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Trigger others Emotional response?

What do you think?


  • Total voters
    1

elements

Well-Known Member
I've been trying to understand the functionality of socialization and communication which has lead me to this wall in that i cannot get around.

If i speak my mind stating this cake you made does not taste good, in which would make you feel bad because you put time/effort, but if i lie (which is always bad in my books) stating this cake taste good, or okay my word has been tarnished and you will now always question what i say in these moments but if i dont i look rude.

I dont understand the ideology of protecting someone feelings, i think we all should take responsibility for how we feel and why we feel that way no matter who triggers you its ultimately your own problem you need to work on.

The cake may be a bad example but you would apply it to something more serious, the concept is simply speaking my mind regardless of stepping on someone else toes and its not like i dont care, i have so much love and compassion for people but they should just take ownership of there being and not place it on someone who triggered them.

I feel very lost.
 
Not bringing harm to other group members is standard behavior for securing one's position within the group. (animal kingdom as well)

If you know the words you wish to speak would harm. Speak other words.
If you cannot manage more pleasing words. You can lie and insinuate that you are in fact lying them. (it shows empathy)

The ideology is actually ethics.

There are a variant of them and i does come down to how you were raised (mostly)
As in.. do not kill..do not lie.. and so on

One branch focus on doing as little harm as possible.
How you weigh it is the complicated part.

There are guidelines for such.
But these days.. everyone gets triggered by everything, everyone seems to want to be the victim. And do not wish to self-reflect.

Sympathy with someone is a choice, empathy is not.
It is not always your problem if someone gets mad because you tell them the hard truth.
But it may give you a problem if you do it to someone within your "group" (daily life..friends - family)

Everyone lies - because it is a requirement for good social behavior.
As in "we all have to be here" - your values are not everyone's values..even if you feel they should be.

If you always spoke your mind, you'd a very suggestive person....



this is a bit of a mess.. but maybe it can jog something in your mind
 
If I don't like the cake someone makes, I say "Its not for me" or some such. Just because I don't like it, doesn't mean its not good - its just not good for me
 
What it boils down to is that if you want the person who made the cake, and by proxy the people who like that person, to like you or at least not hate you, you will lie about the cake.
 
I try not to lie and not say anything bad either. If I hate the flavor perhaps the texture can be complimented. It is from the if you can't say something nice don't say anything philosophy. Not easy to learn, though, but at least I can still be honest.
 
I'm very comfortable with white lies. If someone has made me dinner, and it doesn't taste too good, I'll almost finish my plate and tell them it was good but I'm satisfied for now.
Not because the food was actually good, but because they've invited me and gone through the effort for cooking for me and it's not their fault I'm a culinary mastermind (joking). I basically thank them for the concept of dinner because I don't want to be rude.
 
but if i lie (which is always bad in my books) stating this cake taste good, or okay my word has been tarnished and you will now always question what i say in these moments but if i dont i look rude.

Only if you are not a convincing liar, forget that you lied and tell the truth later on, or tell a third person that you didn't like the cake and then that third person tells the truth to the cake-maker.

I agree that we are responsible for our feelings to some degree, but we are also responsible for our actions and in many cases are responsible for how our actions affect others. I do not exclude words from "actions" and I do not entirely exclude the emotional reactions of others to my words from "how my actions affect others".

If you punch someone in the face, and they are upset about it, you don't say that the physical pain the other person is experiencing is their problem and you are not responsible for it in any way -- as for why, the reasons I can think of are:

Virtually all people, in virtually all contexts, feel physical pain when punched in the face. It is an expected and direct consequence of being punched in the face;

It is also recognized that people do not choose to feel physical pain -- it is a natural biological reaction that's largely outside of our control;

And causing pain/damage is arguably the only reason to punch someone in the face, even when the situation is somewhat complex as it would be in self-defense and fighting sports. At the very least, punching someone is obviously an action directed at them, meant to affect them in a negative way.

Whereas:

Emotional responses are far less universal and far more difficult to predict;

In contrast to punching someone in the face, the purposes of verbal communication are many and varied;

And the harmfulness or non-harmfulness of words is contextual, individual, and variable....

However, that does not mean that emotional reactions cannot be predicted at all nor does it mean that words cannot be used to harm, or that words cannot be expected to cause harm even if that is not their intended purpose....

Also, most people cannot actually choose what to feel -- sure, emotional pain is influenced by thoughts and experiences, interpretations and values and perspectives, but that doesn't mean that people are actually in control of whether or not they feel hurt -- influence is not the same as control. Emotions are fundamentally a natural and automatic biological response just as physical pain is, even if they are far more complicated and can often be shifted or changed, to varying degrees, using cognitive means alone.

I don't see causing emotional pain as entirely different from causing physical pain.....so:

If I say something that I know beforehand will (or probably will) be hurtful to you and it was not necessary for me to say it (meaning I could have just not said it at all, with no harm to me or to you or to anyone else, or that I could have said it in a non-hurtful way) then I see responsibility for the emotional pain caused by my words the same way I would see responsibility for the physical pain you'd feel if I had punched you in the face -- I am responsible for your pain.

Change the situation so that I have no idea my words will hurt your feelings. I would be responsible to some extent, but in a different way because it would be an accident. To use the comparison with physical pain again, it would be similar to if you had just come up quietly behind me and I, not realizing you were standing behind me, suddenly turned around while gesticulating with my arm outstretched and accidentally smacked you in the face. I would feel bad, I would apologize....I would be responsible for the pain you felt but not in the same way as if I had knowingly and purposefully hit you.

Change the original situation again, this time I know that my words will hurt but it is necessary for me to say them because you or I or someone else will be harmed if I do not and I have prioritized avoiding the harm from not saying the words over avoiding the harm from saying the words. In this case I would say I am responsible for your hurt feelings only to the extent that I have made no effort to minimize the hurt.....so if my word choice hurts you more than a nicer word choice would have, then I am only responsible for the extra amount of hurt beyond what you would have felt had I used nicer words.
 
Consider the fact that now you know something would hurt someone else feelings but perhaps you are caught in a situation where you dont know anything else to say that would ease you out of actually answering it, so you have the option of truth or lie This then leads to a compromise of either someone else emotional state or ones own morals.
Also have seen this kind of conditioning where people learn others soft spots then no longer touch them to the point where it wont even come up in conversation becoming the unspoken elephant in the room.
If we touched other emotionally we could evolve as an individual much faster (given people used these instances with understanding of there own internal workings) this is all not done in a malicious manner but a loving way, its natural to turn away from pain but pain is also growth and when someone hurts us its a chance to see what internally is being triggered, rather our whole society seems to be agents this unless done with tip toeing around everyone its absolutely maddening crazy making behaviors.
am i still missing something here?
 
There's the personal guilt to deal with on unintentionally hurting the feelings of another.

But should that mean we invalidate our own feelings or opinion to save an unpleasant feeling for someone else?

I can feel hurt by a remark or action of another but had always thought that 'hurt' is mine to deal with, I wouldn't expect anyone to apologise for owning their own opinion.

I tend not to trust those who always say the right thing. To err is human.
 
I've been trying to understand the functionality of socialization and communication which has lead me to this wall in that i cannot get around.

If i speak my mind stating this cake you made does not taste good, in which would make you feel bad because you put time/effort, but if i lie (which is always bad in my books) stating this cake taste good, or okay my word has been tarnished and you will now always question what i say in these moments but if i dont i look rude.

I dont understand the ideology of protecting someone feelings, i think we all should take responsibility for how we feel and why we feel that way no matter who triggers you its ultimately your own problem you need to work on.

The cake may be a bad example but you would apply it to something more serious, the concept is simply speaking my mind regardless of stepping on someone else toes and its not like i dont care, i have so much love and compassion for people but they should just take ownership of there being and not place it on someone who triggered them.

I feel very lost.
Can you cope with the reaction the listener gives if not don't say It
 
I'm not comfortable with telling lies, even white ones, but if someone had gone to a lot of trouble to make cake or food for me and I didn't like it, I wouldn't make any negative comment. I'd just not say whether I liked it or not, but I'd thank them. If they asked me whether I liked it or not, I would say 'it's good thanks' - or perhaps, it's good, but it could do with a little more/less (insert ingredient). Perhaps the cake is good, but not my taste - in which case I'm more likely to decline the offer of the cake in the first place. I really struggle to sound enthusiastic about something I don't like, I can't act out an emotion I don't feel. Actually, I resent being put in this awkward position, but I don't want to hurt their feelings and try to be polite. Presents can be very difficult.

I don't volunteer compliments unless I genuinely mean it and feel it. People who know me know that when I do volunteer a positive opinion or compliment about something, it's genuine.

One thing I don't understand is how people can be offended by opinions about things that are a matter of taste, like music for example. I remember that when I was a kid, my uncle said he liked a certain kind of music, and then my sister said she didn't like it, then got told off by my parents. I don't understand why it should be such a bad thing to say that you don't like a kind of music, because it's a matter of taste and in no way personal - surely my uncle is not going to expect that everyone will like the music just because he does, that's just not life.
 
There is an important legal principle known as the Absence of Malice. This is what informs my own actions. If the cake is bad because of ineptitude (like the famous terrible baker in The Vicar of Dibley) and the person can't help it and can't tell, then I will smile and come up with some way of not hurting their feelings. "That is some cake!" is often my go-to.

Because they aren't doing this to hurt my feelings. So I don't want to hurt theirs.
 
I'm trying to link this into to something my parents may have said :

'Eat the cake or it will be the last thing you'll ever do.'

Something like that :)
'Come here or I'll strangle you' I overheard that from another parent in the street.

Sorry a bit of a random cakewalk
 

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