Not using the restroom when needed

[KatieKepich23]

My daughter is 12 years old, she is nonverbal and has been diagnosed with Autism since she was 5. Through the years we have seen a steady stream of different behaviors, some that have subsided, some that come back randomly and some that have been consistent her whole life. Lately she have started relieving herself while sitting on the couch or going out to the car when she has access to the bathroom, she just rather sit and go than go properly.

We've tried so many different responses to try and get her to stop from talking, showing, not allowing her to sit on certain furniture and being more stern and reprimanding ( not physically of course.) Has anyone dealt with this situation and found any solutions or helpful information?

 

[Judge]

Have you ruled out any physical issues of your daughter?

Many years ago I had a relationship with a divorced woman (NT) whose daughter (4 to 7 years) was diagnosed with small bladder and urethra...with a prognosis that as she got older she'd gain more control of her bladder. In the meantime she wet the bed nightly, and would periodically have "accidents".

We tried to read her body language the best we could, and escort her to the bathroom rather than always ask if she needed to go. At one point the pediatrician recommended we keep track of her urine output, along with limiting her fluid intake. Every weekend was problematic as she'd have to go with her father who had weekend custody, and she didn't like that at all. Often wetting her pants before her father would arrive to take her. I've always felt bad in seeing kids that nervous.

Sometimes it may be difficult to determine what happens based on behavior as opposed to pathological issues. In the meantime perhaps you can limit the problem with her wearing incontinence undergarments.

 

[KatieKepich23]

Have you ruled out any physical issues of your daughter?

Many years ago I had a relationship with a divorced woman (NT) whose daughter (4 to 7 years) was diagnosed with small bladder and urethra...with a prognosis that as she got older she'd gain more control of her bladder. In the meantime she wet the bed nightly, and would periodically have "accidents".

We tried to read her body language the best we could, and escort her to the bathroom rather than always ask if she needed to go. At one point the pediatrician recommended we keep track of her urine output, along with limiting her fluid intake. Every weekend was problematic as she'd have to go with her father who had weekend custody, and she didn't like that at all. Often wetting her pants before her father would arrive to take her. I've always felt bad in seeing kids that nervous.

Sometimes it may be difficult to determine what happens based on behavior as opposed to pathological issues. In the meantime perhaps you can limit the problem with her wearing incontinence undergarments.

We have thought about it being a physical problem originally. At first I thought the issue may be a UTI or something with her bladder so we made some changes and made sure she was doing things like drinking enough water and watching for too much acids or bases in her daily beverages. When the issue continued we started noticing a pattern in when she does it. Once we were decorating a community building for fourth of July and she didn't want to come out or help so she wet herself, when I took my younger daughter to the store for about 15 minutes and left her and Dad home she went on the couch, when she has to come to work with me and is bored she runs in the car and does it. It almost feels like her equivalent of preteen temper or "getting back" for not getting her way. I know that sounds slightly harsh but what's happening before she does it has me leaning that way in why it's happening, and though she does need a little extra attention than other kids, she is smart, functional, hears everything and understands that this isn't ok. To the point where last time she did it she got right up and run up to the bathroom and asked to take a shower. Sorry for the lengthy message but Id like to give all the details to try and get some suggestions

 

[Rodafina]

It almost feels like her equivalent of preteen temper or "getting back" for not getting her way.

Seeing as she is nonverbal, she needs a way to communicate her worst frustrations. For children with all types of communication issues, eating and relieving themselves are the two most powerful things that they can control. When kids are desperate but have no way to speak, it makes sense that they would resort to using whatever they can to get their needs met (including attention).

I’m not suggesting that you are doing anything wrong, it sounds like you have tried so many different things. It’s just that as she gets older, demands on her become harder and she still has no way to verbally communicate it sounds like.

My best guess for some thing helpful is to support her communication between the two of you. Perhaps it is time to find new ways to communicate with each other. Not pushing verbal communication, but finding other ways for her to process her feelings. I can imagine someone in her position does not feel like they have a great sense of control and autonomy. Peeing is one ultimate form of control.

 

[Aspychata]

As a mom, I would dangle something fun to do, but that particular behavior will prevent her from attending that activity. So, how would this work? If she wants to take ballet class, then you let her know, teacher will not accept students who do this. And if she does it at home, she can't go to class. Yes, it's outright bribery. We had a very hard time transitioning our toddler out of diapers. However, when l put her with a friend, brought a potty chair on outings, then she was onboard. Also l had a bucket of small m&ms in bathroom to show her a reward given. Problem resolved. Perhaps you can find something she would love to do, to reinforce the correct behavior. Maybe a art class, a friend visit, a class of dance, ice skating class, martial arts class. Show her that this is expected if you wish to do this. My daughter peed on the stairs, directly facing the bathroom. I just asked her in a normal voice, why did you do that? That was it, no scolding, l didn't want it to be a issue. I ignored her behavior. Sorry this has been an issue. Hope that you can find a solution that works, and results in a desired outcome. This may need a creative solution.

 

[Outdated]

It almost feels like her equivalent of preteen temper or "getting back" for not getting her way.

I reckon you're probably right here, a challenge to your authority. It's tough with kids because you want them to be as independent as possible and yet they need to learn how to behave as well. Where do you draw the line?

And no, I do not suggest that anyone ever treat a child like this, I'm just trying to explain the psychological side of the way I see your situation.

Spoiler

Although this doesn't sound very nice your whole story reminds me of training a hunting hound. My dog was mostly well behaved until she reached her teen years (15 months) then all of a sudden it seemed she had reverted and started weeing on the floor inside.

Natural response to this was to yell at her and send her outside, but she started refusing that too. So I'd grab her collar and march her outside, telling her to wee outside and knowing that she did understand my words. She even spent a couple of nights sleeping outside in the dog house but it was making no difference to her.

I talked to someone else about it and he explained to me that the dog was a typical teenager and was challenging my authority. He said that every time I had to grab the dog by the collar I had lost the argument. I had to make her obey. When you have a dog that has been specifically bred to chase down and kill wild boar this is pretty important.

He told me to get something thin and whippy like the small end of a fishing rod to hit her with, because it would cause minimum harm and maximum pain. He also told me not to get excited or yell, to make her obey the simple spoken word. I tried his advice that night, she deliberately squatted on the floor right in front of me and looked me in the eye as she was doing it. The old bloke was right, it was a deliberate challenge.

I picked up the thin whippy stick and smacked her across the thigh and quietly said "Outside.". She looked me in the eye and ignored it. I tried again, she flopped down on her belly in front of me and posed as if she was going to sleep. That earned her two much harder stripes on the thigh, along with the quiet command, Outside.

She got up and ran and hid under my bed. I had to hit her three more times and tell her Outside to get her out from under the bed, and she went from there to the kitchen, still refusing to go out. So I stood there with an evil grin on my face and just started repeating the command again and again and hitting her with the stick every time she refused.

It took another 4 or 5 smacks before she finally yelped and ran outside. I never had another issue with her after that. A few times she started to try it on and I'd just ask her "Should I get my stick?" and she'd immediately behave again. For the rest of her life I never had to even raise my voice to her, in fact she always responded better when I just spoke to her quietly.

She amazed a lot of people, if I was over someone else's place and she saw an animal she wanted to chase she'd come and ask permission, I'd ask the property owner and if the answer was no she'd make a big show of sighing and flopping to the floor but she'd stay there next to me and not disobey.

 

[Aspychata]

@Outdated l had a terrier. What a little cutie, smarty pants, stubborn, and extremely intuitive. I decided a different route. We had her has a young adult. I couldn't get her to pee on pad. So l sprayed her with a small water squirter for about 2 or 3 months when l caught her doing it. It was just a little sprinkle, but she hated that. I had to train her because l had to give her up. Her name was Chica. Later l checked back with the kind lady that wanted her, and she said she had zero issues with her. I hope my way was humane and that she wouldn't resort back to her old ways. But getting her as a young adult, meant some work in changing her behavior. She was such a smart dog. But stubborn. Kids though, require creative solutions. I didn't want my stubborn daughter, (she takes after mom and dad), submissive, l wanted her to stay stubborn, because it's not a bad trait, it makes for very determined adults who have strong survival skills.

 

[Outdated]

I didn't want my stubborn daughter, (she takes after mom and dad), submissive, l wanted her to stay stubborn, because it's not a bad trait, it makes for very determined adults who have strong survival skills.

I agree with you totally, and different situations require different solutions. A dog that is capable of chasing down and killing an 80Kg pig is also more than capable of arguing back with it's owner though, a spritz of water won't help you there.

 

[Aspychata]

I have been more scared of little dogs, then big ones. Lol

 

[Au Naturel]

My daughter is 12 years old, she is nonverbal and has been diagnosed with Autism since she was 5. Through the years we have seen a steady stream of different behaviors, some that have subsided, some that come back randomly and some that have been consistent her whole life. Lately she have started relieving herself while sitting on the couch or going out to the car when she has access to the bathroom, she just rather sit and go than go properly.

We've tried so many different responses to try and get her to stop from talking, showing, not allowing her to sit on certain furniture and being more stern and reprimanding ( not physically of course.) Has anyone dealt with this situation and found any solutions or helpful information?

Sounds like a control issue to me. Probably has little or no control over anything in her life, and this is something she has control over. A family friend has an autistic boy who started urinating in the master bedroom after the father left (involuntarily). This is what a child therapist is for.

 

[Rodafina]

I reckon you're probably right here, a challenge to your authority. It's tough with kids because you want them to be as independent as possible and yet they need to learn how to behave as well. Where do you draw the line?

And no, I do not suggest that anyone ever treat a child like this, I'm just trying to explain the psychological side of the way I see your situation.

Although this doesn't sound very nice your whole story reminds me of training a hunting hound. My dog was mostly well behaved until she reached her teen years (15 months) then all of a sudden it seemed she had reverted and started weeing on the floor inside.

Natural response to this was to yell at her and send her outside, but she started refusing that too. So I'd grab her collar and march her outside, telling her to wee outside and knowing that she did understand my words. She even spent a couple of nights sleeping outside in the dog house but it was making no difference to her.

I talked to someone else about it and he explained to me that the dog was a typical teenager and was challenging my authority. He said that every time I had to grab the dog by the collar I had lost the argument. I had to make her obey. When you have a dog that has been specifically bred to chase down and kill wild boar this is pretty important.

He told me to get something thin and whippy like the small end of a fishing rod to hit her with, because it would cause minimum harm and maximum pain. He also told me not to get excited or yell, to make her obey the simple spoken word. I tried his advice that night, she deliberately squatted on the floor right in front of me and looked me in the eye as she was doing it. The old bloke was right, it was a deliberate challenge.

I picked up the thin whippy stick and smacked her across the thigh and quietly said "Outside.". She looked me in the eye and ignored it. I tried again, she flopped down on her belly in front of me and posed as if she was going to sleep. That earned her two much harder stripes on the thigh, along with the quiet command, Outside.

She got up and ran and hid under my bed. I had to hit her three more times and tell her Outside to get her out from under the bed, and she went from there to the kitchen, still refusing to go out. So I stood there with an evil grin on my face and just started repeating the command again and again and hitting her with the stick every time she refused.

It took another 4 or 5 smacks before she finally yelped and ran outside. I never had another issue with her after that. A few times she started to try it on and I'd just ask her "Should I get my stick?" and she'd immediately behave again. For the rest of her life I never had to even raise my voice to her, in fact she always responded better when I just spoke to her quietly.

She amazed a lot of people, if I was over someone else's place and she saw an animal she wanted to chase she'd come and ask permission, I'd ask the property owner and if the answer was no she'd make a big show of sighing and flopping to the floor but she'd stay there next to me and not disobey.

This is heartbreaking. I wholeheartedly disagree. Poor dog. There are other ways. Tears in my eyes.

 

[Au Naturel]

I reckon you're probably right here, a challenge to your authority. It's tough with kids because you want them to be as independent as possible and yet they need to learn how to behave as well. Where do you draw the line?

And no, I do not suggest that anyone ever treat a child like this, I'm just trying to explain the psychological side of the way I see your situation.

Although this doesn't sound very nice your whole story reminds me of training a hunting hound. My dog was mostly well behaved until she reached her teen years (15 months) then all of a sudden it seemed she had reverted and started weeing on the floor inside.

Natural response to this was to yell at her and send her outside, but she started refusing that too. So I'd grab her collar and march her outside, telling her to wee outside and knowing that she did understand my words. She even spent a couple of nights sleeping outside in the dog house but it was making no difference to her.

I talked to someone else about it and he explained to me that the dog was a typical teenager and was challenging my authority. He said that every time I had to grab the dog by the collar I had lost the argument. I had to make her obey. When you have a dog that has been specifically bred to chase down and kill wild boar this is pretty important.

He told me to get something thin and whippy like the small end of a fishing rod to hit her with, because it would cause minimum harm and maximum pain. He also told me not to get excited or yell, to make her obey the simple spoken word. I tried his advice that night, she deliberately squatted on the floor right in front of me and looked me in the eye as she was doing it. The old bloke was right, it was a deliberate challenge.

I picked up the thin whippy stick and smacked her across the thigh and quietly said "Outside.". She looked me in the eye and ignored it. I tried again, she flopped down on her belly in front of me and posed as if she was going to sleep. That earned her two much harder stripes on the thigh, along with the quiet command, Outside.

She got up and ran and hid under my bed. I had to hit her three more times and tell her Outside to get her out from under the bed, and she went from there to the kitchen, still refusing to go out. So I stood there with an evil grin on my face and just started repeating the command again and again and hitting her with the stick every time she refused.

It took another 4 or 5 smacks before she finally yelped and ran outside. I never had another issue with her after that. A few times she started to try it on and I'd just ask her "Should I get my stick?" and she'd immediately behave again. For the rest of her life I never had to even raise my voice to her, in fact she always responded better when I just spoke to her quietly.

She amazed a lot of people, if I was over someone else's place and she saw an animal she wanted to chase she'd come and ask permission, I'd ask the property owner and if the answer was no she'd make a big show of sighing and flopping to the floor but she'd stay there next to me and not disobey.

That shows terrible behavior on your part. It seems clear you never established a good relationship to begin with.