Saddened by a website I was reading

[elspeth]

Well, I am the aspie in my marriage and my husband would probably echo that woman's "vent" about male aspies!

I guess I do come across as a narsissist, since I have my rituals that I go into a childish fit over, if they are changed! And so forth; but me thinks that woman does not know the true definition of a narsissist, because there is a difference.

I grew up with a mother who was as narsissist as one can get!

I, personally would steer away from biased websites that are obviously a dig at aspies.

Marriage is hard for both the aspie and nt, but aspergers is not static and so, we can learn to adapt. When my husband complained that I never ask how he is on coming home from work, I realised that it was not very kind of me; just never thought about it before, but I make sure now that I greet him.

He has also complained that I never volunteer touching or caressing; that is still a work on for me, but I am better than I used to be.

What makes a "mixed" marriage work, is both partners learning from each other, whereas this woman seems to think that it has nothing to do with the nt. The aspie has the issue and so the aspie has to do all the work!

It is funny about this empathy thing, because in truth, I do not think that many people in the world are truly empathetic anyway and I am surrounded by nts and guess what? I show more empathy than many of them!

I sincerely advise you to keep away from negative websites.

Hmm, as someone who is not NT (I have ADHD) but have been in relationships with Aspies - including my current partner, I do assume that I'm required to do some work. I actually think that I do a lot to appreciate and accommodate an AS partner.

Where it can be really difficult for a non-AS partner is in the things that are really non-negotiable for the AS person or in things you want like spontaneous displays of affection that can never happen spontaneously.

I feel like I do a lot to notice the things that I wouldn't otherwise if it were not for my AS partner and now with one of my children (such as noises that for me are just part of the background but for them are excruciatingly painful) and I know that it's hard to notice something that you wouldn't otherwise on the AS side.

I understand the feelings expressed on the site that GeoGuy even as I agree with you that both sides need to try.

 

[elspeth]

I know what you mean Suzanne, I have spent my life surrounded by NT's and they are even less empathetic than I am. They can reject and hurt people with seeming ease and never appear to have any kind of conscience. Many of them are manipulative and like spoilt children who want everything their way. They also seem to just be interested in just using me like an object/tool for my "special" abilities/gifts to benefit their personal missions (I always had to help fix computers, help with maths homework, assignments, etc., now I have a study-promoter who I'm pretty sure is holding on to me so I can write journal publications on behalf of this person. I am not stupid, I know when I'm being used.).

But, it would be silly of me to start a website which denigrates all of them and bashes NT people, advising Aspies to avoid all contact with NT's because they are so "bad", which is exactly what this website is doing to Aspies.

Any sensible person would know everyone is different, and personally, I know that I have not met ALL the NT's in the world, I could just have been unlucky so far. Even if there were only 10% or just 1% who are genuinely good people (impossible if you think about it, more like 90%) you still cannot write them all off of course.

And that was my problem with this website - writing off ALL Aspies and saying "avoid them all" because of a few cases where it sounds to me like there are much more serious problems in the marriage than just the one partner being an Aspie.

My issue with all these people is how easily they go into "complain" and "bash" mode without even considering maybe just asking politely for something. All they have to do is ask nicely. That indicates to me that they too don't know how to communicate properly. The reason the Aspie partner probably reacts the way they do is because they probably feel bombarded and attacked all of a sudden when things were perfect 5 minutes ago.

Sure, it may be frustrating because NT's have this non-verbal way of communicating, but if they wanted that then frankly they should've married another NT then.

And then to top it, a lot of them claim they were "duped" into a marriage. Seriously? The NT was "duped"? The self-proclaimed MASTERS of human communication were "tricked" that easily, by someone "pretending" to be an NT?

LOL

I agree with you about painting whole categories of people or more to the point individuals with differing traits and personalities with the same broad brush.

My experience is like the one WittyAspie described but from the non-AS perspective. Asking alone doesn't do the trick, not about stuff that is solidly about being on the spectrum and as a result doesn't come naturally if it can come at all. If what you need are certain kinds of emotional expression or spontaneity and these aren't the way your AS partner functions then it can feel very lonely and frustrating.

As for being duped, I think that's strong but I think there are lots of things that I didn't realize 1) wouldn't change about my partner (after all I changed and compromised to accommodate him) 2) what would be difficult to take or maintain in the long haul 3) things he said he would try, ways in which he presented during our courtship that changed after we married or things he said he was interested in but when it came down to it couldn't manage or didn't like and 4) that he had AS and what I might expect with that (it's been a process of awakening).

I met my husband online when I was twenty-eight and he was thirty-two. Ours is his only relationship - he hadn't dated before or had a girlfriend. To me he seemed nerdy and a bit quirky, but no different from other guys like that that I had dated. He seemed nice, stable and kind. We were both in IT, he is a software engineer and I was a project manager. We had some shared intellectual interests, similar lefty politics and I thought similar values (although I know now that I'm more of a situationalist and relativist in my thinking than he is - he tends to be more black and white, which I have learned is/may be an AS thing) and we were spiritually similar (though again there he is much more literal and black and white than I am).

We lived in different cities so we exchanged visits to get to know one another. In retrospect, I think that the fact that these were kind of vacation scenarios meant that he was forced out of his comfort zones and so I never saw one of his main AS traits which is his adherence to routines. We talked a ton before we got engaged about what our life together might be like, our goals and stuff like sex and affection (though we held off on being intimate -- though I had had sexual relationships before -- for religious reasons).

After we got married I learned how important routines were to him - that even if we were enjoying ourselves, watching a movie, say, at the appointed hour he would just get up abruptly and start preparing tfor bed. I learned that he had sensory issues that meant that we couldn't sleep in the same bed (though he tried for a bit when we were newlyweds but then couldn't focus at work).

I had valued that he was interested in my ideas and me as a person versus my appearance (which was usually a focus with guys) and at first found that freeing since with him I didn't need to be on my beauty regimens and on point with fashion as I had been before. I relaxed into a more casual look but then realized that he didn't really notice or seem to notice my appearance at all. In other relationships it had been functionally a lubricant, in this one it wasn't visible at all. No compliments. No inkling of feeling proud to be with me in public as in other relationships. And as I got older and after I had kids and my body changed that got harder and harder to take.

He has a bunch of special interests I now realize. I used to participate in them at first but when I realized that he didn't value my interests and would never reciprocate, I stopped.

We talked about having three or four kids but now at two he has said no more - largely I see because it would be disruptive to him re his AS issues - his routines, his sleep issues and the general disruption that comes with kids. Though he is a really great Dad to the kids we have. This was really disappointing to me, as it wasn't what we agreed and in my 40s I am now out of chances.

I have to largely guess at his feelings for me as he doesn't verbalize them but more importantly they aren't evident to me in the ways that would make a difference to me - there is very little touching, no sex (before we married he had said he would be willing to try lots of things sexually but we soon found out that he doesn't like kissing, cannot take light touch and is grossed out by a lot of the bodily parts of it, so now I leave that alone) and none of the little daily kindnesses (that show that someone has been thinking of you and what you might like or want to hear about). And when I am sad or emotional that is usually met with a blank stare. Still he seems fairly happy with the relationship, as long as things run smoothly in our home, I ask about his day and his routines aren't interrupted.

 

[Brizo]

Hi all. I feel terrible after reading articles and blogs on a website which describe the experiences of wives of Asperger's men.

I could hardly believe what I was reading. It was hard to endure. Now, I feel like some kind of monster because I am not sure whether I have ever treated people, especially women, this way.

I am not married, but reading stuff like this makes me feel really guilty for wanting to ever get married.

The website states that Aspie men (like me) are akin to psychopaths and narcissists, and have the same effect in a relationship. They say being married to an Aspie man is like being ignored, invalidated all the time, abused, and their life destroyed. They say Aspie men never give them attention and always blame the wife for everything, and last but not least - are totally incapable of loving her.

I almost cried reading that last part. I mean, I believe that I can love a special girl in my life very much, and I want to treat her so well and do everything for her, hold her, comfort her, love her so very much. I had a girlfriend before and was extremely in love with her.

But, is this what people really think of men like me? How can I ever prove that I would never hurt someone that way?

They explicitly say that a woman should never ever get involved with an Aspie man. Why do I deserve to be alone, just because of my condition?

My wife and I too have read these horror stories and to some extent there is some truth in the experiences of women married to an Aspie. I am very lucky that my wife sort of knew what was going on with me and adapted her behaviour accordingly, lets face it us Aspies are unlikely to change ours. I think if you are a woman thinking of having a relationship with an Aspie you have to have incredible patience and understanding of what "loving" an Aspie can be like. I am lucky to have a unique and special wife who has been willing to put up with all my foibles.

 

[WereBear]

I am lucky to have a unique and special wife who has been willing to put up with all my foibles.

I likewise have an NT partner who has been completely supportive throughout our 17 year relationship.

But then again, he's only doing what a kind and loving adult should do. Not that people don't deserve credit for that, they do. But it shouldn't be so freakin' rare, should it?

 

[BirdsNest]

My wife and I too have read these horror stories and to some extent there is some truth in the experiences of women married to an Aspie. I am very lucky that my wife sort of knew what was going on with me and adapted her behaviour accordingly, lets face it us Aspies are unlikely to change ours. I think if you are a woman thinking of having a relationship with an Aspie you have to have incredible patience and understanding of what "loving" an Aspie can be like. I am lucky to have a unique and special wife who has been willing to put up with all my foibles.

That is super sweet.
Can you describe some of the foibles you mention?

 

[Butterfly88]

I bet there is an equal if not greater number of people happily married to aspies. People tend to post bad things online more than the good. I bet if you searched you could find some stories of happily married couples with at least one aspie. There are both successful and unsuccessful marriages for straight couples, gay couples and lesbian couples. I don't see why it wouldn't be the same for aspies couples or couples where one person has autism.

 

[Suiseiseki]

I understand romance and the little things like noticing a woman's hair and all that, I had to learn that, and my ideas of romance are a tad strange, mostly because I find the more mainstream ones dull and I want to enjoy the act of like doing all that, I refuse to get locked into a "for her only" situation.
Now I don't think anyone half decent will want to put up with my quirkyness, though I have no rigid things, such as schedules, I actually find living by a set time for everything makes me very depressed, I like surprises and that every day could be different then the one previous.
Nothing has a set anything with me, who knows when the next time I go shopping will be, could be payday, could be the weekend.
Even if something isn't what I find interesting, I can still see the interesting angles of it, I wasn't always like this of course, there was no one to let me be all aspergers so I had to change, and I am glad I did.

 

[Suiseiseki]

I bet there is an equal if not greater number of people happily married to aspies. People tend to post bad things online more than the good. I bet if you searched you could find some stories of happily married couples with at least one aspie. There are both successful and unsuccessful marriages for straight couples, gay couples and lesbian couples. I don't see why it wouldn't be the same for aspies couples or couples where one person has autism.

However I dare say people with aspergers have a far higher failure method, I am probably guaranteed a divorce (if I am lucky enough to get married, and there are better people then me who are single).
And since I won't date a single mother or someone fat I am really cutting out anyone who wants to date me lol

 

[Butterfly88]

However I dare say people with aspergers have a far higher failure method, I am probably guaranteed a divorce (if I am lucky enough to get married, and there are better people then me who are single).
And since I won't date a single mother or someone fat I am really cutting out anyone who wants to date me lol

Maybe you want to consider marrying another aspie, as they would likely be more understanding.

 

[Suiseiseki]

Maybe you want to consider marrying another aspie, as they would likely be more understanding.

Never met one
I was smitten with a lady who had similar problems but it didn't take off.

 

[Butterfly88]

Never met one
I was smitten with a lady who had similar problems but it didn't take off.

'If you want to meet more aspies maybe you want to see if there are any aspie social groups in your area. I go to one. I found it through this website:
We are what we do | Meetup

 

[Suiseiseki]

'If you want to meet more aspies maybe you want to see if there are any aspie social groups in your area. I go to one. I found it through this website:
We are what we do | Meetup

I have and there is not for adults.

 

[Katleya]

The problem comes with putting people in boxes.

As soon as you look at a group of people categorised you have dehumanised them.

That's why people aren't supposed to be put in boxes until after they die. That and the fact that they can put up a mean fight if you do it while they're alive.

 

[SnailPie]

As an NT who is with an AS man, I have visited a Delphi Forum AS Partners site and was shocked at the hatred those women spew on a daily basis. There's a handful of them, all seem to be in their 50's, some still with their AS husbands and some divorced but they sit and post awful stuff all....day....long..not realizing they have become their own worst enemy. With that said, I can relate to some of what they're feeling because my long time boyfriend never compliments me, rarely says I love you to my face, often ignores me, is never romantic, never asks about my 15 year old sons high school basketball games, doesn't ask how I'm feeling if I've been sick and just overall doesn't say anything sweet to me. He says expressing his feelings makes him feel uncomfortable and other times he says doing these things just "slips his mind".This has brought me to deciding that I have to leave because I have this overwhelming feeling of darkness from the relationship almost like I'm falling deeper and deeper into a hole. My self esteem is lower than it has ever been, I feel unlovable, uncared for and generally like I don't matter to him. He tires easily from just the demands of everyday life so many times he has nothing left for me at the end of the day. I have tried to understand that none of this is intentional but just as WittyAspie said, that unfortunately doesn't lessen the hurt. He has some really awesome qualities and its going to break my heart to walk away but it's either that or continue to have my own mental health go down the drain.

Just like NT people, no two Aspies are the same, right? From your post, you sound like someone that has a higher emotional IQ and is very aware of yours and others feelings so I wouldn't worry too much about it.

That website is how I landed here. (A bit traumatized as a result of reading a lot of the posts, I might add. It was suggested to me by members that I was the one who *really* made my NT husband emotionally abuse me, because of how "awful" I MUST have been to him, simply because I'm an Aspie. Nothing could be further from the truth. DISCLAIMER from them: "Of COURSE she'd say that!" )

But I have thought the same thing; "If they're THAT miserable and abused by their AS husbands, why don't they get the hell out?!?!?!?" Sounds like some of them are doing that. Others are just now realizing that their mates are somewhere on the spectrum. Or they think their mates are. Divorce is hard and everyone loses. I guess they need a place to vent?

But, darn, it's hard to read about how much they really, really HATE us.

To me, no diagnosis is an "excuse" for ill-treatment of a partner. If you're miserable and feeling abused, it's no different than any other kind of abuse. You need to protect yourself and get away from someone who consistently hurts you, whether or not they mean to.

 

[Jana Delaney]

It is misunderstanding on their part, deliberate or otherwise. I have known lots of autistic guys who would never deliberately hurt anyone in a relationship, wouldn't cheat, and have plenty of kindness. Those who say otherwise have misunderstood what autism is. To a casual observer, there does appear to be a crossover between Autism and personality disorders, but it is only by examining context that a person can realise that they are vastly different. The problem is that because so many of us on the spectrum have been conditioned to live in a state of co-dependency, we often end up believing that we 'need' someone else to validate us, i.e. in a relationship. I think that it is through learning how to love one's time alone, and by learning to validate and love ourselves that we eventually realise that even if we are single, we are still 'whole' as a person and fine just as we are. That's not to say that we don't get lonely, but with self-validation, we can at least come to realise that it is not necessarily a person's 'fault' if they are single, and that even if they are rejected, that does not necessarily mean there is something wrong with their heart or spirit.

 

[SnailPie]

Maybe you want to consider marrying another aspie, as they would likely be more understanding.

Not necessarily.
As a female Aspie, my emotional needs are somewhat different from my Aspie BF. He's more the "classic" type; less emotional and cuddly. No matter my diagnosis, I'm still a female, and as such I like love and cuddling, being told I'm pretty, romantic and mushy stuff.
(Not to generalize; I know there is a lot of variation among us!)
But if you look at males and females in the general population, it's usually us girls who are emotional and want to talk about feelings, etc.
With Aspergers, it's just my belief that those differences can be amplified.

 

[Butterfly88]

Not necessarily.
As a female Aspie, my emotional needs are somewhat different from my Aspie BF. He's more the "classic" type; less emotional and cuddly. No matter my diagnosis, I'm still a female, and as such I like love and cuddling, being told I'm pretty, romantic and mushy stuff.
(Not to generalize; I know there is a lot of variation among us!)
But if you look at males and females in the general population, it's usually us girls who are emotional and want to talk about feelings, etc.
With Aspergers, it's just my belief that those differences can be amplified.

As you said there is a lot of variation among us. I would think some aspie guys would be compatible with aspie females.

 

[SnailPie]

As you said there is a lot of variation among us. I would think some aspie guys would be compatible with aspie females.

No doubt at all!

 

[Katleya]

As a female Aspie, my emotional needs are somewhat different from my Aspie BF. He's more the "classic" type; less emotional and cuddly. No matter my diagnosis, I'm still a female, and as such I like love and cuddling, being told I'm pretty, romantic and mushy stuff.
(Not to generalize; I know there is a lot of variation among us!)

I'm in the same relationship configuration, and I'd pretty much agree. He's still the most compatible person I know (and I'm not looking for more compatibility); in addition to that, a bunch of our shortcomings are different, so we tend to have the ability to make up for what the others lacks.
The one tricky thing is that our aversions (especially regarding foods, smells and noises) are wildly different, so that's sometimes challenging, but overall it's nice knowing there isn't as much of a barrier as there could be.