Interpreting Things Literally

[Sparticus]

Dirty Harry! Got a proposition fer ya Harry, be the town Sheriff. $50 bucks a month, a horse and free meals at the saloon.

I didn't want to get involved & I empathize. Heck I started having bad dreams...an NT tells me how to talk.
Hope I didn't cross any boundaries with people here. I keep praying someone learns & adapts from these encounters. But doesn't seem likely. I'm gittin old...when I see someone's photo and realize I've had far more backpacking and camping trips than they have had birthdays.

I know what you're thinking. "Did he fire six shots or only five?" Well, to tell you the truth, in all this excitement I kind of lost track myself. But being as this is a .44 Magnum, the most powerful handgun in the world, and would blow your head clean off, you've got to ask yourself one question: "Do I feel lucky?" Well, today you are lucky cause I'm gonna check my gun at the door and go about my business on this thread peaceable-like.

 

[Ste11aeres]

when I see someone's photo and realize I've had far more backpacking and camping trips than they have had birthdays.

Can't think of many better ways to count your days

 

[Loomis]

Dirty Harry! Got a proposition fer ya Harry, be the town Sheriff. $50 bucks a month, a horse and free meals at the saloon.

I didn't want to get involved & I empathize. Heck I started having bad dreams...an NT tells me how to talk.
Hope I didn't cross any boundaries with people here. I keep praying someone learns & adapts from these encounters. But doesn't seem likely. I'm gittin old...when I see someone's photo and realize I've had far more backpacking and camping trips than they have had birthdays.

Last time I accepted a job of sheriff was in a town called hell. Didn't turn out so good for the town.

 

[Ylva]

Actually, kleptomaniacs take things literally.

 

[Gomendosi]

Moderator Note:

Just to let you know:

Please keep to topic as much as possible.
Arguing is not acceptable, but debate in the context of the topic as has been seen here, is allowed...

Until it becomes a personal attack or any member complains.

Thank you
gomendosi

 

[Myself]

I was struck by the mention of hyperbole. Versatile tool, that. Sometimes it can make humor a bit funnier. Using it in an interesting anecdote can simply be 'poetic license' and is understood as such. It can make sarcasm more obvious. It can also be used to mislead by misstating facts. What sounds worse, "that guy slapped the other guy" or "that guy was beating on the other guy"? In that case, the use of hyperbole (inaccurately portraying facts) makes a pretty strong case for using precise language, don't you think? That can apply to many scenarios.

Statements that are not literal can encompass a wide range of use and abuse. Technically, they are lies. No two ways about it. That's a pet peeve of lots of people; to lie, that is. A distortion of fact is easily rectified. I've done it my whole life. LOOK IT UP. You can't settle the in accuracy in interpersonal communication. The sender thinks it's the truth, only more interesting. The receiver hears it as a lie because reality has been skewed beyond recognition. Inaccuracy is like a pocket knife. It's a very useful daily tool until you stab somebody in the neck with it.

 

[NTWife]

On the other side of the coin, Myself, there's using the literal to lie, too.

For instance:

Your wife asks you, "Are you cheating on me with someone at work?"
You say, "No, I'm not cheating on you with someone at work."
This goes on for several months, this same vein of questioning.

Months later your wife finds out you've been cheating on her for a year with someone you work with. She also doesn't find this out from you, but from the husband of the female you've been sleeping with. Your wife makes the point to you that you lied for months about it.

You then say: I didn't lie. That wasn't what you asked me. I didn't cheat on you with someone at work. I cheated on you with someone I work with but we never did anything at work.

The point is, using "the literal" to mislead and confuse the situation is still a lie, even if the answer given is the literal response.

 

[Ylva]

Okay, that doesn't sound like a classical Aspie… More like a classical sociopath of the manipulative liar variety.

Perhaps making the question as simple as possible would have helped, but if he was determined to keep it from you he would likely have done it anyway.

 

[NTWife]

Okay, that doesn't sound like a classical Aspie… More like a classical sociopath of the manipulative liar variety.

Perhaps making the question as simple as possible would have helped, but if he was determined to keep it from you he would likely have done it anyway.

Truthfully, Ylva, I thought of that and wish it were that simple with my husband. But he's so adept at the "literal" thing and using it to manipulate and distort, it's tough to stay ahead of him. His being an Aspie also makes it hard to get inside his head in anyway to figure out just what it is you need to ask and how. He twists his version of the truth so much...

However, as much as he demands I be "literal", he requires no "literal" in his own speech, using subtleties and shades of gray to assure his reality is the "truth".

 

[Cyanide Lollipop]

Truthfully, Ylva, I thought of that and wish it were that simple with my husband. But he's so adept at the "literal" thing and using it to manipulate and distort, it's tough to stay ahead of him. His being an Aspie also makes it hard to get inside his head in anyway to figure out just what it is you need to ask and how. He twists his version of the truth so much...
.

It's possible that your husband has a personality disorder as a comorbidity to his AS. That is not uncommon. For a straight out AS with no other mental illness, lying is unusual.

For what it's worth, I used to think my ex-husband lied to me too, even though he assured me that he didn't. I used to think that he deliberately did some things to piss me off. Later when I realised that both of us have AS, I realised that I had completely misinterpreted him. Everything that I considered to be a slight against me could be viewed as unintentional and as a result of AS.

I don't think quite so literally as my ex-husband and so his extreme literal interpretation was very frustrating for me. But if I have a problem then it is my responsibility to ask the question in a way that leaves no opportunity for misinterpretation, lying by omission, manipulation of literal translation or anything else.

 

[tree]

"That's a really odd duck"------Yes, I immediately suppose the person is talking about a water fowl. When my son was little he liked for me to tell him my first impressions of what people said. "What did you think at first, Mom?" He found my first impressions amusing. I wasn't trying to think of a funny thing first. It just happens that frequently I understand a statement in a very concrete way and then translate to the intended meaning.

 

[asnlifecoach]

Truthfully, Ylva, I thought of that and wish it were that simple with my husband. But he's so adept at the "literal" thing and using it to manipulate and distort, it's tough to stay ahead of him. His being an Aspie also makes it hard to get inside his head in anyway to figure out just what it is you need to ask and how. He twists his version of the truth so much...

However, as much as he demands I be "literal", he requires no "literal" in his own speech, using subtleties and shades of gray to assure his reality is the "truth".

I would very much like to hear more of this story. This is an unusual situation. I've seen aspie's convince themselves they are right about something simply because no one challenges them, but to be caught in a blatantly dishonest situation. Very rare. I would be less surprised if he just came out and said "I'm cheating on you." Rather than cover it up and keep it a secret. There is more going on here.

 

[jimited]

I also need specificity in instruction. If I'm asked to write up a particular document or set of documents at work, I need parameters so I know I am meeting expectations. If I am asked to write a draft Lesson Plan I set about doing exactly that. I've been designing and developing training courses for many years and know how to do it properly. When I ask for specific information necessary to do the job right, I'm often told that I'm making it too hard, going too deeply into details and so on. That seriously pisses me off. You're asking me to do a job wrong or incompletely. So there is an example of needing specific instruction. Does that make sense to anybody?

I'm the same, I am often told that I am going to deep with details when I am following specified instructions, it is something I have struggled with my college course in engineering.

 

[Sparticus]

Both my father and brother were mechanically inclined. I'm more creative however I have fixed things. Many times when I've read instructions on putting things together or fixing stuff, I noticed the same thing. Either the writer made a mistake or the instructions were lacking and or illogical. Also when I talk to NT's I have to take out my Mar's translation book to understand them...

This is the one item on the aspie list I always figure I don't have, i.e. literal interpretation. Thus, if someone told me I was "barking up the wrong tree", I assure you I would fully understand this is an idiom that means "drawing the wrong conclusion".
However, what I do notice about myself is I require detailed, exact, specific information to be able to understand something. Like the other day I was reading about the effects of a magnetic field and the book stated "this causes the shaft to rotate in an anticlockwise direction". Then, as the explanation progressed, it read, "the shaft continues to rotate in a clockwise direction". This, threw me totally. I don't know what the rest of you think but, in the above, the words "continues to rotate" and "clockwise" indicate there was clockwise rotation at some point before yet the only prior indication of direction was specified as "anticlockwise", not clockwise. So, the term "continues to rotate" baffled me. Personally I think the book is just wrong and the writer made a mistake and I don't see my need for requiring specific information as defective. However, the fact I do need accurate facts and can't seem to guess my way around these explanations may indicate this is what the literal stuff is based upon.
Any of you folks relate to the need the accurate explanations and anyone not understand idioms and may take an idiom literally?

 

[Ste11aeres]

I would very much like to hear more of this story. This is an unusual situation. I've seen aspie's convince themselves they are right about something simply because no one challenges them, but to be caught in a blatantly dishonest situation. Very rare. I would be less surprised if he just came out and said "I'm cheating on you." Rather than cover it up and keep it a secret. There is more going on here.

Let's not start implying that this guy (who most of us have never met) is cheating. Seriously. Let's not imply based on the fact that he has covered up in the past or in the present on smaller matters to mean that he must be cheating now. We could be messing with other people's lives. :unsure:

 

[Rob]

Hi Everyone

I have been busy at our local gas station going through a difficult weekend, the Canada Day weekend. Many travellers had extended holidays and my boss was away at the same time. What convenient timing!! Our cooler flooded, and our pumps were knocked out by a lightning storm for a couple of hours. On some days previously, I had to come in around 1 pm to restock the cooler, top up washer fluid, and clean the bathrooms when the cashier was too busy with customers. On the same days I had to come in and do an actual shift, until midnight.

On a lighter note, my boss told me, "There's cardboard in the Yukon. Could you pull it out and throw it in the bin for me, please?" This statement sounded illogical to me at first.
Cardboard in the Yukon? What is he talking about?

Then later it dawned on me. The Chevy Yukon SUV!! Not the Yukon Territory! Okay, boss, very funny!! I got your message loud and clear (ha-ha-ha very funny). So I opened up his Chevrolet Yukon hatchback door and took out the cardboard and threw it in the bin. Even after the job was done (months ago) I still have memories of it!

Ha, ha! Cardboard in the Yukon! Makes a great song title!!

Rob

 

[tree]

Using literal interpretation as the basis for illustrations makes for funny cartoon strips. I liked the on-line strip "Ed the Head" which featured humor of that type.

 

[NTWife]

Let's not start implying that this guy (who most of us have never met) is cheating. Seriously. Let's not imply based on the fact that he has covered up in the past or in the present on smaller matters to mean that he must be cheating now. We could be messing with other people's lives. :unsure:

No, he actually was cheating on me. For a year.

To further the discussion on it, once he was found out via the tramp's husband when he called our house (he'd found e-mails between them in a personal account she'd created for the sole purpose of maintaining the relationship). STILL, I was told, "He's lying to you." THEN, my husband was presented with copies of e-mails and still, "No, he's created these." THEN, we got the both of them together in the same room and only THEN did he 'fess up and it still took a lot of gas lighting on his part.

However, he still maintains to this day he'd have NEVER cheated on me four times had I just been a better wife. I have an appointment with an attorney next week to end this fiasco of a marriage. The straw that broke the camel's back, for me, was his refusal to keep the kids out of it all, using them as "sounding boards" and attempting to gain their solidarity (Everyone has to love Dad and hate Mom) usually with his "half-truths" and outright lies. He's incredibly manipulative. If you were to ever meet him, you'd think he was the greatest guy in the world. For his family, though, it's living life walking on a tightrope with his keeping us all off balance, all the time. The result of all this is, our youngest son told us yesterday he couldn't take being in the middle of the fights. Seems every time we had a fight, my husband would call or text our youngest to vent to him about how awful I am. He's been using our youngest the most as his pseudo-counselor for about three or four years and our son can't take any more of it. He's changed his cell phone number and is refusing any and all contact with us until he feels he's got enough counseling under his belt to manage it. That was another major reason I'm divorcing. I'm also incredibly angry I let it go this far, that I didn't do more to protect my kids from him.

Our marriage counselor feels what he's doing is emotionally abusive and I tend to agree now that I've begun to get my wits about me, after 21 years of marriage. I think this is the hardest decision I've ever had to make. However, yesterday, I went into the counselor's office with him and asked for a separation while he did his individual counseling because I couldn't take any more of it and keep my sanity. Since the kids all moved out, he's gotten SO much worse and it's all directed at me, not having any buffers to temper it on one person or the other. The counselor thought it was a good idea but my husband told us he didn't feel he needed counseling since I was the one having the problems, not him. He told me he's comfortable with his AS diagnosis and didn't need "help" with it. He believes I'm the one who needs to do all the adjusting and learning to live with it all, thus, I should go to counseling w/o him. His temper tantrums are happening more often, the threats of physical abuse are becoming more frightening and I feel it's just a matter of time before there's a headline about me being killed.

I did tell the counselor I wanted to get into individual counseling but it was to be in conjunction with seeing an attorney to file for divorce. I have an appt with the attorney next week, I have an appt with the counselor two days later. I've been so focused for so long on "saving" him and "fixing" him and "getting him the help he needs" I lost myself somewhere along the way and I find I'm nothing like the joyful, laughing, dancing through the house singing person I once was. I'd like to be that person again and forget who I am now. Being angry all the time, living with this man for as long as I did, my health is precarious and I deserve better than what I've gotten.

 

[Ste11aeres]

No, he actually was cheating on me. For a year.

To further the discussion on it, once he was found out via the tramp's husband when he called our house (he'd found e-mails between them in a personal account she'd created for the sole purpose of maintaining the relationship). STILL, I was told, "He's lying to you." THEN, my husband was presented with copies of e-mails and still, "No, he's created these." THEN, we got the both of them together in the same room and only THEN did he 'fess up and it still took a lot of gas lighting on his part.

However, he still maintains to this day he'd have NEVER cheated on me four times had I just been a better wife. I have an appointment with an attorney next week to end this fiasco of a marriage. The straw that broke the camel's back, for me, was his refusal to keep the kids out of it all, using them as "sounding boards" and attempting to gain their solidarity (Everyone has to love Dad and hate Mom) usually with his "half-truths" and outright lies. He's incredibly manipulative. If you were to ever meet him, you'd think he was the greatest guy in the world. For his family, though, it's living life walking on a tightrope with his keeping us all off balance, all the time. The result of all this is, our youngest son told us yesterday he couldn't take being in the middle of the fights. Seems every time we had a fight, my husband would call or text our youngest to vent to him about how awful I am. He's been using our youngest the most as his pseudo-counselor for about three or four years and our son can't take any more of it. He's changed his cell phone number and is refusing any and all contact with us until he feels he's got enough counseling under his belt to manage it. That was another major reason I'm divorcing. I'm also incredibly angry I let it go this far, that I didn't do more to protect my kids from him.

Our marriage counselor feels what he's doing is emotionally abusive and I tend to agree now that I've begun to get my wits about me, after 21 years of marriage. I think this is the hardest decision I've ever had to make. However, yesterday, I went into the counselor's office with him and asked for a separation while he did his individual counseling because I couldn't take any more of it and keep my sanity. Since the kids all moved out, he's gotten SO much worse and it's all directed at me, not having any buffers to temper it on one person or the other. The counselor thought it was a good idea but my husband told us he didn't feel he needed counseling since I was the one having the problems, not him. He told me he's comfortable with his AS diagnosis and didn't need "help" with it. He believes I'm the one who needs to do all the adjusting and learning to live with it all, thus, I should go to counseling w/o him. His temper tantrums are happening more often, the threats of physical abuse are becoming more frightening and I feel it's just a matter of time before there's a headline about me being killed.

I did tell the counselor I wanted to get into individual counseling but it was to be in conjunction with seeing an attorney to file for divorce. I have an appt with the attorney next week, I have an appt with the counselor two days later. I've been so focused for so long on "saving" him and "fixing" him and "getting him the help he needs" I lost myself somewhere along the way and I find I'm nothing like the joyful, laughing, dancing through the house singing person I once was. I'd like to be that person again and forget who I am now. Being angry all the time, living with this man for as long as I did, my health is precarious and I deserve better than what I've gotten.

I can tell you, and I speak from the heart, dragging many many people into your marital problems by complaining will not help. In fact, it will make it worse, as complaining drags your spirit down, despite the short term high from hearing people tell you you've been wronged by him. There are people it is appropriate to talk to. (Such as the counselor.)There are such people. But talking to huge groups of people (us) makes it worse. I know he was cheating on you. In my post I did not deny the past. You probably should have separated then. I simply did not think all of us on this forum should be dragged into it, or into speculation about the present (not that you were speculating, i was just afraid some of the other posts might slip into it) nor into insults directed at all Aspies (which most of us are.)

 

[Sparticus]

NTWife I understand you are upset & for you this is an issue that is close to your heart. May you kindly consider reposting this on the dating & relationships forum here. I think that might be more appropriate per where this conversation is going I might be wrong.

Love, Relationships and Dating

No, he actually was cheating on me. For a year.

To further the discussion on it, once he was found out via the tramp's husband when he called our house (he'd found e-mails between them in a personal account she'd created for the sole purpose of maintaining the relationship). STILL, I was told, "He's lying to you." THEN, my husband was presented with copies of e-mails and still, "No, he's created these." THEN, we got the both of them together in the same room and only THEN did he 'fess up and it still took a lot of gas lighting on his part.

However, he still maintains to this day he'd have NEVER cheated on me four times had I just been a better wife. I have an appointment with an attorney next week to end this fiasco of a marriage. The straw that broke the camel's back, for me, was his refusal to keep the kids out of it all, using them as "sounding boards" and attempting to gain their solidarity (Everyone has to love Dad and hate Mom) usually with his "half-truths" and outright lies. He's incredibly manipulative. If you were to ever meet him, you'd think he was the greatest guy in the world. For his family, though, it's living life walking on a tightrope with his keeping us all off balance, all the time. The result of all this is, our youngest son told us yesterday he couldn't take being in the middle of the fights. Seems every time we had a fight, my husband would call or text our youngest to vent to him about how awful I am. He's been using our youngest the most as his pseudo-counselor for about three or four years and our son can't take any more of it. He's changed his cell phone number and is refusing any and all contact with us until he feels he's got enough counseling under his belt to manage it. That was another major reason I'm divorcing. I'm also incredibly angry I let it go this far, that I didn't do more to protect my kids from him.

Our marriage counselor feels what he's doing is emotionally abusive and I tend to agree now that I've begun to get my wits about me, after 21 years of marriage. I think this is the hardest decision I've ever had to make. However, yesterday, I went into the counselor's office with him and asked for a separation while he did his individual counseling because I couldn't take any more of it and keep my sanity. Since the kids all moved out, he's gotten SO much worse and it's all directed at me, not having any buffers to temper it on one person or the other. The counselor thought it was a good idea but my husband told us he didn't feel he needed counseling since I was the one having the problems, not him. He told me he's comfortable with his AS diagnosis and didn't need "help" with it. He believes I'm the one who needs to do all the adjusting and learning to live with it all, thus, I should go to counseling w/o him. His temper tantrums are happening more often, the threats of physical abuse are becoming more frightening and I feel it's just a matter of time before there's a headline about me being killed.

I did tell the counselor I wanted to get into individual counseling but it was to be in conjunction with seeing an attorney to file for divorce. I have an appt with the attorney next week, I have an appt with the counselor two days later. I've been so focused for so long on "saving" him and "fixing" him and "getting him the help he needs" I lost myself somewhere along the way and I find I'm nothing like the joyful, laughing, dancing through the house singing person I once was. I'd like to be that person again and forget who I am now. Being angry all the time, living with this man for as long as I did, my health is precarious and I deserve better than what I've gotten.