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Nonstop Analyzing After Conversations Makes Me Hesitant to Actually Have Conversations

tree said:
Some are more skilled than others to adapting techniques to benefit clients.
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My psychologist adapted other therapies that were more suitable - as did my therapist before her.

You can find overlaps with CBT in what both of them did in their approach with me -- but both of them departed drastically from the CBT paradigm in multiple ways.

Among them that neither ever attempted, directly or indirectly, to tell me my thoughts were the cause of my painful feelings or cognitive distortions ....because neither of them actually believed that. Neither of them really bought into that idea as always applying to all suffering. That foundational element of CBT itself can be re-traumatizing, disempoweing and hugely invalidating of real lived experience for certain types of trauma -- where making a person feel crazy for what are actually reasonable feelings is not helpful. Helping them manage those feelings (not with self-talk, not with altering beliefs -- with self-regulating activities, with understanding of self and others) and solve problems that lead to traumatic situations is helpful.

You can find parallels with CBT and any therapy that uses any type of self-questioning or critical/logical thought and do so while actually empowering a client rather than telling them their thoughts and preceptions are wrong...which again, can be horrifically harmful to people whose thoughts and feelings are not actually clearly wrong/illogical at all and in whom you are just attempting to instill a positive/optimistic outlook whether or not that outlook is actually justified -- particularly when such an outlook is completely unrealistic it can do more harm than good. (You may argue there are always positives to find...and maybe that is true but trying to focus on a positive thing is not the same as saying that seeing an actually awful situation for what it is is a cognitive distortion and should be ignored or disbelieved.)

CBT is not suitable for all people in all situations (and for me personally it is never suitable in any situation). That is true of all therapies - not suitable for all people in all situations. Because there are many valid, healthy ways to think and to live and often many different possible solutions to a problem...not all of them "gel" with every person.
 
Dagan said:
I certainly do this. It's more concerning either very important and/or first time conversations with folks, though. If it's conversations with people I have known for a while, I rarely do it.
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I still do it every time. Even with my wife of 25 years.

It’s probably why we’re still married.
 
Maybe try asking people you know well how they percieved things. It might help you recalibrate your self-criticism to something more accurrate.
 
the_tortoise said:
My psychologist adapted other therapies that were more suitable - as did my therapist before her.

You can find overlaps with CBT in what both of them did in their approach with me -- but both of them departed drastically from the CBT paradigm in multiple ways.

Among them that neither ever attempted, directly or indirectly, to tell me my thoughts were the cause of my painful feelings or cognitive distortions ....because neither of them actually believed that. Neither of them really bought into that idea as always applying to all suffering. That foundational element of CBT itself can be re-traumatizing, disempoweing and hugely invalidating of real lived experience for certain types of trauma -- where making a person feel crazy for what are actually reasonable feelings is not helpful. Helping them manage those feelings (not with self-talk, not with altering beliefs -- with self-regulating activities, with understanding of self and others) and solve problems that lead to traumatic situations is helpful.

You can find parallels with CBT and any therapy that uses any type of self-questioning or critical/logical thought and do so while actually empowering a client rather than telling them their thoughts and preceptions are wrong...which again, can be horrifically harmful to people whose thoughts and feelings are not actually clearly wrong/illogical at all and in whom you are just attempting to instill a positive/optimistic outlook whether or not that outlook is actually justified -- particularly when such an outlook is completely unrealistic it can do more harm than good. (You may argue there are always positives to find...and maybe that is true but trying to focus on a positive thing is not the same as saying that seeing an actually awful situation for what it is is a cognitive distortion and should be ignored or disbelieved.)

CBT is not suitable for all people in all situations (and for me personally it is never suitable in any situation). That is true of all therapies - not suitable for all people in all situations. Because there are many valid, healthy ways to think and to live and often many different possible solutions to a problem...not all of them "gel" with every person.
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I'm wondering if they weren't very good at CBT or didn't research the statistics and prior research of trauma because gaslighting you shouldn't have been considered a valid use of CBT.

It still doesn't mean that it's a good match but I think that you may not have seen the best examples.


That having been said, the government has a vested interest in maintaining a population, so they aren't going to allow a provider to tell you (even if it is logically true) (tw) "yes your life is miserable enough that you should end it." But that is a political task that invades the space, not a logical one.

Personally I think that CPT--cognitive processing therapy--is pretty solid. It might tend to avoid those issues. Instead of directly gaslighting you it says.
Original thought "I shouldn't have opened the door for him. That made it my fault."
Challenge: "do you remember why you decided to open the door"
(5 months later when he tries again and says he's going to break the door down if you don't open it.)
Realization: the door was weak and if he had broken it down then, I wouldn't have had any protection that night and I had to keep the whole fundraiser's worth of money overnight until the bank opened in the morning, so it seemed smarter just to open it.
 
Poppy98 said:
m wondering if they weren't very good at CBT or didn't research the statistics and prior research of trauma because gaslighting you shouldn't have been considered a valid use of CBT.
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No, trust me. They were not the first nor last person to try it. It does not work for all people and it harms me and confuses me no matter who does it,

I know myself and my own experience. I have seen countless therapists. I have done much research.

TO EVERYONE:

I do not understand why it is so hard for everyone to accept that perhaps my judgement is sound and the fact that my experince does not match theirs or most people's or the official narrative does not mean I am wrong about my own self and life.

I AM DONE POSTING PERSONAL
EXPERIENCES HERE BECAUSE I AM SO SO SO SICK OF THIS

EVERYONE BACK OFF
RIGHT NOW AND FOREVER; THE QUESTIONING OF ME AND INSISTENCE EVERYTHING I SAY RE: MYSELF AND THERAPIES IS SERIOUSLY EXCESSIVE AND I NO LONGER CARE ABOUT ANYONE'S GOOD INTENTIONS; AND AT THIS POINT YES I AM VERY VERY TOUCHY ABOUT IT SO AGAIN:

PLEASE BACK OFF.

ANY DISCUSSION OF WHAT I NEED OR OF MY PERCEPTIONS AND EXPERIENCES WITH ANY TYPE OF THERAPY ARE NOW 100% UNWELCOME.

LEAVE IT ALONE!
 
the_tortoise said:
No, trust me. They were not the first nor last person to try it. It does not work for all people and it harms me and confuses me no matter who does it,

I know myself and my own experience. I have seen countless therapists. I have done much research.

TO EVERYONE:

I do not understand why it is so hard for everyone to accept that perhaps my judgement is sound and the fact that my experince does not match theirs or most people's or the official narrative does not mean I am wrong about my own self and life.

I AM DONE POSTING PERSONAL
EXPERIENCES HERE BECAUSE I AM SO SO SO SICK OF THIS

EVERYONE BACK OFF
RIGHT NOW AND FOREVER; THE QUESTIONING OF ME AND INSISTENCE EVERYTHING I SAY RE: MYSELF AND THERAPIES IS SERIOUSLY EXCESSIVE AND I NO LONGER CARE ABOUT ANYONE'S GOOD INTENTIONS; AND AT THIS POINT YES I AM VERY VERY TOUCHY ABOUT IT SO AGAIN:

PLEASE BACK OFF.

ANY DISCUSSION OF WHAT I NEED OR OF MY PERCEPTIONS AND EXPERIENCES WITH ANY TYPE OF THERAPY ARE NOW 100% UNWELCOME.

LEAVE IT ALONE!
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Okay, I apologize. I wasn't trying to upset you. You seemed nice and I was hoping that it would make you feel better not worse.
 
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Poppy98 said:
Okay, I apologize. I wasn't trying to upset you.
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apology accepted but not really needed - my upset reaction does not mean you did
anything wrong I am just sick of the questioning and disbelief. I know you did not mean to upset me. My "to everyone" bit truly was directed at everyone, not specifically you.

I am still recovering from recent experience of what I personally (but unequivocally) characterize as "harrassment/bullying" about something related, and seriously wish I could scrub all posts I have ever made that could garner more questioning about this issue from the site. The harrassment/bullying thing took what was previously just very annoying and made it actually mildly traumatizing and it will be a long time before I get over it.

So everyone should leave me alone about this.

[late esit:] Also I do not feel bad nor have I ever felt bad in any way about the fact CBT is a confusing unhelpful nightmare for me. There is no reason for me to feel bad about that. Everyone is different and there is no shame in that.
 
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@Poppy98 please don't feel bad - you could not predict how this upsets me. You are not to blame for how touchy i have become about anyone challenging my assertions of the realities of my own self and experience -- like the sane, respectful person you are you explained yourself and let the issue go once I said "No you are wrong, this is how it is for me". I am reacting to an accumulation of experiences with many others over years that was massively exacerbated by recent harrassment/bullying that you could not know about.

Sorry I am not as nice about everything as you hoped. I am human and I have flaws. I try not to overreact but i do not always succeed and I am tired of being questioned about the same true things about myself and my life over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over ad infinitum. My patience is used up.
 
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