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Resident Evil Village

Discussion in 'Computers, Science & Technology' started by Paul Lee, Sep 14, 2021.

  1. Paul Lee

    Paul Lee Well-Known Member

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    I hope the DLC that may be announced at Tokyo Game Show, will concern Rosemary Winters in her own chapter of the RE universe. RE8 however, isn't even my favourite game in the series. Although I do think she's going to be targeted by Umbrella, or the Connections, because of her super mould powers. :D



    They're also supposedly doing a RE3 Director's Cut, but it won't save it from being a very bad game.
     
  2. Raggamuffin

    Raggamuffin Well-Known Member

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    2 and 4 are the only one's I invested a lot of time in. I tried 7 but it was too over the top for me. I will try 8 at some point I'm sure.

    Ed
     
  3. Sapphire K

    Sapphire K Autistic Demigirl! (She/They/It) V.I.P Member

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    I don't see how RE7 and RE Village are bad games considering that RE was intended to be cheesy considering it was based on b-rated horror films.
     
  4. Raggamuffin

    Raggamuffin Well-Known Member

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    I never really got a B movie vibe from RE2 or 4. I've never been keen on their system of incorporating puzzles into a survival horror motif. To me that seems like a terrible fusion of genres.

    If they were going for a tongue in cheek horror game like an Evil Dead 2 style - then perhaps. But it seemed like 2, 4 and 7 were trying to be serious asides from the occasional moments of sarcasm and such.

    Personally I've just gone off horror as I've not found any games in the genre to be scary in a very long time.

    For me, the best moment in any horror game has been in Killing Floor 1 and 2 on PC. When the other 5 players on your team have died and "You are the only one left" appears on screen. Which means 5 people are watching you try to survive a wave of enemies. Great fun and extremely tense - especially if it happens early on in a wave of enemies.

    Ed
     
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  5. Misery

    Misery Photo-Negative V.I.P Member

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    It's honestly one of the big pitfalls of game design in general: Incorporating things like puzzles or whatnot in a way that actually makes sense. RE was... well, not very good at doing it. They always seemed to go the route of "but the Game Design Handbook says we gotta have them... just jam one in that door or something".

    I dont think they were the ones to do it first though, or the ones to do it the worst.

    After all, they at least never forced you to Solve the Soup Cans. Look up The 7th Guest if you dont know what I'm talking about.

    RE has always been kinda bad about the "puzzles" but at least it's on the lightweight side to keep it from being stupidly annoying. 7th Guest on the other hand...

    I say this all the time, but look elsewhere if you want good scares.

    There are plenty (big horror game fan here). But you aint gonna find them among the AAA crowd, that's for sure. They're too busy cloning each other. And of course the one time they hit on something that COULD have been a potentially winning formula (maybe) they went an immediately screwed it up entirely (PT, I mean). Granted, other devs then took that idea and ran with it anyway, so at least that one wasnt for naught. I can see why so many gamers were frustrated by that event though.

    Though of course if you want the REALLY big scares, there's only one way to do that, which is VR. Even I have trouble with that, and I should be immune at this point.

    Aye, they're okay.

    I think part of the issue that gets people is that both games can be a bit... overbearing with the concepts they use. I mean, really, they genuinely did the "THIS ISNT EVEN MY FINAL FORM" thing MULTIPLE TIMES in both games. I mean yeah, boss fights, I get it, but the concept stops being surprising or stressful when you KNOW that the boss in question is going to do it. And it's DEFINITELY not scary when you also remember that you've got like 3 shotguns and a rocket launcher jammed into your Backpack of Holding.

    Heck they only time they DIDNT do those things was in the "fight" against Angie in 8. But that's not exactly much of a fight, is it...
     
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  6. Paul Lee

    Paul Lee Well-Known Member

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    When you play RE2 (the original, not the OK 2019 remake), and then play RE7 or 8, they don't feel connected in terms of the canon. :D

    I wasn't keen on Chris Redfield's RE7 redesign. They made him look as if he had been able to de-age himself, but he really didn't. They just hired the wrong guy to model the character.
     
  7. BrokenBoy

    BrokenBoy 戯言使い(Nonsense User)

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    Puzzles are part of the "core" of the survival horror genre though. It's not an outside element they arbitrarily decided to put in "just cause"..
    One of the better takes on survival horror puzzles I've seen in the genre are Ib, Silent Hill 2, and Corpse Party Rebuilt. Ib had puzzles involving you using your brain, but the solutions never felt contrived. The last puzzle is the only one where I felt the need to use a guide. Silent Hill 2 at least gave you separate difficulty options for the puzzles and Corpse Party Rebuilt has probably the most fair puzzle difficulty I've ever seen in a game.
     
  8. Misery

    Misery Photo-Negative V.I.P Member

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    I do question this though. But, from the view of the overall trend, really. The question becomes: WHY is it part of the core, or at least considered to be? When you really think about it, it just doesnt have a logical function, either to the gameplay OR the narrative in most cases.

    As a comparison, think of the idea of, I dunno, floating coins and such in a platformer. In one of those, they serve a very natural/organic purpose that works WITH the core design concept of jumping. They can be placed in various spots to encourage the player to attempt more difficult jumping sections, or as rewards for dealing with, I dunno, a series of falling platforms. They can be reasons to deal with enemies that may be guarding them, and overall serve to give that dopamine-ish sense of reward for completing tasks. And on top of that, unless done ENTIRELY wrong, they never break the pacing, because you never seperate from the jumping to deal with them.

    In survival horror though, the core concept is... er... surviving and horror. The horror element is the one I'm most familiar with, and the puzzle elements (in most cases, not all) are often what really kills the experience for me, as they very heavily dilute the immersion factor and are usually also very seperated from the horror and survival gameplay elements.

    Like, going through a game in the vein of RE: maybe there's a screwy lock on a random door where you need to insert, I dunno, three pig heads and turn them the right way. And the question is... WHY? In a platformer, putting shiny whatsits in totally random places makes sense... freaking Mario isnt exactly meant to be a realistic or immersive experience. It's meant to be wild, flashy, and somewhat surreal, with level design placed above all else. But most survival horror isnt about any of those things. Gritty realism and immersion, even when dealing with cosmic abominations... that's what makes the scares work.

    The pig-head lock though, often just... doesnt fit. WHY is it there? What kind of doofus would bother building such a contraption? Even further, what kind of doofus would bother doing that and then hide the blasted heads around in spots that just scream "SEARCH ME"? I mean, that's "Ganon putting boss keys in big chests guarded by idiots" levels of stupid. They COULD just put, you know... a proper, professional lock on it, and keep the actual key with them. Or even use digital locks, requiring a code for more secure areas (of course, I've seen lots of games screw THAT up too). I mean, in RE 7, it was at least a somewhat normal house (barring the Mold of course) but these screwball gizmos were all over the place. As in most such games, there's not exactly a whole lot of in-universe explanation, or even mild exposition about them, and they fail to tie into the story or the game's core horror-focused mechanics. RE 7 if I recall correctly sorta made a bit of an attempt at explaining it kinda, but... honestly, seemed really contrived, didnt make it less silly.

    And there just seems like there could be better ways to do it, if the puzzles MUST be there. RE 7 for instance: Instead of weird mechanical locks that make no sense, why not have the "locks" be the Mold itself? And the "keys" could instead be perhaps some sort of chemical concoction you need to craft that can dissolve that specific breed of mold. AND, a freaky gross setup involving that adds to the horror element rather than seeming out of place (I mean, the house is DRENCHED in the stuff; the idea absolutely fits without breaking theme). There'd be a lot of ways to creatively implement this while not only fitting the setting but also fitting the story and lore. Instead... pig heads in a door, or whatever.

    Aside from that, at this point I've just played waaaayyyyyyy too many horror games that never saw the need to do any of that... and they worked and flowed just so darned well without it (and had MUCH better pacing). With the immersion never breaking, due to not reaching a point where I go "wait, why in the world is that even there? How does that make any sense whatsoever?"

    There are of course exceptions to all of this though, but... they seem few and far between. At the very least there are so many horror games out there that it's easy for me to just avoid the ones that do too much of this sort of thing. If others like them, that's fine, but... yeah I usually avoid these sorts.

    Sorry, that was all very rambly, but horror game design concepts are just fascinating to me, is the thing. I'd love to try and make one myself at some point, but... yeah I probably wouldnt be very good at that. It'd probably just be a really silly mess.
     
  9. BrokenBoy

    BrokenBoy 戯言使い(Nonsense User)

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    Yeah, I guess you're right about the immersion part. One survival horror series that I think handles what you're describing a little better is the Silent Hill series. The games use the fact that "enviroments and puzzles aren't realistic/make no sense" to it's advantage, as opposed to just having it be an oversight, as each game is set in a place that has been magically reshaped to fit with the psyche of one of the characters, often in a way that's meant to be surreal and uncomfortable.
    BrookhavenOtherworld.png
    While there's no explanation (Other than "MAGIC!") as why the world suddenly has a bunch of locked doors and whatnot, the puzzles tend to hold heavy symbolic value onto themselves. My favorite example is this one section from Silent Hill 2 (Toluca Prison) is one of my favorite sections of that game.
     
  10. Misery

    Misery Photo-Negative V.I.P Member

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    Oh yeah, the surreal horror games do this stuff so much better. Well, honestly, they do everything better, really. I usually find that the ones that try for a more realistic/solid approach tend to be a bit predictable. But the surreal ones, you never know what the heck they're going to do.

    My favorite example, a game called Golden Light:





    Both of those are this game's idea of a boss fight. If you can even tell what the heck is happening half the time, you're doing well.

    Since the game is part roguelike, its idea of a "puzzle" is very drastically different. Instead of trying to figure out the sequence to open some lock, you need to figure out, well... what in the numerous hells is even happening half the time. Why are you throwing fish heads and corrupted fetuses at things? Why exactly should you whack yourself in the head with your own eyeball-covered axe? Why is there a refrigerator covered in eyes and meatballs trying to sell you bat heads? And what in the heck does X do, where X can be 1 of a bazillion different things? Ya gotta experiment a lot and figure stuff out as you go, or you'll never get anywhere.

    All those unknowns work well with the game's general unsettling atmosphere. Both of those videos I think are a great example... that first one was one of my favorite boss fights in a horror game in a long time; doesnt seem hugely action packed but Carre there killed the heck outta me many times (and no, I dont know what the heck it's supposed to be... like, I dunno, a flying meatball orbited by gold chunks and trailed by hand-starfish).

    That second one though deserves a freaking medal. It's very, very rare that a jumpscare manages to get me. Even more rare is when it gets me despite that I know full well that it is both coming and standing in front of me. You can tell the very moment I panic in that one. That godawful sound the boss makes when in berserk mode sure didnt help. Took many tries to finally beat whatever that is. This is a permadeath game too, so... yeah.

    Also that "song" that plays around Carre is stuck in my head again, so... that's a thing.
     
  11. Paul Lee

    Paul Lee Well-Known Member

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    Earlier on, I tried a game called Forgotten Memories, which is very cheap on the Google Play Store. You control a woman named Rose Hawkins in a place a lot like something from the Silent Hill series. :p

    I seriously cannot be bothered with Resident Evil anymore. They're just using it as a cash cow. I honestly feel like they only do so many remakes because they're basically stuck, and they know how nostalgic a fan can get.

    Hell, they haven't had Jill in anything since 2012. I don't count the remake, or those bad Wii and mobile games.
     
  12. Misery

    Misery Photo-Negative V.I.P Member

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    The remakes are really a corporate thing... it's all the rage in that side of the industry currently. More money for far less work than a normal release? OF COURSE the big AAA guys jump at the chance for that one... you can expect that trend to continue for some time.

    In all honesty 7 and 8 have seemed to me to be more of a reboot, than a continuation of the previous games. Yes, Chris shows up, but... they dont make all that much concession to anything else, and I got the impression that the only reason there's ANY ties to the original games is because it'll make it appeal to older fans more.

    I can sorta see the logic behind it, too. It's one of those series that had sorta jumped the shark more than a bit and had gotten a bit too convoluted. Not too surprising that other characters from before also havent really shown up.

    I looked this up... looks like something I might enjoy but for some reason that "over the shoulder" camera absolutely drives me up the wall. I have no idea why. I've seen other games do it too, cant tolerate it in those either. Odd, that.

    Though in all honesty when it comes to horror games I usually prefer 1st-person games in any case. But that's just personal preference.
     
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  13. Paul Lee

    Paul Lee Well-Known Member

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    You know the part in CVX's ending scene where Chris says this to Claire, as they are on the jet?

    "It's up to us to take down Umbrella!"

    In my restless dreams, I'm still waiting for Capcom to do that properly, as opposed to simply saying it in RE4. :p