Really a disorder?

[Nitro]

Just to be completely clear, here's the post you responded to with your post:

"The reason it's considered a difference is because there is nothing inherent to Autism which is problematic.



As opposed to a cut, a diagnosis impacts the identity. How it impacts the identity matters in part to what it's referred to and how it's thought of."



I don't see any negativity in what I said. I'm not sure what you're thinking. It feels as if you accidentally quoted my post and then responded to someone else's.

Here is the original question: ASD a disorder?
Here is my answer: Yes
It can impact some individuals in very profound ways.
As aspies, high functioning autistic people or whatever name you would prefer to go by, there will always be some kind of deficit on your part.
To me, that signals that there is clinically something out of line, therefore, a disorder.
To cry about a clinical label is the negativity I'm referring to.
Changing the name of it in no way will alter how it physically impacts your life.
It will not remove the co-morbids, or magically turn you into the ultimate social animal.

My suggestion to those of you that feel it is such a big issue is to keep your clinical diagnosis to yourself, unless you are seeking professional help.
Other than that, it is no one's business but your own.

 

[Progster]

For me it's a disorder when demands exceed my ability to cope, otherwise it's a difference.

 

[zurb]

Hmm, reading through the thread is interesting. ASD is a spectrum. For some it’s an inconvenience. For others it’s debilitating. For some, it’s not a ‘disorder’. For others, it very much is. Given the OP referred to themselves as an aspie, it’s clear which end they are at (not precisely, but generally). Those arguing it is a disorder are obviously coming from the perspective of someone in a different place on the spectrum. Not sure why people need to get so heat up.

 

[the_tortoise]

The subject of whether or not it's a disorder and the subject of whether or not it should be considered a disorder are entirely different subjects.

Can you explain further what you mean?

To me, a disorder is an abstract concept category so asking whether it is a disorder versus whether it should be a disorder seems to be asking exactly the same thing.

 

[the_tortoise]

Hmm, reading through the thread is interesting. ASD is a spectrum. For some it’s an inconvenience. For others it’s debilitating. For some, it’s not a ‘disorder’. For others, it very much is. Given the OP referred to themselves as an aspie, it’s clear which end they are at (not precisely, but generally). Those arguing it is a disorder are obviously coming from the perspective of someone in a different place on the spectrum. Not sure why people need to get so heat up.

There is no 1:1 relationship between severity of symptoms and opinion on whether it is a disorder.

 

[Thinx]

I think it's a difference and not necessarily a disorder. As for many minorities whose difference is seen as or described as negative, our situation is affected by the stigma aswell as by our autism.

And I also think the umbrella term autism is too vague, it maybe that in time this can be broken down more accurately, so that we know why some people are experiencing symptoms and effects that others dont.

 

[Aspychata]

The gist of what l am reading suggests to me a couple of things:

Even if it takes a 100 years, there should be a breakdown of all the symptoms and levels of these symptoms and the a chart where you clearly see severe then graduating to aspie type top of the chart.

This would serve several purposes:

We would not all be talking about apples and eggplants and trying to find a continuum to discuss all this when we aren't even truly classified. Is it such a monster undertaking at this point? We could then be more knowledgeable about ourselves and those around us and understand this po's questions.

Would there be a point on the chart where you would be disgnosed as severely disordered, or some what challenged in day to day activities. To just state over and over we are all so different doesn't answer questions.

As a forum reader, l have learned so many things that l didn't even realised were my traits, l thought it was either normal or related to ancestry.

Is this such a incredibly diverse complicated trait to have that the logistics are a nightmare to the DSM editors? See l called it trait NOT didorder. lol. Can't there be a blood test for this? Wake up medical community! What a rant, time for me to step down off my soapbox.

 

[Fino]

Can you explain further what you mean?

To me, a disorder is an abstract concept category so asking whether it is a disorder versus whether it should be a disorder seems to be asking exactly the same thing.

Whether or not it is a disorder is concerned with the fact of the matter, an attempt at objective truth.

Whether or not it should be considered a disorder is concerned with the practicality of the label in current society and if it would be beneficial for it to be labeled as a disorder.

 

[Fino]

Here is the original question: ASD a disorder?
Here is my answer: Yes
It can impact some individuals in very profound ways.
As aspies, high functioning autistic people or whatever name you would prefer to go by, there will always be some kind of deficit on your part.
To me, that signals that there is clinically something out of line, therefore, a disorder.
To cry about a clinical label is the negativity I'm referring to.
Changing the name of it in no way will alter how it physically impacts your life.
It will not remove the co-morbids, or magically turn you into the ultimate social animal.

My suggestion to those of you that feel it is such a big issue is to keep your clinical diagnosis to yourself, unless you are seeking professional help.
Other than that, it is no one's business but your own.

I see. Thank you!

I was saying that it's possible changing the name actually will alter how it physically impacts your life. A difference in name could cause a difference in perception, in the way one experiences it, as you are relating to it differently, thinking of it differently, this being the reason for the change of terminology. But I'm not implying this is a negative change, or a positive change, but I imagine it does cause a change. The way we refer to things in the world is a part of what creates our reality, if not determines it.

 

[Thinx]

My understanding is that there has been a concerted effort to understand the causes of autism, whether genetic or environmental and the genes involved. I think so far the research has shown a very large number of genes potentially involved, and accounting for about 50% of the cause, so we still don't know about the other half of the cause, plus there are about 70 different genes involved and these give rise to different effects I think, much of the way this works isn't yet understood.

To me it seems from this that different genes are likely to be involved for different levels of effects, and this may be clarified over time so that they actually identify different conditions that are currently under the umbrella term autism. Also they may identify other contributing factors that are not genetic, and/or further genetic causes.

 

[SolarPoweredNightOwl]

I read a blog post by someone on the spectrum (can't remember name/title or I'd go find it and link it) who in a nutshell argued that autism was not a disorder, and was only considered such because society is neurotypical. I agree that a lot of the issues we have stem from being in a society--in a world--that was simply not meant for us. But I strongly disagree that autism isn't a disorder, because we have issues apart from social. Executive dysfunction, speech processing, sensory sensitivities, motor control, gastrointestinal issues, all cause issues in our lives to some degree or other, and it's nothing to do with NTs. It's because we're autistic. Therefore, it's logical to consider this a disorder.

Stigma is a very valid concern, but let's be honest--many if not all of us already are perceived as "different" and have to deal with occasional flak for it anyway. If being called "disordered" gives us easier access to supports, so be it. Better than many other things I've been called--and I'm "high-functioning" enough to mask, which is a luxury many don't have.

 

[BrokenBoy]

I read a blog post by someone on the spectrum (can't remember name/title or I'd go find it and link it) who in a nutshell argued that autism was not a disorder, and was only considered such because society is neurotypical. I agree that a lot of the issues we have stem from being in a society--in a world--that was simply not meant for us. But I strongly disagree that autism isn't a disorder, because we have issues apart from social. Executive dysfunction, speech processing, sensory sensitivities, motor control, gastrointestinal issues, all cause issues in our lives to some degree or other, and it's nothing to do with NTs. It's because we're autistic. Therefore, it's logical to consider this a disorder.

Stigma is a very valid concern, but let's be honest--many if not all of us already are perceived as "different" and have to deal with occasional flak for it anyway. If being called "disordered" gives us easier access to supports, so be it. Better than many other things I've been called--and I'm "high-functioning" enough to mask, which is a luxury many don't have.

Yeah people in this thread keep forgetting there are autistic problems that have nothing to do with NT's

 

[Fino]

I read a blog post by someone on the spectrum (can't remember name/title or I'd go find it and link it) who in a nutshell argued that autism was not a disorder, and was only considered such because society is neurotypical. I agree that a lot of the issues we have stem from being in a society--in a world--that was simply not meant for us. But I strongly disagree that autism isn't a disorder, because we have issues apart from social. Executive dysfunction, speech processing, sensory sensitivities, motor control, gastrointestinal issues, all cause issues in our lives to some degree or other, and it's nothing to do with NTs. It's because we're autistic. Therefore, it's logical to consider this a disorder.

For the most part (other than sensory sensitivities) what you are listing is not part of the criteria for Autism Spectrum Disorder. They often accompany it but are not it.

 

[Rasputin]

Yeah, that is my question. ASD a disorder?
NT could also a disorder, right?
We are all disordered. I would say so.
As an aspies I am very grown up if I can sit alone at home and compose 4-part harmony accompaniments for hymn melodies. How many NT can actually sit at a piano for some time like I do.
It is just an example. Many aspies seem to have problems with this as well but I guess are another type if aspie. Maybe they have ADD/ADHD which I do not.
So, if I get to look at a thing methodically I might be able to understand it. Most NTs and some aspies just wanna do things at once. Most Nts eant the whole picture at once. I like sitting at my piano trying different chords and voice leading.
I learn things by just trying things out but only methodically. My organ and singing teacher seem kinda aspie in his way of behaving and explaining music. I guess that is why he is so good at playing the pipe organ.
I am not a flexible person but if I get to learn things my way I might suceed.
Is this how it works for you as well?
I guess this is ASD without ADD/ADHD?
In the beginning I might start by less theory than certain NTs ie I start by brainstorming in order to find what way works for me.

I have similar questions, and have learned a lot about myself since participating in this forum. I think it is a disorder, at least the condition I have is. The way I describe my condition is that I have a very narrow range of emotions that I experience. I do experience pleasure, but not with regard to Family social gatherings such as weddings, holidays, or visits. I love my wife, am extremely responsible as a provider, am totally reliable, will go to war to fight on behalf of friends who are loyal to me or my wife. I do not feel joy however at special family events such as weddings, and I feel no connection whatsoever to extended family members or the event. I feel nothing, besides becoming weary and possibly irritable. In dealing with people in general I am easily annoyed. If I have been betrayed or lied to, I have to emotionally detach to control my anger. When my parents died in 2009 and 2014 I felt nothing, and to this day have not wept or felt sad. I have a high measured IQ (measured at or above 145), and am extremely competent and functional. I do not have great attention to detail normally, but am capable of extreme focus and machinelike execution of work processes.

So what is this? I am 61 and have never been formally diagnosed with autism, but scored high on an autism self-diagnistic test. I have never discussed this with my wife, family, or any counselor or healthcare provider for fear of consequences. My father was the same way, struggled making emotional connections to close family, his children, or anyone. Does this sound like anything you have experienced or heard of? Whatever it is, I know it is a disorder of some kind.