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Virtual reality

Jordy

Well-Known Member
I wonder if anyone else here has ever felt compelled to life in vr. It sounds very ridiculous but I have been looking into buying entire an vr setup just so I can escape into a different world. There are vr games out there that even let you socialize, but i fear even those would contain the expected bullies and manipulative people, so i think i would just be playing in private worlds. I figured i could drop 1300 euro into buying used components for a capable pc and another 1000 in a steam index, I can borrow this money from myself but i would have to find some evening or night job again to earn the money back.
 
Grommet had something to say about virtual reality, Post #17.
 
A guy I worked with (who may or may not be an Aspie), told me that he used VR during Covid lockdowns specifically, and at least for him was an excellent way to deal with isolation... Not sure which types of VR he was using, because I also believe it can be used to simulate a walk in the woods as well and/or for social purposes... He did indicate to me that it was fairly expensive to get into

I've never tried it much, but somehow knowing myself, I would rather be outside doing the real thing, not in VR mode at home
 
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VR is not my kind of thing. I prefer to be physically active as well as mentally active, and I like to be outside in the real world, especially outdoors. I don't even play traditional video games so I feel like VR would be even less appealing.

I can also see it probably giving me vertigo or anxiety lol... I get vertigo from looking up at high ceilings, like in a shopping mall or a cathedral or a tall apartment building or office building. Does anyone else get that? A bit off-topic, but...

I can see how VR would be good for things like training medical professionals, or for helping to "simulate" activities from the real world for people who can't leave their homes because of a disability. I have seen it used for both of those purposes.
 
VR is not my kind of thing. I prefer to be physically active as well as mentally active, and I like to be outside in the real world, especially outdoors. I don't even play traditional video games so I feel like VR would be even less appealing.

I can also see it probably giving me vertigo or anxiety lol... I get vertigo from looking up at high ceilings, like in a shopping mall or a cathedral or a tall apartment building or office building. Does anyone else get that? A bit off-topic, but...

I can see how VR would be good for things like training medical professionals, or for helping to "simulate" activities from the real world for people who can't leave their homes because of a disability. I have seen it used for both of those purposes.
Being outside can sometimes really trigger my anxiety and depression, as counter intuitive as that may sound. Potential harassment is an obvious reason (I don't life in a good neighborhood), but also seeing normal people go about their things and socialize makes me very self conscious of how weird I am. There are also ways in which the appearance of the environment I am in heavily influences my mood, but it's hard to describe how, its caused the general oversensitivity to stimuli that comes with autism I guess. I wish I wasn't sensitive to the point that the real world becomes too intense.
 
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Grommet had something to say about virtual reality, Post #17.
@logos, make sure you also read the parts about all the broken controllers and additional expenses… It seems like VR systems and components often end up costing more than initially expected.

I think the use of VR for people with different types of physical or social challenges is amazing and interesting and very promising. There are very real benefits to get from it and it could be a real life changer for some people.

Nevertheless, probably too much of it would be a bad thing. Retreating from the world too much will surely make you forget how to be in it, and actually living in virtual reality seems really unhealthy for the current human brain. Perhaps we will evolve to a state where we live mostly virtually, but currently our brains are wired for social interplay.

Many people do experience nausea – some can overcome it, others cannot. It is not a sensation that everyone can get used to in VR. Although, most people I know who use it a lot have gotten over any sort of nausea. For me it’s only bad when I am playing first person shooter games and there is a lot of flying or fast action.
 
Be warned that it's very expensive to get into, and requires at least some technical expertise.

But also, there are other problems. Like, if you jump into it wrong, start out wrong, well... you could make yourself incredibly sick for days.

On top of that, since it's such an investment, you need to be able to make absolutely sure that, if you buy it, you're going to ACTUALLY use it. A lot of people go to so much trouble to get one, get it set up, they're so darned excited... and then they use it for like two weeks and it collects dust afterwards.

I've been using it for a few years now... previously an Oculus Rift, now the Valve Index. I was actually thinking of maybe making a video about it just to show off what it is *actually* like and such (I'd done one awhile back, but that was terrible since I didnt understand the recording process, and I know more now, so might do it again), so... I dunno, maybe that might help. I've no idea if anyone would actually care to have a look, which is why I havent done it just yet.

Generally, it's a good idea to understand what you're REALLY getting when you decide to dive into this. And just listening to people say things like "oh it's so amazing" aint gonna help you do that.

Many people do experience nausea – some can overcome it, others cannot. It is not a sensation that everyone can get used to in VR. Although, most people I know who use it a lot have gotten over any sort of nausea. For me it’s only bad when I am playing first person shooter games and there is a lot of flying or fast action.

For the most part it is absolutely possible to overcome this (though of course there are exceptions)... the problem is actually knowing HOW. Which is something you're probably not going to hear about, from listening to most users discussing it.

I see so many people doing things like repeatedly trying to thrust themselves into some blasted roller coaster thing or whatever, and then wondering why it never improves for them. It's like trying to master the art of swimming by diving into a riptide over and over and then wondering why they keep nearly drowning. Okay that's not the best analogy but dagnabit I just woke up.

As long as the user starts out really sloooooooooooooowwwwwwwwww with VR (and most people do not), and follows the correct sort of regimen, they can get to a point of becoming immune (or nearly immune) to side effects without ever having to go through that stuff. But it takes awhile (took me a full month) and needs to be done right or it aint gonna work.

And there's more to it than just that. If something is going wrong on the technical side of things (particularly issues like framerate and similar stuff) it can produce effects without the user even quite realizing what is wrong. Again, possible to become immune to that too, but that's a much harder problem to diagnose.

There are other problems too though which do need to be considered. Injuries, for instance... that's always possible.

Beneficial as this tech may be, you really have to be careful with it.

I think the use of VR for people with different types of physical or social challenges is amazing and interesting and very promising. There are very real benefits to get from it and it could be a real life changer for some people.

Aye, this is true.

I always tell people, there's a lot of potential therapeutic use in this technology. There is also a lot of educational use!

Sure, playing games in it is fun and all, but... yeah, that definitely aint all it can do.

My brother is a history teacher, really into that subject overall, and one of the things I've liked doing is that I'd go looking for some history-related app, something that gives a sort of "experience" of some historical event (sort of like an interactive movie that you happen to be sitting inside of), for him to try out when he comes to visit. I've found some darned cool stuff for that, and was amazed at just how much of it there was.
 
Be warned that it's very expensive to get into, and requires at least some technical expertise.

But also, there are other problems. Like, if you jump into it wrong, start out wrong, well... you could make yourself incredibly sick for days.

On top of that, since it's such an investment, you need to be able to make absolutely sure that, if you buy it, you're going to ACTUALLY use it. A lot of people go to so much trouble to get one, get it set up, they're so darned excited... and then they use it for like two weeks and it collects dust afterwards.

I've been using it for a few years now... previously an Oculus Rift, now the Valve Index. I was actually thinking of maybe making a video about it just to show off what it is *actually* like and such (I'd done one awhile back, but that was terrible since I didnt understand the recording process, and I know more now, so might do it again), so... I dunno, maybe that might help. I've no idea if anyone would actually care to have a look, which is why I havent done it just yet.

Generally, it's a good idea to understand what you're REALLY getting when you decide to dive into this. And just listening to people say things like "oh it's so amazing" aint gonna help you do that.



For the most part it is absolutely possible to overcome this (though of course there are exceptions)... the problem is actually knowing HOW. Which is something you're probably not going to hear about, from listening to most users discussing it.

I see so many people doing things like repeatedly trying to thrust themselves into some blasted roller coaster thing or whatever, and then wondering why it never improves for them. It's like trying to master the art of swimming by diving into a riptide over and over and then wondering why they keep nearly drowning. Okay that's not the best analogy but dagnabit I just woke up.

As long as the user starts out really sloooooooooooooowwwwwwwwww with VR (and most people do not), and follows the correct sort of regimen, they can get to a point of becoming immune (or nearly immune) to side effects without ever having to go through that stuff. But it takes awhile (took me a full month) and needs to be done right or it aint gonna work.

And there's more to it than just that. If something is going wrong on the technical side of things (particularly issues like framerate and similar stuff) it can produce effects without the user even quite realizing what is wrong. Again, possible to become immune to that too, but that's a much harder problem to diagnose.

There are other problems too though which do need to be considered. Injuries, for instance... that's always possible.

Beneficial as this tech may be, you really have to be careful with it.



Aye, this is true.

I always tell people, there's a lot of potential therapeutic use in this technology. There is also a lot of educational use!

Sure, playing games in it is fun and all, but... yeah, that definitely aint all it can do.

My brother is a history teacher, really into that subject overall, and one of the things I've liked doing is that I'd go looking for some history-related app, something that gives a sort of "experience" of some historical event (sort of like an interactive movie that you happen to be sitting inside of), for him to try out when he comes to visit. I've found some darned cool stuff for that, and was amazed at just how much of it there was.
Even if I keep it for only a couple months, the resell value on the vr set should be around 80% from what i have seen, as for hardware if I stick to only used hardware i should be able to resell with negligible loss. I would lose some money but if I get 2-3 months of fun out of i think it would be worth it.
 
Even if I keep it for only a couple months, the resell value on the vr set should be around 80% from what i have seen, as for hardware if I stick to only used hardware i should be able to resell with negligible loss. I would lose some money but if I get 2-3 months of fun out of i think it would be worth it.

I suppose, but it also may not work out quite how you think it will.

Also, best to be careful buying used. VR headsets are very fragile. People like to sell things when they arent working quite right.... you do the math there. There's a reason why "used" stuff has a bit of a stigma attached to it.

I should also note, that if a VR unit is in that state of "not working right", well... that's another way to get messed up. I cant overstate how important it is to take the potential side effects seriously. When VR bugs out, it takes you with it... I'll just put it that way.

Also space, I forgot to mention that. You need a lot of space. Be sure to have a look at the general "middleground" space requirements for the headset in question (regardless of buying new or used). Dont buy if you cant manage that. That's a recipe for injuries and broken things (and I dont mean the VR set). That info is easy to find, fortunately.

Overall, the biggest tip I can give is: Do the research. Like, REALLY do the research. I dont mean "watch a review". Learn everything there is to know about the different main options, learn what they can and cant do, learn what problems each may bring (and each does have problems, like all gadgets), learn what sorts of things are required beforehand, and so on. Dont buy until you're *certain* you're making the right choice.
 
I suppose, but it also may not work out quite how you think it will.

Also, best to be careful buying used. VR headsets are very fragile. People like to sell things when they arent working quite right.... you do the math there. There's a reason why "used" stuff has a bit of a stigma attached to it.

I should also note, that if a VR unit is in that state of "not working right", well... that's another way to get messed up. I cant overstate how important it is to take the potential side effects seriously. When VR bugs out, it takes you with it... I'll just put it that way.

Also space, I forgot to mention that. You need a lot of space. Be sure to have a look at the general "middleground" space requirements for the headset in question (regardless of buying new or used). Dont buy if you cant manage that. That's a recipe for injuries and broken things (and I dont mean the VR set). That info is easy to find, fortunately.

Overall, the biggest tip I can give is: Do the research. Like, REALLY do the research. I dont mean "watch a review". Learn everything there is to know about the different main options, learn what they can and cant do, learn what problems each may bring (and each does have problems, like all gadgets), learn what sorts of things are required beforehand, and so on. Dont buy until you're *certain* you're making the right choice.
I roughly have a 9 by 9 feet square of free space in the middle of my room. I bought the valve index as new and i am looking into getting an rtx 3080 to drive it. From my understanding it just takes some time for you brain to learn how to properly integrate the information you're getting from senses into a predictable and intuitive understanding, akin to learning how to ride a bike without falling over.
 
I roughly have a 9 by 9 feet square of free space in the middle of my room. I bought the valve index as new and i am looking into getting an rtx 3080 to drive it. From my understanding it just takes some time for you brain to learn how to properly integrate the information you're getting from senses into a predictable and intuitive understanding, akin to learning how to ride a bike without falling over.

To a degree, that's how it works, sorta.

Like I said: Just take it slow. Real slow. And the very second you start to feel a little weird when using it, take the damn thing off and take a break and come back later. And dont do long sessions (the weight of the headset on your neck will start to cause you problems if you go overboard with long sessions).

Careful and slow, that's really all it takes, and anyone can get the hang of it.

Honestly the only reason I tend to be so adamant about telling people to do it this way is the sheer number of idiots out there who think it's funny to do things like put their newbie friend into a rollercoaster simulation (usually doesnt end well). Or those who start out with some big ACTION PACKED THING OMG because of course THEY wont get any side effects, THEY wont fall for any illusions, no sir, not THEM, they can HANDLE IT... and then later they're at the ER because they broke a bone after sprinting into a wall.

Do it right though, and you're gonna have a great time.
 
My headset should arrive within 5 days. Probably going to try vrchat first and see if i can strike up some conversations with people.
 
I wonder if anyone else here has ever felt compelled to life in vr. It sounds very ridiculous but I have been looking into buying entire an vr setup just so I can escape into a different world. There are vr games out there that even let you socialize, but i fear even those would contain the expected bullies and manipulative people, so i think i would just be playing in private worlds. I figured i could drop 1300 euro into buying used components for a capable pc and another 1000 in a steam index, I can borrow this money from myself but i would have to find some evening or night job again to earn the money back.

Yes. I bought a Valve Index so I could spend more immersive time in VR. There are games like Half Life: Alyx that are so real, you can just spend time in them without playing the game otherwise. I had almost 200 hours playing. One man spent 800 hours. He would just walk around rooms and look at things. I have so many favorite places in the game. Being outdoors with clouds in the sky, the afternoon sun, no people anywhere and the sound of a dog barking somewhere.

I think there may be other games you can spend time in too. I liked Nature Treks a lot but it looks nothing like Half Life: Alyx. In Nature Treks I would go to a lake in a desert. Birds, clouds, fish in the water and a beach in the sun. No people. Safe and peaceful and better than other life.
 
To a degree, that's how it works, sorta.

Like I said: Just take it slow. Real slow. And the very second you start to feel a little weird when using it, take the damn thing off and take a break and come back later. And dont do long sessions (the weight of the headset on your neck will start to cause you problems if you go overboard with long sessions).

Careful and slow, that's really all it takes, and anyone can get the hang of it.

Honestly the only reason I tend to be so adamant about telling people to do it this way is the sheer number of idiots out there who think it's funny to do things like put their newbie friend into a rollercoaster simulation (usually doesnt end well). Or those who start out with some big ACTION PACKED THING OMG because of course THEY wont get any side effects, THEY wont fall for any illusions, no sir, not THEM, they can HANDLE IT... and then later they're at the ER because they broke a bone after sprinting into a wall.

Do it right though, and you're gonna have a great time.

I would say please Listen to Misery. She is the one who taught and helped me learn about VR. If you have not done it, you must take it slow to start. I used to get badly motion sick but it almost never happens now. I think an RTX 3080 will be fine. I have an RTX 3070 ti. Your GPU is about 25% faster than mine but I also have an i7-12700KF CPU, which is very powerful and fast.

I also use a bHaptics x40 vest and Tactosy Arms. I can feel it when someone shoots me, which is frightening but adds so much to the immersion it is worth it. Also the haptic gear vibrates with gun shots, punches or when you run into something.

One thing that I think can help a lot to help you stay oriented is to have a fan, small or big blowing on from the front. You will always know where it is and where you are facing.
 
My headset should arrive within 5 days. Probably going to try vrchat first and see if i can strike up some conversations with people.


I use VRChat myself, but in a limited and frankly unusual way... I dont deal with randoms, and I've heard that a lot of users have had very mixed experiences. Sometimes someone meets up with friendly people. Other times they meet trolls and bratty children (who shouldnt be on such a platform).

Be warned also, it IS possible to encounter "crash content". This can consist of either avatars that can break the program if they should appear in the same world you're currently in, and also you can find entire worlds that are purposefully glitched.

On top of that, it's possible to encounter "forced movement" in worlds. Be careful what you grab or interact with in a given world. One of the absolute worst things you can do as a new user is anything that has you falling any length. Buttons/whatever that teleport you into the air... or do other things involving vertical movement... are a big no-no as a new user. Usually, when interacting with something, holding your hand near it will show you what it is going to do when activated.

The glitched stuff absolutely can trigger the VR side effects as well, due to what they do to your framerate. So, just be careful.

As much as I appreciate what the creators of VRChat have made (and it is really cool), they arent exactly very good at fixing problems. So... yeah, just be aware of it.

Oh, and if you should have any questions, or if you'd like recommendations on certain types of apps/games/whatever to get, feel free to ask, I'd be happy to help.

Also, fair warning, the Index controllers are a bit... finicky. If the finger tracking is acting up, hold out your arms and perform a sort of "drumming" motion with your fingers (is that the right thing to call it?) and just do this over and over again for a minute. This motion is used by the system to calibrate the sensors.

I've had to do that one fairly often. A bit annoying, but... there's no denying that the finger trackers add more immersion to the whole thing. Sure is better than the ancient Oculus controllers I'd been using before getting the Index.


Sorry, didnt mean for that to be so long. Anyway, let us know how it goes! It's a very interesting experience as a new user.
 
been playing on the index today, resolution and fov are a bit dissaponting. It can get really immersive like you forget about vr but than suddenly you realize its not real. Taking a break now cause i don't want to puke. Tried to talk with people in vr chat but it didnt work.

Been thinking about returning the valve index and saving up money for a pimax 8k, i can use it for 2 weeks before i have to decide whether or not i want to return or keep it.
 
I doubt anyone is going to be interested but you can dm me if you want to play vrchat with me.
 

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