how to act normal around nonautistic/allistic/normal girls?

[apolloidolsice]

It would probably be easier if you just told people what you want them to say then. I removed my replies since they weren't good enough for you. Several people took the time to reply to you and tried to be helpful, you ignored all of them. I suggest you start with a "thank you" next time, instead of complaning. Good luck.

this is a forum site. it's made for people to answer each other, people answering my post isn't unique or them being nice to me. and i said what i wanted. People have just decided to go the "love yourself" answer route instead of teaching me to mask

 

[tree]

@apolloidolsice

Oh.
You want to learn to be a good faker.
OK.

 

[Judge]

Perhaps this is what the OP might be looking for.

Forget all the judgmental comments. In the end, masking is just a matter of mimicry and diplomacy, done to survive rather than only to deceive. Especially if you are in an office environment surrounded by predators er uh... competitors. Those who may be euphemistically be referred to as your co-workers. Where socialization isn't the primary goal as is keeping your job by getting along with people you are ultimately competing with.

So what's the catch? The catch is that you mask when and where you must, and perhaps most of all with whom. For some you can be yourself. For others , not masking may have lasting consequences.

So how do you go about masking to leisurely socialize with NTs? -You don't. That's where you inevitably must let down your shields, otherwise you'll never have a genuine relationship with someone you may care about.

Conversely don't assume your closest relatives automatically fit this description. Mine certainly don't. I have come to the conclusion that I'll have to mask myself in their presence for the remainder of my life, or that point when they simply stop interacting with me altogether.

mimicry

1. The act, practice, or art of mimicking.
2. An instance of mimicking.
3. The resemblance of one organism to another or to an object in its surroundings for concealment and protection from predators.

That the most basic way to accomplish masking is to copy what you observe with NTs interacting with one another. Be prepared to engage in meaningless small talk. To compliment someone for what they have said, to make a more favorable impression. And above all, do more observing than talking. Don't just blurt out exactly what you are thinking whether brutally critical or mildly frank. More often than not that can be the "kiss of death" for us.

Those are the easy things to consider. More complex is trying not to look stressed when in reality you are just that. Where non-critical socialization is just plain alien to you, for better or for worse. And that the process of masking for many of us comes at a cost emotionally and physically. An acceptance that it can be exhausting, and not something you want to attempt on a 24/7 basis.

Or say what you will....and get your ass kicked more often for rather unimportant reasons that may never make much sense to you. A choice most of us have short of being perpetually surrounded by "shiny-happy-people-holding -hands" that reflect more of a social myth than a social reality.

 

[Rodafina]

Forget all the judgmental comments

I didn’t see any of those here.

 

[Judge]

I didn’t see any of those here.

We'll just have to agree to disagree. Masking isn't evil. But at times it can be necessary to keep the peace and stay out of harm's way whether emotionally or physically.

Saying what we mean and meaning what we say does not always go over so well in the NT world. A key reason for diplomacy on all kinds of levels, and not simply reserved for matters of state.

So we improvise. Our bad!

Though I still must reiterate that if you really wish to form a special bond with someone on a very personal level, that's when you leave your masking at the door, IMO. That much I suspect most of us agree upon.

 

[Kavigant]

can i get actual answers and not what you'd hear in a wholesome family 90s sitcom?

I can empathize because being judged, being othered, and being alone can be so incredibly, incredibly painful. I never had any idea that I might be on the spectrum, but I certainly had so much loneliness and pain with the only explanation being that I was a weirdo.

My solution was to mask, and I turned out to be damned good at it. I went from being the class outcast and weirdo to being the class clown. I grew my hair long, started smoking (this was the 1980's) and girls became interested in me. I was naturally skinny due to an eating disorder that I didn't know I had, and I found that I was able to get laid and even find a wife. (I still remember my fantasic English teacher who wrote note on one of my report cards which said that my grades had fallen because I had "become one of the boys.")

But all my relationships fell apart and my social ineptness guaranteed that I emotionally hurt many of my partners (despite being, by all accounts, phenomenal in bed). The pain I caused others due to my ignorance still pains me decades later. I have even contacted some of my exes in order to apologize to them once I realized the pain I had caused them.

So, I won't force some 90's sitcom garbage on you. It's up to you what you do in order to make/keep friends. I honestly don't know what I'd do if I had it all to do over again. I'd like to think that I'd just say to hell with anyone who didn't accept me at my most authentic, but who knows.

Do what you can live with. Do what gives you the best cost/benefit ratio. Just be aware that folks on a board with an autism/mental health focus will give you the healthiest and perhaps most ideal answer - and that answer is to be your most genuine self. That's a damn good answer, but not everyone is able/willing to go that route at this stage in their lives. I've screwed up too much to judge anyone else.

 

[Hypnalis]

this is a forum site. it's made for people to answer each other, people answering my post isn't unique or them being nice to me. and i said what i wanted. People have just decided to go the "love yourself" answer route instead of teaching me to mask

The posts you made before the one I quoted here didn't ask for help to improve your masking. You asked for a magical solution to a very complex problem.

Masking maps one individual's thoughts and behaviors onto an important aspect of their local human society.
It's a big topic. The complexity and effort is similar to learning a foreign language. And there's no system for describing masking, or for teaching it.
Which also means that it's not possible to select a few techniques to fit a specific requirement.

You need to engage in the learning process. You'll probably need to lead it (that may sound like a contradiction, but it's not). And if you can't resolve what I said about your "leading" the learning process, you probably need to learn something about the ideal relationship between teacher and student.

 

[Masked Man]

This might sound like a weird reply but to me it sounds like what you're basically looking for is how to play a more stereotypical gender role - one that doesn't come naturally to you.

I don't have any specific suggestions but could you try to view some videos on Youtube that are either for women looking for makeup/behavior tips or - and this is the weird one - maybe look at some tips that are designed for men who are transitioning.

I make that last one because not too long ago when I was traveling I stayed at an AirBnB and the regular business of the host was guiding men who were transitioning from male to female and teaching them how to dress/act/speak, etc., in a more stereotypically feminine manner. It was really interesting to talk to her and also some of the people she was working with.

 

[Judge]

Good points raised about what the actual intent of the OP may be. "Normal" in the context of being Neurotypical, or "normal" in a context of simply being more relaxed around someone they want to know more? Personally I try not to use terms like "normal", as they ultimately mean different things to different people.

But as other posted, you're in an area where there is no specific methodologies when it comes to socialization or courtship. Probably compounded by those of us who either were a disaster at dating, or who eschewed that social ritual altogether. Relying on making friends with a remote possibility of such a friendship blossoming into something more. The only that in my case actually worked when it came to romantic relationships.

Masking for pragmatic reasons like work is one thing, doing so for romance could be self-defeating. In as much as I have masked over the years even before I knew why it was always based on more pragmatic interactions with others. When it came to friends I could be more relaxed and let all those defenses down. Having a better chance in a few instances where friends became lovers.

Yet when I think about how they happened, I can't say there was any particular or methodical way I went about it. Yeah, it's extremely complicated in that regard...no simple or concise explanations.

 

[apolloidolsice]

sorry if i was rude. should i delete this thread? it seemed to not have gone my way and made people upset

 

[Rodafina]

it seemed to not have gone my way and made people upset

I wonder what you are seeing in the responses that makes you think people are upset?

The advice given here may be valuable to others even if it’s not useful to you right now. I don’t think you should delete it. Maybe asking a different question in a new thread would bring more satisfying answers to you.

 

[Ronald Zeeman]

I'm in no way upset, just a bit confused. when I joined this site, I had no idea what masking was realized for the first time I'm an extravert parading around as an introvert. Not the way you want to live your life. As I make friends at parties and get more comfortable my natural exuberance comes out. And yes, they like me. I've always had fun talking to the women.

 

[Kavigant]

With all of the communications issues many folks with autism have, it amazes me that so many good conversations and good discussions take place on this site. That kind of peaceful and meaningful communication, in my opinion, requires that we all extend a lot of grace to each other.

* Don't assume the worst if someone seems annoyed, angry, or hostile. That may just be their autistic bluntness. Or maybe they aren't communicating exactly what they intend. Every day, I keep learning how I have been unintentionally miscommunicating with others without even realizing it.

* Remember to speak to everyone here the way you'd want neurotypicals to speak to you.

(These are just my thoughts. None of these comments are directed at any particular person either in this thread or any other; nor are they meant to criticize anyone. They are just the general principles I am trying to keep in mind when I think that someone may be criticizing me.)

 

[apolloidolsice]

UPDATE: i hung out with her, unmasking and she didn't react neg.

 

[Rodafina]

i hung out with her, unmasking and she didn't react neg

I hope you had fun and were able to enjoy your time together. Friends are important when we can manage having them.

Thanks for the update.