• Welcome to Autism Forums, a friendly forum to discuss Aspergers Syndrome, Autism, High Functioning Autism and related conditions.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Private Member only forums for more serious discussions that you may wish to not have guests or search engines access to.
    • Your very own blog. Write about anything you like on your own individual blog.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon! Please also check us out @ https://www.twitter.com/aspiescentral

Passing

Professori

Professori
I want to raise the question of ‘passing’, knowing that it has been dealt with in various ways,
but nevertheless, I want to raise it for a specific reason. Today people with hidden disabilities are said to pass when they present in a way that conceals any signs of their disability. Passing is often demanded by society, and sometimes becomes second nature as we learn various little tricks so as to be accepted.

I am from the ‘lost generation’ of Aspies who never knew that Asperger's existed, or what it encompassed. Thus, if one actually had this ‘disability’ (I believe this is a misnomer) then there was no recognition thereof. So, even though I realised that I was dramatically different in many ways, and could not change, I simply had to fit in and make sure that I made my life as ‘normal’ as possible. The demand was also to find a career and make a success of it.

It is difficult to decide on what ‘normal’ is in a world that is decidedly messed up, with very few people who classify as ‘normal’. Anyway, who defines ‘normal’ and on what basis? So, a neurotypical ‘normal’ is my abnormal. This adds to the burden of being able to pass, with messed up people telling me how to be ‘normal’. The irony is that even neurotypical people learn to pass in order to hide their own issues.

Nevertheless, i am soon to 'retire', I have led what would be defined as a ‘successful’ life in that I achieved well in my chosen career. However, at what cost? I have found it to be an incredibly difficult path to have walked, largely feeling like I was the cursed princess in the movie ‘Shrek’. Of course, It turns out to be the ogre who was cursed – the curse being to have to live as a princess in order to be accepted by society - and even desire that. My apologies to those who have not seen the movie, as well as for the unfortunate analogy, but these simple movies sometimes make a poignant point, even though the principles are seldom adhered to in life. In short, I felt like an ogre passing as a princess. An 'ogre' is quite normal to other 'ogres.'

So, in passing I have still felt the pain of lying to myself, forcing myself into a predetermined mold - the one who I refer to as my 'impostor'. I was not accepted as ‘normal’, was still regarded as the odd one out, different, could not be accepted into the inner circles of the university in which I worked, regarded as cold, awkward, abrupt, standoffish, eccentric. Even though I became head of my department, I felt the constant pressure from those who ostracized me. It affected my health, my mental state, as well as my own sense of self.

So, I did not really pass at all because my differences were identified and labeled. I pulled off a great passing act at work and then paid for it dearly. I would take on the full workload of a professor throughout the year and end up overwhelmed to the point of illness, but mainly because of the mental games that are played in passing. I also had to cope with my own psychological problems in the midst of all this. I was constantly confused in the battle to fit, knowing that I am different, but feeling that my differences were wrong, and told so by people around me. I never considered autism or Asperger's simply because I was never pointed in that direction. Anyway, to my generation, to admit to any such classification, or to disclose it is simply infradig.

The pressure to pass can be intense, and can certainly be very destructive. What is worst of all is that it robs us of true identity - who we really are, and being at peace with that. That is a difficult question to answer: who am I? – the answer comes over a lifelong journeying, if at all. However, passing disguises one, cloaks one in some sort of ideal which is not real self. After my ‘successful’ career, I find that I have not been successful at all – I feel that I have given too much to someone who I am not. I betrayed myself, and feel the intense pain of that, and suffer the consequences at this stage, too intense to detail.

So, these are some of my personal comments, experiences, and opinions, and I would be interested in your own – even though it may be well worn territory.
 
So it sounds like you have regrets over having to pretend to be normal all of your career correct?

I am also from the undiagnosed generation being 46 years old. I too felt the pressures to be normal. I always thought I had to be like my sister and get good grades, go to college and work in some professional job in an office. I finally realized it wasn't going to happen and I always just thought I was too dumb to be like her. It's kind of ironic that even though I didn't take the path she did I ended up starting a carpet cleaning business and making three times as much as her.

At age 44 I finally figured out I am an aspie and that I have been pretending to be normal all my life. It is tiring at times. The last 2 years I have been figuring out who the real me is and I have to say I kind of like me. I finally accepted that I'll never be normal but at my age I sort of feel like the world can kiss my white ass if they don't like me, although I think the real me is very likable.

Anyways, I think I can relate to what you are saying, and congrats on surviving a successful career. Sounds like you did pretty well in spite of being an aspie.
 
I pass very well, and I view passing as a sort of kindness I'm doing for the benefit of the neurotypical. Being Aspie in a NT world is much like being a foreigner living in a foreign land. In such a situation, you're faced with two choices: assimilate to the dominant culture, or stubbornly refuse to give up your identity.

Those who choose the latter are in for an uphill battle. They typically try to force the dominant culture to accept who they are but have no real leverage with which to do so, and so are either rejected totally or accepted with acknowledgement that they are different (as per their wishes) and are thus regarded as being different; in other words, their choice to retain their identity marks them as different so they are, at best, tolerated - but never fully accepted.

Instead of making such an awful choice, I choose both. I am who I am, but I'll play the NT's game by their rules; I have no other choice if I want to do more with my life than sulk and whine about how it isn't fair. No, it's not fair. It's an exhausting exercise to pretend to give a damn about how someone's weekend was, or something equally asinine and pointless. What matters is that it matters to them.

It wears me down, sure, but it's gotten me places in life. But ultimately the reason I do it is because it just feels so good to be treated with the dignity and respect afforded to those who fit the definition of "normal". There's value in simply being treated like a person. Plus, its fun to develop my skill set further and further. It never stops growing.

There's more to it, but that's basically my take. Passing is a favor to NTs so they don't feel uncomfortable, it's a benefit to me because I gain the acceptance I wouldn't if I refused to play ball, and it's a skill that's fun to develop and provides a sense of satisfaction when employed successfully.
 
So it sounds like you have regrets over having to pretend to be normal all of your career correct?

I am also from the undiagnosed generation being 46 years old. I too felt the pressures to be normal. I always thought I had to be like my sister and get good grades, go to college and work in some professional job in an office. I finally realized it wasn't going to happen and I always just thought I was too dumb to be like her. It's kind of ironic that even though I didn't take the path she did I ended up starting a carpet cleaning business and making three times as much as her.

At age 44 I finally figured out I am an aspie and that I have been pretending to be normal all my life. It is tiring at times. The last 2 years I have been figuring out who the real me is and I have to say I kind of like me. I finally accepted that I'll never be normal but at my age I sort of feel like the world can kiss my white ass if they don't like me, although I think the real me is very likable.

Anyways, I think I can relate to what you are saying, and congrats on surviving a successful career. Sounds like you did pretty well in spite of being an aspie.

Thanks, and yes, I do regret the pretense. Well done on making your own stand and starting a successful business.
 
It's exhausting, but I see it as a survival skill. Something that kept me from being a social outcast at critical times. Of course I know at all times that it's a charade of sorts, but the important thing has always been never to have been outed as such.

The only thing I continue to truly regret is that self-awareness didn't come until my mid fifties.
 
I pass very well, and I view passing as a sort of kindness I'm doing for the benefit of the neurotypical. Being Aspie in a NT world is much like being a foreigner living in a foreign land. In such a situation, you're faced with two choices: assimilate to the dominant culture, or stubbornly refuse to give up your identity.

Those who choose the latter are in for an uphill battle. They typically try to force the dominant culture to accept who they are but have no real leverage with which to do so, and so are either rejected totally or accepted with acknowledgement that they are different (as per their wishes) and are thus regarded as being different; in other words, their choice to retain their identity marks them as different so they are, at best, tolerated - but never fully accepted.

Instead of making such an awful choice, I choose both. I am who I am, but I'll play the NT's game by their rules; I have no other choice if I want to do more with my life than sulk and whine about how it isn't fair. No, it's not fair. It's an exhausting exercise to pretend to give a damn about how someone's weekend was, or something equally asinine and pointless. What matters is that it matters to them.

It wears me down, sure, but it's gotten me places in life. But ultimately the reason I do it is because it just feels so good to be treated with the dignity and respect afforded to those who fit the definition of "normal". There's value in simply being treated like a person. Plus, its fun to develop my skill set further and further. It never stops growing.

There's more to it, but that's basically my take. Passing is a favor to NTs so they don't feel uncomfortable, it's a benefit to me because I gain the acceptance I wouldn't if I refused to play ball, and it's a skill that's fun to develop and provides a sense of satisfaction when employed successfully.

Well said. My own experiences while passing still placed me in the mold of being different and outside of the norm. I cannot mask some of my characteristics. This is what made me ask if it was worth it. However, a university environment is very political, with people always looking for an advantage against others, and my differences certainly provided that.
I appreciate you sharing your experience and view.
 
I think we all learn to fake it to make it to some extent. At times, I can almost pass for neurotypical but the effort renders me completely exhausted.
 
It is refreshing to simply be one's self.

The high cost of passing, and associated burnout, seems to be quite common with Aspies. Professori, you have my deep compassion. Would that the world had been kinder to someone so thoughtful, :sunflower: and instead had honored your differences.

For those who are able to allow the mask to fall away, I can only imagine how good it must feel to them to simply be themselves, and just breathe.
 
It is refreshing to simply be one's self.

The high cost of passing, and associated burnout, seems to be quite common with Aspies. Professori, you have my deep compassion. Would that the world had been kinder to someone so thoughtful, and instead had honored your differences.

For those who are able to allow the mask to fall away, I can only imagine how good it must feel to them to simply be themselves, and just breathe.
I have to second this! The high mental, emotional, and spiritual cost of having to pass as normal was enough to finally cause me to breakdown. I broke down so completely that I got to the point where I could no longer even walk into the office to do my IT job. I hated my job and everything about my life.

I'm in recovery from depression but at least I found a job on the fringe that let's me be who I am going to be. With the help of people on this forum, I'm going to take this a step further by learning the executive functioning skills that I need to make this happen. It's a relief that I no longer have to pass.
 
Professori, other than at work, how do you feel nowadays about disclosing your Aspie status?
 
It is refreshing to simply be one's self.

The high cost of passing, and associated burnout, seems to be quite common with Aspies. Professori, you have my deep compassion. Would that the world had been kinder to someone so thoughtful, :sunflower: and instead had honored your differences.

For those who are able to allow the mask to fall away, I can only imagine how good it must feel to them to simply be themselves, and just breathe.

Thanks for the kind words - I see the warmheart! Unfortunately, I have never met other Aspies who have openly disclosed to me that is who they are, and who I could discuss similarities with, but I understand why.
 
Professori, other than at work, how do you feel nowadays about disclosing your Aspie status?

I am quite ok with it. The problem prior to this has always been that I attempted to explain my differences, but the pressure from most to change because of an implied 'problem' with me usually made me withdraw and actually made me feel guilty on occasion.

It is really good to associate with others who understand!
 
I expend a great deal of energy every day for this "passing" effort. At one time, I thought it would be good and welcomed by the people who love me to try to be more of myself with them. I didn't know about AS yet, and so my efforts at being more authentic resulted in a great deal of confusion and hurt feelings.

Even though I've done some intense personal work and therapy, I've still come to the conclusion that I simply can't be truly authentic with people IRL. My inner-aspie character is too difficult to be in relationship with, because I tend to be very quiet and withdrawn if left to my own preferences, or I want to discuss topics at a level others aren't interested in. It's difficult to build a relationship with someone who prefers to be alone, even though I very much want to have friendships, too.

So I work at being the person people want me to be, to some degree anyway. I try to speak their social language, while also finding pockets of solitude and silence for my own well-being. I try to filter what comes out of my mouth so I don't say anything too far off from what I think they expect me to say. I never feel connected with people--it seems they're all far-off-somewhere, and what they see of me is just a remote-controlled robot-person, not the real me.

It is nice to have access to resources or success as payoff for my efforts at passing. But it's exhausting, as others have said, and I often feel lost inside. Lately, I've been trying to come to terms with the fact that this is going to be what relationships look like for me for the foreseeable future. I watch other people interacting and enjoying each other, and even though I can "play that part", it doesn't feel real to me.

It takes constant effort and diligence to manage every word I say, every facial expression, every body movement, my proximity to each person around me, and also monitor everyone else's words, facial expressions, body language, movement, positions on issues, perspectives, preferences, and more. I never just "relax and hang out"...I don't know how.

Slowly, I'm learning to be okay with this fact. But it's kinda like mourning the loss of someone close to you...there are layers and layers of loss that must each be faced and processed, like waves on the beach. You get through one, and start to feel the relief, and then here comes another layer of realizing what's been lost (that, in this case, I never actually had--I just hoped to have it "some day").

In the meantime, I'm reading a lot about "inner solitude", and learning to be okay with the way I see things, even if it's very different from the way other people see them. I'm learning to not be bothered so much about what other people think of me...to not put so much effort into "people pleasing"...and to not react emotionally to other people's issues.

If someone is angry at me, I'm learning that it's really their issue they're dealing with...it really has nothing to do with me. There's something inside themselves that they're reacting to, and it's best just to let people have the emotions that they have, and not try to "fix" it for them. I'm slowly learning that I can validate what someone is feeling without taking responsibility for their feelings. Some people can handle this better than others...in fact, some people are very offended when I stop trying to manage their emotions or manage their perception of me. But, I've been my family's scapegoat for so long now, other people's offenses don't trigger the same defensiveness and terror and panic that it used to.

So I think that, on the codependent side of my background...I've greatly reduced my conformity to those "passing" standards. But on the AS side of my background...I've probably, actually, increased my efforts at passing. As I understand better what parts AS plays in the way I experience the world, I'm able to anticipate problems and find better ways of covering for those things.
 
Professori, I understand what you mean, regarding the discussion might have turned to things the others felt you should change. How nice that today, society is learning to move away from the medical model (deficits-based) toward the social model (strengths-based) regarding many developmental conditions. :)

I was able to attend an Aspies Over 50 group. Everyone felt so understood, supported, and comfortable in the group! Many shared of the challenges with maintaining employment, raising children, etc. while managing in an NT world. What was beautiful there, was watching how comfortable and happy some of them had become, embracing their Aspie-ness.

I wish you could find such a group. Most there were very supportive of those getting ready to "drop the mask."
 
I expend a great deal of energy every day for this "passing" effort. At one time, I thought it would be good and welcomed by the people who love me to try to be more of myself with them. I didn't know about AS yet, and so my efforts at being more authentic resulted in a great deal of confusion and hurt feelings.

Even though I've done some intense personal work and therapy, I've still come to the conclusion that I simply can't be truly authentic with people IRL. My inner-aspie character is too difficult to be in relationship with, because I tend to be very quiet and withdrawn if left to my own preferences, or I want to discuss topics at a level others aren't interested in. It's difficult to build a relationship with someone who prefers to be alone, even though I very much want to have friendships, too.

So I work at being the person people want me to be, to some degree anyway. I try to speak their social language, while also finding pockets of solitude and silence for my own well-being. I try to filter what comes out of my mouth so I don't say anything too far off from what I think they expect me to say. I never feel connected with people--it seems they're all far-off-somewhere, and what they see of me is just a remote-controlled robot-person, not the real me.

It is nice to have access to resources or success as payoff for my efforts at passing. But it's exhausting, as others have said, and I often feel lost inside. Lately, I've been trying to come to terms with the fact that this is going to be what relationships look like for me for the foreseeable future. I watch other people interacting and enjoying each other, and even though I can "play that part", it doesn't feel real to me.

It takes constant effort and diligence to manage every word I say, every facial expression, every body movement, my proximity to each person around me, and also monitor everyone else's words, facial expressions, body language, movement, positions on issues, perspectives, preferences, and more. I never just "relax and hang out"...I don't know how.

Slowly, I'm learning to be okay with this fact. But it's kinda like mourning the loss of someone close to you...there are layers and layers of loss that must each be faced and processed, like waves on the beach. You get through one, and start to feel the relief, and then here comes another layer of realizing what's been lost (that, in this case, I never actually had--I just hoped to have it "some day").

In the meantime, I'm reading a lot about "inner solitude", and learning to be okay with the way I see things, even if it's very different from the way other people see them. I'm learning to not be bothered so much about what other people think of me...to not put so much effort into "people pleasing"...and to not react emotionally to other people's issues.

If someone is angry at me, I'm learning that it's really their issue they're dealing with...it really has nothing to do with me. There's something inside themselves that they're reacting to, and it's best just to let people have the emotions that they have, and not try to "fix" it for them. I'm slowly learning that I can validate what someone is feeling without taking responsibility for their feelings. Some people can handle this better than others...in fact, some people are very offended when I stop trying to manage their emotions or manage their perception of me. But, I've been my family's scapegoat for so long now, other people's offenses don't trigger the same defensiveness and terror and panic that it used to.

So I think that, on the codependent side of my background...I've greatly reduced my conformity to those "passing" standards. But on the AS side of my background...I've probably, actually, increased my efforts at passing. As I understand better what parts AS plays in the way I experience the world, I'm able to anticipate problems and find better ways of covering for those things.

I truly appreciate your sharing in such depth because I can relate to a great deal of what you have outlined. The great deal of energy that you mention has been almost a lifetime for me, but if I ask whether others for whose benefit I have been passing have recognised or appreciated it in the least, then the answer is an outright 'no'. That is wasted energy, even though I know the reasons for my having done it, and even though I know that it may be necessary. It is destructive, and the inner self is affected terribly negatively, even abused. I have always realised that self talk is always important to one, but what a confusing message to constantly give oneself.

Nevertheless, it is wonderful that you have learned and begun to change how you deal with your situation. The issues of relationship that you mention are tough, and continued vulnerability is always difficult because it leads to hurt. I trust that you will find those with whom you can really connect.
 
Professori, I understand what you mean, regarding the discussion might have turned to things the others felt you should change. How nice that today, society is learning to move away from the medical model (deficits-based) toward the social model (strengths-based) regarding many developmental conditions. :)

I was able to attend an Aspies Over 50 group. Everyone felt so understood, supported, and comfortable in the group! Many shared of the challenges with maintaining employment, raising children, etc. while managing in an NT world. What was beautiful there, was watching how comfortable and happy some of them had become, embracing their Aspie-ness.

I wish you could find such a group. Most there were very supportive of those getting ready to "drop the mask."

Ah, that would be good, and good to share experiences!
 
My idea of 'passing' was to act crazier. I don't recommend this . Had I known how my brain was wired... I would have chosen totally different path. I was on my own from the start, basically. My father was a southern raised 3rd generation military man who became an a marine fighter pilot , gone commercial pilot. When he wasn't absent, he was militant:mad: with us. He met my mother , in New Zealand,on way back from being based in antarctica. He married her and dropped her off in Texas ,during late fifties. She was asked to leave public places when they heard her accent! She is one tough lady! She was a reporter in NZ and TX, locksmith in NJ & custom retail store owner in OH. Oh yeah, she graduated from Cleveland State U at age 60! She majored in Anthropology and minored in eastern religion. They adopted my narcissistic mexican sister from Texas when they were told they couldn't have children. I mention ethnicity only because it made a difference to my sister and none other. I was white, tall, thin, long legs, high cheekbones... everything opposite. Mother favored me, which added fuel to fire.. My sister hated me from birth and ostracized me from any other children my entire childhood. I was totally in my own world till I found my 'front'. I became absolutely wild. In a nutshell... At age 50 I was leading a double life. By day I was a hairstylist/salon owner. By night a biker. My husband was an outlaw who was diagnosed with lung cancer 9 months after being released from prison. I lost "everything". Everyone including myself thought my lack of NT skills was due to drugs and alcohol. I'm sober 6 yrs now and just learned of asperger's a month or two ago. Losing everything was the best thing that could have happened. I had the opportunity to re-invent myself. I've cut out as much social contact as much as possible. I've learned to show humility , painted with humor when NT's are effected by my 'shortcomings'. I'm in total acceptance of and am hiding my eccentricities in plain site. I believe if I'm living by the Golden Rule ... it doesn't matter what anyone says. I'm sure I posted more personal information than needed but, couldn't delete it. That was the most objective I've seen my life. I had some kind of epiphany! :astonished: I'm gonna press enter now.........yeesh, here it goes.... hahaha...wrong button!
 
I have to second this! The high mental, emotional, and spiritual cost of having to pass as normal was enough to finally cause me to breakdown. I broke down so completely that I got to the point where I could no longer even walk into the office to do my IT job. I hated my job and everything about my life.

I'm in recovery from depression but at least I found a job on the fringe that let's me be who I am going to be. With the help of people on this forum, I'm going to take this a step further by learning the executive functioning skills that I need to make this happen. It's a relief that I no longer have to pass.
I haven't been on line for a bit...you found a job you like?! That's great!! I've thought about ya n sent good juju your way :herb:
 
My idea of 'passing' was to act crazier. I don't recommend this . Had I known how my brain was wired... I would have chosen totally different path. I was on my own from the start, basically. My father was a southern raised 3rd generation military man who became an a marine fighter pilot , gone commercial pilot. When he wasn't absent, he was militant:mad: with us. He met my mother , in New Zealand,on way back from being based in antarctica. He married her and dropped her off in Texas ,during late fifties. She was asked to leave public places when they heard her accent! She is one tough lady! She was a reporter in NZ and TX, locksmith in NJ & custom retail store owner in OH. Oh yeah, she graduated from Cleveland State U at age 60! She majored in Anthropology and minored in eastern religion. They adopted my narcissistic mexican sister from Texas when they were told they couldn't have children. I mention ethnicity only because it made a difference to my sister and none other. I was white, tall, thin, long legs, high cheekbones... everything opposite. Mother favored me, which added fuel to fire.. My sister hated me from birth and ostracized me from any other children my entire childhood. I was totally in my own world till I found my 'front'. I became absolutely wild. In a nutshell... At age 50 I was leading a double life. By day I was a hairstylist/salon owner. By night a biker. My husband was an outlaw who was diagnosed with lung cancer 9 months after being released from prison. I lost "everything". Everyone including myself thought my lack of NT skills was due to drugs and alcohol. I'm sober 6 yrs now and just learned of asperger's a month or two ago. Losing everything was the best thing that could have happened. I had the opportunity to re-invent myself. I've cut out as much social contact as much as possible. I've learned to show humility , painted with humor when NT's are effected by my 'shortcomings'. I'm in total acceptance of and am hiding my eccentricities in plain site. I believe if I'm living by the Golden Rule ... it doesn't matter what anyone says. I'm sure I posted more personal information than needed but, couldn't delete it. That was the most objective I've seen my life. I had some kind of epiphany! :astonished: I'm gonna press enter now.........yeesh, here it goes.... hahaha...wrong button!

Really good to read someone's epiphany! Great that you turned your life around after such a tough time, and that you can live by the Golden Rule since many sink into anger and resentment - very self-destructive. I can relate to your story and also went off the rails for a while - lost. However, I ended up with a battle with cancer, and being institutionalized for supposedly being 'psychotic'. However, I can tell you that I met more people who made sense in that institution than in the 'normal' world out there;).

It is a long walk.
 
I wonder if we will ever make that compromise between Aspie and NT social interaction. Will we meet each other half way? From what I can tell, even NT's have to wear some kind of mask, if you really think about it. The question is. Do we have to wear more beautiful/sophisticated masks then what NT's do to compensate for that fact that we are aspies? Or do we hate the idea of having to wear a mask in general?
 

New Threads

Top Bottom