Are people on the spectrum capable of lying or manipulating?

[LearnedCoward]

Yes, of course we are capable of it.

Does it mean that's what's happening here? I can't say, and honestly it's too much for me to try and unpack, and it's not my place to do so, and even if it were my place I would quickly grow tired of sorting out every stranger's AS/NT relationship issues.

 

[AloneNotLonely]

Come on. You probably know by now how guys function. You mention another guy and he goes wild and says things that he doesn't really mean but actually does mean.

Now you are asking if he's applying some high level Machiavellian techniques? Nah. He has the hots for you and wants to do all kinds of things with you better left unmentioned and when you mention another guy his brain short-circuits and does whatever he can to keep you away from another guy. Just pure biology.

He doesn't care about the age difference. Right now. However, once you guys would be together... he would have all the time in the world to think about that age difference. Statistics say that it has a very bad chance of success, but nobody can guarantee anything.

Right now you seem like an amazing fun sexy woman. When you guys are in the same apartment together, will things remain the same? Will he still feel the same after being with you for 3 or 6 months and the primal excitement of the whole thing dies a bit? The other thing that adds to the complexity is that his autism does come into play when living together. Most autistics have a need for isolation and "alone time" and that is very hard to deal with. Living with someone can seem great, until it actually happens. When you are on a screen that he can turn off at any time it's very easy to be with you. Can he also turn you off when you are in the apartment with him?

He's a guy. You know what guys are like. We can't even trust ourselves when an attractive woman is involved. This guy is no different, but he has an extra level of complexity added. That is all. Low chance of success, fortune loves the brave, etc etc. It's a gamble, and a long shot at that.

 

[SimplyWandering]

I know I lie... mostly to fit in , but holding on to that secret/lie is much harder in the end then telling the truth. those of you who say that they would never lie or don't lie ; are lying to themselves.

 

[paloftoon]

. . .

Is it possible that he was just being manipulative to keep me interested and into him only? Is it possible that he was lying?

I ended our friendship as I can't remain friends with someone who I had love for. He does not understand this. He thinks because he came to the realization from a Google search and talking to friends, that a relationship with someone my age was impossible, that everything should go back to being buddy, buddy.

Again, from the advise I got on here, I ended the friendship, but I do have to wonder if he was manipulating me, at least partially for his own sexual gain and for company. I never thought it was possible for those on the AS to be manipulative like this. Sorry again if I am not clear. I have a central nervous system issue due to medications.

Jamie5136, I agree with pretty much everyone it is hard to say what his intentions really were. You experienced it, so you would/might understand his intentions best. It is good to gather other opinions, but in the end, make your own decision definitely.

If he can't understand that you can't remain friends after having been lovers, that is his problem, not yours. Many people can't, but a small number can.

If, say, you were to change your mind on trying to be friends with certain prior lover(s) too, that's okay too. It really depends on you. Take context into consideration and your feelings.

This person didn't necessarily intentionally do anything to you. I do believe people can change if they want to too, but they have to want it themselves and talk it out amongst others.

 

[Bolletje]

We’re people. Therefore some of us are honest through and through, and some of us are manipulative shits.

 

[tducey]

Honesty is usually one of our strong suits but yeah we have the ability to lie.

 

[Ylva]

Is it possible that he was just being manipulative to keep me interested and into him only? Is it possible that he was lying?

It's possible, but from what you say it doesn't sound like he was lying…

I ended our friendship as I can't remain friends with someone who I had love for. He does not understand this. He thinks because he came to the realization from a Google search and talking to friends, that a relationship with someone my age was impossible, that everything should go back to being buddy, buddy

…it just sounds like he's extremely gullible. He read it on Google?! Is his only rationale that other people think your relationship wouldn't work? I'm sorry, you can do better.

If it's important to you that he gets it, try using an analogy. Say, to you relationships are different rooms and you can only move forward in them not backwards. Or something more literal, if you're afraid he will turn the analogy around and be all, "but why can't I be in the friendship room after I've been in the romantic room why why". You can also back up and clarify that you were just trying to help him understand, and where was all this "but why?" when he was googling anyway, maybe he should try to mean the things he says instead of just saying whatever seems true at the time. The possibilities are endless.

 

[Mr Allen]

It's possible, but from what you say it doesn't sound like he was lying…



…it just sounds like he's extremely gullible. He read it on Google?! Is his only rationale that other people think your relationship wouldn't work? I'm sorry, you can do better.

If it's important to you that he gets it, try using an analogy. Say, to you relationships are different rooms and you can only move forward in them not backwards. Or something more literal, if you're afraid he will turn the analogy around and be all, "but why can't I be in the friendship room after I've been in the romantic room why why". You can also back up and clarify that you were just trying to help him understand, and where was all this "but why?" when he was googling anyway, maybe he should try to mean the things he says instead of just saying whatever seems true at the time. The possibilities are endless.

Contrary to popular belief, not everything found on the almighty Google is Gospel truth.

 

[pamelaperejil]

I'm sure people on the spectrum can be manipulative, but I don't see anything manipulative in his actions. I just see you grieving a loss.

 

[Tom]

Absolutely not! We are all paragons of virtue, sworn to uphold the sacred 'Aspie Code of Ethics and Good Table Manners'. An Aspie would rather die than break that code!

 

[AO1501]

...Every time I said I was meeting with another male friend online, he would say he wanted to visit me instead and live with me, take care of me, etc. I told him the age difference was too vast and he said he did not care. So, I actually believed him and fell head over heels. One of the reasons I like people on the spectrum is that they seem to be super honest and straightforward, and logical to a fault.

Is it possible that he was just being manipulative to keep me interested and into him only? Is it possible that he was lying?

This does not sound at all manipulative to me, nor would I say it likely that he was lying. If I had to quantify it at all, I'd say that he is an immature young man with a significant emotional attachment to you and he doesn't (or at least, didn't) want to lose you. You talking to other men directly threaten that, and his rather typical response is trying to strengthen the bond he has (had) with you, that he wants (wanted) you to have with him.

This is very common behaviour in relationships, particularly ones which are failing.

I ended our friendship as I can't remain friends with someone who I had love for. He does not understand this. He thinks because he came to the realization from a Google search and talking to friends, that a relationship with someone my age was impossible, that everything should go back to being buddy, buddy.

To be honest, I don't understand why it wouldn't be possible to remain friends either. Which is not to say you don't have the right to make that decision, but that I think for him (as for me) it would be hard to understand why not. Given he clearly wanted to be in a relationship with you, wanting to remain in contact, and possibly with the hope of being able to rebuild that relationship going forward, I think his view of this would be very logical.

Again, from the advise I got on here, I ended the friendship, but I do have to wonder if he was manipulating me, at least partially for his own sexual gain and for company.

Ask yourself this: Was your interest in him for your own sexual gain and for company? Also, ask yourself this, based on the comments you have made about what had been your relationship with this person: If you were in the relationship because you were emotionally attached to him, why can you not accept that he was in the relationship because he was equally emotionally attached to you?

If you are prepared to accept that premise, his actions have been very predictable and - within the boundaries of a maturity imbalance and his age - perfectly 'normal'.

 

[OlLiE]

if you are not exchanging factual information, then you are 'manipulating'

if someone you care about feels bad, and you adjust your attitude, words and actions to make them feel better, then you are manipulating that person

if you try to motivate someone at work, then you are manipulating them

anyone who understands emotional mechanics can manipulate someone else, whether they are on the spectrum or not doesn't really matter imo

not all manipulation is bad, but the word always seems to have a negative connotation

 

[FlowerChild]

While I do think diagnostic labels like 'Autism' can be helpful in people understanding and categorising behaviours, sometimes they can be problematic, in that they can lead to a dehumanizing effect which erases personal autonomy and agency in favour of 'black and white' diagnostic reasoning. Autistic people are human; we can absolutely be manipulative and lie. We can do selfish things. We are logical, rational, calculating, and intelligent--of course, we can at times, use these skills to be manipulative and dishonest when it suits us--just like Neurotypicals can. It may be more difficult for some of us than others, but the same can be said for Neurotypicals. However, I'm not saying he maliciously tried to harm you; but, of course, it's absolutely possible that he'd act in his best interests without considering the consequences for your own feelings.

On the other hand, we are not necessarily static and unchanging just because we like our routine and stability. It's entirely possible that he had feelings for you, meant what he said about being with you, and then over time, those feelings changed or dissipated. I'm sure you've done the same to others in the past, as I'd be willing to bet that most people with relationship experience have been in similar situations before. Be wary of boiling all his behaviour down to being explicable via the lens of Autism--his behaviour regarding a change in romantic interest is arguably just human behaviour. Nothin' to see here, folks...

 

[FlowerChild]

PS - I am saying the above as somebody who just ended a longterm Autistic/Autistic relationship with a large age gap. We really loved each other, wanted to be together, etc. He wanted children desperately, and I changed my own plans from holding off on children for another 5-10 years, because he is much older than I, and we didn't have that luxury. When it came time to start putting the plans into action, he changed his mind and said he wasn't sure he wanted children anymore. By this point I WAS sure, and didn't want to wait endlessly when he wasn't even decided one way or the other. However, this doesn't mean that either of us were manipulating each other, lying, or just out for our own sexual gratification throughout our relationship. The reality is that people change. And the really difficult thing to accept sometimes is that relationships specifically have the capacity change you quite fundamentally in some contexts (i.e. my desire to have children sooner rather than later after being with him). Relationships like this can make you ask yourself tough questions, and subsequently grow to understand yourself better.

So, what I'm getting at, is that while it's natural to go through an 'angry' stage during grief, don't let it permanently tarnish your thoughts of him; don't let an angry grieving process lead you down the road where you think he's manipulative and awful simply because he did not want to pursue a romantic relationship. I think the fact that he was a) willing to research the topic in-depth to understand himself better, and b) ultimately choose to be up front and honest with you about his conclusions (rather than ghosting or continuing the illusion of romance) speaks very highly of him. My ex and I are now moving forward into a very satisfying friendship despite having both been deeply in love with each other in the past--and we didn't break up because we fell out of love in the present, we broke up because we wanted different futures. I think if you really valued this person you'd be willing to go off, take some time alone to grieve, and consider accepting their good qualities and moving forward as friends without resentment. And I think in most cases where abuse is not a factor, this is a good way to go about break-ups. Once an appropriate amount of time has passed to allow for a 'moving on' process, I don't really understand the 'if I can't have you romantically I don't want you at all' logic. If anything, that to me seems like quite a cruel and potentially manipulative ultimatum. But that's just my two cents.

 

[paloftoon]

To be honest, I don't understand why it wouldn't be possible to remain friends either. Which is not to say you don't have the right to make that decision, but that I think for him (as for me) it would be hard to understand why not. Given he clearly wanted to be in a relationship with you, wanting to remain in contact, and possibly with the hope of being able to rebuild that relationship going forward, I think his view of this would be very logical.

Ask yourself this: Was your interest in him for your own sexual gain and for company? Also, ask yourself this, based on the comments you have made about what had been your relationship with this person: If you were in the relationship because you were emotionally attached to him, why can you not accept that he was in the relationship because he was equally emotionally attached to you?

If you are prepared to accept that premise, his actions have been very predictable and - within the boundaries of a maturity imbalance and his age - perfectly 'normal'.

Some people can't mix being in a relationship and then a friendship, especially if the break up wasn't mutual. If two people who were in a relationship can now be in a friendship, then a thought might be why can't they be in a relationship? The romantic piece is a big difference, but some people don't really separate the two emotionally and want it all or nothing basically. They may feel used or "used" from being formerly intimate, and that's a bit part of the struggle or "struggle."

Another thing to keep in mind is that when dealing with emotions, people can choose to do whatever. Emotions are not supposed to be logical 100%, NT or not.

 

[Pats]

Jamie5136 I apologize if I said the wrong thing. Just as I was reading your question, it just jumped out at me and I felt such an uneasiness. To answer your question about honesty and manipulation - yes. I say I'm honest because if I'm asked a question I answer honestly and believe you can't build a real relationship (friend or otherwise) based on lies. I am brutally honest, which some people don't like at all and others like that I'm so up front. Sometimes I think people don't believe me because they can't see things like I see them or have no idea what I'm talking about. But, yes, I have lied before - the usual call in to work excuses which leaves me bearing guilt the rest of the day. I have a hard time understanding manipulation because I feel that if you want me to do something just ask. I have a hard time saying no and I'm easily manipulated. So I think when I first read your question I was reading it from my view - I know I'm gullible and I think everyone is basically honest. People used to tell me to take off my rose colored glasses all the time. And over time I have become more cautious. I've had some really bad experiences because of my being so gullible and don't want to see anyone else making those same mistakes. Maybe I care too much about others and become over protective.
But one thing I learned to do to help myself out of situations. Because I tend to think more of others than myself I ask myself if a friend asked me this question or made this statement, what would I tell them?

 

[WereBear]

Turns out Anthony Hopkins, the celebrated actor, is on the spectrum. So yes, acting is in our skill set.

 

[Mattymatt]

I suppose it is possible for someone on the spectrum to also suffer from anti-social personality disorder but I am hard pressed to think of any examples. Somehow I do not think that this is very common.

 

[jacinto]

I for one rarely lie. I'd rather tell the truth even when it's extremely difficult or downright unwise/counterproductive. I've read that a lot of Aspies are like this

 

[Federica]

Is he a diagnosed aspie? By a doctor?