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Memory and sense of self in individuals with autism

Mia

Well-Known Member
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Memory and sense of self may play more of a role in autism than we thought

From: The Conversation The Conversation: In-depth analysis, research, news and ideas from leading academics and researchers.
by Lorna Goddard, University of London


It’s well-known that those with autism spectrum disorders including Asperger’s syndrome develop difficulties with social communication and show stereotyped patterns of behaviour. Less well-studied but equally characteristic features are a weaker sense of self and mood disorders such as depression and anxiety. These are connected with a weaker ability to recall personal memories, known as autobiographical memory.

Research now suggests that autobiographical memory’s role in creating a sense of self may be a key element behind the development of autistic characteristics.

Autism is much more common in men than in women, to the extent that one theory of autism explains it as the result of an “extreme male” brain, where autistic females are assumed to be more masculinised. Historically, however, research participants have been predominantly male, which has left gaps in our knowledge about autism in women and girls. Psychologists have suggested that the criteria used for diagnosing autism may suffer from a male bias, meaning that many women and girls go undiagnosed until much later in life, if at all

What we remember of ourselves
This is supported by research that suggests women with autism develop different characteristics than autistic males – particularly in respect to autobiographical memory.

Personal memories play a key role in many of the psychological functions that are affected in those on the autistic spectrum. Personal memories help us form a picture of who we are and our sense of self. They help us predict how others might think, feel and behave and, when faced with personal problems, our past experiences provide insight into what strategies we might use to cope or achieve our goals. Sharing personal memories in conversation helps us to connect with others. Recalling positive memories when we feel down can help lift us up, while dwelling on negative personal memories can induce depression.

What’s become clear from studies of autobiographical memory in autism is that while those with autism may have an excellent memory for factual information, the process of storing and recalling specific personal experiences, such as those that happened on a particular day in a particular place, is much more difficult. Instead, their memories tend to record their experience in general terms, rather than the specifics of the occasion. This might be due in part to their more repetitive lifestyle, in which there are less occasions that stick out as memorable, but also because they are less self-aware and less likely to self-reflect. However, our research suggests that this memory impairment may be exclusive to autistic males.

Divided by memory
We examined the personal memories of 12 girls and 12 boys with autism, and compared them with an equal number of girls and boys of similar IQ and verbal ability without autism. We asked them to remember specific events in response to emotional and neutral cue words such as “happy” and “fast”. We also asked them to recall in as much detail as they could their earliest memories, and recollections from other periods of their life.

We know that girls tend to demonstrate better verbal skills and are better at recognizing emotions. Might this affect the content and degree of detail they could recall from their own memories? We also wondered whether any gender differences we might find would be replicated between boys and girls with autism, or whether autistic girls would be more like boys – as predicted by the extreme male brain theory.

What we found was that autism did lead to less specific and less detailed memories, but only for the boys. The girls with autism performed more like non-autistic girls – not only were their memories more specific and more detailed than the autistic boys, but like the girls without autism, their memories contained more references to their emotional states than both the autistic and non-autistic boys. So rather than an extreme male brain, the girls with autism were more like girls without autism.

This better autobiographical memory might be one reason why autistic females are often better at masking the difficulties they have with communication and socializing with others, and so are more likely to go undiagnosed. Of course, this poses the question that if they have the building blocks of good communication – access to detailed personal memories – why are they still autistic?


There is some evidence to suggest that the automatic connection between our memories and knowing who we are, and how to use this information to inform how we act in problematic situations, is weaker in those with autism. This means that while women with autism can recall the past, they may not be using their experience to help them understand themselves and solve personal problems.
Note: my underline, not the writer's.

Even though they may be better able to socialize than boys with autism, this may come at a cost, as greater social interaction brings with it more personal problems, and when problems seem overwhelming this can lead to depression. Indeed, recent research suggests that among those with autism, depression in more common in women than men. This gender difference with respect to personal memories is an aspect of autistic characteristics that has been little studied, and should be explored further.

Memory and sense of self may play more of a role in autism than we thought

This explains quite a bit for me, the understanding of oneself has taken much longer in my own life than it has in the other people I know who are not autistic. Suspect that both myself and my spouse as aspies are 'late bloomers' where it concerns self-realization.

Has this been similar for other aspies I wonder?
 
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Has this been similar for other aspies I wonder?
In my case, I would have to say no. I have very clear memories prior to age 3. Most of them are flashes of a few seconds to maybe a minute of events at that time. Unfortunately many, if not most, are traumatic recollections of my father beating me up. These memories disturbed me for many years until I got EMDR treatment to deal with them. They are still there, they are still disturbing, but they no longer constantly intrude into my thoughts; I have control over access them or not. As you might guess, this has had a profound effect on my life.

I accordance with the study(clear, early memories), I have a good sense of self. That self is an unassuming, wishy-washy, submissive person with no drive, ambition, or goals. How much of this is due to autism, ADD, or life experiences I cannot tell, only that is.

An interesting study might be to compare late diagnosed autistics with a benign upbringing to those with a traumatic upbringing, and compared to similar groups of non autistics.
 
For me,definitely Yes.

Was thinking something similar the other day.

Relabeeling 'sense of self' as 'social self'

Those that grow up socially have numerous feedback loops from other people - how to behave,when they have mis-stepped,when they are bolstered socially by their group.
Almost everything can be seen socially.
Almost without 'people' there is no self.

Whereas,autistically, the ''feedback loops' don't work.

We have no basis to form a social self (or a limited or different one) so have to create ourselves from within.
Leading to manifold outcomes :)

So ,for a while, I'll be thinking of the ''social self' vs me - a self with less social input to his self.
 
An interesting study might be to compare late diagnosed autistics with a benign upbringing to those with a traumatic upbringing, and compared to similar groups of non autistics.

The three aspies that I know personally IRL, are all independent and not in contact with their biological families. They had abusive upbringings and all went out into the world and created their lives from scratch.

A close friend who is an aspie is convinced that autism can be exacerbated even created by childhood trauma. He maintains that if his childhood had been a helpful even kind one he would not have autism. Think it may have some connection to levels of trauma.
 
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Whereas,autistically, the ''feedback loops' don't work.
We have no basis to form a social self (or a limited or different one) so have to create ourselves from within.
Leading to manifold outcomes

Feedback from most others, created a fear of 'others' originally. Surmised that they had a personal agenda that was for their own benefit, from early on.

The social adept I created was from books, movies and television. Then I questioned.
 
Very small sample so this study will have to be replicated on a much larger scale.

For me, no. I remember learning how to walk at the,age of around 1.5...

There may be multiple etiologies involved in autism so I am hesitant to think that most of us will definitely display this smaller or weaker sense of self thing.
 
Feedback from most others, created a fear of 'others' originally. Surmised that they had a personal agenda that was for their own benefit, from early on.

The social adept I created was from books, movies and television. Then I questioned.

I started reading early and that's mostly what I continued to do.

So my social world of how one should be came from an amalgam of the Bible,Oscar Wilde, multiple other works even Stepehn King.

Didn't realise or think,really of what others were doing.

I was mostly alone and learning.

A lot 'about' people but not through experience with people.
 
To me it seems as though most people don't get enough feedback, including NTs and that most of the feedback we do get from others is negative. Kind of like a boss saying if there's a problem I'll tell you, but leaves you wondering, if no feedback is received, where you stand, absent problems. Many, if not most, people seem to have a somewhat distorted sense of self which, I believe, is partly due to this lack of balanced feedback from others. I always felt like I had no idea how others viewed me as I didn't get the kind of feedback that would tell me. Until I joined this forum where I've gotten more feedback than ever before. So I've started trying to give others feedback when I can, especially positive feedback because I think people generally need it whether autistic or not. One of the benefits of group therapy is that one does get this sort of feedback from other group members, both positive and negative and can form a less distorted self image. Growing up without feedback must be quite disorienting I'd think- because you have no points of reference to orient oneself. But maybe my point of view is due to my being an NT and totally misunderstanding the ASD experience and if so I apologize.
 
In memory, I recall early parts of my life where I reacted to some situation, but I don't really remember having any special emotional feelings about it. Most of my memories were visuals, not acknowledging or attaching emotions to the scene. My first emotional memory was at age 6. I was sent by my first grade teacher to the Kindergarten class because I did something that was too immature for first grade. I had misbehaved in some way, or I hadn't answered a question properly. Whatever the infraction, I was told to sit in the Kindergarten class, by the door, in the back of the classroom. I have no idea what I did wrong, but I remember feeling shame and embarrassment. I remember hiding my face by keeping my head down and using my arm to block any ability to see the room or the people around me.

I'm aware that I am one of those people who has trouble expressing empathy. I can understand hurt, but I don't react emotionally. My inclination is to stop the hurt to make it go away. This might work well with physical pain, but I don't respond to emotional pain with any finesse or expertise. I'm too analytical - find the problem and fix the problem. Emotional pain is too nebulous. There is nothing to fix and the damage is already done. Perhaps this is the male brain recognizing limitations in emotional empathy. Boys cry, but they don't want sympathy. They want to get through it and move on as quickly as they can. In my opinion, emotions take a back seat to the other forces driving men's needs and interests. We feel, but we tend not to internalize our emotional woes, even though we experience them.
 
It's difficult for me to say, to be honest. I know that as a child I did everything not to focus on things and not to remember. I know that things happened but whenever an emotion gets into the picture, my brain 'zaps' to push it away. An avoidant coping mechanism is what a therapist called it once. I also cannot remember in clarity things that happened before my fourth year and I instinctually recoil from anything between ages 6 and 8. In fact, when I think about it I recoil from most of my childhood memories, although ages 6 to 8 the most. They are still quite triggering at times. That avoiding is one of the things I remember well - the effort not to think and the rocking. I always remember the sounds though.

So, the clarity here may be heavily influenced by the unwillingness to remember. It happened but I don't want to think about it.

If we're speaking about neutral memories, I remember those in great clarity if I didn't space out at the time, up to all the events, surroundings, sounds and feeling of the textures. Especially the textures. They are interesting. Unless they are the nasty textures like some of these slick sweatpants. Ugh.

If I space out, I remember little to nothing or everything blurry/foggy.
 
I didn't relate to the majority of what was said and, from my perspective, found it inaccurate, but it's not like it ever said "all" for anything so there ya go. :)
 
My memories go back to birth, but, emotional reactions were few.
I do remember some negative emotions around age five when taken to doctors and a dentist.
I would cry and fight over getting an injection.
Same with the try at a dentist. I was so out of hand that he called Mom in and said take her, I don't
want her.
So the first emotions were fear and anger that I remember.
About the same time I remember fear of Mom's reaction if I did something I thought she would find
wrong. I hated being scolded.

First emotions of happiness were my parents taking me to a park and I rolled down a grassy hill.
Also getting to ride a llama and watching swans and ducks on a pond there.

So my memories are well defined.
Since I grew up without the urge to socialise, reactions to others didn't happen until around age eight
when I first experienced bullying from other kids.

Sense of self is an odd concept to me. I sense myself constantly with all of the senses, emotions
and thoughts. I am.
 
I can remember childhood events, but not the emotion attached to it, if I had an emotion at all - I seemed to have a very limited range of emotions anyway (that I was aware of), either excitement or anger, not much in between... alexithymia. I often have atypical emotional reactions to things. I remember the fact that I was angry or excited, but don't experience the emotion. I see people on TV getting all teary and emotional over photos or memories, but this just doesn't happen with me. I have a good visual memory, but no emotional memory.
 
Growing up without feedback must be quite disorienting I'd think- because you have no points of reference to orient oneself. But maybe my point of view is due to my being an NT and totally misunderstanding the ASD experience and if so I apologize.

No. I think you hit it on the spot here. To me, it feels like 99% of all my social failings where the result of not getting the real-time corrective feedback that I needed to navigate the social progress. I can't begin to count the number of social situations that I've been in where something all of a sudden changes and I'm left wondering "What the heck just happened?". Subject changes, conversation ends, etc. And I don't anticipate that change. It's like something has gone out of sync.
 
If the ladies are mimicking, the acting will be spectacular.

Perhaps we could feign ‘upset’ and know how ‘upset-people’ behave in public or socially,
Practiced enough times over a long period of time it may become a habit.

A ‘fake it ‘til you make it’ kind of thing, although one doesn’t genuinely ‘make it’
Just becomes more natural. (Through habit? Reinforcement?)

Does it follow that the ladies would feel upset?

We could copy another’s behaviour but we can’t feel their emotion (fully)?

Without the emotional response the memory won’t be stored as well, if at all,
But the acting/ reaction may still be apparent?


I have some emotional memories from my life time,
Most of which are from some pretty intense emotional times.
(Mainly fear)
I’m guessing these are stored not only to keep me alive and safe but because of my level of emotion too.

My other memories happen like snapshots or a very short clip of film. (One second or less)
 
An example might be my father in law is a day or two (at most) away from passing. (Dying)
I liked the man. He could be quite comical.
I wouldn’t be able to tell you how old he is exactly or the date of his birthday.

I’ll remember where he died (hospital location)
and the many contributing factors to the actual cause of death.

I’ll remember how upset Mr Gracey was (will be)

But I think that will be all.
Death is the end of life. All living things die.

I suspect I won’t remember the time or date of death, be lucky if I remember the date of the funeral.

I’m not a heartless person, just won't remember the amount of detail others will.

Don’t feel the emotion others do.
Won’t get any ‘feedback’ on appropriate emotional response because I’ll be acting almost like everyone else at the family funeral.
 
An example might be my father in law is a day or two (at most) away from passing. (Dying)
I liked the man. He could be quite comical.
I wouldn’t be able to tell you how old he is exactly or the date of his birthday.

I’ll remember where he died (hospital location)
and the many contributing factors to the actual cause of death.

I’ll remember how upset Mr Gracey was (will be)

But I think that will be all.
Death is the end of life. All living things die.

I suspect I won’t remember the time or date of death, be lucky if I remember the date of the funeral.

I’m not a heartless b****, just wont remember the amount of detail others will.

Don’t feel the emotion others do.
Won’t get any ‘feedback’ on appropriate emotional response because I’ll be acting almost like everyone else at the family funeral.

I remember one funeral in the funeral car. Getting everybody laughing.

Special as people try to act appropriately. Which means at funerals - not laughing.

Wouldn't recommend you do it though :)

You only die once you may as well take your time about it.

I should be saying sorry to hear that, and all that stuff ,right? :)
(I know you won't mind)

It's a tough time, I'm sure you'll be helping people as you need too.

Ease off on the irritation things.. (from the other thread ) :)
 
I am male and have many autobiographical memories.

I don't know how they get from "can't remember where/when" to "lacks sense of self/lacks autobiographical memory" .... seems like a huge and bizarre leap to me. (Although perhaps I am missing huge bits here, dunno.)

I don't remember details I didn't consider important at the time, nor abstracted details (things that I can't directly experience like times and dates and addresses...I have practically no sense of time....a caveat about addresses: unless I have clear memories of street/office number plates and street signs because at some point it was important for me to know and remember these things over the long term), but I remember what I saw and what I felt as well as information about what was happening and usually any understanding/thoughts (whether they were accurate/correct or mistaken) I had at the time.

I have language processing issues and tend to forget specific words over time unless they were particularly upsetting or confusing (or soothing/uplifting/intriguing), but I can remember clearly things like tone of voice and facial expressions.

I don't really have a third-person perspective picture of myself and probably never will (I do have some ability to create ad-hoc imaginings based on what others tell me but this is pattern matching and life experience....it's an abstracted thing and not at all natural, had to work hard to develop it...I go through life seeing from my perspective, from the inside-out, not the outside-in), but that does not mean I have no sense of self (nor does it mean I had no sense of self before i could do perspective taking -- a strong sense of self can exist without a strong sense of how other people see you....there is more to the self than the perceptions of others) or insight into my own behavior or that of other people...I just go about it differently.

Also, I don't think in words and my memory retrieval system is not coded with words -- I'd probably not be able to remember much if people just gave me a single word and asked me to talk about memories I associate with that word. Just because a word, offered in a completely-removed-from-ordinary-life research context, doesn't cue up many (or any) of the vast store of autobiographical memories I have doesn't mean that they don't exist or wouldn't be cued up by other things and/or in other contexts.

And just because my autobiographical memories may not contain the same info as other people's doesn't mean they are flawed or that they are not really autobiographical memories -- they are just different. I see the world differently and I think differently -- prioritizing or focusing on different types of information seems like a perfectly natural consequence of this.
 
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From what I can tell from one of the base study references for this paper. It seems as if we are supposed to quickly remember things, in keeping with normal parameters. In essence we are not fast enough as other people without autism. This is not a surprise, I need more time, rather than a base reaction on the spot.

"Autobiographical memory and social problem-solving in Asperger syndrome.
Goddard L1, Howlin P, Dritschel B, Patel T.
Abstract
Difficulties in social interaction are a central feature of Asperger syndrome. Effective social interaction involves the ability to solve interpersonal problems as and when they occur. Here we examined social problem-solving in a group of adults with Asperger syndrome and control group matched for age, gender and IQ. We also assessed autobiographical memory, on a cueing task and during social problem-solving, and examined the relationship between access to specific past experiences and social problem-solving ability. Results demonstrated a social problem-solving impairment in the Asperger group. Their solutions were less detailed, less effective and less extended in time. Autobiographical memory performance was also impaired with significantly longer latencies to retrieve specific memories and fewer specific memories retrieved in comparison to controls."Autobiographical memory and social problem-solving in Asperger syndrome. - PubMed - NCBI
 
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