Apsies Drawn to Other Aspies?

[2010Dolby]

Ill try to keep this short and too the point.

An old co-worker and I have been hanging out and going to a church group together. I could tell as soon as I met him that he seemed pretty Aspie-like. Very very very smart, socially awkward, clumsy. Everyone loves him though, hes just so cool that its hard NOT to like him.

Me on the other hand, I was raised in a sub-culture where its only acceptable to hid your intelligence and blend in with everyone else. So I've spent the last 8 years of my life mastering the skill of disguising my Aspie traits. I can guarantee its undetectable to anyone. Everyone that I know assumes Im a "dumb-beer drinking-jock" (which to be fair, is partly true :lol

So Im fairly sure he's an Aspie, and no one knows that I am.

He's actually pretty popular, but he seems to always want to talk to ME. Always wants to hang out with and party with ME. Dont get me wrong, he's cool as hell and a blast to hang out with. But it got me wondering... is there something about us that makes us socially drawn towards other Aspies? Like a sub-concious unknown thing?

 

[King_Oni]

I don't know if it's the subconcious thing...

I can however state that people I get along with are either on or just on the border of being on the spectrum; however, I wouldn't say aspie, but just autism in general

- My best friend has an official diagnosis for being on the autism spectrum
- My best childhood friend is on the border
- A friend of his (which I can get along with perfectly) is on it
- My former best friend was in the process of seeing a therapist for his diagnosis

And while I got more into reading stuff about the spectrum it made me think even more so, that even my ex-girlfriend (who is the sister of that aforementioned childhood friend), was really on the border.

And then there's some people I know with PDD-NOS, which I can get along with better than NT people. It came down to situations where I actually talked to some girl a few years ago, and I really liked her and I told her... "look, I know there's something not entirely right with you, I can sense it... is there anything you care to tell me?" and she kinda spilled the beans in confirming that she had PDD.

In a way I actually feel like NT people for most part (on a friendship basis) think I'm totally untollerable, however all those (near)ASD folks I know think I'm a blast to be around with.... (or at least they give me that idea)

And actually, if look around on this board, I think this is the merriest bunch of people I could be around (or even throw a party with; would be weird though... the aspie-only party, afterwards to be followed by a straight to dvd edition of "Aspies gone wild")

 

[2010Dolby]

Ya man, it just seems like we get along better with other people that understand us. Id say about 98% of my friends are complete neurotypicals. There's nothing wrong with it, they're cool and we usually all get along great. But there seems to be a point where the friendship wont get any closer. I can go hunting, fishing, and gravel travel with them but we never seem to actually depend on each other.

In a way I actually feel like NT people for most part (on a friendship basis) think I'm totally untollerable, however all those (near)ASD folks I know think I'm a blast to be around with.... (or at least they give me that idea)

And actually, if look around on this board, I think this is the merriest bunch of people I could be around (or even throw a party with; would be weird though... the aspie-only party, afterwards to be followed by a straight to dvd edition of "Aspies gone wild")

Dude! That'd be righteous! We can all meet on the gravel road two miles north of my town, start a bonfire, and have a good old fashioned high school party haha. Seriously though, I love the idea of going to a party of nothing but Aspies. Or even meeting another officially diagnosed person on the spectrum in real life so I dont have to fake my normalness haha

 

[Droopy]

There's nothing wrong with it, they're cool and we usually all get along great. But there seems to be a point where the friendship wont get any closer.

I can relate to that.

Seriously though, I love the idea of going to a party of nothing but Aspies. Or even meeting another officially diagnosed person on the spectrum in real life so I dont have to fake my normalness haha

Now that would be interesting!

 

[King_Oni]

I love the idea of going to a party of nothing but Aspies. Or even meeting another officially diagnosed person on the spectrum in real life so I dont have to fake my normalness haha

I do wonder though... if there's still a line in between the "cool people" that are the center of attention and the people who stand in the corner... afterall, the corner might get crowded... with the cool people.

Or do we need a load of cats, because of the stereotype that "we" are likely to pet a cat instead of hang out with others...

Also, does awkwardness work like math? If 2 people are feeling awkward, would they cancel each other out?

Oh man, the silly (but funny) ideas one can have with this hypothetical situation

 

[Droopy]

King_Oni, you have some funny thoughts.

 

[kasmanaft08]

And actually, if look around on this board, I think this is the merriest bunch of people I could be around (or even throw a party with; would be weird though... the aspie-only party, afterwards to be followed by a straight to dvd edition of "Aspies gone wild")

I've thought about that sort of thing. I'd be down for an all-Aspie party. Too bad everyone here lives too far away.

Ya man, it just seems like we get along better with other people that understand us. Id say about 98% of my friends are complete neurotypicals. There's nothing wrong with it, they're cool and we usually all get along great. But there seems to be a point where the friendship wont get any closer.

This is really how I've always felt in NT friendships or relationships, even the best ones, there always seems to be some sort of block where we just don't get each other on a really basic level. I never have felt fully connected to any of them, and have always felt like sort of the weird one out. Even when I had "normal" friendships, it was kind of like the sitcom Seinfeld, where everyone in the group was the basic three and I was Kramar, who just kind of appeared as a sort of novelty, but was never really a part of the group.
Maybe that is a bad analogy, but, eh, you know. ^_^

Also, does awkwardness work like math? If 2 people are feeling awkward, would they cancel each other out?

I do kind of think this would be true, though. Just by relativity...even if you weren't the same exact kind of weird, you would still have that understanding and would feel more comfortable to be yourself. I found the more normal the person, the more uncomfortable I am around them and tend to get along with them less well.

With all that said, I could be idealizing a bit. But that's not how I feel when I talk to people on here or on Skype, I can sense a difference then even. But I haven't met another Aspie in real life, so it's really hard to say. It would be cool, I think, though, if some of us got together somehow in the future. Even if I'm not involved, it would be ineresting to hear about anyways.

 

[inflammablefish]

there was a genome study done (maybe I'll find it and post it) that showed that groups of friends either all shared a common gene or did not posses said gene and somehow subconsciously they were drawn to each other. The same results were shown for couples and a certain gene that relates to sickness: one partner has it while the other partner does not so that when one partner is ill the other will not be sick so as to care for them and then vice-versa.

It might also be said that the particular aspie gene is somehow subconsciously picked-up on by other aspies so they will drift together.

 

[2010Dolby]

This is really how I've always felt in NT friendships or relationships, even the best ones, there always seems to be some sort of block where we just don't get each other on a really basic level. I never have felt fully connected to any of them, and have always felt like sort of the weird one out. Even when I had "normal" friendships, it was kind of like the sitcom Seinfeld, where everyone in the group was the basic three and I was Kramar, who just kind of appeared as a sort of novelty, but was never really a part of the group.
Maybe that is a bad analogy, but, eh, you know. ^_^

That actually seems like a spot on analogy. But I don't mind being Kramer. How many people would watch Seinfeld without Kramer?

there was a genome study done (maybe I'll find it and post it) that showed that groups of friends either all shared a common gene or did not posses said gene and somehow subconsciously they were drawn to each other. The same results were shown for couples and a certain gene that relates to sickness: one partner has it while the other partner does not so that when one partner is ill the other will not be sick so as to care for them and then vice-versa.

It might also be said that the particular aspie gene is somehow subconsciously picked-up on by other aspies so they will drift together.

Ah-ha! I would love to see that study! It's exactly what I was wondering. I might have to do some internet searching after hearing that something like this was actually researched. Thank you so much inflammablefish!

 

[jaws]

I recall something about a study done with people on the spectrum having better facial recognition to Neanderthal faces than Homosapien faces. There was also some study that thought there might be a link to Autism and a recessive Neanderthal gene. So there might be a like species attraction between those of us on the spectrum. However, I've met other aspies that I don't get along with as well as others.

 

[King_Oni]

I recall something about a study done with people on the spectrum having better facial recognition to Neanderthal faces than Homosapien faces. There was also some study that thought there might be a link to Autism and a recessive Neanderthal gene. So there might be a like species attraction between those of us on the spectrum. However, I've met other aspies that I don't get along with as well as others.

Well, I don't think that only the aspie aspect counts. Personality does come with it, just like NT people can have a hard time dealing with other NT's.

 

[slartibartfastibast]

I recall something about a study done with people on the spectrum having better facial recognition to Neanderthal faces than Homosapien faces. There was also some study that thought there might be a link to Autism and a recessive Neanderthal gene. So there might be a like species attraction between those of us on the spectrum. However, I've met other aspies that I don't get along with as well as others.

Autism: The Eusocial Hominid Hypothesis

 

[kasmanaft08]

I met up with one recently.

We've talked for months on Skype/Webcam (constantly), so I guess it was a bit different in that sense since we pretty much knew each other well beforehand, but I'm still really happy about how it went. I did actually notice some differences though-but they were all good, I think.

I was surprised how much more comfortable I felt in general, particularly in public and crowded places- where even people I know well tend to make me feel more anxious about how I am in those situations. But it was different, since I didn't feel like I had to justify my actions or over-explain too much...I could just be honest about things and I didn't feel weird about it. I actually didn't realize how much of that justification and 'tolerance' I did until then. It was always my default thought, so it made a lot of work for me to avoid misunderstandings and whatever else comes with people finding me weird or annoying.

One I didn't think about though, that he had mentioned a few times is that he finds my body language especially difficult to read. I guess it's the same with anyone, but I guess it would make sense if you're not good at reading it, you're not good at showing it. It may make that a bit more difficult I think if you're used to trying to figure out Neurotypical body language. I also felt a bit confused/paranoid by it sometimes, but it was actually a good thing I think...because I could just ask and since he felt the same, I think, it didn't feel like a "weird question" (particularly if you ask them often, which I am prone to do...). It actually made me more comfortable later because I didn't feel like I had to assume everything and get some backlash or paranoia from it later.

It's difficult to explain, but it just felt more honest than anything else. I'm not saying all neurotypicals are liars, but it's just more complicated and things are hidden more I think, which makes asking or answering honestly really difficult sometimes. Also getting answers that are feel a bit more metaphorical and multi-layered often make things worse for me. So it was quite a relief to not have that....even though I had to actually get used to not feeling weird around someone else for once.

So yeah, it went well.

Spoiler

Also, I had to work hard to make this post as un-cheesy and un-biased as possible, since I'm sure you guys don't want me to SPAM the forum with me going on about falling in love with this guy and whatever uncharacteristically cheesy thought I have. But we plan on meeting again before I leave.

 

[King_Oni]

Actually re-reading your post a couple of times, especially on the body language thing... also in line with the tests/questions my therapist gave me earlier this week on recognizing emotions in faces/eyes... I think I have a total blindness up to the fact that it's not even that I don't recognize it, but I just don't notice it if people have a different posture. The same could be said about me acting out of body language... a therapist once told me "you're a closed person" cause I had my arms across when I was sitting at the table. To me, it had nothing to do with that... I just felt weird not knowing where I'd put my arms. I should add that in that same convo I went up to putting my hands on the table, letting them hang beside me... just because I had no f'n clue where to put them.

I think it's funny how people judge you on body language if in fact your use of body language isn't something you're intending or even familiar with using in the first place. Made me wonder if that guy even had someone across the table who was possibly an aspie (or somewhere along that spectrum).

 

[kasmanaft08]

Actually re-reading your post a couple of times, especially on the body language thing... also in line with the tests/questions my therapist gave me earlier this week on recognizing emotions in faces/eyes... I think I have a total blindness up to the fact that it's not even that I don't recognize it, but I just don't notice it if people have a different posture. The same could be said about me acting out of body language... a therapist once told me "you're a closed person" cause I had my arms across when I was sitting at the table. To me, it had nothing to do with that... I just felt weird not knowing where I'd put my arms. I should add that in that same convo I went up to putting my hands on the table, letting them hang beside me... just because I had no f'n clue where to put them.

I think it's funny how people judge you on body language if in fact your use of body language isn't something you're intending or even familiar with using in the first place. Made me wonder if that guy even had someone across the table who was possibly an aspie (or somewhere along that spectrum).

I do the arm thing as well, actually, so I think you know what I mean. A lot of my body language I've told comes off as "uncomfortable" or "defensive" except it's really nothing more than what was comfortable at the time. Usually if I'm not holding onto something or myself, I'm tapping and stimming about with my hands, which people tend to find more distracting. It feels like when people try to read my body language, it's usually wrong. Even more frustrating though is when people ask me and I tell them, they take the body language interpretation first and throw out any answer I give them. So I think it's odd, given your therapist knows you have difficulty reading body language, that he would rely on his interpretations so much.

I think I was suprised by the body language thing since it's not something people think about, though. From all that I would make a good bet that body language isn't completely innate, but socially learned for the most part- particularly the more complicated ones. It's also how I feel about the whole "Aspie stare" thing. Looking someone in the eye isn't something that comes naturally, so it's never quite right somehow...even if you are doing it naturally, if that makes any sense. I guess the body language we'd give would kind of come off the same- the basics are there, but I guess something doesn't appear quite right about it.

 

[King_Oni]

I do the arm thing as well, actually, so I think you know what I mean. A lot of my body language I've told comes off as "uncomfortable" or "defensive" except it's really nothing more than what was comfortable at the time. Usually if I'm not holding onto something or myself, I'm tapping and stimming about with my hands, which people tend to find more distracting. It feels like when people try to read my body language, it's usually wrong. Even more frustrating though is when people ask me and I tell them, they take the body language interpretation first and throw out any answer I give them. So I think it's odd, given your therapist knows you have difficulty reading body language, that he would rely on his interpretations so much.

I think I was suprised by the body language thing since it's not something people think about, though. From all that I would make a good bet that body language isn't completely innate, but socially learned for the most part- particularly the more complicated ones. It's also how I feel about the whole "Aspie stare" thing. Looking someone in the eye isn't something that comes naturally, so it's never quite right somehow...even if you are doing it naturally, if that makes any sense. I guess the body language we'd give would kind of come off the same- the basics are there, but I guess something doesn't appear quite right about it.

That therapist was the one from the job agency, and I only spoke to him 2 hours once. And he kinda put me on the spot saying I was "defensive"... i'd hardly call that a worthy judgment. He did however tell me that judging on a lot of my behaviour, as well as understanding, and above average verbal capabilities and all, he thought I might be on the spectrum, thus he suggested that somewhere in the end. But I guess he just noted body language within the first 5 minutes, wrote it down and put it in his notes, cause in his final assessment I couldn't find anything that said "might be on the spectrum" (or anything like that; possibly due to putting that label on me would make me a rather long term case for him instead of just assessing if I could simply get any random job).

As for body language... I tend to use my hands quite often and gestures and stuff like that, but it really depends on what I'm explaining and to whom I'm speaking.

My current therapist is also testing me on AD(H)D because I apparently use my hands a lot, which could just as well be stimming... it's weird how presumably stimming in social situations kinda moves away if you are aware of it. But if I'm not aware of it and just sitting still but have a slight discomfort (for example because of noise that annoys me), my therapist has noted that I move my hands or feet a lot.

As for the aspie stare... I don't have a problem with looking people in the eye, yet people told me I make them really uncomfy because I can turn it into a staring game. Weirdest thing some people told me was that apparently even when I'm looking people in the eye it's a really, really blank stare as if there's no one there... that apparently freaks people out. (someone once asked me if I was blind or had some kind of problem with my eyes).

 

[Gomendosi]

I only know one person who has Aspergers and he and I don’t get along because he is a child diagnosis and his parents do anything at all for him, like they are trying to make it up to him or something and so he has openly admitted to me that he is playing on the whole thing so as to “cash in”.

I would dearly love to meet more people of a like mind but there are no Aspergical people in my current view of things, I could go look for them I suppose but that not really what I’m about, at all. Guess it’s kind of weird that I challenge myself almost daily by talking to strangers at work and yet I won’t deliberately expand my social capabilities.

 

[NeverEnder]

I do wonder though... if there's still a line in between the "cool people" that are the center of attention and the people who stand in the corner... afterall, the corner might get crowded... with the cool people.

Or do we need a load of cats, because of the stereotype that "we" are likely to pet a cat instead of hang out with others...

Also, does awkwardness work like math? If 2 people are feeling awkward, would they cancel each other out?

Oh man, the silly (but funny) ideas one can have with this hypothetical situation

I have five cats. They are my best friends. Yes, I would rather pet them than be around the average human. Humans annoy the Hell out of me, usually.

 

[NeverEnder]

View attachment 2107

Me in most social situations.

 

[King_Oni]

I have five cats. They are my best friends. Yes, I would rather pet them than be around the average human. Humans annoy the Hell out of me, usually.

I'm not to fond of animals... nor a lot of humans, that leaves me in a really weird vacuum I guess