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When does confidence become arrogance?

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by SimonSays, Apr 11, 2021.

  1. SimonSays

    SimonSays Time is an illusion I have a lot of V.I.P Member

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    After having been away for a few weeks, my housemate returned and decided to invite a few friends up to his room, in our shared house, from 8 o'clock in the evening until well after midnight. He played his music so loud my earplugs did nothing and I could often feel the bass vibrating right through my body. I'm right next to him, with only a small partition wall separating us.

    It seems like a very confident decision to decide that he could do this without caring how it would affect anybody else in the house. Is that arrogance? I'm sure he knew that nobody would say anything as there is no point in asking him to turn it down because I'd already tried that a few times only to discover a very angry and aggressive response, as he does not want to do anything he doesn't want to do. This is not a pleasant man by any means. But there must have been a time when he was just confident about his ability to do what he wanted and not yet arrogant. Does confidence with a big ego inevitably lead to arrogance? Or is this just an indication of some other type of character flaw?

    I would never even think about playing music in my room and impose it on anybody else. If I want to listen to music I put earphones in and then I'm not interfering with somebody else's life. The concept of playing music at club level volume in a shared house, never mind in your own house that might border another, or even in an apartment building, which would still cause a problem, but in a shared house where we are in rooms that are essentially ordinary rooms of a house, to turn it into a club for five hours, so we just have to put up with it whether we like it or not. Selfish arrogance?

    What is the difference? Where is the line between confidence and arrogance, and how much consideration should confidence allow for, because if it has to give too much consideration then it's not confident in its ability to do it the way it wants. So perhaps it has to become arrogant in order to get everything it wants and not care what others think about the decision to do it.

    Perhaps it is a slow shifting into arrogance that is unnoticed by confidence? It just gets used to getting its own way, doing it the way it wants, that it just becomes where it doesn't have to care about anybody it doesn't care about, doesn't have to consider anyone a neighbour, a brother, even a fellow human being. It doesn't have to care about anyone at all.

    I have definitely been more confident than I am now and it could be that when I was more confident about what I was doing and how I was doing it, I may have veered into arrogance at times without noticing it, and yet if I did something that resulted in somebody getting upset, it bothered me. I would feel guilty, which would be the check and balance for not being arrogant, because I cared.

    So does arrogance also imply a certain kind of sociopathic nature, because my neighbour definitely appears to exhibit sociopathic tendencies, and if you are sociopathic, arrogance must be just a part of the package; the more arrogant, the more confident, the better you feel, and the more you're being yourself.

    So this is not just a judgement of a bad person, as it could be the pathology of a sociopath. I know that I can't change things. I can't do anything that might stop it from happening because my confidence is nowhere near as confident as his is, and I simply cannot express myself well enough; he is simply too overwhelming.

    So in realising that confidence, self-importance and arrogance are sort of in the same ballpark, my self-importance can now be looked at through his arrogance.

    I have to adopt certain coping mechanisms when he's around; earplugs have to be in for certain. I can't consider watching something with earphones because if he's watching a film, his audio overwhelms mine and it becomes too distracting, so it makes more sense not to even try. But it means that I'm not free when he is here unless he isn't interfering with me which isn't very often.

    So I have to let go of the idea that something is wrong. I mustn't think I have to get my own back or become like him to battle him at his own game. None of those things are good for me. But if I can accept it because that is what is happening, and I know that I can't do anything about it, so allow it to be as it is, I can find peace, which is a lot better than existing in a state of resistance which is not good for me at all.
     
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  2. OkRad

    OkRad μῆνιν ἄειδε θεὰ Πηληϊάδεω Ἀχιλῆος οὐλομένην V.I.P Member

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    There are narcissists everywhere. Those who have power and do what they please are quite happy to chase down dopamine fixes where ever they may be, screw everyone..........
     
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  3. Mia

    Mia Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    I've called the police on people making a lot of noise, after asking them to turn music down. When I lived in apartments. Often they would simply turn it up after the police left. As it's a civil law matter in my country, police will often fine people for noise disturbances. Eventually if they do it a lot, they have thousands of dollars in fines to pay.

    When I had parties in apartment buildings I lived in, I informed other tenants ahead of time. They were not all that loud, mainly people talking and no music usually. Mostly gaming and discussions. There was still uncharacteristic noise though, but the other tenants seemed to not mind.

    Suspect that people who have loud parties, simply don't care about others.
     
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  4. Aneka

    Aneka Well-Known Member

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    Believe me, your character is set pretty early on in childhood/ puberty although life experiences and trauma can still have a major impact later in life. You will see how children already have quite distinctive personalities and how even siblings who grew up together in the same family can be opposed characters.

    What most people don't see is that arrogance is low self-confidence in disguise. People tell themselves they're better and greater because they subconsciously feel the opposite. There is no such thing as 'overconfidence' if you look at it that way.
     
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  5. SimonSays

    SimonSays Time is an illusion I have a lot of V.I.P Member

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    As @OkRad mentioned, rather than arrogance, it may be narcissism. I'm not sure if it matters whether it's narcissism or sociopathy, or just plain arrogance, the experience feels the same.

    that's a good point. It's interesting though, that the experience I have is one of overwhelming oppression, And yet I also recognise a lot of what you say. and that is how I try to also see it. while he is undoubtedly acting as a petty tyrant, he is also just the little boy wearing the suit of a wolf so that he appears to be something he is not really.
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2021
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  6. SimonSays

    SimonSays Time is an illusion I have a lot of V.I.P Member

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    I've written about the petty tyrant before, and there is something to be gained from not letting him get to me and create a reaction where I feel affected by him. it makes me look at my own self-importance and reduces it.

    On the one hand, it is an unreasonable situation, while on the other hand, it makes me focus on maintaining my own discipline, keep to my own patterns and routines, as best I can. Ear plugs are my lifesaver. and sometimes when he slams his door whenever he goes into his room, no matter what time of the day or night it is, having attenuated it, I do sometimes laugh at the ridiculousness of his action. I used to think it so unreasonable that someone should behave that way, as if somehow thinking like that would change things. Now I don't imagine things will change, and it's easier to accept, and it is that acceptance which brings peace. It's all about what I focus on...is he an arrogant narcissistic tyrant turning me into a victim of his actions, or am I learning not to be affected by such things and not to expect the world to have to work in the way I would prefer it to.
     
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  7. Gift2humanity

    Gift2humanity Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    :confounded:
    Confidence does not come into it.
    Arrogance does.
    This man is full of self-hatred.
    It is a character flaw, he responded to abuse/neglect/unmet needs, the wrong way when his ego was forming, so the ego got stunted at the stage where toddlers have tantrums.
    So, there was never a time when true confidence, which comes out of love, developed for him.
    There is no point in asking him to turn the music down, and of course his response would be aggressive, because although he won't admit it, his angry aggressive response is coming from that angry tantrum throwing little toddler inside of him.
    These types of people break rules, they disregard social courtesy and decency, they don't/can't care for others, as they are incapable of caring.
    I sang at night, I checked with my neighbours when they lived below, they told me not to worry about it, I am sure they would have told me if it bothered them.
    I'm getting new neighbours I'll say the same to them, they may not want to hear my warbling after 8pm, I must respect that. Some people need bad feeling, they feed off it, that's why they impose themselves on others in various negative ways.
    True confidence comes from a mature child, who loves themselves.
    Arrogance comes from a child who never grew up, who responded to adverse circumstances in an unhealthy way and grew from a bully into a narcissist/sociopath.
    In my personal opinion, no slow shifting, unresolved childhood trauma at the root, no chance for true confidence to develop, if the child does not, or cannot, get an opportunity to mature, hence the arrogance, but I am no psychologist.
    Something knocked your confidence, you can re-trace your steps back to correct it if you do not already know what that something is.
    If we veer into arrogance without knowing, we can examine ourselves honestly, or any other negative trait we may discover in ourselves. That shows a willingness to be positive, not something a narcissist or sociopath is willing to do.
    Yes it can, sociopathic or narcissistic nature.
    He is not being himself. He built up a false "self" as a toddler, when the adverse circumstances he did not/or could not, respond to healthily, sowed the seeds for narcissism/sociopathy.
    These people want a reaction, it feeds them.
    He is not confident, he has never been confident, this is arrogance, if anything, he lacks confidence, he hates himself, but he will never let you see that, all you will see is this supposedly confident facade, and that is all it is, a facade, and if you react, you will see the angry little child.
    You or nobody else can successfully express your/themselves to people like this, they do not listen, they will not hear, they might as well have the most powerful ear plugs in the world inside their ear canals.
    Overbearing? yes, the feeling these people emanate is hatred, misery, anger, jealousy, scorn, disguised as confidence, suaveness, fake happiness and fake contentment. They are in survival mode, they have been, ever since their ego was stunted in it's development at a tender young age.
    They are to be pitied, strong is the man who can have (but not show) compassion for/to them.
    I say "but not show" as this will dent their stunted fragile ego, and they are so arrogant, they will feel patronised and will act from that toddler-in-pain with anger and aggression.
    I don't think confidence, self-importance and arrogance are in the same ballpark, I think self-importance and arrogance come from a hateful ball park and true confidence comes from a ball park of love.
    You've got to do what you have to do for yourself, and if that means earplugs in, then so be it.
    Look after yourself, he is not looking after anyone, not even himself, he seems like the type of man that isn't just bothering you, he probably feels the need to make a misery wherever he goes and to whom ever he meets.
    'Something is wrong" could be reframed into "I have a challenge, not to give this man the reaction he wants".
    Don't follow my errors and fall for revenge, it's good you have the sense to see how futile this would be.
    Please see above bolded purple text - I think, if you can do this, it is a very wise decision, but, as I said earlier, I am not a psychologist, or a diplomat with people, they scare me, he would make me tremble.
    If I had all the power I wished for, that is how I would like to think I could handle him.
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2021
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  8. Gift2humanity

    Gift2humanity Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    I am glad that other members echo some of the things I said, it feeds my ego.
    My ego needs strengthening, not by imposing myself on others, but by feeling validated by hearing others have the same sentiments as me.
    The world will always have these sorts of characters in, the best we can do is not feed the dragons, they just want more and it burns us out.
     
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  9. Neonatal RRT

    Neonatal RRT Well-Known Member

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    When does confidence become arrogance? (1) When you look down upon others (2) When your sense of humility and respect diminishes (3) When you loose the sense that you could possibly be wrong (4) You let others know how good you are at something

    Folks who work at hospitals that are teaching facilities will run across the young physician-in-training that because they have an MD or DO behind their name,...that somehow they know more than the staff that have been working on that unit for 10, 20, 30+ years,...giving us the arrogant attitude. Dunning-Kruger effect in full display,...just enough knowledge to think they are experts,...but not enough to realize they are wrong. We are quick to give him/her the "Excuse me young man/lady lecture",....just to let them know we have more knowledge in our little pinky finger than they will ever have,...and they are here as students,...to learn.
     
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  10. Gift2humanity

    Gift2humanity Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    No point in telling them, it's like talking to a brick wall.
     
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  11. OkRad

    OkRad μῆνιν ἄειδε θεὰ Πηληϊάδεω Ἀχιλῆος οὐλομένην V.I.P Member

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    Stupidity is far more common than evil or hatred, etc. When people are thoughtless, they are simply thoughtless. It is terrible for the one who has to endure it and spend hours and hours wrangling with their thoughts and forcing their thoughts to find meaning out of something that the other never even considers.

    If you and the Tyrant were alone in an elevator for a few days and you really got to hear him talk about why he does what he does, it would be such a surprise to him. It would completely surprise him to think you are spending hours listening for that door to slam, figuring which ear plugs work, so much mental energy to even give him a nickname when he probably hardly knows your name.

    He is a major part of your psyche, though you are working on that. You are not even on his radar. People often have an easier time garnering meaning from evil because others can bolster you and understand how hard that is. But it's very hard to go round and round with thoughtlessness of others who cannot be blamed for just living their lives.

    This scenario happen SO MANY TIMES with ASD people because they are sensitive. Unkind and thoughtless words and things people do for fun like smoke and yell with friends......ASD doesn't get that and so there is so much mental wrangling.

    How I hope you get a kind and sensitive room mate who will allow you truly to free up that part of your brain that always has to convince itself that it is squeezing meaning out of thoughtlessness.

    Peace, friend.
     
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  12. SimonSays

    SimonSays Time is an illusion I have a lot of V.I.P Member

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    You are so right. although, when I was first here, I did attempt to have him understand his thoughtlessness. as you might imagine this did not go down well. so while I'm sure he doesn't care about me in the slightest, there may be an element of affecting me intentionally because he knows he is, or at least he was a lot more then than he is now.

    Thank you. Your words have wisdom.
     
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  13. Streetwise

    Streetwise Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    If anyone has pictures I can't understand the written definition thanks
     
  14. watersprite

    watersprite inadvertent vagabond V.I.P Member

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    All these words & discussion have helped me significantly with a stressful & kind of traumatic set of circumstances.
    Put it in a file to remind myself of the realities.

    {thanks}
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2021
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  15. Gift2humanity

    Gift2humanity Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    When does confidence become arrogance?

    Arrogance was never confident, for to be arrogant, you confidence was squashed and your ego never allowed to develop in a healthy way, so arrogance, while putting on a convincing confident face is actually not confident at all.
     
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  16. watersprite

    watersprite inadvertent vagabond V.I.P Member

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    This is a tad tangential; is it possible they need others to be sort of addicted to them?