Is there a link between Complex PTSD and Autism

[Fitzo]

Hi all I have recently been under a prolonged period of sustained stress which has left me almost unable to function.

In the process of trying to get some relief from this pressure I have been doing more research on the major symptoms which are currently crippling me. Someone suggested I might have Complex PTSD. As soon as I started reading about it and watching clips on YouTube, it became clear that this is a perfect fit for my history and symptoms.

I have suffered from chronic insomnia, anxiety and depression for about the last 50 years, but I am now of the opinion that these things are the result of having C-PTSD from a very early age. I also suffer from hypervigilance, anger, emotional flashbacks, being easily startled, difficulty concentrating and a significant number of other symptoms which are a perfect fit for C-PTSD.

I have read that trauma in early childhood actually changes your neural pathways so I am now wondering if it could actually trigger autism, especially as trauma can occur even in the womb. There are a significant number of traits which overlap with autism so I am wondering whether people may also be misdiagnosed or have both conditions.

Complex PTSD is a fairly recently recognised condition and as such doesn't even have a definition under the DSMV. Only PTSD which does share some of the same manifestations, but also a significant number which are unique to C-PTSD. It is also acknowledged that conventional treatment for conditions such as depression may be unhelpful or actually be harmful to people with this condition

My history is that I was brought up with a narcissist mother and an angry, sometimes violent father. I don't remember much about my childhood (which is also consistent with C-PTSD) but my overall feeling is that it was frightening, loud and my parents were emotionally unavailable as well as actively dismissive of my fears and totally failed to provide comfort. I was blamed for things which had nothing to do with me and punished accordingly. I have often said I felt like I grew up in a war zone. My mother is still alive and my recent trauma is directly related to having increased contact and ongoing abuse from her.

I am interested to hear what others think, especially those with a similar background.

 

[the_tortoise]

I don't know about it triggering autism, but I think that all the misunderstanding and confusion and sensory sensitivities mean that the world is full of extra trauma for autistic people.

So yes there is correlation.

 

[BraidedPony]

I want to respond but I need time to get my thoughts together. In the meantime just know that you are not alone!

 

[BraidedPony]

OMGoodness, that was me! I am so sorry, i meant to hit Agree, and it was next to the funny face.
Im glad you said something, this is the second time ive done that on this sire. imreally need to be more careful.
What you said isnt funny at all.
Sorry.

 

[the_tortoise]

OMGoodness, that was me! I am so sorry, i meant to hit Agree, and it was next to the funny face.
Im glad you said something, this is the second time ive done that on this sire. imreally need to be more careful.
What you said isnt funny at all.
Sorry.

No worries! I went and deleted the post because I figured that's what happened when you changed it to agree -- sorry for making it all confusing!

 

[BraidedPony]

And I know better when ive read about child abuse my brain doesnt work as well and i know to be extra careful, but not careful enough imguess.

 

[the_tortoise]

And I know better when ive read about child abuse my brain doesnt work as well and i know to be extra careful, but not careful enough imguess.

Please don't feel bad -- no harm done

 

[Thinx]

I think dissociative processes are a common factor, I believe that research says autistic people are good at dissociation. Dissociative processes can occur around trauma. I also wonder if narcissistic parenting may exacerbate this, as there's misattunement and the child is required to be there for the parent, instead of being supported in their own development.

 

[Fino]

I have a very similar background, from the looks of it!

I feel like I've been diagnosed with everything. And there are so many that are so similar, it could drive you mad! But I stopped worrying so much about the label, mostly because I've gotten treatment that works.

I've been diagnosed with over a dozen things, including PTSD that is clearly CPTSD, just because the trauma was prolonged and PTSD involves a single incident, I believe?

Anyway, I'm currently being treated for:
BPD
ADHD
ASD

And the treatment chosen based on those diagnoses has been the most effective treatment I've ever had. Various records in various places show many more diagnoses, but I don't think they're relevant, and I don't think it's relevant whether or not the three above are correct, because all that matters is how my life is going, and it's good.

So I guess I'm sorta saying that the accuracy, or relevance, or efficacy, of a diagnosis is dependent upon the outcome of the resultant treatment, in my opinion, at this moment.

My brain feels tangled, I done.

 

[mw2530]

I can't say I know much about the difference between complex PTSD and PTSD, but I certainly believe many of us with ASD suffer with a form of PTSD. I agree with @the_tortoise. Being misunderstood at a fundamental level can cause a lot of added stress. In my opinion, those with ASD suffer from elevated levels of stress at a young age. When going to school, I recall feeling different from others at a very young age and feeling ashamed for not fitting in and being unable to make friends. Failing to make friends over and over, being laughed at, being left out, and having no one to provide constructive advice in the face of these problems leads to experiencing trauma's through out childhood. Kids are not able to handle the stress that adults are able to. This repeated trauma causes the negative traits associated with ASD to become more pronounced. I think many of us are still struggling with the lingering affects of PTSD which was developed at a young age and reinforced through repeated traumas throughout our lives.

 

[Aspychata]

This was very informative. @Fitzo My heart goes out to you, that is a tough path to walk, but you are taking giant steps to accomplish something important, have you considered writing any type of thesis or research paper on this? Has any other clinician brought this to the forefront? It seems this could be prevalent in out culture, and may even explain the rash of out of control random shootings that are popping up, disgruntled, disoriented younger kids that are depressed, angry about it, and many are picked on in schools as yourself mentioned. My brain keeps searching for a link to this rash of younger killers now dotting our history. We lived about 40 mins away from a school shooting in Minnesota.

 

[Aspychata]

@mw2530 actually mentioned being bullied at school, but not sure if this happened to @Fitzo

 

[Fitzo]

I have a very similar background, from the looks of it!

I feel like I've been diagnosed with everything. And there are so many that are so similar, it could drive you mad! But I stopped worrying so much about the label, mostly because I've gotten treatment that works.

I've been diagnosed with over a dozen things, including PTSD that is clearly CPTSD, just because the trauma was prolonged and PTSD involves a single incident, I believe?

Anyway, I'm currently being treated for:
BPD
ADHD
ASD

And the treatment chosen based on those diagnoses has been the most effective treatment I've ever had. Various records in various places show many more diagnoses, but I don't think they're relevant, and I don't think it's relevant whether or not the three above are correct, because all that matters is how my life is going, and it's good.

So I guess I'm sorta saying that the accuracy, or relevance, or efficacy, of a diagnosis is dependent upon the outcome of the resultant treatment, in my opinion, at this moment.

My brain feels tangled, I done.

The only reason I feel correct diagnosis is important is that treatment may sometimes trigger or exacerbate some of the problems if not correctly diagnosed.
I have read that BPD is often misdiagnosed when C-PTSD is more likely to be the case. Some people are uncomfortable with being labelled with a Personality Disorder, especially a Cluster B disorder, given they include Narcissism and sociopathy. Therefore such a diagnosis could be potentially harmful.
However if treatment is working for you, and the labels are irrelevant then clearly that is the most important thing.
Good to hear that you are getting treatment that helps you. Previous treatments I have received for some of my issues have actually made me more angry and isolated.

 

[Fitzo]

I can't say I know much about the difference between complex PTSD and PTSD, but I certainly believe many of us with ASD suffer with a form of PTSD. I agree with @the_tortoise. Being misunderstood at a fundamental level can cause a lot of added stress. In my opinion, those with ASD suffer from elevated levels of stress at a young age. When going to school, I recall feeling different from others at a very young age and feeling ashamed for not fitting in and being unable to make friends. Failing to make friends over and over, being laughed at, being left out, and having no one to provide constructive advice in the face of these problems leads to experiencing trauma's through out childhood. Kids are not able to handle the stress that adults are able to. This repeated trauma causes the negative traits associated with ASD to become more pronounced. I think many of us are still struggling with the lingering affects of PTSD which was developed at a young age and reinforced through repeated traumas throughout our lives.

I think the main difference between PTSD and C-PTSD is that PTSD usually relates to one major trauma (or experience such as war) which is sustained as an adult and usually shows itself relatively quickly afterward. C-PTSD usually occurred in early childhood which actually shaped and changed your neurology. Therefore there is certainly an overlap in symptoms but things like shame or guilt, thinking that it may be your own fault, difficulty with concentration and dissociation as well lifelong feelings of being different to others are more likely with C-PTSD. Flashbacks are also more likely to be 'emotional' memories rather than actual memories of traumatic events. These things often do lead to being marginalised and bullied which is fuelling further trauma.

 

[Fino]

The only reason I feel correct diagnosis is important is that treatment may sometimes trigger or exacerbate some of the problems if not correctly diagnosed.
I have read that BPD is often misdiagnosed when C-PTSD is more likely to be the case. Some people are uncomfortable with being labelled with a Personality Disorder, especially a Cluster B disorder, given they include Narcissism and sociopathy. Therefore such a diagnosis could be potentially harmful.
However if treatment is working for you, and the labels are irrelevant then clearly that is the most important thing.
Good to hear that you are getting treatment that helps you. Previous treatments I have received for some of my issues have actually made me more angry and isolated.

I agree, and a lot of that is what I was attempting to convey.

My prior diagnosis, in place of BPD, for years was Bipolar. I was treated for about six years for it and it only ever got worse--self-harm, suicide ideation and attempts, drug abuse, relationship problems, etc. all worsening over a six-year period as doctors stubbornly treated BP.

I agree that getting the correct diagnosis is vital. What I had in mind was afterwards, questioning your diagnosis, and that I believe it's only necessary to question your diagnosis if something isn't working, which might seem obvious, but my brain, and others I've seen, tend to obsess over these things and the similarities between their diagnoses and others and the possibility that something may be wrong, and wanting it right only for the sake of the label being correct and not for reasons of treatment.

There's also the funny circumstance, I have found, in which years are spent in treatment, years of unbelievably hard, painful work, and finally there is significant improvement and feelings of well-being, then someone says, "You don't seem XXX" or something that conveys, "Maybe you're not actually XXX," but it's only because the amount of work and medication that it is now so that technically the criteria is no longer meant but which certainly does not necessarily mean the diagnosis is gone entirely.

 

[Fitzo]

This was very informative. @Fitzo My heart goes out to you, that is a tough path to walk, but you are taking giant steps to accomplish something important, have you considered writing any type of thesis or research paper on this? Has any other clinician brought this to the forefront? It seems this could be prevalent in out culture, and may even explain the rash of out of control random shootings that are popping up, disgruntled, disoriented younger kids that are depressed, angry about it, and many are picked on in schools as yourself mentioned. My brain keeps searching for a link to this rash of younger killers now dotting our history. We lived about 40 mins away from a school shooting in Minnesota.

As I mentioned, recognising C-PTSD as a separate diagnosis is a relatively recent phenomenon. However it is my understanding that there is a significant amount of research being done in this area. I feel that it will likely result in at least partially explaining some of the problems experienced by young people in recent times, and hopefully lead to accurate diagnosis and treatment.

 

[Fitzo]

@mw2530 actually mentioned being bullied at school, but not sure if this happened to @Fitzo

I don't recall specific bullying at school, but I certainly struggled to make friends and always felt 'different' to other kids.

 

[LadyBird84]

I think there is a connection, but not a causal one.

Speaking from personal experience I'm thinking two things:

1. When trauma happened I was unable to clearly communicate what was going on to my environment and so the trauma continued for longer than it otherwise probably would have, plus since nothing happened I assumed people didn't give a hoot and so I stopped talking about it, which made things harder to process.

2. Before I got my late diagnosis with autism, I was diagnosed with PTSD and while I do think I had some signs of it, a lot of things they saw as being part of PTSD, I now think were just autism, for instance: being alarmed by loud sounds, difficulty with eye contact etc.

 

[Fitzo]

I think there is a connection, but not a causal one.

Speaking from personal experience I'm thinking two things:

1. When trauma happened I was unable to clearly communicate what was going on to my environment and so the trauma continued for longer than it otherwise probably would have, plus since nothing happened I assumed people didn't give a **** and so I stopped talking about it, which made things harder to process.

2. Before I got my late diagnosis with autism, I was diagnosed with PTSD and while I do think I had some signs of it, a lot of things they saw as being part of of PTSD, I now think were just autism, for instance: being alarmed by loud sounds, difficulty with eye contact etc.

Interesting, because my late diagnosis with Aspergers I now wonder if it could have been C-PTSD. Things like feeling 'different' and actively isolating myself from others. Not being comfortable with unexpected events. Being very intense and worried about the state of the world etc. Sometimes feeling emotionally 'numb'. I too react to loud sounds and sometimes have trouble with eye contact, but mostly when I feel 'apart' from the other person/s. I guess we'll never know if it was the chicken or the egg.

 

[Mary Lyn]

@Fitzo

I can relate to everything you said and am convinced I have cPTSD starting from a very early age - in my case it was from hospital admission after mercury poisoning from 'teething powders' containing up to 50% mercury (afterwards taken off the market but after many babies died).

Hospitals in those days used to just leave babies to cry in their cots and discourage parental visitation. But anyway my mother was I am sure a narcissist and targeted me against my golden child younger brother.

Since all of this came out, so very late in my life, I have done a lot of reading in a short space of time and have made some progress in parenting that little child inside myself, and am noticing changes in confidence etc.

Things are starting to fit together as well as finding out I probably have Ehletrs-Danlos Syndrome as well which is an inherited connective tissue disorder causing many health problems and serious pain.

This forum has also helped me so much so thank you.