Is autism a neurodevelopmental disorder?OG Answer.

[lunarious]

Question: Is autism a neurodevelopmental disorder?

It’s a neurological, not neurodevelopmental.

The difference, to clarify is that autism is not a lack of, or damaged development; but literally a brain wired differently than the stereotypical norm.

We’re not damaged, just different. Our brains process information in a different way, and are overwhelmed by things a NT brain would be fine with.

In contrast I’ve seen my NT friends flip over stuff that I don’t bat an eyelash at, so there could possibly be something there - or I could just be odd.

Updated opinion.

Three years on, and I’d honestly say I now think it’s both. There’s definitely some cases that are just neurological, and others that have developmental issues; so I’d wager there are cases that have both.

Edit: Source: Is autism a neurodevelopmental disorder?
Edit2: Added title/question

 

[lunarious]

Comment there at Quora:

Actually Autism Spectrum Disorder is both neurological and a neurodevelopmental disorder. A neurodevelopmental disorder is a neurological condition that someone is born with that affects their development. I have aspergers and am a neurobehavioural science major.

also neurodevelopmental doesn't = damaged development. It just means that we are wited differently and it causes our development to deviate from what is considered that norm or standard.

 

[lunarious]

I @lunarious approve

 

[Neonatal RRT]

It’s a neurological, not neurodevelopmental.

The difference, to clarify is that autism is not a lack of, or damaged development; but literally a brain wired differently than the stereotypical norm.

We’re not damaged, just different. Our brains process information in a different way, and are overwhelmed by things a NT brain would be fine with.

In contrast I’ve seen my NT friends flip over stuff that I don’t bat an eyelash at, so there could possibly be something there - or I could just be odd.

Updated opinion.

Three years on, and I’d honestly say I now think it’s both. There’s definitely some cases that are just neurological, and others that have developmental issues; so I’d wager there are cases that have both.

Edit: Source: Is autism a neurodevelopmental disorder?

OK. First off, you are using Quora for a source, which IS NOT a source of reliable information. These were expressed opinions and thoughts. This is NOT scientific data.

Secondly, you did say, "a brain wired differently than the stereotypical norm". Correct. By definition, this makes it a neurodevelopmental condition. The brain (neuro) developed differently (developmental). We have hundreds of scientific studies to demonstrate this, actual imaging comparing autistic brains vs neurotypical brains. The areas of our brains MOST affected are areas that develop in the 1st trimester of pregancy, and then into the cortex which develops during the 3rd trimester and into childhood. No argument. We have over 200 genetic autism markers, some 1000 epigenetic autism markers, and some 1500 RNA autism markers identified to date.

Thirdly, you said, "we're not damaged, just different". This statement could be (1) correct, (2) partially correct, or (3) wrong depending upon the circumstances triggering brain development. (1) If the autism is primarily due to familial genetics, then the brain developed the way the genetics dictated it to be. (2) If the autism is primarily due to epigenetic factors such as triggered by maternal hormonal conditions, exposures to environmental toxins, maternal infections, etc. then the brain will develop differently. (3) If the autism was due to damage or insults to normal development, and this is also epigenetic, such as being born extremely premature (22-26 weeks gestation) and prolonged neonatal intensive care environmental exposure, alterations in placental blood flow, intrauterine intracranial hemorrhages, etc can alter brain development.

Now to be further clear on this, many variants of autism are also associated with poor fine motor skills (fingers, hands, and wrists, as well as, feet and ankles) and then there are the immune function alterations such as enhanced release of inflammatory cytokines when exposed to injuries and infections leading to an abnormal amount of inflammation. Not to mention that many of us, if tested, would have elevated inflammatory markers such as homocysteine, as a baseline, effecting blood pressure, kidney function, inflammatory bowel, arthritis, and the like as we age.

Autism is, for some, a MEDICAL condition. The functional anatomy of the brain, which we already established as "different" in many ways, will often dictate the function, and primary or base behaviors of the individual. Over time, these base behaviors, when interacting with our environment, can then lead to tertiary psychiatric conditions.

I appreciate what you were trying to do here, but we get "gaslit" enough by the people around us that there isn't an underlying cause for our condition, that it is just a difference. Yes, there should be acceptance. Yes, there should be some internal peace. However, let's have a bit more accuracy with our language even amongst ourselves here because neurotypicals know almost nothing of what we are going through and are quick to push our condition off as something that is a "moral shortcoming", an "excuse", or just a "label".

 

[lunarious]

Why are you angry?

And you posted longer critisism than my Original post. I'll try read it later.

Edit: Personal opinions are good, ... like your view.

 

[lunarious]

Definition of TRIMESTER
Definition of SEMESTER

We have over 200 genetic autism markers, some 1000 epigenetic autism markers, and some 1500 RNA autism markers identified to date.

What does this quote translate to? ... i know what DNA is is, but what is rNA?

Edit: I was less intimidated and more prepared reading your post now. ... i'll read the rest sometime maybe.

 

[Crossbreed]

Even though I believe that we [ASD1s] have viable neurologies, our development looks to be partially stunted according to NT standards. That is why it is considered to be a developmental disorder.

On the plus side, we retain our fluid thinking capabilities longer, when NTs transition to more crystalized thinking. They consider that to be "childish." (Most gifteds have this same feature.)

The severe co-morbids of ASD2/3 halt their development at an earlier stage.

 

[Misty Avich]

For some it's a disability.

For others it's a difference.

For some like me it's a mental health illness.

 

[Neonatal RRT]

Definition of TRIMESTER
Definition of SEMESTER


What does this quote translate to? ... i know what DNA is is, but what is rNA?

Edit: I was less intimidated and more prepared reading your post now. ... i'll read the rest sometime maybe.

Genetic markers are on the DNA. They can be familial, that is, passed down from parents and the genetics can run in families, aunts, uncles, siblings, cousins, etc.. They can be passed down from parents, but NOT familial, as in the case of "older parents" with "old eggs and sperm" with damaged DNA from aging, environmental toxin exposures, certain medications, etc. Genetic markers can be epigenetic, in that DNA alterations occur within the intrauterine environment, and this is often associated with other gene alterations within the ribonucleic acid (RNA). An interesting example being identical twins, one autistic, one not. Ribonucleic Acid (RNA) Fact Sheet

 

[Ken]

In my observation throughout my life, I find that anything "different" is considered "bad" (even it the bad offers some benefits). It almost seems to be human nature to reject differences. Thus, seeing someone as different, including differences in perception or mental differences are considered "defective" or ill developed - never just developed differently. Thus, the general population - including professional scientists, researchers, doctors, etc. always considers anyone who is different, physically or mentally, are ill developed and needs "fixing" or treatment.

It is easy to say that autism is a defect or disorder because they suffer for being autistic. In my experience, however, I only suffer when I have to interface with other people or society. If left alone, I am always OK. I only suffer with that interface - and that interface is man made. What I'm expected to do or think, or how I respond, etc. is by society's definition. Again, I do just fine with the physical world. It's just the man made society that I have a problem with.

And indeed, that is a big problem.

Makes me think about "Tommy" by the Who.

 

[Neonatal RRT]

In my observation throughout my life, I find that anything "different" is considered "bad" (even it the bad offers some benefits). It almost seems to be human nature to reject differences. Thus, seeing someone as different, including differences in perception or mental differences are considered "defective" or ill developed - never just developed differently. Thus, the general population - including professional scientists, researchers, doctors, etc. always considers anyone who is different, physically or mentally, are ill developed and needs "fixing" or treatment.

It is easy to say that autism is a defect or disorder because they suffer for being autistic. In my experience, however, I only suffer when I have to interface with other people or society. If left alone, I am always OK. I only suffer with that interface - and that interface is man made. What I'm expected to do or think, or how I respond, etc. is by society's definition. Again, I do just fine with the physical world. It's just the man made society that I have a problem with.

And indeed, that is a big problem.

Makes me think about "Tommy" by the Who.

Agree. That's human nature and goes back to when we were 3 hairs from being baboons. Tribal. Anyone or anything that did not conform to "the group" was considered a threat and was either driven out or killed. Nearly, if not all, social animals, birds, and fish do the very same thing. This is primal. It is deeply seeded in our DNA.

We like to distinguish ourselves as some "higher order" of being on this planet, but NOT when it comes to this. We are constantly trying to separate ourselves into little groups and we love to fight.

The bottom line here, if you are one who has been a victim of this sort of behavior, in some form or fashion, DO NOT expect any different in the future. Sure, in an authoritarian state, we can make all sorts of social rules, equity and equality, and compel speech, but those rules cannot change our thoughts or our nature. It's always there. Advice: Accept yourself first, make peace with your autism, and stop playing the victim. You can't change this. Don't let others have power over you.

 

[lunarious]

In my observation throughout my life, I find that anything "different" is considered "bad" (even it the bad offers some benefits). It almost seems to be human nature to reject differences. Thus, seeing someone as different, including differences in perception or mental differences are considered "defective" or ill developed - never just developed differently. Thus, the general population - including professional scientists, researchers, doctors, etc. always considers anyone who is different, physically or mentally, are ill developed and needs "fixing" or treatment.

It is easy to say that autism is a defect or disorder because they suffer for being autistic. In my experience, however, I only suffer when I have to interface with other people or society. If left alone, I am always OK. I only suffer with that interface - and that interface is man made. What I'm expected to do or think, or how I respond, etc. is by society's definition. Again, I do just fine with the physical world. It's just the man made society that I have a problem with.

And indeed, that is a big problem.

Makes me think about "Tommy" by the Who.

I feel strongly in doubt what to say, because what i say will be misunderstood.

Opener says:

Updated opinion.

Three years on, and I’d honestly say I now think it’s both. There’s definitely some cases that are just neurological, and others that have developmental issues; so I’d wager there are cases that have both.

 

[Neonatal RRT]

I feel strongly in doubt what to say, because what i say will be misunderstood.

Opener says:

Updated opinion.

Three years on, and I’d honestly say I now think it’s both. There’s definitely some cases that are just neurological, and others that have developmental issues; so I’d wager there are cases that have both.

Let's be careful wanting to separate the two, when it's one and the same. Neurological function, at its core, is a result of the anatomy, the neural development. This is not unlike a computer or a machine built with a purpose and specific performance specs. Form and function are tied.

Core functioning might be our base reactions to stimuli and how our senses perceive our world. In the example of autism, it might be our sensory issues, sound, light, sense of touch, taste, etc. It may also be our immune system reactions, our fine motor skills, our oxytocin and vasopressin levels, and how we input information like reading/not reading all the subtle nuances of non-verbal communication and facial micro expression. Now, the tertiary psychiatry, the personality traits, the results of what happens over time when a brain, with a specific neurodevelopment and functioning, interacts with its environment, with other people, etc. both good and bad experiences, what was integrated and how it was integrated, that now influence behaviors.