Functionality in ASD1

[Thinx]

I was interested when people who are ASD 2 and others were discussing functionality, especially when people were contrasting their challenges IRL as opposed to their verbal skills online, and people were discussing many challenges to how they can practically function as opposed to apparent verbal and thinking abilities. @Ella Spell posted a visual test result showing a skewed picture of attributes, which seemed relevant.

I self diagnose as ASD 1, and I have a skewed experience whereby verbal and thinking processes, whilst having some challenges, such as slow processing, seem more functional than some areas that require physical coordination or other elements of functionality than verbal. Struggling to express this, hence the thread, as I wonder what others would say about how this works for them? I know there's plenty on here very handy and physically skilled so it's clearly not not necessarily about a thinking / doing split, exactly, and I can get good at 'doing' things, particularly if explicitly shown the movements involved.

An example for me of how this difference can manifest, would be, my friend wants me to help carry an item of shelving. We pick it up, but I realise it's heavier than I thought. I have to put it down, and my thinking is telling me that I can manage it if we lay it down and carry it longways instead of vertical. I intuit that will spread the load. But my friend is getting frustrated and calling out instructions. Albeit my friend has full on ADHD so that's part of the challenge here. My friend starts grabbing the item and dragging it and calling out orders of where I should stand etc but I can't respond easily because I can't tell if they know what I meant about it being too heavy upright, hence I want a slower, clear verbal interaction (but somehow we did soon lay it down and I could help carry it that way, as I had thought.)

However, thinking about this typical incident I was realising how what I seemed to need was for the process of carrying the item to stop, and a verbal exchange to take place, where I said my suggestion, and my friend understood it and then the carrying recommenced, I needed words to be involved. Stress clearly also played a part. We got there anyway, because I can allow for the ADHD and they had heard my suggestion.

I'd be interested if anyone's got thoughts about this or examples about practical functioning issues and how it relates to thinking or verbalising?

 

[Aspychata]

Not sure if this applies, however l notice l hit a stumbling block if the situation is new and l am being asked to do something as l am thinking it out. If l don't necessarily agree with it, and l am extremely disengaged until l go home and rerun the circumstances thru my mini recorder to find out why l was blocked.

In this case, l realize something is amiss and as long as l am not in danger, l continue to operate at that level.

 

[Thinx]

Not sure if this applies, however l notice l hit a stumbling block if the situation is new and l am being asked to do something as l am thinking it out. If l don't necessarily agree with it, and l am extremely disengaged until l go home and rerun the circumstances thru my mini recorder to find out why l was blocked.

In this case, l realize something is amiss and as long as l am not in danger, l continue to operate at that level.

Yes that's an example of the kind of issue, I think. I am thinking about areas where ASD 1 or Aspergers may have well functioning thinking, but have challenges to take action, or work out what action to take. I think it mixes in with dyspraxia probably, and being clumsy? But maybe some people wouldn't find difficulties with active things, but be more challenged verbalising?

 

[Progster]

Such tasks require a lot of multi-tasking, left brain hemisphere and right hemishphere activities which need to happen in tandem. I think that in my case at least, difficulties arise in coordination between right hemisphere and left hemisphere activities (?) It's difficult to coordiate, or switch between activities using different brain hemishperes. I have similar issues while driving - when I'm driving I find it hard to talk at the same time.

 

[Thinx]

Such tasks require a lot of multi-tasking, left brain hemisphere and right hemishphere activities which need to happen in tandem. I think that in my case at least, difficulties arise in coordination between right hemisphere and left hemisphere activities (?) It's difficult to coordiate, or switch between activities using different brain hemishperes. I have similar issues while driving - when I'm driving I find it hard to talk at the same time.

That's interesting, yes, so it may be left and right brain coordination issues, and presumably that's also why I can't multi task? Especially around actions, so when I play the guitar, which I took years learning and still can hardly do, I can't sing at the same time, for example. Though some would say that's a blessing. I really wish I could though.

Left brain is logical reasoning and right brain is creativity, I believe, in terms of general functioning? And I can certainly function pretty well in aspects of both areas, but it's the tasks that might want both areas at the same time then, that are problematic. This is maybe due to the deficit in synaptic connexions in autistic brains, that is currently being researched? Interesting.

 

[Progster]

That's interesting, yes, so it may be left and right brain coordination issues, and presumably that's also why I can't multi task? Especially around actions, so when I play the guitar, which I took years learning and still can hardly do, I can't sing at the same time, for example. Though some would say that's a blessing. I really wish I could though.

Left brain is logical reasoning and right brain is creativity, I believe, in terms of general functioning? And I can certainly function pretty well in aspects of both areas, but it's the tasks that might want both areas at the same time then, that are problematic. This is maybe due to the deficit in synaptic connexions in autistic brains, that is currently being researched? Interesting.

It's a theory I read in a book by Donna Williams, I don't know if there has been any actual research into it, but what she was saying seemed to make sense to me.

Yes, right hemisphere is creativity, imagining. Left hemisphere is logic, language and reasoning. So, in the bookcase carrying task, you needed to imagine how the bookcase needed to be carried and then postioned, for which, presumably, you'd use your right hemisphere. Then, language and verbal processing of your friend's instructions takes place in the left hemisphere. It might explain why you needed to stop carrying the bookcase in order to speak, or why it is hard to me to speak while driving - it's hard to switch from right brain activities to left brain activities. Hard to multitask.

 

[Thinx]

It's a theory I read in a book by Donna Williams, I don't know if there has been any actual research into it, but what she was saying seemed to make sense to me.

Yes, right hemisphere is creativity, imagining. Left hemisphere is logic, language and reasoning. So, in the bookcase carrying task, you needed to imagine how the bookcase needed to be carried and then postioned, for which, presumably, you'd use your right hemisphere. Then, language and verbal processing of your friend's instructions takes place in the left hemisphere. It might explain why you needed to stop carrying the bookcase in order to speak, or why it is hard to me to speak while driving - it's hard to switch from right brain activities to left brain activities. Hard to multitask.

Yes, I see. That makes sense.

Yes there definitely is research going on around this, along with a lot of research about the brain and genetics in autism.

I needed to stop in order to speak but also then needed further discussion to check what was meant to happen next after I got hold of the shelves in the way they suggested, I know from experience others expect me to intuit that somehow, then off they go but I have no clue what's supposed to happen next and it may end in tears. Or dropped furniture. Or a back injury. But the extra questions were interpreted as resistance to the idea suggested, as is often the case, presumably because what to do seems obvious to many people?

 

[Aspychata]

Yes that's an example of the kind of issue, I think. I am thinking about areas where ASD 1 or Aspergers may have well functioning thinking, but have challenges to take action, or work out what action to take. I think it mixes in with dyspraxia probably, and being clumsy? But maybe some people wouldn't find difficulties with active things, but be more challenged verbalising?

True - l draw a blank because l don't know why l disconnected. Later l do come back now and state what issues l was having so they don't think l am a complete (fill in blank).

 

[Progster]

Yes, I see. That makes sense.

Yes there definitely is research going on around this, along with a lot of research about the brain and genetics in autism.

I needed to stop in order to speak but also then needed further discussion to check what was meant to happen next after I got hold of the shelves in the way they suggested, I know from experience others expect me to intuit that somehow, then off they go but I have no clue what's supposed to happen next and it may end in tears. Or dropped furniture. Or a back injury. But the extra questions were interpreted as resistance to the idea suggested, as is often the case, presumably because what to do seems obvious to many people?

It's a theory of mind thing, that people have a tendency to assume that you are seeing and thinking things as they are, they subconsciously assume that you know what they do, so you don't get the full picture, then they expect you to be able to fill in the gaps - which can be difficult and unfair. In my opinion, it's a communication deficit on their part - if you are communicating instructions to others, it's up to you to be clear and communicate those instructions in a way that the other person will understand. In that particular situation, what needed to happen was for your friend to explain and make everything clear before the moving of the shelves began, and also to check that you had fully understood.

 

[Thinx]

True - l draw a blank because l don't know why l disconnected. Later l do come back now and state what issues l was having so they don't think l am a complete (fill in blank).

Yes that's slow processing I think, which also happens to me, I don't know what to say because my processing hasn't caught up with the discussion usually, but I may feel uncomfortable. It's all part of the same thing, I guess. But it's more obvious when complex tasks are involved.

I would need to write down the steps of a new task, for example something new to do on the computer, and keep looking at my notes each time I do it for a while.

 

[Karamazov]

Yes, I have difficulty lining those general areas up too, I can’t perform an activity and listen to someone else talk at the same time, can’t listen to someone and think of responses simultaneously (tbh, can’t listen to someone and think at the same time at all: when someone starts talking, my thoughts disintegrate and are lost)

I suspect I have ASD level 1: and am currently in pursuit of an assessment.

I’ve taken the same test as the member in the other thread: it’s comes up if you type “rdos” into a search engine.
My graphic looked like this:

 

[Thinx]

Yes, I have difficulty lining those general areas up too, I can’t perform an activity and listen to someone else talk at the same time, can’t listen to someone and think of responses simultaneously (tbh, can’t listen to someone and think at the same time at all: when someone starts talking, my thoughts disintegrate and are lost)

I suspect I have ASD level 1: and am currently in pursuit of an assessment.

I’ve taken the same test as the member in the other thread: it’s comes up if you type “rdos” into a search engine.
My graphic looked like this:

Yes that's the one.

I was thinking particularly about how the differently functioning brain produces differences in my connection to actions, aswell as in communication and social situations which is what I have focussed on more in the past. And what the strategies are or could be around that.

I don't think I would get a diagnosis, as I have learned to mask, always seemed to cope and had work, and finances are ok etc, although in reality I have struggled a lot with any unstructured social interaction which does make life very different and puzzling if undiagnosed autism is the issue.

However I am confident that this is the issue, I did a lot of research and had training and worked with people with Aspergers and their families, plus did so much personal therapy that in the end only features of ASD1 were left.

But since realising, I have been piecing together what lies beneath the mask...

 

[Aspychata]

Yes that's the one.

I was thinking particularly about how the differently functioning brain produces differences in my connection to actions, aswell as in communication and social situations which is what I have focussed on more in the past. And what the strategies are or could be around that.

I don't think I would get a diagnosis, as I have learned to mask, always seemed to cope and had work, and finances are ok etc, although in reality I have struggled a lot with any unstructured social interaction which does make life very different and puzzling if undiagnosed autism is the issue.

However I am confident that this is the issue, I did a lot of research and had training and worked with people with Aspergers and their families, plus did so much personal therapy that in the end only features of ASD1 were left.

But since realising, I have been piecing together what lies beneath the mask...

Breaking down our " think" patterns helps us understand bigger pitfalls when it does happen. l tend to think why l hit a stumbling block then discuss it with that subset group and that can release me.

And l feel like the giant question mark tattoo has finally left my forehead. Maybe the asshole tat has dissipated too.

 

[Dadamen]

I am a bit late to my peers with most of the physycal things, but I learn them in my tempo and probably will be indepandant in adulthood. Cognitive and verbal things are not a problem.

 

[SDRSpark]

I'm self identified, and have no idea where I would fit (somewhere between 1 and 2 I suspect. Having lived my entire life without diagnosis and support, though, it's hard to say. Does the use of internet for social interaction count as "support"?)

I'm a mixed bag when it comes to functionality. I definitely have an easier time communicating in writing than I do verbally (though to be fair, my verbal skills may have suffered a bit from lack of practice and reliance on communication online as opposed to in person. It's entirely possible that I would be far better at verbal communication if I were to make an effort to practice it regularly.) I do stutter sometimes (not all the time, but often enough to be noticeable. Maybe more than I realize.)

I have real difficulty figuring out my "place" in a conversation, and when it's my turn to speak - I wind up talking over people; despite having been frequently scolded for "interrupting" as a child, and knowing full well that talking over people is rude, I haven't been able to learn this skill. I'm 32 years old now, I don't think it'll ever change. It's like my brain can't process the conversation fast enough to keep up, and the result is something like audio lag in a conference call.

I am clumsy, but I have a high level of fine motor skills (better than many people) and am good at individual sports (but not team sports.) I had difficulty with learning physical skills when I was younger, such as learning to ride a bike, learning to snap my fingers, learning to swim. As an adult I seem to learn a lot of things more quickly than I did as a child.

 

[Dadamen]

Learning to swim was a pain for me, failed to learn it at mandatory swimming school, but learned it at the seaside over years. Riding a bike was also a problem, especially without aid wheels. I learned to ride a bike at the age of 7 and to swim at 10, but I know that many children know both at 5 or 6. Then in 5th grade I had a demanding P.E. teacher and it was a nightmare for me. Thanks god that now in high school I have a mild P.E.

 

[Statest16]

I'm DXed ASD level 1.I did a lot of drugs when I was young which damaged my neurological system.And years on benzodiazepines have given me cognitive issues.Between legal and illegal drugs,I'm about really a 1.5 at this point.The 3 level system is over simplistic I think.

 

[Tom]

I have experienced that difference in approach in carrying things so many times. My Dad, who was fairly short always stressed to me the need to carry things or do heavy tasks smart and safely and not just fast. That is agreeable with what I think is my natural (perhaps Aspie) inclination to prefer to take things in clear steps as opposed to barreling forward. I think I need to reassess the situation each step of the way. It makes some frustrated/impatient but its best not to shortcut safety.

 

[Karamazov]

@Thinx I don’t interview for jobs very well at all, and tend to find the application forms confusing (the free-form answer questions really). Have had a few jobs, but they haven’t really worked out all that well... I think the longest lasted 4 months.
I gave up on full time employment and do part time self employment/keep house.
(Mrs K is full time self employed and has helped me enormously with having work to do and money in my bank account).

@SDRSpark do you mean a nervous stammer?
I have that, I don’t get into situations which trigger it if I can avoid doing so anymore, mine’s very noticeable: I loop on the same syllable multiple times in a row... it’s like the routine for forming the sound from muscle movements has been misfiled.

I resonated very strongly with what you wrote about figuring out your “place” in conversations.
I also struggle with subject changes: I’ll sit there silent wanting to contribute, and then I’ll do it when a gap comes and “we’re not talking about history any more, we’ve moved on to boxing” or equivalent turns out to be the situation.

Got the clumsy in general but with fine motor skills combination too: drawing and music here.

@Dadamen what I really remember noticing myself was swings and shoelaces: can’t remember when I worked out swings but I know my sister taught me and she’s two years younger, shoelaces I didn’t work out till I was twelve... and they still tend to be a bit sloppy and either too tight or continually coming undone.

P.E... *shudders* ...we had Games as well as P.E at my school.
Mandatory rugby in the rain for all the boys

 

[Thinx]

Yes I have that difficulty of joining in to a group conversation, I do things like try to speak first or else wait till last, in meetings, but in unstructured social situations I just don't speak, unless it's one to one. Or if I know people well, I would probably just talk over someone, in order to join in.

Seems like there is quite a lot of similar experience of social communication issues and coping with slow processing, in what people are saying.