualms about saying that in general and for the reasons above I don't "like" people (in a general sense).

 

[Tom]

Unless you know something we don't, humans are all we have to work with.

 

[Kalinychta]

Just curious, how much do I have to fake it in your opinion? I despise lying, so would rather avoid it altogether, but from my experience, not lying often makes humans hostile, so I'm often forced to do it...

I don't want to duplicate similar thread that is already here, so I should add that I'm fine with basic politeness when I'm forced to use dreaded "human interface" in order to access some kind of essential services, since luckily this is straightforward enough. But how about things beyond that?

Take this forum as an example, how much do I have to lie here in order to be able to keep using it as a source of inspiration and intellectual stimulation?

I’m rather confused by your post. If you don’t like humans and are worried that you will have to lie to us all here in order to make us think you like us (when you really don’t?), how do you find inspiration and intellectual stimulation from the forum? That strikes me as contradictory.

 

[StrayCat]

If everyone approached every situation with genuine niceness then there would not be a word for politeness, it would just be called being honest.

As a kid, I thought honesty is desirable. Then I've learned that it's not. In fact, "need for honesty" is basically a disability.

I don't like when people are fake nice and i stand by that, if you are not genuine i don't want any of it.

I've noticed another thing, there are some people who try to be genuinely nice, but they are being nice not to real me, just to their assumptions of me. This happens every time people give me compliments for example, these don't give me any joy at all. I find insults more useful actually, since these at least give me interesting feedback.

miss out on opportunities to have positive experiences

What kind of positive experiences are possible though? Anything worth the negative ones?

From my experience so far, positive ones are so rare and required so much masking and hypervigilance that I have hard time seeing much worth there. But always open to learning more.

 

[Atrapa Almas]

I may need more popcorns

 

[StrayCat]

I can and do like/love individuals for who they are specifically

How do you manage to find them? I mean, some humans can be nicer than others obviously, but I still have to keep my distance to not go crazy...

I’m rather confused by your post. If you don’t like humans and are worried that you will have to lie to us all here in order to make us think you like us (when you really don’t?), how do you find inspiration and intellectual stimulation from the forum? That strikes me as contradictory.

Because I have no other choice? Where else do I go for that? Post right before yours answered it nicely

 

[PinkPhilodendron]

Well, you live in a world full of humans. You have a dependancy to a certain degree of humans. If you think you don't like them then you should 1. reduce the encounters as much as you can (though I am pretty sure you are already trying that) but with the rest (the ones you need to encounter and communicate with) I recommend 2. treating them like beings that need to be treated kindly. Don't be rude (by telling them you don't like them). They are vulnerable like you are. They just fear different things.
And it's actually not fair to generalize that all humans are some kind of evil, only because you are scared of them. Sometimes humans are like wild animals, they can be scary if they are scared.

 

[Magna]

How do you manage to find them? I mean, some humans can be nicer than others obviously, but I still have to keep my distance to not go crazy...

Life has its way of showing you many different kinds of people, good and bad. Align with the good ones and stay away from the bad ones.

 

[StrayCat]

They just fear different things.

That's actually interesting, the kind of things normal humans fear. What do they fear?

 

[Atrapa Almas]

That's actually interesting, the kind of things normal humans fear. What do they fear?

Many people do fear psychopaths.

 

[StrayCat]

Why should somebody make themselves vulnerable for you after you insult them as being "privileged Karen" or "well off white guy"?

Because I appreciate when someone does the same to me. I love honesty. And I've noticed that insults are one of the most honest things I can get out of humans.

And to be honest, being seen as one of those is good, because people will treat you well?

Would you prefer to be poor kid in 3rd word country who gets bombed for oil by those two former ones? I'm taking "rich white guy" over that any time, even happy to be "Karen", as long as I can get rid of "rich white husband" and live off nice fat inheritance...

Right now, I believe I'm effectively "pet autist" to country of "Karens" and "rich white guys"... It's quite safe life to be honest, so not complaining, I can even low key blend in, being white certainly helps...

Anyway, I can try to mask, but I suspect too late now... Although I'll try anyway:
"Calling all wonderful, kindest and the most angelic people here on this forum. What do you fear?"
Is it better? I know I can sometimes go a bit overboard with flattery, but that's because it's completely alien to me, I cannot relate to it at all, buttering me up works completely differently...

Many people do fear psychopaths.

I think sometimes I sort of pull that off online since in order to communicate with humans, I have to try minimize any kind of emotions and go with abstract thinking. Offline I think I'm much worse monster than psychopath, since I'm the one who prefers to go clean up dog poo than to socialize with humans... I suspect this is huuuge insult to human egos, so I try to mask it...

 

[Fino]

Have you faced a lot of social rejection in your life? It's understandable to feel rage toward people when it feels as if they all reject you, but these beliefs that we form like this are always based on a small number of people, in comparison to how many people are out there. Not everyone is like that.

 

[StrayCat]

Have you faced a lot of social rejection in your life?

As long as I mask, I'm fine, so guess not really? People usually make it quite clear what kind of lies I have to tell them in order to be accepted, so it's mostly my choice, how many lies I'm willing to endure in order to be tolerated. I just don't like lying/masking, so being forced to do that is obviously annoying.

Not everyone is like that.

As always, I'd be grateful for showing me just one person in meatspace who isn't like that in

 

[Atrapa Almas]

.
As always, I'd be grateful for showing me just one person in meatspace who isn't like that in

Antisocial people dont need to mask when they meet other Antisocial buddies, some of them openly admit they are antisocials. You can find some YouTube channels of antisocials talking about their things, some of them even have patreons, followers and earn money that way. There are also specific forums of antisocials (as spected they wont spend much of their resources helping each other for nothing).

There are also specific therapy to help them with their specific problems. There are tons of resources on the inthernet.

Autism masking info is not of much help to any antisocial person, since it comes from a diferent perspective.

• Autism mask because they dont understand social behavour.
• Antisocial mask to hide their inner nature to others.

 

[PinkPhilodendron]

Because I appreciate when someone does the same to me. I love honesty. And I've noticed that insults are one of the most honest things I can get out of humans.

And to be honest, being seen as one of those is good, because people will treat you well?

An insult is something different than honesty.
An insult hurts people, always. Honesty does so sometimes but not necessarily and is affected by wording.
Saying you like to be insulted is like saying you like to be kicked in the face. If you are masochistic that's of course possible.

 

[StrayCat]

Antisocial

I thought about it too, but apparently I don't fit that definition very well. Let me google some traits:

lie, break laws, act impulsively and lack regard for their own safety or the safety of others

Almost nothing fits, not only I hate lying (it's huge PITA), I'm also biggest coward ever, my safety is very important to me. For the same reason I don't break laws, it's dangerous, not to mention that I agree with many, so breaking them would make little sense. It's laws that keep me safe from humans in the first place, last thing I want is to lose that protection.

The one thing that aspd online spaces are good for is safety. Other places tend to be infested with narcs, autistic included. While grandiose narcs are relatively harmless, it's vulnerable kind that are the biggest pain. And since aspd peeps are great at making the place hostile for the latter, vulnerable narcs don't last there long. It's actually crazy, it feels safer to be "pet autist" in aspd space, than autist in autisitic space, since the latter will be overrun by "drama queening" narcs anyway...

An insult hurts people, always.

That's exactly why I stopped including myself in "people" set, since these don't hurt me. You could scare me with them in meatspace since I interpret them as a sign of hostility (if I even notice them that is). Online, the worst you can do with insults is to annoy me, since if I discover there is not much logic behind them, I will get annoyed that I wasted my time on someone who can't even think of something that makes sense...

 

[SRSAutistic]

Hi,

I feel that when I try to mask in social situations, it is very exhausting and tiring. How are some autistic people able to mask themselves to look more neurotypical/NT?

When I travel to India, I feel like everyone 'knows' that I am autistic from just talking to me. t takes me just 1 hour after reaching New Delhi and I fit in. It's as if I am a 'citizen' out there. In America, it takes me a lot of time to fit in. It’s as if I am a 'foreigner' in the US but a 'citizen' in India. In India and America, people can sometimes sense that I have autism. I do not have to fake myself in India, but I am forced to fake myself in America.

Regards,

SRSAutistic

 

[Au Naturel]

An insult is something different than honesty.
An insult hurts people, always. Honesty does so sometimes but not necessarily and is affected by wording.
Saying you like to be insulted is like saying you like to be kicked in the face. If you are masochistic that's of course possible.

Yeah. Almost by definition, an insult cannot be the truth. it's just name-calling and little children who have not been taught otherwise will often get up to it. Hurling insults only tells us the inferiority of the hurler.

 

[SRSAutistic]

Hi everyone,

I feel that when I try to pass as neurotypical/NT in social situations, it is very exhausting and tiring. How are some autistic people able to pass as NT in social situations?

Regards,

SRSAutistic