Antiques vs antique people

[Martha Ferris]

I am going to try to explain this even though I haven't figured it all out for myself yet. Sorry this is so long.

My sister PMd me last night about having had her DNA tested to see what her (our) family history is and gave me the results. I responded that our brother had done this several years ago and that he had sent me the results when I asked to see them. I wondered to myself why she hadn't just gone with those rather than being tested herself as we are all siblings. I told her I was not interested in geneology. I also pointed out that both of our brothers had researched our geneology and that one of them had been doing so for many, many years and that they had sent me the reports of their findings. She said the one brother was still doing it. I expressed my surprise and wondered what more he could hope to find to which she replied that with the internet there is so much more opportunity to discover things. I suggested that at least it was something to keep him busy and to myself thought that it was perhaps an autism trait as he is on the spectrum. I replied that what is on the internet has to be inputed data and unless one has done something notable then it is not likely that there would be much information about someone especially from generations ago. She then cited all the places to get information but these are very limited sources and again the farther back one goes the more limited they become. She said that her husband is also very interested in the subject and that when they went to Cleveland, Ohio they found the steet and the house where his grandmother had lived. Oh excitement. I replied "That's cool" trying to be friendly in a tense situation and that ended the converstation. No reply back. My sister is quick to annoy and anger.

This is just another example, as I have mentioned in my comments in other posts, where I am the odd one out. Where one of my family members seemed to have become upset or even dismissed me when I was not in agreement with them on a topic.
I don't get this fascination with other people. I, as a rule, don't gossip. I just don't care about the lives of others unless I can help them in some way. We all are born, we live our lives through easy and hard times, we all have our sorrows and our joys then we die end of story. Our ancestors lived that is why we are here. For me there is nothing more of interest and certainly nothing that would make me spend time and energy on. Did you know this about so and so? I don't care.
I can accept that geneology is of interest to my family. I don't understand the interest but I can accept it. I can't understand the hostility.
For myself I prefer objects over people. I like antiques. I like the history of things. I like the unusual. I like the craftmanship. The creativity. On the many Autism tests I have taken this was one of the questions: Do you prefer people or things? Perhaps it was worded differently but that was the gist of the question. Everytime it was things. Things over people.
I am tired of the hostility because I am different. I am tired of being "other" and not accepted as being of the same value as the next person because I am not like someone or "everybody" else. I am tired of the judgement. I am tired of others opinions of my "shoulds". And I am sad because again there is strife in my family over something so insignificant which has put up a barrier again in a relationship.

 

[Yeshuasdaughter]

For genealogy, you should test both the male and female lines of a family. A man will give a more accurate, broad result, and show all the places and races your family has identified in, and the movement of peoples, the rise and fall of empires, due to his XY chromosomes.

But the woman, she may not carry the history book of races and peoples, but her mitochondrial DNA will tell you your origins, mother to mother to mother to mother, all the way back to the beginning, to what scientists call "Mitochondrial Eve".

I love learning about the ethnicity of my friends, and who their ancestors were, what wars they fought in, what they were known for. Genealogy is a special interest.

 

[Thinx]

I hear what you are saying about your own preference for things over people. There's nothing wrong with you having that preference in my opinion. I tend to like interacting with places, more than interacting with people. Although I do care about people.

However, in terms of social communication, I would think it was fine to show some interest in the interests of others. Whereas, to me, you sounded a bit dismissive of their interests, whilst labelling them as hostile towards you. I wonder if maybe, all you have been through has resulted in this.

 

[1ForAll]

I can see what you mean there, as personally I could care less what my grandparents and great grandparents did, did not do, where they lived, how they behaved, and what their genetics were in comparison to mine. I am what I am, and am not curious about those that did not even know me, and when circumstances in life were so different. I realize I have a mix of genetics and environmental factors that are the reasons I am as I am today, but why clutter my mind any more than that and with lots of unneeded facts, judgment and speculation, and as I cannot change the distant past or learn much from it to benefit family now?

In my case, I focus far more on the present, unless I have a special interest and need, and then the past and future could come more into play. I guess in your case, you could consider telling them the truth, if not already, in a very condensed version. I mean, tell them you value antiques or historical things having some use or appeal now, more than distant family information, so you appreciate their geneology interest, but you are far more fascinated with the mentioned and prefer to keep your interests there, and among other things, and to pursue any interests when you have the desire and time for that.

If your other family members want to get excited at or debate with each other over that common interest, or want to keep comparing past family genetics or living situations with them or their lives, or need to get some past history data or facts for some pleasure or practical need, that is their choice. But, they should not be assuming you think like them, want to do the same as them, and keep pushing those things on you, as you could see more negatives or at best neutral there. Who knows their intentions there. In my case, for past family others I did not relate to, I first asserted my views calmly back. If they then tried to make me feel guilty for what I thought or what I did, and that pattern repeated, I chose to avoid.

I do not need drama and controlling and/or judgmental others in my life. I mean, everyone has different issues, and different abilities, interests, opinions and needs. So, it's pointless to compare, or to try to get others to agree with us or do like us. As adults, we should be respected for our views as long as we are not harming others. I do realize judgements occur everyday by most persons, and sometimes it could be fair, or well meaning, if that other or others are doing repeated harmful things, and if all points of views and factors were considered, but more often than not those judgements seem harmful and/or are premature, and it reflects badly more so on that other/those others.

 

[Suzette]

@Martha Ferris, I don't get it either. You weren't hostile with her. You barely registered disinterest. Why the hostility? For what it's worth, I don't think you are the odd one here!

On the things vs people issue, I have an anthroplogists heart. So, in a way, I dance the line down the middle. I am interested in why people do things, including the objects they create and the rituals that they do.

 

[Kalinychta]

It may be less about your lack of interest in a topic and more about how you respond to others, such as your sister, when they talk to you about things they’re interested in or that matter to them. When my mother tells me about what she did in church or when my boss spends ten minutes harping on about his love of cars, I listen politely and ask a question or two here and there even though I haven’t the slightest interest in either topic. They do the same for me when I send them detailed weather reports and webcam shots from Antarctica - ha!

So perhaps instead of telling your sister that you’re not interested, just listen to what she has to say. She clearly put some work into the genealogy thing. It has meaning for her even though it doesn’t for you. I’m sure you talk about things with her that she has no interest in, right?

 

[Mary Terry]

I am going to try to explain this even though I haven't figured it all out for myself yet. Sorry this is so long.

My sister PMd me last night about having had her DNA tested to see what her (our) family history is and gave me the results. I responded that our brother had done this several years ago and that he had sent me the results when I asked to see them. I wondered to myself why she hadn't just gone with those rather than being tested herself as we are all siblings. I told her I was not interested in geneology. I also pointed out that both of our brothers had researched our geneology and that one of them had been doing so for many, many years and that they had sent me the reports of their findings. She said the one brother was still doing it. I expressed my surprise and wondered what more he could hope to find to which she replied that with the internet there is so much more opportunity to discover things. I suggested that at least it was something to keep him busy and to myself thought that it was perhaps an autism trait as he is on the spectrum. I replied that what is on the internet has to be inputed data and unless one has done something notable then it is not likely that there would be much information about someone especially from generations ago. She then cited all the places to get information but these are very limited sources and again the farther back one goes the more limited they become. She said that her husband is also very interested in the subject and that when they went to Cleveland, Ohio they found the steet and the house where his grandmother had lived. Oh excitement. I replied "That's cool" trying to be friendly in a tense situation and that ended the converstation. No reply back. My sister is quick to annoy and anger.

This is just another example, as I have mentioned in my comments in other posts, where I am the odd one out. Where one of my family members seemed to have become upset or even dismissed me when I was not in agreement with them on a topic.
I don't get this fascination with other people. I, as a rule, don't gossip. I just don't care about the lives of others unless I can help them in some way. We all are born, we live our lives through easy and hard times, we all have our sorrows and our joys then we die end of story. Our ancestors lived that is why we are here. For me there is nothing more of interest and certainly nothing that would make me spend time and energy on. Did you know this about so and so? I don't care.
I can accept that geneology is of interest to my family. I don't understand the interest but I can accept it. I can't understand the hostility.
For myself I prefer objects over people. I like antiques. I like the history of things. I like the unusual. I like the craftmanship. The creativity. On the many Autism tests I have taken this was one of the questions: Do you prefer people or things? Perhaps it was worded differently but that was the gist of the question. Everytime it was things. Things over people.
I am tired of the hostility because I am different. I am tired of being "other" and not accepted as being of the same value as the next person because I am not like someone or "everybody" else. I am tired of the judgement. I am tired of others opinions of my "shoulds". And I am sad because again there is strife in my family over something so insignificant which has put up a barrier again in a relationship.

My mother was obsessed with geneology and family history. I sometimes found her sitting in the living room crying - literally crying - while looking at ancient photos of ancestors who died before she was even born. She never even knew those people but cried over them.

I probably hurt her feelings because I had and still have no interest in the subject. I remember telling her that we came into this world alone and we will leave this world alone so it doesn't matter to me who those other people were.

One of my younger sisters (the one I can't stand) has all the family geneology stuff, the pictures, papers, old letters, etc. I've told my children to go to her if they want to know about family history.

Guess that makes me a bad mom and grandmother?

 

[Tom]

When you die it may not be the end of the story exactly. Bugs and worms might get to eat you and well I guess then you are passed so to speak and become dirt or maybe just generic matter. And then some dog eats you (they eat anything) and in a way you become dog and maybe learn to fetch... there's so much to die for really.

 

[Mis-fit]

Hi Martha,

I have learned recently, through an Aspie book, when NT's say things, they are looking for you to agree with them, like they may say, "Did you see that car? It was going way too fast." Then they expect you to say, "Yes, way over the speed limit." When we say, "Yeah, but it was ugly, I hate that color." They don't understand. Some time ago, as I have been trying to figure out how to talk to NT's before I knew I was an Aspie, I figured out that the way to get along with them is to, "Give 'em strokes, and tell 'em jokes." If you pay attention to the way they talk to each other, you might notice that a lot of them do just that. To me it is a silly way to talk because it just seems kind of childish to me. But that is what they want. Tell silly jokes, to have something to laugh about, and they need validation to make them feel secure. I don't need that. I can come up with my own jokes, and I feel secure alone. I have had to learn to feel secure in my own skin because I have NEVER fit in Anywhere, Ever! So to me, needing someone to give me emotional or verbal validation for what I just said is quite silly. Sometimes the jokes NT's say are funny, and I don't mind laughing, but if I want to fit in with them, it seems to be that I have to communicate on their terms, not mine.

Think of it like going to a foreign country or something, they have traditions, ways of communicating, and the things that are socially acceptable there, may not be here, and vice versa. So if you want to go there, you have to communicate and act the way they do if you want to fit in.

I am learning more and more about ADS, and I think that it is not a disability at all. I believe it is just because we are in the minority and the fact that we are wired differently would not exclude us or put us odd man out if everyone were on the ADS. Know what I mean? It is just because we are different that we get bullied, pushed away, and excluded. Not we are disabled, we are just totally different. Does that make sense? Because we don't do what they do or say what they say, we don't have social skills like they do, it is a disability in that we are not able to play ball on their terms, level, or under their conditions, and since they make up 95% or more of society we are "Unable" to play ball on their terms. By play ball I mean communicate. If we cannot communicate on their terms, then we are at a tremendous disadvantage and we get scorned for it, that is the word I was looking for, we get scorned for being different.

I hope this all makes sense. If not, don't worry, it's just my opinion. It may be right to some and not for others. It's just the way I see things.

 

[Aspychata]

Sympathetic here. I have always been talked down to. I didn't achieve the status that my mom and brother did. Both held prestigious jobs at a famous software company. My brother was the youngest ever to be made police detective for a major city. My parents did pay for my brother's college. I was kicked out of the house at age 17. I am never good enough. Now l just don't try. And l am fine with that. They seem less likely to talk down to me. I have corrected them on a few things. And l do speak up more. But l don't seek out their company nor do l call them on a regular basis. They refuse to hire me at their store and that's how the ball rolls. I can't try to satisfy them. There is a very tangled emotional back story. Life with family sucks, at least with my family.

 

[Martha Ferris]

It may be less about your lack of interest in a topic and more about how you respond to others, such as your sister, when they talk to you about things they’re interested in or that matter to them. When my mother tells me about what she did in church or when my boss spends ten minutes harping on about his love of cars, I listen politely and ask a question or two here and there even though I haven’t the slightest interest in either topic. They do the same for me when I send them detailed weather reports and webcam shots from Antarctica - ha!

So perhaps instead of telling your sister that you’re not interested, just listen to what she has to say. She clearly put some work into the genealogy thing. It has meaning for her even though it doesn’t for you. I’m sure you talk about things with her that she has no interest in, right?

No, we don't talk much. Bad history so each interaction is like walking on egg shells.

 

[Martha Ferris]

I hear what you are saying about your own preference for things over people. There's nothing wrong with you having that preference in my opinion. I tend to like interacting with places, more than interacting with people. Although I do care about people.

However, in terms of social communication, I would think it was fine to show some interest in the interests of others. Whereas, to me, you sounded a bit dismissive of their interests, whilst labelling them as hostile towards you. I wonder if maybe, all you have been through has resulted in this.

I admit to being very tired and irritable that evening.

My family and I have a very contentious history. I don't talk to my brothers at all and my sister very little and then it is like walking on egg shells. We are trying to find a commmon ground where we can interact in peace.

I am liberal and they are conservative. This is not all about politics. It is how our brains are constructed and that makes a difference in how we think. https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/ For me as long as people don't harm anyone or anything they can do what they want. My family has a problem with that.

I think I am a good listener and try to appear to take an interest in what other people are saying even when I couldn't care less. It is the polite thing to do and it is being respectful. I realize that things are important to others even when they are not important to me and I participate in activites that are important to others when I would rather not because of this understanding.

I would not be upset if someone told me that they have no interest in what I was talking about. I would respect that and change the subject.

Being who I am I point out problems in statements such as the comment I made about the internet. Her statement was not accurate and was an assumption.

I know my response disappointed her but I am so tired of having to fit into the mold my family wants me to fit into. I am so tired of being passive, just accepting, while my family seems to think that the way they are is the way everyone should be. I am tired of being silent just to keep the peace. To go along just to get along.

I do not miss my family and if I never hear from them again I am sad that it couldn't have been different but it is what it is. I am sad for what could have been but accept the reality of those relationships. I have thought about how I will feel when one of my siblings dies and I don't think there would be any change in how I react when that occurs.

I suppose I fell into the same old same old again with my sister. Sigh.

 

[Martha Ferris]

Hi Martha,

I have learned recently, through an Aspie book, when NT's say things, they are looking for you to agree with them, like they may say, "Did you see that car? It was going way too fast." Then they expect you to say, "Yes, way over the speed limit." When we say, "Yeah, but it was ugly, I hate that color." They don't understand. Some time ago, as I have been trying to figure out how to talk to NT's before I knew I was an Aspie, I figured out that the way to get along with them is to, "Give 'em strokes, and tell 'em jokes." If you pay attention to the way they talk to each other, you might notice that a lot of them do just that. To me it is a silly way to talk because it just seems kind of childish to me. But that is what they want. Tell silly jokes, to have something to laugh about, and they need validation to make them feel secure. I don't need that. I can come up with my own jokes, and I feel secure alone. I have had to learn to feel secure in my own skin because I have NEVER fit in Anywhere, Ever! So to me, needing someone to give me emotional or verbal validation for what I just said is quite silly. Sometimes the jokes NT's say are funny, and I don't mind laughing, but if I want to fit in with them, it seems to be that I have to communicate on their terms, not mine.

Think of it like going to a foreign country or something, they have traditions, ways of communicating, and the things that are socially acceptable there, may not be here, and vice versa. So if you want to go there, you have to communicate and act the way they do if you want to fit in.

I am learning more and more about ADS, and I think that it is not a disability at all. I believe it is just because we are in the minority and the fact that we are wired differently would not exclude us or put us odd man out if everyone were on the ADS. Know what I mean? It is just because we are different that we get bullied, pushed away, and excluded. Not we are disabled, we are just totally different. Does that make sense? Because we don't do what they do or say what they say, we don't have social skills like they do, it is a disability in that we are not able to play ball on their terms, level, or under their conditions, and since they make up 95% or more of society we are "Unable" to play ball on their terms. By play ball I mean communicate. If we cannot communicate on their terms, then we are at a tremendous disadvantage and we get scorned for it, that is the word I was looking for, we get scorned for being different.

I hope this all makes sense. If not, don't worry, it's just my opinion. It may be right to some and not for others. It's just the way I see things.

It's more about how our brains work. Our brain structures are different. Not only am I on the spectrum but I am a liberal while they are conservative. This has more far reaching effects than just politics. Both my brothers are on the spectrum. One would think that would unite us but it doesn't. My having a brain structure that has been identified with being liberal and their having a brain structure that has been identified with being conservative divides us. https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/

I am tired of going along to get along. I have been silent for too long. Masking for too long. Hiding for too long. At 65 can't I finally just be who I am?

 

[Martha Ferris]

For genealogy, you should test both the male and female lines of a family. A man will give a more accurate, broad result, and show all the places and races your family has identified in, and the movement of peoples, the rise and fall of empires, due to his XY chromosomes.

But the woman, she may not carry the history book of races and peoples, but her mitochondrial DNA will tell you your origins, mother to mother to mother to mother, all the way back to the beginning, to what scientists call "Mitochondrial Eve".

I love learning about the ethnicity of my friends, and who their ancestors were, what wars they fought in, what they were known for. Genealogy is a special interest.

I can accept that geneology is fascinating for others just not for me.

I am aware of the "Mitrochondrial Eve." I find it interesting but not something I want to pursue. I am more into the why people are the way they are not the facts and figures of their existence.

Glad you have found something that is so interesting for you. Have at it!

 

[Suzette]

@Martha Ferris

I am the odd one in my family. This is significant because there are only 3 of us. I didn't speak with either of them for years. I just share that to comiserate.
At times it feels like I was the "add in" that exceeded family capacity. Like my presence causes spill over.
I used to be really hurt by this. But the more I think of them as "weird" for their attitudes, the easier it is to be around them.

I even have a little fun calling them out on their hypocracies and gaslighting.
Mom - "I never hear from you!" (In response to me calling her)
Me - "My phone is never off, you can call anytime you like!"

Mom- "We didn't invite you to go on vacation with us because we didn't think you would want to go"
Me-"You always did tell me that there was no such thing as reading minds, I guess you were right!"

You family sounds very anxious. You challege their tidy world view and they can't tollerate anything outside if that view. Their loss!

 

[Kalinychta]

No, we don't talk much. Bad history so each interaction is like walking on egg shells.

Well, think about it this way. Suppose you called her to tell her something new that you learned about autism, and she said the same thing you said to her: that she isn’t interested in autism and your brother had already told her all about the subject anyway, and she didn’t want to hear anything more about it. How would that make you feel?

 

[Mis-fit]

Yes, Kalinychta. That is kinda what I was referring to in my post. NT's need validation like their lives depend on it or something. We all seem to have been outcasts from the beginning and have learned how to deal with ourselves and life without it. This seems especially true to me because anytime I talk with an NT and validate their words, their feelings, thoughts and ideas, when I find what they say as interesting, boy they light up, but when I say something contrary or even off the wall, they clam up and leave me. Not that we don't need validation and someone to listen to us and find us interesting, I just think our tolerance for not being validated is much higher than NT's.

I wrote a poem about this...

I posted it in the Member's only Serious Topic Forum under "An Aspie Poem:

 

[watersprite]

I find the “block this number” and “block this email address” features work quite handily.

 

[Kalinychta]

Yes, Kalinychta. That is kinda what I was referring to in my post. NT's need validation like their lives depend on it or something. We all seem to have been outcasts from the beginning and have learned how to deal with ourselves and life without it. This seems especially true to me because anytime I talk with an NT and validate their words, their feelings, thoughts and ideas, when I find what they say as interesting, boy they light up, but when I say something contrary or even off the wall, they clam up and leave me. Not that we don't need validation and someone to listen to us and find us interesting, I just think our tolerance for not being validated is much higher than NT's.

I wrote a poem about this...

I posted it in the Member's only Serious Topic Forum under "An Aspie Poem:

I think everyone is like that, not just NTs by any means, but I would almost say that autistic people are worse about it, since inflexibility and rigid thinking patterns are so common with us.

My point was about manners and basic social interaction, though. If I called my friend to tell her that I read a great book about carnivals today, and she said, “I’m not interested in carnivals, so I don’t want to hear what you have to say”…I would be hurt, not because I need validation, but because I wanted to tell her about something that had meaning for me. Or: my mother often talks to me about her garden. I don’t garden, and I’m not very interested in it, but she is, so I listen to her. I don’t tell her I’m not interested in gardens and to please shut up about it.

 

[Martha Ferris]

Well, think about it this way. Suppose you called her to tell her something new that you learned about autism, and she said the same thing you said to her: that she isn’t interested in autism and your brother had already told her all about the subject anyway, and she didn’t want to hear anything more about it. How would that make you feel?

As I responded to another comment on this topic I would accept it and move on. I have since messaged her and tried to smooth things over because I do understand how she would feel being told this without context.
I do admit to being tired and irritable and that played into my response. But behind this is a whole lot of **** between us, decades worth, so that comes into play as well. I become very anxious when I have to deal with her and that, on top of being tired, came into play. I was just too tired to deal with her. It's always about how not to piss her off. How to have a conversation on topics where we can just be pleasant. She lives in a very controlled world of those like her. Yeah I could have responded when I was less tired but the whole thing just irritated me more than I already was and still does. I couldn't give her the response she was seeking and I still can't. We have talked about her crafts and she has shown me pics of what she has done and I have been supportive even though I have my own opinions about them.
My sister says many things that I could easily take umbrage to but I don't. It's just the way she is and I let it go. I have never been given that courtesy by her. BTW she isn't interested in anything I find interesting and that's OK too. It does not impact my self worth.
It was just a bad conversation all around and I am moving on.