Intrusive rumination

[Azul]

My head is collapsing. I'm ruminating over that teacher's bullying everyday for a year.

I can't stand the fight or flight state. Or imaginating she ignoring and disdaining me. This is what most makes me ill. Imagining her indiference.

The rumination lasts for a whole day. I can't work nor function. I feel almost nauseous sometimes.

 

[Outdated]

That happens to me too. It makes me lose sleep and interferes with routines. It often takes days for my mind to settle down again.

 

[Thinx]

Sounds like there may be some trauma there, if that's true, some therapy or talking this through with a good listener, will likely move you on.

For ruminating generally, which is common for us and does tend to lack usefulness, try out interrupting the process with a phrase like, right, no more ruminating, I am going for a walk, and looking to see how many different birds/trees/animals/ umbrellas I can spot (or some other activity that is distracting and will get you out of that pointless groove) Interrupt, do something different, feel better.

 

[MildredHubble]

I completely understand what this is like @Azul I do it often. I think I've described it before like my mind gets into a recursive loop, like a computer trying to calculate pi.

The one that bothers me most right now is the rather awful experience I had with a psychiatrist for over a year. It's like I can't process why someone would be so evil. I feel like I should have acted to do something about it. But it's stuck in the past but also causes issues for me in the present.

I think the thing that my brain is trying to process is the sheer unrelenting cruelty and why someone could behave that way when I did nothing to warrant it. The truth is I simply can't understand that kind of mind. But my brain needs to figure out how to avoid it and even resolve the issues it has lead to.

It's like I'm running every scenario over and over so I can build a model in my mind that won't lead to yet more misery. The issue is that I play by the rules and they don't. So it's essentially impossible to build a strategy that works. But my mind hates incomplete resolution.

As @Thinx says, distracting yourself from the unrelenting trainride is the only thing that you can really do until you can speak to someone and externalise the lack of resolution and trauma.

My mind has a lot of traumatic experiences to churn up. A few are very similar (involving teachers) to what you describe. I'm a problem solver, and when I run out of problems to solve in the external world my brain serves up a nice dollop of unresolved trauma to "resolve".

I'm really sorry you are going through it right now :-( I hope it passes soon!

 

[Gerald Wilgus]

Please be careful and find ways to derail that train of thought. I hope you never know the thoughts that something like PTSD can create. I am slowly rebuilding myself with positive thoughts to combat recent meltdowns. Perseverating on the negative is as useless as worry.

 

[Rodafina]

Sounds difficult and exhausting, @Azul.

@Thinx’s advice seems really sound here. One addition that a helpful therapist suggested to me was to allow myself a certain, small amount of time to worry, approximately 10 minutes a day, and then close the door and move on to distraction and other things.

 

[MildredHubble]

I often recommend trying these breathing exercises in the links below. They aren't your usual wooly breathing exercises. They have been rather effective for me in getting relief from excessive rumination. If you want to try them please watch the safety video first.

These definitely create a physiological change in the body that helps you relax, unlike a lot of breathing exercises you might find out there. In my opinion and experience, these are the real deal. But you have to do them where you will be safe. Even if you aren't very good at them at first they can still be quite effective.

With practice you will likely get more proficient. The idea is not to force yourself beyond your comfort zone, just do your best. The breath holds can feel quite challenging, if you need to breathe, just breathe and resume holding your breath.

I hope you find this useful!

 

[Au Naturel]

To me, it is obvious you need help. That kind of thinking can be anxiety or PTSD or OCD or any of a number of other issues. Yeah, I know that therapy isn't always available. Not free, or a long waiting list, and you're not guaranteed of getting one who is useful.

I've been hit by intrusive thoughts. Like I want to go and delete every social media post I've ever done. I want to erase my public identity and disappear. Every bad thing or mistake I've ever made comes flooding in. (Trust me, I've done a few.) I understand the thoughts are irrational but that doesn't stop them. I found that the best thing for me was distraction and physical activity.

It isn't the thought itself that causes the problem. It is the associated physical reaction. Your body starts cranking out adrenaline and cortisol. Without those, you aren't anxious. Physical activity, like a long hard hike, neutralizes the anxiety chemistry. Now it is just thoughts without intense anxiety attached. It allows me to crowd the thoughts out with music or television or youtube videos or (shudder!) social activity.

A Valium or other anxiolytic short circuits the attack. Not always available. I might need something to help me sleep. Can't sleep if your system is flooded with adrenaline. Obviously, it is a time to avoid stimulants.

If the thoughts start to come back, I hit them hard immediately with distraction or physical exertion. Over time they stop intruding and it is easier to move on to something else. Eventually, (Days? Weeks?) the thoughts lose their power. I'm not denying the past, I am refusing to let it control the present.

 

[Angular Chap]

I too was bullied by a teacher, many years ago now. It took me a while to realise that what I endured was actually bullying (or by today's standards and definitions, maybe something worse) and I thought maybe it was the source of all of my issues, before I discovered Autism. I always felt like I could never talk about it because I always got shut down. Like people seemed to hold teachers in the same high regard as paramedics and firefighters. In an ideal world maybe, I have met a handful of good teachers, but no one wanted to listen to what I had to endure.

 

[Outdated]

I have met a handful of good teachers, but no one wanted to listen to what I had to endure.

This was also me, but where I seem to differ from so many others on this forum is that by the age of 8 it was painfully obvious to me that I was abnormal and unacceptable. From other kids, from teachers, from doctors, and even from my father.

I stopped bothering trying to fit in because every attempt ended in dismal failure. I went the other way, I was adamantly me and other people could like it or lump it. Mostly they lumped it, I always thought that my high tolerance to pain came from my childhood.

But I never gave in, perhaps there's a perversity in my nature, I am unable to back down. If people just don't like me I can accept that and I'm happy to walk away, if they try to change who I am I'll go out of my way to rub their noses in their own inferiority.

 

[Rodafina]

my high tolerance to pain came from my childhood.

But I never gave in, perhaps there's a perversity in my nature, I am unable to back down. If people just don't like me I can accept that and I'm happy to walk away, if they try to change who I am I'll go out of my way to rub their noses in their own inferiority.

@Outdated are you sure you aren’t a honey badger? A really smart honey badger at a computer?

I’m learning so much from your tenacity.

 

[Outdated]

I'd never heard of a honey badger before and had to look it up. Thank you so much, I'm proud of that description. It possibly helped that I was a young man in the 80s, being different was to some degree celebrated back then, the world has turned more conservative again now. My more annoying neighbours have discovered that it's best to leave me alone.

 

[Azul]

The one that bothers me most right now is the rather awful experience I had with a psychiatrist for over a year. It's like I can't process why someone would be so evil. I feel like I should have acted to do something about it. But it's stuck in the past but also causes issues for me in the present.

I think the thing that my brain is trying to process is the sheer unrelenting cruelty and why someone could behave that way when I did nothing to warrant it. The truth is I simply can't understand that kind of mind. But my brain needs to figure out how to avoid it and even resolve the issues it has lead to.

That's what I feel too. I feel an urge to either find a possible solution, a better scene where all could potentially be resolved, or to fantasize about a better world.

I too was bullied by a teacher, many years ago now. It took me a while to realise that what I endured was actually bullying (or by today's standards and definitions, maybe something worse) and I thought maybe it was the source of all of my issues, before I discovered Autism. I always felt like I could never talk about it because I always got shut down. Like people seemed to hold teachers in the same high regard as paramedics and firefighters. In an ideal world maybe, I have met a handful of good teachers, but no one wanted to listen to what I had to endure.

One thing that aggravates the feeling is the despair of not being heard, of not having no one to turn to.

To me, it is obvious you need help. That kind of thinking can be anxiety or PTSD or OCD or any of a number of other issues. Yeah, I know that therapy isn't always available. Not free, or a long waiting list, and you're not guaranteed of getting one who is useful.
(...)
If the thoughts start to come back, I hit them hard immediately with distraction or physical exertion. Over time they stop intruding and it is easier to move on to something else. Eventually, (Days? Weeks?) the thoughts lose their power. I'm not denying the past, I am refusing to let it control the present.

Having therapy help is something I need, although I'm not in good situation regarding money right now. I might at least change psychiatrist, since mine doesn't do much that is useful.

@Thinx , @Rodafina , @MildredHubble , @Au Naturel

Thanks for the useful suggestions, I will try some of those and see if it helps.

 

[Angular Chap]

One thing that aggravates the feeling is the despair of not being heard, of not having no one to turn to.

Very true. But as we see in this thread, you can always turn to all the great people on here.

All the best to you working through your current thoughts.

 

[Leanon]

Hey there,

Congrats on identifying how you feel and sharing about it for support (y)

Is it possible for you to open up to the teacher in an assertive way? The other day when you "[factual neutral description of what hurt you, is it words?], I felt [your emotion: hurt, dejected, misunderstood]. In the future I would like that if you need to [what you think the teacher wanted in reality] you use a different way like [for example ...]"

For example, the other day when you said that I was lazy to in reality encourage me to learn more my lessons by heart, I felt hurt. In the future, I would need that yoU avoid judgemental words as they can hurt and instead focus on what I should do differently (the tasks).

Often people have good intentions in saying things how they say them, but the way they time it, the words they use, their automatic responses too sometimes can indeed break quality listening and communication at all.

Also if you can talk about how you feel to people you trust (relatives). Take care.

 

[MildredHubble]

I too was bullied by a teacher, many years ago now. It took me a while to realise that what I endured was actually bullying (or by today's standards and definitions, maybe something worse) and I thought maybe it was the source of all of my issues, before I discovered Autism. I always felt like I could never talk about it because I always got shut down. Like people seemed to hold teachers in the same high regard as paramedics and firefighters. In an ideal world maybe, I have met a handful of good teachers, but no one wanted to listen to what I had to endure.

I thought I had replied to this earlier but I mustn't have hit the post button.

I too took a long time to realise that the bullying I received from several teachers was real and probably really should be listed under the "something worse category".

I always blamed myself. I thought it was my fault, but having the hindsight and the perspective of an adult, I now know what they did was completely unacceptable. It damaged me. The damage lead to other sources of friction and eviscerated my self esteem, and not least, lead to the belief that I shouldn't defend myself against other people whose behaviour fell into the "something worse" category.

I always believed there was something defective about me that warranted people absolutely riding rough shod over my boundaries in ways they simply would not dare to with other people. And on the rare occasions I did stand up for myself, I would be ruthlessly attacked and punished for "stepping out of line".

Now I understand the truth of the situation, certain ruminations have finally ceased. I will certainly be a formidable force if these tormentors happen to cross my path in the future and try to pedal the same routine they did back then.

 

[Gerald Wilgus]

I am slowly learning to handle the thoughts that trigger the profoundly negative emotions from my dead past. The triggers revolve around sexuality and the experiences I missed that make me feel worthless, unwanted. I am starting to parent that hurt young man, telling him that it will all work out better than he can imagine, that I DO get noticed by women, some of whom think I am vigorous and handsom. And learning skills not shared by many, from whitewater open canoe to diving in overhead environments. Plus, if I am to be a successful Big Brother, I've gotta get my **** together.

 

[MildredHubble]

I am slowly learning to handle the thoughts that trigger the profoundly negative emotions from my dead past. The triggers revolve around sexuality and the experiences I missed that make me feel worthless, unwanted. I am starting to parent that hurt young man, telling him that it will all work out better than he can imagine, that I DO get noticed by women, some of whom think I am vigorous and handsom. And learning skills not shared by many, from whitewater open canoe to diving in overhead environments. Plus, if I am to be a successful Big Brother, I've gotta get my **** together.

I can really relate to this so much. I'm trying to show my inner child/teen/young adult, the love they didn't receive. I spent so many years feeling like no one loved me and no one would. I was so distressed and confused. It only got better when I got away from my mother and all the horrible mantras she had polluted my head with, about my value as a person etc could start to be torn down.

I'm sure you are going to make a fantastic Big Brother! You are probably exactly the sort of Big Brother and mentor I would have truly benefited from being around!

I have every faith that you will heal and also help others heal!

 

[Angular Chap]

I always blamed myself. I thought it was my fault, but having the hindsight and the perspective of an adult, I now know what they did was completely unacceptable. It damaged me. The damage lead to other sources of friction and eviscerated my self esteem, and not least, lead to the belief that I shouldn't defend myself against other people whose behaviour fell into the "something worse" category.

I always believed there was something defective about me that warranted people absolutely riding rough shod over my boundaries in ways they simply would not dare to with other people. And on the rare occasions I did stand up for myself, I would be ruthlessly attacked and punished for "stepping out of line".

I was victim blamed into feeling the same way. That's another thing about bullying, it always seems to bring out the enablers and the apologists, which leads on to victim blaming. Or even victim punishing.

 

[MildredHubble]

I was victim blamed into feeling the same way. That's another thing about bullying, it always seems to bring out the enablers and the apologists, which leads on to victim blaming. Or even victim punishing.

Very true. I think this is related to people indulging in the "Just World Hypothesis". They believe that if bad things happen it's partly the victims fault.