NT and Aspie Communication

[Grumpy Cat]

ASPIE QUESTIONS ON FEELINGS:

I know Aspies have said that they do feel empathy and have very deep feelings. I read that Aspies are not able to interact with others on an emotional level. Is this true?

If an Aspie is able to convey how they are feeling, do they talk about their feelings in logical terms?

If an NT is feeling a certain way, is an Aspie able to understand why the NT is feeling that way?

 

[Ylva]

ASPIE QUESTIONS ON FEELINGS:

I know Aspies have said that they do feel empathy and have very deep feelings. I read that Aspies are not able to interact with others on an emotional level. Is this true?

If an Aspie is able to convey how they are feeling, do they talk about their feelings in logical terms?

If an NT is feeling a certain way, is an Aspie able to understand why the NT is feeling that way?

This may be my alexithymia speaking, but… why does it matter why? Why isn't it enough that I understand that you are feeling that certain way?

I don't really like dealing with feelings, in me or others. I know they are just brain chemistry, but they can still be painful. It has to be worth it. The other person has to mean something to me, and a stranger just doesn't, not in that way, I refuse to be that intimate with them. This could be more due to my early learning (by experience) and only very indirectly because of autism.

 

[Grumpy Cat]

This may be my alexithymia speaking, but… why does it matter why? Why isn't it enough that I understand that you are feeling that certain way?

I don't really like dealing with feelings, in me or others. I know they are just brain chemistry, but they can still be painful. It has to be worth it. The other person has to mean something to me, and a stranger just doesn't, not in that way, I refuse to be that intimate with them. This could be more due to my early learning (by experience) and only very indirectly because of autism.

I understand not having any feelings about people that aren't close to you - I am the same in a way. I never used to be like that until I got into nursing and witnessed some really bad things happening to people and then I knew I was going to have to shut down my feelings somehow or I wouldn't be able to continue doing my job successfully. So I can relate to not "caring" (for lack of a better word) about strangers.

About your question "Why isn't it enough that I understand that you are feeling that certain way?" - if an Aspie and an NT are close and the Aspie is aware the NT is feeling a certain way, how does the Aspie communicate to the NT that they do understand what the NT is feeling? (This is one of the biggest communication problems NTs say they have with Aspies - feelings not being validated leaving the NT feeling isolated and alone.)

The words "brain chemistry" to describe feelings is more of a logical way of thinking in relation to feelings. Is it true then that Aspies relate to their feelings in a logical way?

 

[Ylva]

About your question "Why isn't it enough that I understand that you are feeling that certain way?" - if an Aspie and an NT are close and the Aspie is aware the NT is feeling a certain way, how does the Aspie communicate to the NT that they do understand what the NT is feeling? (This is one of the biggest communication problems NTs say they have with Aspies - feelings not being validated leaving the NT feeling isolated and alone.)

The words "brain chemistry" to describe feelings is more of a logical way of thinking in relation to feelings. Is it true then that Aspies relate to their feelings in a logical way?

I once read a book that said to give feedback to people by telling them how you think they feel. I kind of stopped after my sister told me not to tell her how she felt. I don't know if I could do that with people I don't know. I feel like an intruder when I get involved in someone's feelings, since that is their private mindspace, and I also don't know when to hug.

Maybe if you could abandon the "they should understand"-thing which I get that is deeply ingrained and maybe hard to contradict, and just lay down how it works during a calmer period. My mother tries to tell me how she feels in words, which I can't reciprocate because I don't always know how I feel, but it seems to help that she does.

If I can distance myself from my feelings, I often will. Even the good ones can be overwhelming. Like David Blaine or whoever it was who puts pins through his arm and just thinks of it as an arm, instead of his arm.

 

[wyverary]

ASPIE QUESTIONS ON FEELINGS:

I know Aspies have said that they do feel empathy and have very deep feelings. I read that Aspies are not able to interact with others on an emotional level. Is this true?

If an Aspie is able to convey how they are feeling, do they talk about their feelings in logical terms?

If an NT is feeling a certain way, is an Aspie able to understand why the NT is feeling that way?

I consider myself somewhat hyper-empathic, actually. It's just that it's impossible to express that empathy. What do I say? If I look them in the eye will they see it?

I know many Aspies could care less. But for me, this trouble expressing empathy is the aspect of Aspergers that I could most prefer to live without. I hate it.

 

[Grumpy Cat]

I once read a book that said to give feedback to people by telling them how you think they feel. I kind of stopped after my sister told me not to tell her how she felt. I don't know if I could do that with people I don't know. I feel like an intruder when I get involved in someone's feelings, since that is their private mindspace, and I also don't know when to hug.

Maybe if you could abandon the "they should understand"-thing which I get that is deeply ingrained and maybe hard to contradict, and just lay down how it works during a calmer period. My mother tries to tell me how she feels in words, which I can't reciprocate because I don't always know how I feel, but it seems to help that she does.

If I can distance myself from my feelings, I often will. Even the good ones can be overwhelming. Like David Blaine or whoever it was who puts pins through his arm and just thinks of it as an arm, instead of his arm.

"I once read a book that said to give feedback to people by telling them how you think they feel. I kind of stopped after my sister told me not to tell her how she felt." Maybe the book meant to give feedback to the person of how you think they are feeling (not as a statement) but as a question to make sure you are understanding how they are really feeling.

When an NT is dealing with difficult feelings like sadness it helps to know that the people around them understand what they are going through and can show support in some way - even if its a reassuring touch on the hand or shoulder (I'm not a hugger either, but if someone was really needing hugs I probably could get more into it with time - I just wasn't brought up in a family of "huggers"). If an NT isn't around people who understand and can show in some way that they understand what the NT is going through, then the NT feels like they are going through the difficult time alone and that no one cares which is even more painful. This is what NTs are talking about when they say they can't feel an "emotional connection" to an Aspie. I still don't know how this can be remedied. It ties in with empathy.

How does one distance themselves from their feelings? Isn't life all about feelings - especially the good ones? Do all Aspies not want to experience their feelings, good or bad? As an NT there is no way for me to turn off my feelings. Like Dr Jekyll said in the movie Mary Riley, "Sadness comes in like the tide". It's hard to understand how Aspies can't communicate nonverbally how they are feeling.

 

[wyverary]

"I once read a book that said to give feedback to people by telling them how you think they feel. I kind of stopped after my sister told me not to tell her how she felt." Maybe the book meant to give feedback to the person of how you think they are feeling (not as a statement) but as a question to make sure you are understanding how they are really feeling.

When an NT is dealing with difficult feelings like sadness it helps to know that the people around them understand what they are going through and can show support in some way - even if its a reassuring touch on the hand or shoulder (I'm not a hugger either, but if someone was really needing hugs I probably could get more into it with time - I just wasn't brought up in a family of "huggers"). If an NT isn't around people who understand and can show in some way that they understand what the NT is going through, then the NT feels like they are going through the difficult time alone and that no one cares which is even more painful. This is what NTs are talking about when they say they can't feel an "emotional connection" to an Aspie. I still don't know how this can be remedied. It ties in with empathy.

How does one distance themselves from their feelings? Isn't life all about feelings - especially the good ones? Do all Aspies not want to experience their feelings, good or bad? As an NT there is no way for me to turn off my feelings. Like Dr Jekyll said in the movie Mary Riley, "Sadness comes in like the tide". It's hard to understand how Aspies can't communicate nonverbally how they are feeling.

This post prompted me to text the friend of mine who recently lost her boyfriend. I just said, "Hello. Just saying hi. *hugs*" Thanks, Angie.

 

[Grumpy Cat]

I consider myself somewhat hyper-empathic, actually. It's just that it's impossible to express that empathy. What do I say? If I look them in the eye will they see it?

I know many Aspies could care less. But for me, this trouble expressing empathy is the aspect of Aspergers that I could most prefer to live without. I hate it.

You say you have empathy, but can't express it. Can you express your own feelings of happiness, sadness, etc., or do you just feel the emotion inside but don't show it outwardly?

And if one can't express empathy, how does one express other feelings - like love?

 

[Ylva]

If an NT isn't around people who understand and can show in some way that they understand what the NT is going through, then the NT feels like they are going through the difficult time alone and that no one cares which is even more painful. This is what NTs are talking about when they say they can't feel an "emotional connection" to an Aspie. I still don't know how this can be remedied. It ties in with empathy.

How does one distance themselves from their feelings? Isn't life all about feelings - especially the good ones? Do all Aspies not want to experience their feelings, good or bad? As an NT there is no way for me to turn off my feelings. Like Dr Jekyll said in the movie Mary Riley, "Sadness comes in like the tide". It's hard to understand how Aspies can't communicate nonverbally how they are feeling.

Now you're just being sarcastic.

I didn't say "shut them off". If NTs don't get that emoting is an intimate thing, that's not my problem. Why do you say we can't communicate nonverbally? Did you just up and decide that we can't and that's that, so that you won't even notice if we do?

 

[wyverary]

You say you have empathy, but can't express it. Can you express your own feelings of happiness, sadness, etc., or do you just feel the emotion inside but don't show it outwardly?

And if one can't express empathy, how does one express other feelings - like love?

An interesting question indeed. Some emotions are easy to express, like happiness or anger or what-have-you. Love is an interesting one...if I love someone (and I mean "love" in a platonic way, being asexual aromantic myself) I'm pretty much already comfortable enough with this person to just say outright, "You know, you're really awesome, and I'm glad to have you in my life."

Empathy is different, for whatever reason. I don't know if I have a simple answer for that. Perhaps it comes down, quite simply, to nonverbal communication, or an uncomfortableness or awkwardness of how to precisely word one's expression verbally.

Now you're just being sarcastic.

I didn't say "shut them off". If NTs don't get that emoting is an intimate thing, that's not my problem. Why do you say we can't communicate nonverbally? Did you just up and decide that we can't and that's that, so that you won't even notice if we do?

I don't think sarcasm was her intention; she seems genuinely curious.

 

[Grumpy Cat]

Now you're just being sarcastic.

I didn't say "shut them off". If NTs don't get that emoting is an intimate thing, that's not my problem. Why do you say we can't communicate nonverbally? Did you just up and decide that we can't and that's that, so that you won't even notice if we do?

If it sounds like I'm being sarcastic - I'm not meaning it that way. I took the words "distancing myself" to mean "shutting off" because in my mind in order for me to distance myself from my feelings I have to literally try to shut them off and ignore them.

I'm reading in books that Aspies don't communicate nonverbally with body language and facial expressions. Am I wrong? My friend told me his facial expressions don't always go with what he is feeling. I'm actually wanting to know if there is a way Aspies show what they're feeling nonverbally. I also read that all Aspies are different so maybe some can show their emotions nonverbally.

Also, I know not to do any sarcasm here and I don't. If I say something that bothers you, ask me because its probably a miscommunication.

 

[Flinty]

As an Aspie, what is your preferred way of communication (telephone, text, email, person) and why? Also, why are the other ways of communication not to your liking?

Definitely writing over speaking, because editing is tech. Also, phones are practically designed to make it sound like an emergency at the receiving end.

I HAVE ANOTHER ASPIE QUESTION TOO:

If an Aspie has a friend or significant other, is the Aspie interested in their friend's/sig other's interests and hobbies and what is generally going on in the other person's life or does the Aspie care just about their own interests, hobbies and life?

Basically, I keep these things on file in my brain somewhere and otherwise don't worry about their interests too much otherwise.

 

[Ylva]

If it sounds like I'm being sarcastic - I'm not meaning it that way. I took the words "distancing myself" to mean "shutting off" because in my mind in order for me to distance myself from my feelings I have to literally try to shut them off and ignore them.
…
Also, I know not to do any sarcasm here and I don't. If I say something that bothers you, ask me because its probably a miscommunication.

Okay, I will remember.

I mean more like you feel them, but you don't care about them. Guess I have that from Lawrence of Arabia. I am far less successful at it than the character.

I'm reading in books that Aspies don't communicate nonverbally with body language and facial expressions. Am I wrong? My friend told me his facial expressions don't always go with what he is feeling. I'm actually wanting to know if there is a way Aspies show what they're feeling nonverbally. I also read that all Aspies are different so maybe some can show their emotions nonverbally.

Facial muscles are just muscles… Yeah, I don't really know about expressiveness. I recognise the tension patterns when I feel sad; sometimes that's how I know I feel sad. (This is why I think Bella Swan was aspie; she keeps realising things like that she is crying or shaking. Or maybe she just had alexithymia too, with or without the authors knowledge. But I digress…)

When I express my feelings to others, it often feels like acting, no matter how spontaneous it is. It's not that my muscles don't respond to what I feel or expect to feel, it's just that they don't always follow the regular patterns. I think body language is a form of full-body sign-language that people just learn growing up, along with their mother tongue. Much like with French (my third language) I understand more than I speak. To be fair, I have a quite mild form of autism, so getting by is what I do.

Stims. Stims are the most nonverbal expressions I have. I won't tell you what mine mean, but they're mostly finger movements. (So maybe that's why I think of body language as sign language.)

 

[King_Oni]

I HAVE ANOTHER ASPIE QUESTION TOO:

If an Aspie has a friend or significant other, is the Aspie interested in their friend's/sig other's interests and hobbies and what is generally going on in the other person's life or does the Aspie care just about their own interests, hobbies and life?

If they were interests I have no interest in at all, I most likely wouldn't care. I've got enough interests to keep myself busy. Luckily, my girlfriend is the same (but then again, she's on the spectrum as well).I know about my girlfriends interests/hobbies and she knows about mine. Clearly we don't know all the ins and outs and that's fine. I'd like to keep it to myself and so does she. I'm not visiting the forums for her hobbies, nor does she visit the ones for my hobbies. We just don't have much business; I think it would seem to much as if we are checking up on each other.

On the other hand; I share a lot of interests and hobbies with my girlfriend from before we met and eventually we actually got together through a mutual interest in a lot of things. Perhaps it's just less hassle for the both of us. Getting involved in something that doesn't really matter to either of us might just be less appealing. I probably am lucky in that my girlfriend works in a gaming store that sells card and boardgames, one of my interests, so she's a bit aware of the ins and outs on that. But then again it's an interest we both share. A difference in interest might be music. While we can both appreciate the same genres/styles, I'm really not sold on certain artists and vice versa. We're not going to haul each other to concerts because we want to hang out.

As for what's going on in each others life; well, obviously we both care a bit about each others lives. It being long distance kinda limits how much I do and should know probably. I mean, I might know she's been there and there and maybe had an interview, but if she wouldn't tell me where exactly she went I wouldn't have a clue about travelling and such. Alas, that comes with about 100 miles of distance in between us. I guess with distance comes a bit of planning when someone has time to meet up, so it's somewhat important to know what's going on in each others lives.

So maybe not exactly the answer you're looking for though; but I think the question by itself wouldn't even be that trivial, as I would most likely look for a partner who shares interests to start with.

 

[Grumpy Cat]

Okay, I will remember.

I mean more like you feel them, but you don't care about them. Guess I have that from Lawrence of Arabia. I am far less successful at it than the character.
Facial muscles are just muscles… Yeah, I don't really know about expressiveness. I recognise the tension patterns when I feel sad; sometimes that's how I know I feel sad. (This is why I think Bella Swan was aspie; she keeps realising things like that she is crying or shaking. Or maybe she just had alexithymia too, with or without the authors knowledge. But I digress…)
When I express my feelings to others, it often feels like acting, no matter how spontaneous it is. It's not that my muscles don't respond to what I feel or expect to feel, it's just that they don't always follow the regular patterns. I think body language is a form of full-body sign-language that people just learn growing up, along with their mother tongue. Much like with French (my third language) I understand more than I speak. To be fair, I have a quite mild form of autism, so getting by is what I do.

Stims. Stims are the most nonverbal expressions I have. I won't tell you what mine mean, but they're mostly finger movements. (So maybe that's why I think of body language as sign language.)

"Facial muscles are just muscles… Yeah, I don't really know about expressiveness. I recognise the tension patterns when I feel sad; sometimes that's how I know I feel sad."
I'm the opposite - I feel the feeling of sadness first then I cry. Same with happiness - I get the feeling then my face follows. Anger - I think for a second and process if I should be angry then I get the feeling and my face follows.
Wyv said how he feels and expresses love, do you feel love the same way?

 

[Rudy Schmidt]

ANOTHER ASPIE QUESTION:

As an Aspie, what is your preferred way of communication (telephone, text, email, person) and why? Also, why are the other ways of communication not to your liking?

I absolutely hate talking on the phone. I can't understand what people are saying too well, and I keep interrupting them and they keep interrupting me and it's a mess. It's like trying to drive with one eye closed and one half-open.

Just today I had a bit of a man-trum because my boss kept calling my voicemail and texting me and telling me he wanted to speak to me, and I'm thinking "well please, do so!" But he kept being vague. Even when I asked if everything was okay, he wouldn't answer me. Eventually I had to drop everything and drive to him so he could spend a couple of minutes telling me about a change in the work rotor. What a song and dance. A text message would have been fine. I'm told that it's polite to talk face-to-face instead of over text, but when there's actual travel involved, it just seems like to much hassle.

I prefer email or text, to answer your question. That way I can take my time answering. When it's face-to-face, I feel put on the spot and pressured to give an immediate response when I may want to mull it over for a minute or two.

 

[zurb]

if an Aspie and an NT are close and the Aspie is aware the NT is feeling a certain way, how does the Aspie communicate to the NT that they do understand what the NT is feeling? (This is one of the biggest communication problems NTs say they have with Aspies - feelings not being validated leaving the NT feeling isolated and alone.)

I think I read recently somewhere (maybe here?) that aspies tend to be quick at picking up other people's emotions. The trouble is they may not be able to identify it, or know what to do with it. It just feels uncomfortable. This certainly seems true for me. I'm learning to repeat back to my wife what she says she feels.

I think its Tony Attwood (I'm too lazy to go check) that gives a classic example. He was with a couple as the wife is describing her problems with aspie husband. As she gets more upset, aspie husband walks out. When asked if could not see she was upset, he replied that he was giving her space. That's what he would want, but it's clearly not what she wanted.

I think we probably do respond to emotions in a logical way. But maybe the need is not being clearly communicated. Once the need is clearly communicated, the need can be logically fulfilled. Otherwise, if you don't tell us the need, and we will just do the most logical thing we see to do. If the need is to be acknowledged and hugged, tell us. We can't mind read and most of us don't read between the lines.

 

[Grumpy Cat]

I think I read recently somewhere (maybe here?) that aspies tend to be quick at picking up other people's emotions. The trouble is they may not be able to identify it, or know what to do with it. It just feels uncomfortable. This certainly seems true for me. I'm learning to repeat back to my wife what she says she feels.

I think its Tony Attwood (I'm too lazy to go check) that gives a classic example. He was with a couple as the wife is describing her problems with aspie husband. As she gets more upset, aspie husband walks out. When asked if could not see she was upset, he replied that he was giving her space. That's what he would want, but it's clearly not what she wanted.

I think we probably do respond to emotions in a logical way. But maybe the need is not being clearly communicated. Once the need is clearly communicated, the need can be logically fulfilled. Otherwise, if you don't tell us the need, and we will just do the most logical thing we see to do. If the need is to be acknowledged and hugged, tell us. We can't mind read and most of us don't read between the lines.

That's what I read in this book I was reading too. An NT has to tell their Aspie what they want. I understand that. The thing is if we have to ask another person for how we want or need them to be acting, then their behavior is "forced" and not genuine in our minds (NT).
**All Aspies reading this, if an NT is going through a difficult time such as a death or sickness or anything traumatic, the NT USUALLY doesn't want to go through it alone and will need some support such as your presence, hugs, just the closeness of you being there sitting close to them (not saying anything) and holding their hand or putting your arm around them. They just need to know that you acknowledge their grief.

 

[zurb]

Hmmm, but for the aspie, if it's uninvited it feels very awkward, maybe even fake and manipulative.

 

[Grumpy Cat]

Hmmm, but for the aspie, if it's uninvited it feels very awkward, maybe even fake and manipulative.

Then ask them something like "would you like me to stay with you?" If you say this then it lets them know you care and it just means you will sit with them - no conversation, just your presence and you might need to listen if they want to talk.about their sadness. Just saying something like that is enough to let them know you acknowledge their sadness.

That's just my idea and how I would need support as an NT.