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Chest hair and ASD

ancusmitis

Well-Known Member
I've got to warn you, this is going to be a little bit rambly. The reason I started thinking about chest hair is because someone on another forum claimed that ASD's were a form of hyper-masculinity.

I don't want to give more credence to those theories by granting them airtime, but oh well, you'll probably hear about them eventually. They bug me a lot, because at least part of the evidence for them is the under-diagnosis of ASD in girls. I simply do not consider it proven that ASD is actually less common among female persons, instead of just overlooked. I also don't care for the concept of "male traits" being autistic traits, because those are culturally defined. On the AQ test, neurotypical men get two points more than neurotypical women. Autistics of any gender tend to score higher by ten or twenty points. Boys in western society tend to communicate less about their feelings because when they do communicate them the same way as girls do, they are "corrected" and taught to do things the way men are expected to. Autistics tend to communicate less about their emotions because autism includes impairment in communication skills. As I have gotten older and gotten to know myself better, I have begun expressing myself a lot more freely. So yeah, that really bugs me.

But most of all, my body has always struck me as kind of odd for someone who is supposed to be "hyper-masculine." I think it's relevant to mention that my ascribed sex is male. But I never developed the thick, bushy mats of hair on my chest and back and arms, and even my leg hair is rather sparse. As for my chest, I did not have chest hair through my teens or even into my twenties. At one point I had eight long, black hairs poking out around my nipples. Seriously, I counted them. As of right now, I've got this area shaped like a bell curve stretching between my nipples sparsely scattered with dark hairs. I have arm hair, but it is very thin and light, and the back of my hand is not hairy at all. David Tennant has much hairier hands than I do (Seriously, look at the hair on the back of his manly hairy hand).

And although I'm focussing on hair here, my voice also never deepened all that much, so I'm often mistaken for a woman over the telephone.

One final note, I've sometimes perceived my "figure" as a bit feminine as well, but other times I don't feel that way or at least not very much. I doubt my body is physically changing shape, but that perception is also part of my experience. (My long hair has gotten me called "ma'am" in the past, but I am pretty much certain that that's cultural).

Has anyone else got this experience? Do you ever wonder where your "hyper-masculinity" is hiding? I know I have, because it's not on my chest.
 
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I am a really, really, really hairy guy. I don't know if that's masculinity or genetics or what. And I'm not going to waste valuable money just to get rid of it, the way too many do.
 
DJ is slender, lanky build but, he had a decent bit of chest hair and, a nice "happy trail" and, defined muscles. Of course he works out as much as I do so that explains his fit body. He is a baritone vocally so, yeah pretty masculine but, I wouldn't say hyper masculine.

Another Aspie friend is middle eastern , known for having a good bit of body hair but, he's as hairless as a Native American and, barely a tenor so, I don't think there is any credence to that rumor.
 
I'm 39 and I still have never sprouted any chest hair, ever.......

I've got the weird nipple hair, but my armpit hair is so sparse that, from a distance it probably looks like I shave them.

Of interesting note though, pertaining to hair: Per all my genetics I should be bald as a bat by now on top of my head: My mothers father was completely bald by 28 & my brother (who is only two years older than me) was pretty much there 10 years ago, per the family genes. Yet here I am complaining to my barber every month that my hair is still too thick and needs to be thinned out more than they did last time.

And yes, I look just like my brother / father / grandparents: So don't ask me if the milkman still had a full head of hair at 40...... :)
 
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Marmot Yeah, DJ is the same, he's seven years older than his brother, who is bald as Patrick Stewart, his father went bald before he was 30 but not DJ he still had long, thick hair and, not even a receding hairline. Maybe Aspie genes cancel out bald genes. (Hmm mutation or variation there too maybe?)
 
All the aspie men I've known were very feminine. Two of them even said they felt like girls. Lanky, tenor voices, not at all hairy.
 
Marmot Yeah, DJ is the same, he's seven years older than his brother, who is bald as Patrick Stewart, his father went bald before he was 30 but not DJ he still had long, thick hair and, not even a receding hairline. Maybe Aspie genes cancel out bald genes. (Hmm mutation or variation there too maybe?)



There's several threads here talking about aspies who look (physically) much younger than they actually are, and I've always wondered about this (pertaining to hair loss) myself, particularly before I was diagnosed (2.5 years ago) but even more-so now that I've been diagnosed and know that my gene sequence is slightly different than had I been born NT.

This is interesting.

Any geneticists out there who can chime in on this ? I want to see some diagrams of aspie DNA kicking the crap out of inferior NT DNA, at the sub atomic level like the midi chlorians in the Jedi !
 
This response is a bit rambly too, hope that's okay. I'm not male, so maybe not as pertinent but it hits on something not talked about much here.
Our appearance: it is what it is. We can ignore it, work on it, worry about it, or perhaps obsess about it. I encourage myself to care about it for health's sake but not use the measuring stick of society to judge self or others.
 
I have always looked masculine but the hair on my head, before it disappeared, was ultra-fine: like a baby's hair. My facial hair is a little more course. My chest hair is also fine. I am not sure any of this has any meaning at all.
 
I'm in a position where I have to use society's or, at least industry genre fashion to judge my own appearance and that of my bandmates and crew - it is a pain to have to keep up expected appearances but, that's part of the job. I can't bee seen in baggy sweats or cozy fleece tops which I love just like I can't let the guys be seen in anything that isn't ripped or black, preferably both.
 
This response is a bit rambly too, hope that's okay. I'm not male, so maybe not as pertinent but it hits on something not talked about much here.
Our appearance: it is what it is. We can ignore it, work on it, worry about it, or perhaps obsess about it. I encourage myself to care about it for health's sake but not use the measuring stick of society to judge self or others.
Hi, Kestrel. I didn't mean for this to be exclusive to AMAB or non-females or whatever. I'm happy to hear from anyone about this.

I don't mind appearing more feminine on occasion; I do have masculine gender, though. And if the only reason they think I'm a woman is because I have long hair, um, there's about fifty years of history that they need to be clued in about. LOL.
 
Hair EVERYWHERE, yeah. It's a struggle to groom myself, just shaving my face, the blade will wear down in about a week.

As for the voice, it never did deepen naturally. I make a conscious effort whenever possible to use the masculine, adult voice, which I wish had been explained to me. I had no idea it took that conscious effort. I guess it becomes second nature down the road.

It is like my hormones don't know wtf they're doing. Hyper-masculine body, natural voice sounds like a pleasant little flute.
 
I have no idea if I'm hairy or not hairy, I've never had anything to judge that from. All my body hair (with the exception of regions that have the different hair) is blond, so it's hard to tell. At a guess probably average?
 
Slothra I'd just be yourself, your face looks like you'd be a natural alto voice to me, mid alto probably, not too close to soprano or tenor either one. That's a good voice, not common to males but, not unheard of either.
 
Personality-wise, the Aspie men I have known never seemed "hyper masculine." In my personal experience, the Aspies I have known have seemed like a third gender, or androgynous or a third gender. I'm not sure which. Whether male and female, being more similar to each other than to either gender.

As for the masculinity of femininity of Aspie physical appearance-I've never found a noticeable pattern.
 
Ste11aeres Yes, I agree that we seem to be more androgynous personality, likes, interests and, mannerisms wise than NTs. It's as if our minds don't see any reason to make gender distinctions in those areas. It seems easy for most of us to accept that boys can like pink and play with Barbie dolls and girls can like blue and play with G.I. Joes and Tonka trucks. :)
 
i totally agree Asperger's has nothing to do with being hyper masculine and i think it is likely the higher diagnosis of male aspies is due to a plethora of issues like male centred diagnosis leaving many aspie women undiagnosed and ignored. its not good to generalise all aspies, i think some aspies will be very masculine and others will be more feminine, its normal for any group to have a wide variety of people.

personally i am very hairy and have hair all over (legs, arms, armpits, chest, nipples, groin, bum cheeks, belly(snail trail)),i also have a beard and long hair. most of my hair is blonde.

however despite being really hairy i wouldn't fit the hyper masculine stereotype fully, i do have a low deep voice and im athletic and lithe but im not very muscular or strong. in terms of personality im very far from the hyper masculine stereotype, i dislike sports generally and much prefer reading and poetry etc. and i would generally be described as being fairly feminine for a man in a very male body.
 
The 'hyper-masculine' reference is always (within my experience) connected to 'the mind' like 'Aspergers is the extreme male mind'. This relates to thought and communication patterns, eg 'lack of empathy' and monosyllabic answers. There was never any implication other parts of the body were involved. In fact, many aspies lack upper body strength, have loose joints, and have poor coordination. Hairiness or otherwise is not a good indicator of masculinity and is very dependent on genetics.
As others have noted, another problem with this theory, is that in other areas, while aspergirls might drift towards masculine stereotypes, asperguys tend the other way – both towards some middle ground or overlap.
 
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The 'hyper-masculine' reference is always (within my experience) connected to 'the mind' like 'Aspergers is the extreme male mind'. This relates to thought and communication patterns, eg 'lack of empathy' and monosyllabic answers.
Even if we focus on "the mind," it still isn't a valid comparison. Neurotypical guys communicate they way they were taught to. Aspies communicate as best we can.
 
I have a thick coat. It's very thick and curly at the chest and straighter in places elsewhere. I get restless and a little reckless at the time of the full moon. I get along very well with dogs and they take to me quickly, often more then their owners. I'm definately hetero-only. Women are the best, the most important reason for living, but I would not wish to be one.
 

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