Tough question: why do we separate ourselves from the rest of the world?

[Judge]

Not that I disagree with your point, however...I agree that AS is simply one factor among many that define each of us.

Good point. I think everyone has any number of traits and behaviors that aren't necessarily neurologically defined. Whatever their neurology may be.

 

[On the Inside]

Do you think, if you associate yourself with an Autism group (meaning that you think that you have, or was diagnosed with ASD) you tend to "throw" all your thoughts, behaviors and feelings into this "Autism basket"?

I think I do to some extent when participating on forums like this. I am here, after all, because of Autism, and I want to fully understand where I am along that rainbow spectrum.

Do you tend to think that majority of you feelings, behaviors, your perception have everything to do with Autism? Or do you separate all the "normal" characteristics and "autistic" characteristics?

No, I don't think the majority of those things are all related to Autism for me, but I am not certain yet what parts are and what parts aren't. I am wary of the desire to lump it all under one banner, if it is a problem. I'm also aware that I don't have the knowledge, discipline or the ability yet to fully discern normal and autistic traits. They are just my traits. Ones that are problematic warrant some kind of delving into the roots.

I feel (and again I might be wrong, maybe I'm the only one seeing it) that many people who speak/ write about their Autism, or about their kids' Autism tend to "throw" everything into one "autistic basket". I see countless "that's how Autism feels like" articles and videos. Sometimes I feel that there's certain desperate need to divide the world into "autistic" and "normal". And, in my opinion, it's not just about Autism, many groups divide the world into "us" and "them".

So I'm not sure... humans do it instinctively but is it working for us? Do we really need this separation?

What do you think?

I think that desperate need is basically a desire to show that while autism might be different, it might not be what many people think. That dividing into normal/autistic is a blunt way to communicate the reality of the spectrum to those who may not have much if any understanding.

 

[watersprite]

I wrote this before reading the whole thread, so as not to lose my train of thought.

I see what you mean, I think, epath13. This subject, for me, is 2-fold. There is - it seems especially magnified lately - the need for declaring, socially, one's existence, one's identity. Some people are really good at this - NT's and/or aspies, it just depends on the person. My personality is strong, but it is not showy. They're not necessarily always paired.

I notice that "jump on the bandwagon" thinking with some people, and that can sometimes include a less than accurate sort of thinking. I am not a super smart person, nor especially evolved spiritually, but I try to maintain self aware honesty and that prevents me from feeling comfortable with agreeing too easily with any group. Just can't. I come to AC and am grateful for it. I do not go to any other forums, at all. I don't go to church. I have no social club, no group activity, nothing. Everything I do, I do alone, peacefully as possible. (I am still raising a teen, so there's some interaction there)

Sure, absolutely I sense in me a need for others who won't overwhelm me. I would gladly have a friend like that, but for me it is impossible to find. So, I exclude others, and live a solitary life because my mind needs to use its focus on what works, not what doesn't.

Have to add: It is fortunate I found AC when I did, and I'm grateful because this place and you all are helping me lots.

 

[On the Inside]

Sure, absolutely I sense in me a need for others who won't overwhelm me. I would gladly have a friend like that, but for me it is impossible to find. So, I exclude others, and live a solitary life because my mind needs to use its focus on what works, not what doesn't.

I agree with all of what you wrote, Kestrel. Your lines I quoted are what I felt I should say, but couldn't for some reason.

Actually the reason is because it gets to the emotional core of why I separate from the rest of the world. I have always been overwhelmed by the other people in relationships, it was a way to keep myself hidden while appearing to be sociable/in a relationship. I haven't been able to effectively deal with the emotional side of this, and I keep putting that off.

I've spent so much time on the practical, because that is what is a problem for others, and why I sought help, first with anxiety and sleeplessness which lead eventually to being diagnosed on the spectrum. The answers and comments I gave earlier were my logical self, keeping the emotional out of it.

 

[watersprite]

That is very well said, I agree. (Strongly agree past clicking 'agree')
I vacillate between the two ways of thinking too. It's hard to know what is going on emotionally, so I leave it alone, mostly, and it makes sense to me, to stay logical. Then I seem to use the emotional in paintings(?) - but that territory does not have words, so I could easily make a mistake trying to talk about it.

 

[On the Inside]

Then I seem to use the emotional in paintings(?) - but that territory does not have words, so I could easily make a mistake trying to talk about it.

I like the idea of a wordless territory, I have drifted pretty far from the things that existed without words that communicated something that I wanted to get across to others, or just get out of my head and into the outer realm. Something about having expression in visual, tactile methods....

Well, most of my expression comes in the form of words, now. Seemingly endless talking (which I could do without), and thankfully, lots of writing on this forum. I appreciate that.

 

[kris]

This is going to be a quick reply because I am on my way to work, but I wanted to chime in..

I tend to think of mine in something of the same way as Harrison.. It's as much who I am as my hair or eye color. It definitely doesn't define me. But it does influence my thoughts and actions.

I think it's like comparing apples and oranges.. different but still both fruit.

 

[DogwoodTree]

I like the idea of a wordless territory,

Don't know that I would say I "like" the idea, but I have found myself in that area an awful lot lately. I don't express emotion except in my writing, so my T says I should keep writing this stuff. But...words just aren't descriptive enough for my inner reality anymore. I've thought about painting and tried a little...wish I was better at it. Nonverbal outlets are hard to come by for me, even though I think so visually. The crux of the disconnect...

 

[HappyHermit]

I don't believe that my autism colours all my feelings, thoughts and actions. Not always significantly, anyway.

Personally, I don't like using autism as a go-to explanation for every difference I might detect between me and my environment or every problem I have.

I'm sure it affects a lot of my feelings and thoughts and actions in that it is a fundamental part of me, my 'camera lens', but at the same time who I am doesn't begin and end with autism.

I don't constantly sort how I'm feeling, what I'm thinking and doing into either a 'normal' or an 'autistic' category, and I doubt it's that black-and-white anyway. I barely think about autism in everyday life. The instances when I'm most likely to think about it is when I'm coming up against stock NT behaviours that NTs seem to find particularly enjoyable or natural and I find particularly trying or mystifying, when it's happening too much in too short a time frame and it's wearing me out too badly.

More obscure and unusual differences that don't relate to autism in any obvious way don't get dropped in the autism basket, nor does any random problem I may have.

But yes, I think we do need the separation into autistic and NT occasionally to be able to talk amongst ourselves, discuss our particular problems and to be validated and heard because 'out there', where the NT majority rules, we aren't going to get it. We need autistic ingroups for that.

 

[AsheSkyler]

Do you think, if you associate yourself with an Autism group (meaning that you think that you have, or was diagnosed with ASD) you tend to "throw" all your thoughts, behaviors and feelings into this "Autism basket"?
Nah.


Do you tend to think that majority of you feelings, behaviors, your perception have everything to do with Autism? Or do you separate all the "normal" characteristics and "autistic" characteristics?
I usually get more caught up in carefully monitoring my human and animal characteristics since most people get a little spooked when your growl or hiss at them when they try to pull your ear. And I didn't particularly enjoy my inner squirrel biting a pecan shell in two without warning...
But, I am me. The only time I really get concerned about any behaviour is if it's an indication of something being wrong, like any of the stuff associated with stroke, injury, and such.


Is it intentional denial of sameness or we're just incapable of seeing it?
Not in my case. I just can't find somebody "same" enough to be worth socializing in person with!


So I'm not sure... humans do it instinctively but is it working for us? Do we really need this separation?
I do. If somebody enjoys shooting puppies and drowning kittens, I don't want to be associated with them, and I think they do need to be separated from the rest of society before they start wanting to do it to people. I wish I could say I was exaggerating, but I know a family who has happily drowned a family of cats and shot their daughter's puppy, and then bragged about all of it to me. Might say it's an Aspie justice complex, but even allistic folk I've talked to agree those people are a problem.

Morality aside, I'm just not as clingy as most people. Some people act as if they're afraid to be alone or are incapable of entertaining themselves, and I find them exhausting because they're so needy. I honestly don't understand why the self-sufficient loners come under fire constantly in commercials, media, and those ridiculous corporate videos, but those who can't wipe their own butt without an audience and handshake are considered the well-balanced and capable ones.


What do you think?
To each their own. Let the social butterflies and extroverts plan every last minute of their day to be together, let us hermits happily meet once every five years for a quick cup of tea, and let those in the middle meet as they please.

 

[DogwoodTree]

Some people act as if they're afraid to be alone or are incapable of entertaining themselves, and I find them exhausting because they're so needy. I honestly don't understand why the self-sufficient loners come under fire constantly in commercials, media, and those ridiculous corporate videos, but those who can't wipe their own butt without an audience and handshake are considered the well-balanced and capable ones.

Ooooh yes. My gripe here has nothing to do with NT/AS issues...my family is sooo clingy, to where it's difficult to exist among them without conforming to the box they've created for me. It's been a refreshing and yet challenging journey to find and spend time with people who don't feel the need to Velcro themselves to others, to have their every feeling pivot around the actions of all those around them.