Animal Cruelty? Or Self-protection from a Bite?

[Ste11aeres]

Watch from 8:35 to 11:00 (I'm referring to the time points in the video. You can watch it at whatever time of day you want )

Here's a link to the blog post in which I give my take on it.
People hate him because he avoided being bitten... | AspiesCentral.com

 

[Beverly]

First, I need to preface this by telling you that I own Wolf/Malamute hybrids and, while it was not stated in the video, this on looks as if it may be a wolf hybrid as well.

Caesar, in my opinion, handle the dog perfectly. He did not choke the animal, he merely prevent it form biting him then, asked it to submit as soon as that was possible. This dog wasn't showing aggression, it was trying to dominate Caesar. Like my own wolfdogs, a show of dominance, testing the hierarchy is not unusual. These animals will do that occasionally.

While mine have never attempted to bite me, they have challenged me several times, that's normal behavior. I have put them on the ground and asked them to submit exactly as Caesar did this one. That's the proper way to handle them, it doesn't hurt the animal, it isn't punishing them, it's communicating with them in a way they understand.

Caesar did what he needed to do to prevent a bite from the dog, then corrected the dog in a way the dog understood. That's the right things to do in that situation. Rather than chastise, I would applaud Caesar for his handling of the dog in this video.

 

[Ste11aeres]

First, I need to preface this by telling you that I own Wolf/Malamute hybrids and, while it was not stated in the video, this on looks as if it may be a wolf hybrid as well.

Caesar, in my opinion, handle the dog perfectly. He did not choke the animal, he merely prevent it form biting him then, asked it to submit as soon as that was possible. This dog wasn't showing aggression, it was trying to dominate Caesar. Like my own wolfdogs, a show of dominance, testing the hierarchy is not unusual. These animals will do that occasionally.

While mine have never attempted to bite me, they have challenged me several times, that's normal behavior. I have put them on the ground and asked them to submit exactly as Caesar did this one. That's the proper way to handle them, it doesn't hurt the animal, it isn't punishing them, it's communicating with them in a way they understand.

Caesar did what he needed to do to prevent a bite from the dog, then corrected the dog in a way the dog understood. That's the right things to do in that situation. Rather than chastise, I would applaud Caesar for his handling of the dog in this video.

It's interesting to hear you give your take as the owner of wolf-malamute hybrids. My experience with dogs is almost exclusively with pitbull type dogs, and I have never seen behavior like this from a dog, and I wonder if there is a breed-characteristic thing at play.

 

[tree]

Nice point he makes, to
differentiate between
dominance and aggression.

 

[Beverly]

It's interesting to hear you give your take as the owner of wolf-malamute hybrids. My experience with dogs is almost exclusively with pitbull type dogs, and I have never seen behavior like this from a dog, and I wonder if there is a breed-characteristic thing at play.

It is a breed dynamic. Malamutes and wolves both mature more mentally that other breeds. Most dogs mature to about the equivalent of early teens, Malamutes and wolves become full adults mentally. They see themselves as just as capable as a human of giving orders, basically. They are dogs so they don't think as we do, but that's the best way I know to explain that behavior.

Most dogs default to accepting being your child, they don't question that they might be able to usurp your authority over them. Wolves and Malamutes will, invariably test the authority, and suitability of any new handler and, periodically challenge establish authority. It's instinct for them, they aren't being vicious or mean, or intentionally disobedient - they are being themselves is all.

The dog in this video would not have seriously injured the other dog. That dog was already showing submission and, as soon as it rolled over and exposed it's belly to the malamute, that would have been the end of it between the dogs but, the Malamute challenged Caesar for the right to make the other dog submit and, had to be reminded that humans ALWAYS have the right to do anything before the malamute.

Caesar did the right thing, you never hit, yell at or otherwise punish those animals, you correct them and ask them to submit, you protect yourself but, never back away from them when they are trying to assert dominance. Hit them and they will defend themselves aggressively, back away and they have won dominance over you in their minds.

Once you understand them though, such animals are amazing companions and, a joy to live with, you just have to communicate on their terms and, not treat them like you would a lab or poodle or something.

 

[Ste11aeres]

It is a breed dynamic. Malamutes and wolves both mature more mentally that other breeds. Most dogs mature to about the equivalent of early teens, Malamutes and wolves become full adults mentally. They see themselves as just as capable as a human of giving orders, basically. They are dogs so they don't think as we do, but that's the best way I know to explain that behavior.

Most dogs default to accepting being your child, they don't question that they might be able to usurp your authority over them. Wolves and Malamutes will, invariably test the authority, and suitability of any new handler and, periodically challenge establish authority. It's instinct for them, they aren't being vicious or mean, or intentionally disobedient - they are being themselves is all.

You're making good points. The pitties I work with, and my own pit-type dog are intellectually smart, but emotionally/instinctually baby-ish. They are basically preschool children (I am a professional Infant/Toddler caregiver/Preschool teacher) or even more like human one-year olds. They will often refuse to submit to a human, but won't try to actively dominate that human; it's like the thought never occurred to them that they can. Same as human one year olds.
If you don't step up to the plate, and don't present yourself as an authoritative figure, that kid/dog will disobey til the cows come home, but the thought won't even occur to him/her to actively dominate you. And, in the case of such dogs and of such a child, he/she will be happiest when submitting to you.

 

[AsheSkyler]

All our dogs were passive, but I did have a few cocky chickens and goats to sort out a pecking order with. The chickens were easy, pin them down and stroke their backs. The goats... not so much. Not big meat and dairy goats that are taller than you when they rear up. Somehow I managed mutual respect with the dominate billy, but I have no idea how.