Why is aspergers considered a "disability"

[the_tortoise]

I would be curious if there is any specific data on this. Just from personal observation I would say people with high functioning autism at least, do seem to be more intelligent on average. I really don't have experience with move severe cases. These forums alone, I would say folks on here tend to sound more well written and intelligent than the general population on average.

High functioning autism is, by definition, autism with an average or above average IQ score. (Not everyone uses functioning labels this way, but this is the only standardized definition I'm aware of and it's the one used in research settings.)

To make a fair/valid comparison of IQ at the group level between HFASDers and non-autistic people you'd have to look only at non-autistic people with the same range of IQ scores -- not the whole general population.

It's meaningless to say that a group that has been selected on the basis of higher IQ has a higher IQ than the general population that has not been selected on the basis of IQ.

If your definition of intelligence goes beyond IQ scores (which would be fantastic, in my opinion) I'm not sure you'll find any data.

There are studies that show autistic people are more skilled at certain types of cognition or certain tasks, but that's not the same as saying autistic people (or HF-autistic people specifically) are more intelligent than non-autistic people, overall/in general. There are also studies that show autistic people are less skilled at certain types of cognition or certain tasks.

 

[dragoncat16]

"High functioning" refers more to the amount of support a person needs in day-to-day life than actual IQ. There are some very bright people on the spectrum who nevertheless need continuous support, and there are some with a lower IQ who are able to live independently just fine.

 

[the_tortoise]

"High functioning" refers more to the amount of support a person needs in day-to-day life than actual IQ. There are some very bright people on the spectrum who nevertheless need continuous support, and there are some with a lower IQ who are able to live independently just fine.

From everything I've seen, that sort of definition is not a single definition but many, many definitions.

In all the time I've spent trying to understand what people mean in concrete, real-world terms when they say "high/mid/low functioning" (i.e. behavior, specific abilities, specific difficulties/impairments, support needs) all I have ever found is disagreement -- people's definitions are all over the map.

By most definitions I'm in two or more functioning levels at once.....maybe most autistics have more uniform abilities than I do, I don't know....but I do know that it's not rare for autistics to have "spiky" profiles of strengths and weaknesses.

 

[Ameriblush]

Aspies still have limitations, such as poor social skills and highly individualized needs. Some people can't keep regular jobs because they often need to be reminded of procedures with complicated steps(bad memory) or can't focus for long periods of time. (ADD) So it can be crippling like a disabilty when given the right scenario.

 

[dragoncat16]

Aspies still have limitations, such as poor social skills and highly individualized needs. Some people can't keep regular jobs because they often need to be reminded of procedures with complicated steps(bad memory) or can't focus for long periods of time. (ADD) So it can be crippling like a disabilty when given the right scenario.

Lots of NTs also have a bad memory and can't follow instructions, yet they can keep a job. ADD is a separate issue from ASD. Yes, many people on the spectrum have limitations, just as some NTs have limitations. However, to put a blanket definition on ASD as a disability is simply not logical or accurate, when the symptoms are not at all uniform among all people on the spectrum. If we look at any other "disability" it is much more well-defined: e.g. legal blindness is 20/200 or worse corrected vision, a mobility issue is not being able to walk a certain distance without using an aid, etc. To say that Aspergers or ASD is a disability without a clear definition of specific capability thresholds is to invite discrimination. How can a person on the spectrum get a job when potential employers assume all sorts of things about what they will have difficulties with?

 

[pjcnet]

Sometimes people on the higher functioning end of the autistic spectrum can get a raw deal even compared to people who are low functioning, I'm not saying I'd want to be low functioning, but I will still make this point...

Very low functioning people will nearly always get help and support from the state and/or other people when needed as they are clearly totally reliant, but higher functioning autistic people are often left on their own to fail in various aspects of life and quite often don't get the right support, and in some cases they don't even get diagnosed. They are also more often misunderstood, where someone who is low functioning usually comes across as clearly disabled and allowances are normally quickly made. Both my brothers who are very low functioning are mostly happy in their own world and are looked after very well, but myself who is higher functioning has been left in various situations where I've struggled throughout my life and this often causes depression / anxiety. I don't like using the word "disability" when referring to people who are on the higher functioning end of the autistic spectrum, but if the state starts saying that higher functioning autism is no longer classed as a disability it could make the situation even worse as often much needed help and support could be cut totally (this could start happening in the UK at least and it's very worrying that it's more about saving money, but I won't say any more outside the politics forum). So maybe we shouldn't be so quick to argue that Asperger Syndrome and other high functioning autism isn't classed as a disability even if we'd rather use other words to describe it.

You said that so well. Many so-called low functioning autistics are actually highly intelligent and have high IQ scores. They just can't talk or communicate or regulate their behavior in a manner that enables them to live on their own or hold jobs or establish/maintain relationships like marriage.

I agree that even low functioning autistic people can be highly intelligent, but in totally different ways and measuring their true IQ in traditional ways would usually be impossible. Low functioning autistic people such as both my brothers may not be-able to for instance count, add 2+2, tell the time, read or write, talk properly or even at all, hold normal relationships or jobs, but people may be surprised what they can do and they still often have a special interest or interests that they can really exceed in. It is still most definitely a disability however and is in a different league to Asperger Syndrome.

My brother David can remember certain things in extreme detail from many years ago that most people would have considered totally irrelevant and he can suddenly come out with it at the most unexpected times (he can talk, but will only do this with people he knows very well like family and only they can understand his voice). He is extremely good at art / drawing and spends many hours doing this, he is also surprisingly stunning at controlling a football which is unusual since normally co-ordination and motor skills is impaired with autistic people, it's a shame he wouldn't ever be-able to understand the rules of football or be-able to interact with others (Football in the UK is known as soccer in the USA). He analyses many situations in detail and often knows exactly what is going on when people underestimate him, normally he will only mention it if something is bothering him however, E.g. if there's a threat of change, then he will go on and on repeatedly about it, sadly you could try to reassure him 100 times and it still wouldn't be enough and eventually it can cause a meltdown where he will scream, growl and bite his finger, throwing himself about.

 

[Jacoby]

It's a terrible awful disability if you didn't or don't have the proper supports. There isn't one good thing in my life and its because of this condition.

 

[nowwhat]

I live at home, because I'm a full time student, but I don't have long-term friendshps or a romantic relationship.

Not to be pessimistic, or damn you, but once you move on to independence, and find yourself working and involved in relationships, you will find that these things come with unforseen expectations of you, and you may be one of us that understands why AS is a very real handicap at times.

 

[BradT]

I wonder if I became a social drinkerld improve my social life? but, I promised my family I wouldn't touch one drop of alcohol

 

[WereBear]

I wonder if I became a social drinkerld improve my social life? but, I promised my family I wouldn't touch one drop of alcohol

There's nothing you can do buzzed that you can't do sober. That's a problematical solution best avoided if you can't control it.

In my case, I have ably demonstrated there's nothing an NT can do that I can't do, usually better... but I did not know the crushing toll it was taking on my mind and body. So there are definite limits to our adaptation, one way or another, and that's the only "accommodation" we ask.

I have seen NTs have tantrums over moving their smoking area or changing the cafeteria menu or switching the software at work. Yet they are "normal?" That is what we need a redefinition of.

 

[Mia]

Think that it's a societal classification, if you can't function in everyday life, hold down a job, get through school, and be self-sufficient then you might have a 'disabled' label.

Worked in a sanitarium for a summer when I was a teen. Many of the residents couldn't speak or read or write. The ones who could speak were considered smarter than the residents who didn't. Yet many had been there since infancy, and were not taught. They had no access to education or a way to communicate. Many were classified as LFA, because they couldn't speak. They may have been highly intelligent, yet without speaking or communication skills they were classified as low functioning.

Figuring out ways for communication and education would have helped them. Nothing is what it seems. And luckily there are systems in place now that don't automatically resign people to the kind of life these people had, in canada these places existed right up into the middle of the 1980's.

 

[Mary Terry]

Think that it's a societal classification, if you can't function in everyday life, hold down a job, get through school, and be self-sufficient then you might have a 'disabled' label.

Worked in a sanitarium for a summer when I was a teen. Many of the residents couldn't speak or read or write. The ones who could speak were considered smarter than the residents who didn't. Yet many had been there since infancy, and were not taught. They had no access to education or a way to communicate. Many were classified as LFA, because they couldn't speak. They may have been highly intelligent, yet without speaking or communication skills they were classified as low functioning.

Figuring out ways for communication and education would have helped them. Nothing is what it seems. And luckily there are systems in place now that don't automatically resign people to the kind of life these people have, in canada these places existed right up into the middle of the 1980's.

Finding out the ways in which FLAs can communicate is key. My mostly non-verbal 25 year old LFA nephew sometimes talks to me in Sesame Street dialogue. His IQ scores are in the 140 range. Sometimes it is hard for me to figure out what he is trying to tell me, but I think I usually do understand him. He acknowledges my responses in a way that makes me think he understands me which is a good thing because I don't know much Sesame Street dialogue to formulate responses. It is our form of communication and we don't care what anyone else thinks about how we "talk". He also sometimes can sing to me to express himself. We make up songs to sing to each other to say what we need to say. It may sound strange to others, but it works for us.

 

[Mr Allen]

This kind of thing winds me up immensely! Contrary to popular opinion, us Aspies are NOT retarded or otherwise mentally incompetent, on the contrary some of us could be Chasers we're so clever!

In the UK at least, it is however classed as a disability under the DDA (Disability Discrimination Act 1995), but as I'm sure you've read in my previous rants on the topic, I've been saying for years that the DDA ain't worth the paper it's printed on, because the government don't enforce it, hence outside of a very lucky few, hardly any UK Aspies work, not for loot anyway unless it's Autism specific £2 a day work in special Factories etc.

 

[Ylva]

I don't have melt downs, I do have anxiety and I obsess.

I am happy for you. I just don't understand what you are trying to argue.

If you had a disability that rendered you incapable of perceiving cars or trees, you would be in more danger from them. If there is communication going on that you can't perceive, well, there would be some risk involved, because you would risk missing out on crucial information and there are people who would take advantage of that.

Intelligence is hard to measure with tests. Mostly because it requires a lot of other thing that have nothing to do with your ability to think and solve problems. Before tablets, having a motor dysfunction that made it difficult or impossible for you to write by hand would impact your test score, as might problems speaking with your mouth parts, and so on. Getting ipads didn't solve everything, and some people – not just autistics, but people with CP for instance – are trapped by their carers' inability or unwillingness to communicate/let them communicate. I probably don't even have to mention Stephen Hawking for you to realize what we could be missing out on by this neglect.

 

[BradT]

This kind of thing winds me up immensely! Contrary to popular opinion, us Aspies are NOT retarded or otherwise mentally incompetent, on the contrary some of us could be Chasers we're so clever!

In the UK at least, it is however classed as a disability under the DDA (Disability Discrimination Act 1995), but as I'm sure you've read in my previous rants on the topic, I've been saying for years that the DDA ain't worth the paper it's printed on, because the government don't enforce it, hence outside of a very lucky few, hardly any UK Aspies work, not for loot anyway unless it's Autism specific £2 a day work in special Factories etc.

That's what makes me irritated, I'm not "mentally retarded." These people are such idiots, they don't know me from Adam and yet they judge me. I don't like being around people nomore besides family ,because I'm afraid I'm going to get ****ing judged. I'm afraid to ask women out, because they will think I'm "retarded". It's ridiculous!!!!!

 

[Crossbreed]

I don't consider it a disability, just a handicap. In some settings, it's an asset.

 

[MaybeNotWhoKnows]

People with aspergers are supposed to be on the higher end of the autism spectrum while we are supposed to be intelligent. Why is aspergers even considered a part of autism?

To me, what makes something a disability is: if it interferes with my ability to function, and it is (at the very least) uncomfortable, and there is no way to "fix" it/cure it/make it no longer a problem. All of those apply to me personally, so I am disabled. But if you do not consider yourself disabled, don't let anyone convince you that you are.