NT & AS English language

[Spiller]

I've come to the conclusion that there are two Englishes.
I talk to people and it seems we understand each other, but it then becomes apparent that we don't.
I finally had an assessment, after waiting a year for an appointment, with NHS Community Mental Health Team and was told that, yes, I appear to have AS traits and can be referred to a psychiatrist for diagnosis and to a councillor for 2-3 years of councelling; they said they're a mental health team who help people with mental health issues; they can see that I have mental health issues; they're not going to help me and I am discharged!
How do they not see that one end of that conversation does not match the other?
I'm aware that I comprehend conversation literally, while NT's tend to use words to convey literally unrelated meaning, but to be told that they can help me, that's what they do, so they're not going to.. ???
I didn't realise that NT's could so thoroughly abandon logic and still believe that they make sense.
So my conclusion is that there is NTEnglish and ASEnglish.. they coincidentally sound alike, but ne'er the twain shall meet!
This is not intended as a rant, though I am sore over it, I'm just interested in anyones comments/experiences/thoughts on the subject, thank you

 

[Judge]

I'm aware that I comprehend conversation literally, while NT's tend to use words to convey literally unrelated meaning, but to be told that they can help me, that's what they do, so they're not going to.. ???
I didn't realise that NT's could so thoroughly abandon logic and still believe that they make sense.
So my conclusion is that there is NTEnglish and ASEnglish.. they coincidentally sound alike, but ne'er the twain shall meet!

Good point. Having a common language in no way guarantees that words and phrases are used in an identical fashion. Especially when it comes to social, neurological majority versus a minority.

 

[Ylva]

They made you wait a year, not to be evaluated, but to evaluate whether or not you were worth evaluating? That is pretty ******, even for NTs.

 

[Anon88]

I too have had many experiences conversing with NTs where I thought we were both on the same page and suddenly the end of the conversation takes a strange turn. And often times there's just the strangest lack of logic on their part. Yet they are absolutely convinced they make sense. Even if I present them with cold, hard facts that contradict what they've just said. I'm always left wondering "Am I the crazy one here???". Lol

 

[Angel123]

I agree with this wholeheartedly. I am an NT and my partner is an aspie. I'm forever being told that I'm making no logical sense but I feel that I am, it often causes a lot of confusion and hurt/arguments. I have started calling what I do illogical logic, because it seems to me that when I talk I'm also talking from an emotional standpoint (which can be illogical sometimes even for me) but it's part of the overall experience so it gets included. Compared to my partner where emotion is a completely separate entity and is dealt with separately from facts. I've found that both of us asking A LOT of clarifying questions helps heaps.

Meanwhile, being given the run around for assessment and provision of help is pretty crap. Considering you mentioned it was a community mental health service I can only imagine that it was the whole system that let you down; community/government based systems are the worst set up things around! I hope you get some help you want from somewhere where there is likely less bureaucracy.

 

[royinpink]

Ugh, that sucks! It sounds like, however, they might actually be the ones being pedantic and literal (and bureaucratic) about language here. Technically AS is a developmental disorder, not a mental health issue like depression and other mood disorders. I'm just trying to figure them out here. Do you think there's any chance that's what they meant, or did they really say that you DO have "mental health" issues (not just AS) and yet refuse to treat you?

 

[Datura]

Okay, but you did get a referral for a propper assessment and counceling, correct? That is at least progress, even if it is excruciatingly slow.

I just went in for what I thought was an ADD assessment today, but turned out to be an intake interview persuant to councelling (I already have a councellor, thank you) and a possible assessment.

It seems that there are countless professionals out there who get paid good money to make people wait, just to foist that person upon an other professional. It makes one feel like an unwanted problem who is being exploited for both time and money.

 

[NiceCupOfTea]

Since you mention the NHS, you must live in the UK. Your being discharged probably has far more to do with oversubscribed and underfunded mental health services being stretched to breaking point than linguistical differences. Were you given a reason for being discharged? In one case, I was booked to have a 10-week course of therapy, but the consultant psychiatrist discharged me from the service, saying I had improved so much I didn't need the service anymore - this meant of course I could not have the 10-week course of therapy. Needless to say, the consultant psychiatrist didn't discuss his decision with me first, or anything ridiculous like that.

Go to your GP and tell him/her what happened. You may not be able to get back in with that particular team, but perhaps you can be referred to a different service.

PS: What's happening to the referral to a psychiatrist for an AS assessment/diagnosis? My advice on that would be to seek a referral to an adult autism service rather than a general psychiatrist who may not have any experience with AS.

 

[Warmheart]

Spiller, can you do that, secure an ASD specialist, rather than just a general psychiatrist? I think that would bring you the best supports and understanding. May this progress, though slow, be moving in a direction to bring you strength and optimism.
I am sending you good thoughts for today.

 

[Spiller]

Since you mention the NHS, you must live in the UK. Your being discharged probably has far more to do with oversubscribed and underfunded mental health services being stretched to breaking point than linguistical differences. Were you given a reason for being discharged? In one case, I was booked to have a 10-week course of therapy, but the consultant psychiatrist discharged me from the service, saying I had improved so much I didn't need the service anymore - this meant of course I could not have the 10-week course of therapy. Needless to say, the consultant psychiatrist didn't discuss his decision with me first, or anything ridiculous like that.

Go to your GP and tell him/her what happened. You may not be able to get back in with that particular team, but perhaps you can be referred to a different service.

PS: What's happening to the referral to a psychiatrist for an AS assessment/diagnosis? My advice on that would be to seek a referral to an adult autism service rather than a general psychiatrist who may not have any experience with AS.

I think, from what I've experienced, that there seem to be linguistic, body language, belief and political differences.

I get the sense that, as there's little mental health funding available now and nothing at all for adult autism, the directive from above is to ignore people in my situation.

I finally got to see a psychiatrist in february, who referred me, due to my careful use of medical cannabis, to a drugs rehabilitation centre - as they deal with this daily they were immediately satisfied that I'm not abusing drugs.. but just to be thorough they allowed me 8 sessions with a councellor who, it turned out, doesn't 'believe' in MMJ, despite all the recent clinical and anecdotal evidence.
I had a complete meltdown after every session as she refused to read or discuss any of the trial results I printed out to show her. I wanted to resolve some personal issues but we couldn't get past her belief that I must be a substance abuser as I was attending the clinic in the first place, I can't have AS as I can feel emotions and I couldn't have been alone all my life - "everyone feels like that".
The limit for me was her saying that she knew more about MMJ, AS and my experience than me - well, clearly not!

I've recently seen the psychiatrist again and.. he just gave me an official diagnosis of AS based on that basic and ambigous 10 question Baron-Cohen test.. just like that! No four hour assessment or tests, nothing!
I'm still confused and a little distrusting of it, tbh, especially as he finished the letter with a description of how calm, pleasant and conversational I was - I actually had to take someone with me that day as I was in the midst of a depressive slump which heightens my anxiety and makes it hard to speak.
I now have to get my GP to write a covering letter reiterating that I suffer with suicidal depression and severe anxiety (my original diagnosis) to offset the psychiatrists letter.

So a councellor advises me based on her own opinions and beliefs - not facts or my story. A psychiatrist doesn't recognise depression and anxiety in association with AS and can bypass the relevent tests to diagnose anyway.

I've been editing this post as it keeps reading like a rant to me, sorry - the point is that the people I've encountered seem to interpret my speech and body language based on their own style of thinking and the cultural and political influences they're exposed to and not, no matter how I try to convey a point, the information I'm actually presenting.

 

[inabox]

I think, from what I've experienced, that there seem to be linguistic, body language, belief and political differences.

I get the sense that, as there's little mental health funding available now and nothing at all for adult autism, the directive from above is to ignore people in my situation.

I finally got to see a psychiatrist in february, who referred me, due to my careful use of medical cannabis, to a drugs rehabilitation centre - as they deal with this daily they were immediately satisfied that I'm not abusing drugs.. but just to be thorough they allowed me 8 sessions with a councellor who, it turned out, doesn't 'believe' in MMJ, despite all the recent clinical and anecdotal evidence.
I had a complete meltdown after every session as she refused to read or discuss any of the trial results I printed out to show her. I wanted to resolve some personal issues but we couldn't get past her belief that I must be a substance abuser as I was attending the clinic in the first place, I can't have AS as I can feel emotions and I couldn't have been alone all my life - "everyone feels like that".
The limit for me was her saying that she knew more about MMJ, AS and my experience than me - well, clearly not!

I've recently seen the psychiatrist again and.. he just gave me an official diagnosis of AS based on that basic and ambigous 10 question Baron-Cohen test.. just like that! No four hour assessment or tests, nothing!
I'm still confused and a little distrusting of it, tbh, especially as he finished the letter with a description of how calm, pleasant and conversational I was - I actually had to take someone with me that day as I was in the midst of a depressive slump which heightens my anxiety and makes it hard to speak.
I now have to get my GP to write a covering letter reiterating that I suffer with suicidal depression and severe anxiety (my original diagnosis) to offset the psychiatrists letter.

So a councellor advises me based on her own opinions and beliefs - not facts or my story. A psychiatrist doesn't recognise depression and anxiety in association with AS and can bypass the relevent tests to diagnose anyway.

I've been editing this post as it keeps reading like a rant to me, sorry - the point is that the people I've encountered seem to interpret my speech and body language based on their own style of thinking and the cultural and political influences they're exposed to and not, no matter how I try to convey a point, the information I'm actually presenting.

Spiller , I hope things find a way of becoming less infuriatingly annoying for you. A few years ago I also experienced the vast inadequacies in the glorious NHS.. and the doctors that leave you wondering what exactly they had been doing for all the years they were supposedly training, and why they decided that as a person with the amount of people skills they don't have they decided that becoming a doctor or councellor was the perfect profession for them to go into.... Yes, I feel your pain....
Hopefully you can get the help you do need and less of the "help" that you don't .. I don't know how you can help it along though.. all i can suggest is to vent on here and just try to keep as calm as possible til it's sorted out.

[Edit: That was sarcasm when I referred to the NHS being "glorious"]