Manifestations of Depression?

[Sportster]

• My best friend suffers from depression, or so he claims. I am trying to understand the manifestations of it, because it seems very different from how I experience depression or how I’ve heard others describe it.
  
  What I am hoping to do is understand it better and discern if his behavior is depression-driven or if he is merely acting like a swine and blaming it on the depression.
  
  When depression strikes me I get into a funk; I feel sad and prefer to be alone. Over the years I have taught myself to power through until it passes, because I know that if I don’t it may overtake me. The most extreme thing I have done has been to shut myself off from people for several days or binge eat Keebler cookies.
  
  My buddy can be manic (happy one minute and in a funk the next), but he also has made some very unsound decisions like buying a vehicle he cannot afford; he’s two months behind on his payments. He has skipped out on paying his bills. He buys things he does not need nor can afford. He has delusions of grandeur and believes that he will get wealthy through get-rich-quick schemes like those multi-level marketing programs you see on late-night TV.
  
  In addition to the aforementioned, when he’s having an episode (as I call it) he can be a real rattlesnake. He’ll say things that are borderline cruel. There have been times when I’ve visited that he has gone upstairs and gone to bed leaving me just sitting or he’ll just leave the house and leave me sitting there. I recall a time when he left me sitting in his living room and his niece came and told me he had gotten on his motorcycle and left.
  
  So, is his behavior normal for a depressed person or is he merely using it as an excuse to be a jerk? He’s my best friend that I’ve known for forty years. Being his friend is a challenge, but he’s been like a brother and has been a friend to me when others weren’t.
  
  All input will be appreciated, as I’m trying to understand him as best as I can.

 

[Gritches]

That kind of sounds like Rapid-Cycling Bipolar, the most extreme kind. When he's in a manic state, he'll do all the impulsive and grandiose stuff. Then when he's depressed, he's suddenly aware that he's in deep doo doo for all the crap he did when he was manic and will lash out. That's my take on it anyway.

He may also just have a general problem with self-control.

It can be controlled with medication, and is common enough where any psych worth their salt would know what to do.

But as to whether his depression is a valid reason/excuse? Living with mental illness is difficult. Medication helps, but they aren't magic beans that make it all better. You're still going to have the mental illness you're dealing with, you just have to learn to "ride the dragon". It sounds like your friend is letting the mental illness control him, instead of being in control of his mental illness. So no, I don't think it's a valid reason/excuse unless he's actively trying to get better.

 

[the_tortoise]

The manic things would fit with standard symptoms of bipolar disorder, I think.

 

[Judge]

Just go straight to the "quick list" of bipolar symptoms:

Bipolar Disorder Symptoms - What Does Mania Feel Like?

 

[Mattymatt]

My best friend suffers from depression, or so he claims. I am trying to understand the manifestations of it, because it seems very different from how I experience depression or how I’ve heard others describe it.

What I am hoping to do is understand it better and discern if his behavior is depression-driven or if he is merely acting like a swine and blaming it on the depression.

When depression strikes me I get into a funk; I feel sad and prefer to be alone. Over the years I have taught myself to power through until it passes, because I know that if I don’t it may overtake me. The most extreme thing I have done has been to shut myself off from people for several days or binge eat Keebler cookies.

My buddy can be manic (happy one minute and in a funk the next), but he also has made some very unsound decisions like buying a vehicle he cannot afford; he’s two months behind on his payments. He has skipped out on paying his bills. He buys things he does not need nor can afford. He has delusions of grandeur and believes that he will get wealthy through get-rich-quick schemes like those multi-level marketing programs you see on late-night TV.

In addition to the aforementioned, when he’s having an episode (as I call it) he can be a real rattlesnake. He’ll say things that are borderline cruel. There have been times when I’ve visited that he has gone upstairs and gone to bed leaving me just sitting or he’ll just leave the house and leave me sitting there. I recall a time when he left me sitting in his living room and his niece came and told me he had gotten on his motorcycle and left.

So, is his behavior normal for a depressed person or is he merely using it as an excuse to be a jerk? He’s my best friend that I’ve known for forty years. Being his friend is a challenge, but he’s been like a brother and has been a friend to me when others weren’t.

All input will be appreciated, as I’m trying to understand him as best as I can.

I think your friend is actually manic depressive. When I am depressed I don't want anyone around me. I just sort of retreat into my own little world and that is all I want. It's been pretty much a lifelong fight but at least the depression is in a waning phase for the first time in 4 years. I am finally starting to feel better. When I am depressed I am moody and irritable.

 

[Judge]

Yes, I see that in him. However, I wonder about the unsound decisions, etc, if that's part of the depression. He even tries to laugh off how he has skipped out on some of his bills, but blames it on the depression. I understand why his girlfriend has broken up with him a dozen times, because his moodiness can be a challenge, but the other stuff is worrisome for someone looking for a husband.

Good call. Sounds like you went right to the heart of his issues.

It's right there on that list:

• heightened sense of self-importance
• exaggerated positive outlook

• poor financial choices, rash spending sprees
• excessive irritability, aggressive behavior

 

[Mattymatt]

Yes, I see that in him. However, I wonder about the unsound decisions, etc, if that's part of the depression. He even tries to laugh off how he has skipped out on some of his bills, but blames it on the depression. I understand why his girlfriend has broken up with him a dozen times, because his moodiness can be a challenge, but the other stuff is worrisome for someone looking for a husband.

Depression is known to effect and impair judgement. It does for me. I've made some really poor decisions as a result of being depressed in an effort to get out of it. Depression is more than just sadness, it causes some cognitive difficulties as well as changes in behavior and other biochemical changes.

 

[Judge]

Well said!!! That's what I've been thinking. He is seeing a therapist finally and he's supposedly taking some sort of medication, but I have a bad feeling that the therapist is doing little to help him control his impulses and is reinforcing some of his behavior by making him believe that it's not his fault but rather things that have been planted in his mind.

I have chronic clinical depression, not bipolar disorder. Though from my own perspective, the idea of "control" in a general sense is something I've never thought I had. I can sense it coming, but past that for me it's mostly a matter of just enduring it, getting past it and waiting for it to cycle all over again.

I gave up my meds many years ago. Wanted back "me" instead of a shell of myself. However unlike my autism, my depression follows me everywhere, whether I'm alone or surrounded by people. I can't get away from it by shutting a door or ending a social interaction.

Simply put, when it comes to any sense of control....I guess I suck at it. Almost like a person having a seizure of sorts. Don't be too tough on your friend if he is as well. It's a struggle for many.

 

[Judge]

Sometimes I feel like I have as much control of depression as Kevin Bacon had of being initiated into a fraternity:

 

[LucyPurrs]

excessive irritability, aggressive behavior

These as well as the other impulsive behavior you mentioned are classic symptoms of a manic bi-polar phase. He may do well on a mood stabilizer used for bi-polar illness. Sounds like he needs something fast before he digs himself into a hole he can't get out of (financially).

 

[LucyPurrs]

He's already in the hole . . . at the bottom looking up. It would scare me beyond words to be in the kind of debt he is. I'll not go into detail here, but I'm surprised people haven't came for him yet. Unless he lands a very well paying job, I don't see how he'll ever recover financially.

As for medication, he did tell me they prescribed something, though I can't recall the name. It's something fairly new that he says doesn't make him feel like he's in a fog. He was taking something a few years ago, but quit since he didn't like how it made him feel.

Sorry to hear its gotten so far financially. But glad to hear he's on a medication that seems to agree with him. That's good if it keeps him from the manic phase. It is difficult to see what's happening- I feel for you but try to keep clear boundaries so you don't get sucked into stuff.

 

[Adora]

Sounds very Bipolar to me,i have family with it and they would go on a gambling binge and lose all of the rent and food money,they will do this usually in a manic phase and think they will be lucky in gambling,it was hard to live with it growing up because you never knew if the rent or bills would be paid but from what you have mentioned it does sound like a strong possibility of Bipolar type 1 because there is also Bipolar type 2 but it’s not as severe and people experience more depressive episodes than manic episodes.

 

[Adora]

Hmm, that does sound a lot like him, though he doesn't gamble. He just spends money on stuff he obviously doesn't need or makes irrational decisions. I suspect that's why his kids have little to do with him now, though he has been working on trying to improve that relationship. Oddly, I'm probably the only person that can tolerate him.

i can relate I don’t talk with said family member partly due to these issues and also being manipulated and lied to too many times,I been hurt way too many times and while I don’t blame this on the Bipolar entirely I still think it did contribute to the behaviour.

 

[Progster]

I agree with the others who say that it sounds like bipolar. A family member of my partner's is exactly like this - she claims to have depression, but I things there is something more than this, depression doesn't account for all of the symptoms. I think that she has bipolar or possibly borderline personality disorder.

 

[Autistamatic]

Another vote in favour of the bipolar possibility, in which case mood stabilisers would be the most likely medical option.
SSRIs can be good for depression but are not very good for someone who is bipolar.
I've been on SSRIs a few times for depression (not bipolar) and I have never found them to have any side effects for me. They take 4-6 weeks to have any noticeable effect, but once they kick in they have made a difference. I feel no dulling of the senses or of emotions, no loss of creativity, no nausea, headaches, sleep disturbances etc. They do take the edge off though - they don't fix the depression, just give me that little bit of extra strength and focus to beat it myself rather than be beaten by it.
No two people react to a medication the same way though, so I'm sad that other people have less positive experiences with SSRIs. They've helped me regain control in a few of the lowest points of my life.

 

[Mattymatt]

I think I have a severe form of clinical depression because if I don't take medication, I really spiral downhill fast. At least the only side effect that I notice is sleepiness so I always take it at bed time. Otherwise I don't feel any ill effects. I just feel hopeful and positive and it's easier for me to correct doom and gloom thinking if I find myself falling into that pattern.

 

[Monachopia]

As others have said, your friend is highly likely to be suffering from bipolar disorder. Quite severe form at that, my partner's mother is bipolar and is relatively mild as she's been on medication for about 20 years. Her manic/depressive phases aren't extremely severe, but she's tired a lot, she talks at a million miles an hour when she's manic and gets anxious and stressed. When she's down, she withdraws. Her cousin is more extreme on the bipolar scale and has gone out to buy expensive cars and has done irrational things and sounds like the friend you're describing.

I think, though, we all experience these disorders differently, we just simply have different chemical makeups and tolerances. I have clinical depression, but have at the worst times made irrational decisions (not as extreme as buying a car!), but mostly of the self-destructive type. There have been times when I just didn't have the capacity for love and tolerance anymore and have lashed out at people and pushed them away by being cruel because I just wanted to hurt myself more and to disappear. It's the same with medication and without. As someone pointed out, unfortunately depression is something that just follows us around everywhere and sometimes it gets too much and we can do stupid things too.

 

[Fino]

To me, your original post sounded like a question on a test in a General Psychology class. The symptoms for Bipolar are clearly stated, even using the correct terminology, classic, almost cliche, behavior is described, and the whole thing is told through the seemingly artificial lens of an ignorant bystander who knows nothing about mental illness.

And PSA: if someone uses mental illness/depression as an excuse for something, that does not automatically make the mental illness/depression not legitimate.

I bet he's on Depakote. Doctors love to prescribe that nowadays. Lamictal and Abilify also seem to be popular.

And just to have an opinion on the other side of these posts talking about medication taking away their real self: when I want to be myself, I go on medication. It's the only time I'm clear-headed, rational, etc. Just sayin!

 

[Propianotuner]

My best friend suffers from depression, or so he claims. I am trying to understand the manifestations of it, because it seems very different from how I experience depression or how I’ve heard others describe it.

What I am hoping to do is understand it better and discern if his behavior is depression-driven or if he is merely acting like a swine and blaming it on the depression.

When depression strikes me I get into a funk; I feel sad and prefer to be alone. Over the years I have taught myself to power through until it passes, because I know that if I don’t it may overtake me. The most extreme thing I have done has been to shut myself off from people for several days or binge eat Keebler cookies.

My buddy can be manic (happy one minute and in a funk the next), but he also has made some very unsound decisions like buying a vehicle he cannot afford; he’s two months behind on his payments. He has skipped out on paying his bills. He buys things he does not need nor can afford. He has delusions of grandeur and believes that he will get wealthy through get-rich-quick schemes like those multi-level marketing programs you see on late-night TV.

In addition to the aforementioned, when he’s having an episode (as I call it) he can be a real rattlesnake. He’ll say things that are borderline cruel. There have been times when I’ve visited that he has gone upstairs and gone to bed leaving me just sitting or he’ll just leave the house and leave me sitting there. I recall a time when he left me sitting in his living room and his niece came and told me he had gotten on his motorcycle and left.

So, is his behavior normal for a depressed person or is he merely using it as an excuse to be a jerk? He’s my best friend that I’ve known for forty years. Being his friend is a challenge, but he’s been like a brother and has been a friend to me when others weren’t.

All input will be appreciated, as I’m trying to understand him as best as I can.

-Yes your friend is depressed and what you've described is also depression. Being depressed is simply something human, we live in the kind of world that can drag a person's mood down for extended periods of time and leave them feeling disillusioned or jaded.

Clinical depression is something distinct from that. Either of you may or may not necessarily be experiencing the condition and symptoms I'm about to list. I'd like to be clear in that I'm not sharing this information as if I am some kind of authority myself, rather I'm sharing things I've learned from extended familiarity with ICD and DSM, the international and American manuals for practicing psychiatry.

-Clinical depression, which is now understood through the diagnosis of Major Depression, is a condition which causes people to feel lethargic, struggling to find and maintain stimulation and interest, irrationally assuming guilt (this is shown with examples of a person assuming guilt when any other party with knowledge of the circumstances would consider such a response cognitive dissonance), experiencing unhappiness even during what are supposed to be pleasant events, and living with most or all of these symptoms over periods of time that can last months or years.

-If I had to make an educated guess your friend will likely benefit more from looking at the criteria for Bipolar Disorder and Borderline Personality Disorder. The former may explain his mania and erratic nature although I'm more inclined to think he may be struggling with BPD, not BD, especially because of the self destructive behavior and delusions of grandeur you've mentioned.

 

[Fade2black]

My comment on the original post: Sounds like depression to me. The chronically depressed want to run away from themselves, but can't. I can say from experience that with long term depression, I'll do anything to escape it, even if it's just for a short while. This is the impetus behind making irrational purchases, gambling, and of course the flip side, which is the more destructive behavior of affairs, drugs and alcohol. Anything to escape the grips of depression. This behavior is in no way indicative of manic behavior.