Boundaries are Reasonable

[Darkkin]

Straight up, point blank setting boundaries with friends, family, and coworkers is acceptable. It is also one of the biggest challenges of actualized self care.

As autistics, knowing that we struggle with social skills, how many of us have become habitual people pleasers in order to compensate?

Don't want to go to the movie? It's okay. Don't want to drive fourteen hours across two states to help a sibling move ten miles down the road? (True story, she's still mad about it.).

It is reasonable to point out the fact that their request is presumptuous and unreasonable. It was the first time anyone said anything about her attitude toward others to her face. It was a reality check that needed to be voiced and brought an uncomfortable truth into focus.

Requests come in all shapes and sizes. Most are doable and ultimately reasonable, but there are times when you need down time or just cannot do something. Sometimes you don't want to do something. It is reasonable to say no.

You learn pretty quick where you stand with people when you tell them no. If they respect the boundaries, they respect you. If they don't, take notice because it is a sign they take you and your time for granted. You can learn a lot about a person when you set a reasonable boundary and enforce it.

What are your thoughts on the subject?

 

[Magna]

Excellent topic. Great advice.

It took the Covid pandemic (ie forced isolation which prevented extended family from inviting themselves over to our house regularly for stressful mealtimes, etc) and therapy for me to learn two things: 1) Tow members of my extended family have zero boundaries. 2) Like you said, @Darkkin , healthy boundaries are not something to be ashamed of wanting to have for yourself.

I also learned that I'm not responsible for ensuring that someone else's feelings aren't hurt if I assert a healthy boundary for myself. Meaning, if I assert a healthy boundary for myself and the other person is upset by that, they'll get over it and that's really for them to deal with; it's not my obligation to change just so they don't feel bad. There are two reasons for this: 1) We must all learn to deal with disappointment as much as we must all learn to respect other people's boundaries. 2) It's common that people can exploit and manipulate in order to get their way and to the detriment of other's needs and feelings.

Bottom line, each person's needs (ie heathy and respectful) are just as important as another person's needs.

 

[Taylor Baker]

Ugh...

Recently, I wanted to talk to someone about their insights on this one video game. I voiced my objections in the way this game was advertised, and I earned insult after insult for it. I was told that I needed to learn "how to take it before I dished it;" and incredibly bewildering response especially after I told them they were being incredibly rude. I went to forum to vent about it, and suddenly everyone started to call me mentally disturbed.

This is what I said in the forum, paraphrased because I don't remember every detail:
"I'm sorry that setting up my own boundaries wounds your fragile ego. I'm sorry that trying to reason with you is tantamount to violating your rights."

Seriously, the whole section of "Serious Discussions" was put on lock just because of that.

 

[Darkkin]

Arguing with strangers on the internet is not logical. Point blank, it is an exercise in futility. Trolls are a species known to inhabit the space. A reasonable boundary is knowing when to walk away.

If someone is rude once, they will probably repeat the exercise especially under the guise of internet anonymity. It is the choice of doing what is right, (walking away) or doing what is easy, (joining in mud slinging).

Not advice, merely an observation. Patterns in behaviour are very easy to spot.

 

[Fino]

Thanks for the advice! I tend to say no to most things, so people have come to know to not ask me things very frequently, other than my mom.

 

[KimS]

Yes, I've recently learned how important it is to establish healthy boundaries in families. My life would be a lot easier if i had learned that in my youth.

 

[Darkkin]

Thanks for the advice! I tend to say no to most things, so people have come to know to not ask me things very frequently, other than my mom.

For my mom, grandparents, or best friend, I would move the world because they have always been there for me.

 

[Gerald Wilgus]

I reached adulthood with little agency, having lost myself trying to please everyone. That never worked to relieve my lonliness. It took work regaining my agency with a lot of mistakes made, but eventually being able to set clear boundaries worked for me. And I found that with being able to advocate for myself, when I met a special woman, feeling secure enough to be vulnerable, letting her through my physical and emotional boundaries, made our intimacy special.

 

[Aspychata]

Now l have great boundaries and l feel good about standing up. However, it was a deep toxic people pleaser pit that l pulled myself out of. Since hanging out my boundaries, l now noticed another change. I respond less to people's jabs, remarks, insults. You can say what you want because l stated my boundary and you are upset and that's on you. You can't take me down just because l have said "no".

The minute you give up your boundaries, you are just asking for people/trolls to mess with you.

Don't be a people pleasing sheeple. (Say this 5 times really fast).

 

[Darkkin]

Setting and enforcing boundaries can help strengthen one's sense of self, clarifying whose emotions are whose. They help us see what blocks belong to us, and what ones we are borrowing. It is easy to borrow anxiety, pessimism, and negativity without even being aware that we are doing it. We often reflect the emotions of those closest to us.

One really surprising thing I learned about myself after my older sister left for college, is I tend to be a reluctant optimist. I find contentment in spite of myself. I was borrowing blocks from my sister's pile without realising what was happening until the source was removed from my environment.

My sister is the oldest and the first of us, but she has never been conciliatory or considerate toward others. If it wasn't her way, it was wrong. Fundamentally that attitude was wrong and unfair, but it wasn't a boundary anyone challenged for a very long time. And it was a boundary that needed to be challenged and reestablished.

 

[Bolletje]

I’m working really hard to set boundaries because I’ve always been a people pleaser too. Two years ago I went on a family holiday with my parents and my younger sister (for the first time in 20 years).
It was not a pleasant holiday because I found out that my opinion wasn’t really listened to and I kept being steamrolled, especially by my sister. And me trying to stand my ground and set my boundaries was interpreted as me being difficult. Why? Because I usually just went along with everything in the past, because I didn’t feel like getting bullied into whatever my parents/sister wanted to do so it was easier to just go along with it. I’ve been practicing my boundary setting for two years, so we’ll see how the next holiday (in a month) turns out.

 

[Gerald Wilgus]

They help us see what blocks belong to us, and what ones we are borrowing. It is easy to borrow anxiety, pessimism, and negativity without even being aware that we are doing it.

My mother was a very fearful person and I think I learned that. I never stretched my boundaries and while I yearned to do outdoor activities, I never had anybody to teach me the skills. Finally being on my own I broke free and facing some old anxieties about competence I learned things like running whitewater in an open canoe, up to Class IV. I learned not to be fearful.

 

[Callistemon]

You learn pretty quick where you stand with people when you tell them no. If they respect the boundaries, they respect you. If they don't, take notice because it is a sign they take you and your time for granted. You can learn a lot about a person when you set a reasonable boundary and enforce it.

Indeed.

I've spent a fair bit of today dealing with the fallout of setting a firm boundary on an entitled and rude past guest, and it's nice to be back in a universe where people believe in ground rules, personal boundaries and good manners.

Said guest broke several house rules, and when I asked him to stop breaking our house rules, told me I was "in a mood" - this is a guy who'd been in the private areas of our house without our presence or permission and helped himself to food in our fridge, and who had stressed out our dog by not staying away from her sleeping area as requested, and then eye-rolled me when I asked him to back off the dog. Needless to say, there's explicit rules about not entering the private areas of our house uninvited and about respecting the dog's sleeping area by staying well away from it, but apparently he felt they didn't apply to him, and that it was fine to be rude to me about that.

He got the option of agreeing to stick to our house rules and treating me respectfully for the rest of his stay, or to check out early and receive a refund for the balance of his booking. He had the afternoon to think about it and decided to check out, then sent me a rude PM threatening me with a lawsuit. Here's someone who hasn't learnt to accept responsibility for his own behaviour. And someone who has shown me he has no real respect for other people.

Most of our farmstay guests are really lovely, and enjoyable to host. But you do get the odd one that's not, and it's always that they think the clearly posted house rules they agreed to when booking don't apply to them and that they can be rude to people in their own house.

 

[_eri_bellehumeur]

Very well put. Also, it is amazing to me that your sister thought that her request was even reasonable to begin with, nevermind to be upset about when you obviously refused.

I am definitely guilty of overriding my own needs to make things more comfortable or convenient for others- it's something I still struggle with. When I first started being mindful of my own needs, I just started cutting people out of my life without a word if they consistently pushed or challenged them. My circle is a lot smaller now, lol

 

[LuxLuca]

I feel like a great way to ease into setting boundaries is to start saying "let me think about it" when it's something you don't feel like doing but aren't sure if you should do anyway.

It gives you time to consider and is easier to defend (imo) then a hard no. I say this because usually when someone has issues setting boundaries and starts drawing them anyway, people need to adjust when they're suddenly being told no (even if it's absolutely justified).

I do feel a bit troubled about how to explain the reason 'why not'. I get the sense that people don't always understand that some things, like driving for hours, can be very taxing for me when it's relaxing for them. It's very annoying to draw a line, explain that you're overstimulated and then not taken seriously + insulted.

 

[Callistemon]

Hello and welcome, @LuxLuca!

That's a great strategy - saying you'll think about it. Gives you time to prepare a response if you're not used to setting boundaries yet etc. Also lets some time elapse and expectations perhaps moderate a bit in the other person/s.

Explanations: I personally like the take that you don't owe anyone an explanation for why you say no, and certainly you don't owe anyone an apology. Other people don't own you or your time and energy (and even at work, there's whether it's in the job description or fair compared to colleagues). If you offer an explanation it's because you're choosing to; I like the rule of thumb not to give more than one reason why you said no (and zero is perfectly fine), and to keep that really short, and if necessary, repeat what you said in the first place with a full stop on it. Then - discussion over. Next!

"I prefer not to" is a perfectly valid, and short, response.

 

[LuxLuca]

"I prefer not to" is a perfectly valid, and short, response.

As much as I agree and wish to stick with just that, I cannot imagine that working out. I think I might have the wrong sort of people around me for that.. they're all very insecure.

Thank you very much for the compliment, I didn't realise that the waiting time could also have an effect on the individual that asked! That's very cool!

 

[Callistemon]

You're not responsible for their insecurities, @LuxLuca - they are. Your boundaries belong to you, and not to others.

By working out, do you mean avoiding upsetting others? Consequences of their upset on you, etc?

 

[LuxLuca]

By working out, do you mean avoiding upsetting others? Consequences of their upset on you, etc?

A little I suppose, it's not something I like doing (upsetting someone). A bigger part is them not respecting or understanding my boundary and starting a discussion about it anyway. Because I come across as rather put together because I'm verbally strong I tend to get dismissed rather easily if I mention any kind of disability. The discussion ends up taking even more energy from me.

I know it's not my responsibility but it affects me regardless. Picking my words carefully tends to cost less energy, even if it's slower.

 

[paloftoon]

I have a hard time saying "no" sometimes. Sometimes, I might ask a person to initiate something because we don't hang out in like forever and there are all kinds of excuses and I'm always asking. And then if it's not fun when I am able to hang out with them, it's like what's the point.

Some people on dating apps, after two weeks of chatting or if they ask me about something like how do I like to do (fun stuff), I'm okay answer them. But then I also escalate the level of communication. I ask them if they want to meet or if they are too far away, for a video chat. If they aren't okay with either, then I say "no" and move on.

It's good to say "no", but just make sure you're considering give and take too and giving a person a chance to meet each other on a good level. Like maybe you do want to meet sometimes, but not in what they want to do. There has to be enough give and take.

I don't expect to like every single little thing either, but there needs to be some give and take and a certain amount of respect and dignity offered and given.