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I don't understand authority

Discussion in 'Politics Discussion' started by PastelPetals, Jun 23, 2021.

  1. PastelPetals

    PastelPetals Well-Known Member

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    I meet criteria for ODD yet I am not diagnosed. That is for a few reasons. Most symptoms can be attributed to being autistic or PTSD (99% of trauma happened at school) however it has been noted (and they are right) that I don't have a good understanding of hierarchies. I have wondered if that's common in autism. I sure hope not as it brought be a ton of trouble. I have no issues standing up for myself, correcting teachers, telling them their ideas are bad etc. As far as I see it we are both people and we have not lived the same life so if I know more about the topic than you do I deserve a seat at the table. Maybe you are older or get a paycheck or have a degree but I am not dumb. We are all equals inherently and I think things would work better if we lived like that.Now I can tell you this because I have learned but I don't truly understand it and since I don't I can't in good faith follow the logic of hierarchies. Does anyone else think like that?
     
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  2. TryingtoLearn

    TryingtoLearn New Member

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    I have had similar thoughts. In theory I understand and respect hierarchies, but quite often I treat everyone as an equal human being which can be a problem for example when I've given higher priority to tasks from junior persons at work.
     
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  3. Aspychata

    Aspychata Serenity waves, beachy vibes

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    I think you are great and wish more people had your courage. But l need to warn you, you have a rough dark bumpy road ahead of you in life.☺
     
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  4. TryingtoLearn

    TryingtoLearn New Member

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    I know. Right now I'm pretty screwed because I'm sticking up to my local authority who are illegally mistreating me.
     
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  5. PastelPetals

    PastelPetals Well-Known Member

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    Oh I am sorry about that
     
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  6. TryingtoLearn

    TryingtoLearn New Member

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    It's not fun, but get to enjoy some little battles. Like recently managed to have me GP acknowledge proof and put on my medical record how badly one of the mental health team leaders seriously mistreated me.
     
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  7. Aspychata

    Aspychata Serenity waves, beachy vibes

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    My comment was directed to you about a bumpy road ahead.
     
  8. PastelPetals

    PastelPetals Well-Known Member

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    Oh yes I did know that the friendly reaction was to acknowledge the truth but also thank you for saying it. It was bee hard even more so since I was abused in the school system and ignored me when they broke the law (yes many people in my schools just fully broke laws). But I am bad at change so I guess I will be like this anyway.
     
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  9. Progster

    Progster Gone sideways to the sun V.I.P Member

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    I can relate to this, I have similar issues with authority. I see all people as being equal. A specialist in their field will probably know more than me about that field overall, but that doesn't mean that I can't know a fact that they don't, and it certainly doesn't mean that they are superior to me or have authority over me. I have found out information about medical conditions that a GP doesn't know simply because I've done the research on that particular condition in more depth and more recently than they have, and actually, it's not at all uncommon for patients to come to doctors with research that they had never heard of.

    In English, we address all people with "you" but in other languages like German there is also a polite form of address (du/Sie). This was something I could never grasp in learning foreign languages - native speakers sense when to use the polite "Sie" and when to use the familiar "du". I can't sense this intuitively - I can learn rules for it, but I don't 'feel' it.

    In the office there are also unspoken and unwritten rules about hierarchy - some people seem to get more respect than others and it's understood by all who has priority, but I'm oblivious to these, has caused me problems when working in that kind of environment.
     
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  10. Sarah S

    Sarah S Well-Known Member

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    Reg you're not being diagnosed with ODD or indeed perhaps other diagnosis. In my case as i have stated earlier they stopped searching and adding more diagnosis in my medical files when they located my ASD. In general, as i have understood this they tend to not want to add all diagnosis so they usely stopp at a few. If they were to put all my gazillion both already found as well as the multiple diagnos yet to find. (They already concluded in my medical records multiple other diagnosis yet to find. But as the odds of locating them all is not good & next to impossible. So, they decided to stop) it would fill up a whole page.

    As i have been treated and regarded as a retard /idiot all my childhood (and like you seems to i have also been bullied and most definitely not fitted in while in school) & in my case when i turned 18 (our legal age of adult) i said NO more so after that i haven't taken any unjustifiable crap or bs from anyone since (and yes i have fought both governments, bosses ,etc.... So just because you might (i might as well) fit in the ODD diagnose it may also be due to your earlier life my young friend.

    I have no problem with authorities of any kind myself but i don't take any unjustied crap from either of them & I'm a scared warrior and well known as one.
     
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  11. unperson

    unperson Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    Yes, I'm the same it's a big problem. I think they call it 'talking back to a policeman'. Authority figures do not like being corrected. I see people as equal too, whereas they're very conscious of rank.
     
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  12. SusanLR

    SusanLR Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    I talk back to those who talk down to me like I'm less than or some type of idiot that doesn't know
    what I'm talking about.

    I see people as equals. Different back grounds and knowledge, but, it's the attitude of some authority
    figures that gets me.
    Certain jobs are more attractive too for this type of personality.
    The bullies that want to feel large and in charge and get away with it because their position lets them. That type will look for positions that allow them to act out their urge for control and get away with it.

    It isn't so much the authority or title. There are people who can hold high positions and still act
    humane. It's the ones with the personality, narcissistic types that want to rule.
     
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  13. Rainbowcat

    Rainbowcat Well-Known Member

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    I fit the criteria of ODD. As i kid i had a lot of trouble in school, i could not understand that a teacher has power over me, i used to answer back and defend my self, that brought even more bullying from them.

    Even now i can't understand hierarhies, i find that all people are equal,even if i am talking to the prime minister. I respect who that person is in front of me,but i find we are both humans and that makes us equal.

    I had a quarell recently with a future employer, he wanted that i will work more hours, but be paid the same, i told him i can't do that and he started shouting at me, he thought i would say yes to all his requests, i told no to all the requests that were not in the contract. I did not go there to work. He got red from his anger, before i left.

    Currently i am working at a hotel and the hotel owner told me on Monday something rediculous(don't go often to the toilet) i answered her back in the same way and she took the message ,that what she said was crazy. She started lauging when she understood what she just told me.

    It's better to defend ourselfs than be abused and not to speak up.

    I was severely bullied by teachers for defending my self in front of the whole class, but that is who i am and i won't change that.

    In our societies it is normal for male ones to defend their selfs ,but when a girl does it or a woman they look at her like she is an alien. This is my personal experience as a female( i don't relate to my gender but i am still treated as a female,due to my small built and my feminine looking,which i can't change easily).
     
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  14. Ronald Zeeman

    Ronald Zeeman Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    My issue my whole life is being unable to respect authority. If someone is wrong I have no issue correcting them. thats why I like to work alone
     
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  15. unperson

    unperson Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    Not understanding power relationships, yeah, I'm blind to it. Have very poor 'fear' detectors as in situational awareness. Being fairly harmless myself I have trouble detecting danger. It takes one to know one.
     
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  16. Ronin82

    Ronin82 Dog Trainer Extraordinaire

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    I get in so much trouble for this!! I've never been one to let inaccuracies slide, and have corrected teachers and professionals alike over the years. I just have no patience for social hierarchies with idiots and egotists. I definitely respect someone who does a job I can't do, with responsibilities I couldn't even DREAM of handling, but if they make a stupid decision I'll call them on it. Knowledge is knowledge, and all humans make mistakes or can be misinformed about something. Only by having ALL the RIGHT info can leaders make appropriate decisions. I'm cool with helping good leaders get the job done right, but I'll definitely step on toes to do it. Rank cuts no mustard with me. Its probably a big reason why I'm unemployed and alone...I can live with that.
     
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  17. Aspychata

    Aspychata Serenity waves, beachy vibes

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    Funny but l grew up with a complete egotistical buttwipe for a stepfather who truly thought he walked on water and the seas parted for him. So we can just imagine what happen to me going against him, then he pulled out the sex abuse card on me.

    Now l have matured, l realize people who are in authority can be good or bad and you have to roll with the program.

    Most of my bosses have been fair, the ones on the spectrum. The other bosses - it can be trying for me to get along with them but l try hard and l am a work in progress. The best bosses leave me alone and know l do a great job. Authority is needed in society and it's best we get along.
     
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  18. watersprite

    watersprite inadvertent vagabond V.I.P Member

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    People are equal, social groups are by definition unequal. Partners are equal, family members are equal, mates are equal, but the more aggressive personality will usually prevail.
    The people and groups who have a set of behaviors that work for their benefit often see everything as a competitive game. Almost always they have other people backing them and in emotional compliance in a sorted order. This ‘team’ can appear clever while in amygdala- numbing safety. When we fail to behave in the agreed upon way, they’re only capable of reacting within their little set of behaviors. They have to force us, quick: back into line. Some use bullying some use manupulation, some use a creepy sense of “helping us” but we’re always being herded to comply with what keeps them in charge & in control.
     
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  19. Martha Ferris

    Martha Ferris Seeking answers

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    I have upset quite a few people over the years because I did not give them the respect that they thought they deserved. I have questioned not just accepted and their sense of security was threatened by merely being questioned. I question everything and assume nothing.
    I have problems with the chain of command.
    I don't bow and scrape to anyone.
    I understand why there are hierarchies but I don't necessarily agree with all the ones that exist and there are various reasons why they do. Organizations need a hierarchy to get things done. Most are too large to function with more intimate interactions with all their employees. The smaller the organization the more are the opportunities to have ones voice heard and to exert influence. The old idea that men know more than women and are thus superior is one hierarchy that is being eroded and exterminated.
    I view people as equals therefore each person's view should be respectfully listened to and considered in my opinion.
    What effect you have when standing up to authority depends upon their attitude and yours.
    We must consider our motivations. Are we confrontational because we can't stand being told what to do? Or is there a problem that really needs to be addressed? Therein lies the crux of our behavior and which should be carefully examined.
    We must exemplify the attitude of respectful listening and discourse regardless of the behavior of the authority figure. Two wrongs don't make a right and if we want to be listened to then we must extend the same courtesy.
    Having been an activist since my early twenties I have stood up to authority many, many times and am still doing so but there is a right way and a wrong way to do it. A way that can effect change and a way that only sets up road blocks. One must have a sound basis for questioning authority and be able to back it up with either the law or with supported evidence. When we have that behind us then it is harder to dismiss us or for them to defend their position. In your place of employment know your policies and procedures. In your interactions with others extend courtesy even if you think the other person is a doofus.
     
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  20. OkRad

    OkRad μῆνιν ἄειδε θεὰ Πηληϊάδεω Ἀχιλῆος οὐλομένην V.I.P Member

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    The sad fact is social hierarchies matter to the extreme even if they don't matter to you. Look up Social Dominance Orientation which explains how different people see social dominance. But it does not matter if you respect it not. You will pay a deep price if you either decide to fight it or refuse to respect it.

    In times when you need to fight it (i.e Nazi Germany), you need to have allies. You cannot just NOT respect the system, especially if you have mental health issues on record. If you don't, it will only escalate with increased diagnoses, "treatments", jail time, and in Nazi Germany, you would be killed.

    Hierarchies, once they are established, fight like hell to remain. They can shift, that's true, but you can't just decide you don't like it and assume you can live in a society unless you want to be Amish, a hermit, or a homesteader.
     
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