FOR THE ASD MUSICIANS OUT THERE! Difficulty with NAMING NOTES.

[Merete]

I have always had difficulty identifying/naming notes. And it`s so embarrassing! When I went to music school, my teachers were horrified of my poor skills in identifying intervals, chords and so on... I am a high leveled pianist (both jazz and classical) and are composing in-the-moment. SO.... WHY do I have that problem?
One teacher said I should quit musicschool, and take private lessons for it. That was just awful. And I have done a lot of ear training. ALOT. It just doesn't work. So after I got my diagnosis for ASD, I wondered: Is that maybe some traits of my asd? Before I got my diagnosis, I just kept it for myself- trying to hide it as good as I could. My analyze was that I hade a different pathway from my auditory to (maybe language) area in my brain... heheh. Maybe it is so?
People on the spectrum have these "genius" musicians who hade perfect pitch. Sometimes I feel I have perfect pitch, because I feel I see the notes like pictures in my head- and just know what they are. BUT- I can never NAME them... I can never do this when I am a little bit anxious, or trying to prove myself or others what I "think" (maybe) I can do.

I just wonder- are there any other musicians that feel like they have the same issue? (normal people usually cannot name an interval when they hear it-- or a chord---but trained musicians should maybe have the skill when learned...It shouldn't be that hard....) I MEAN- EVERYONE IN MY CLASS COULD DO IT!!!!! It is embarrassing for me to explain to fellow musicians my problem- because I feel they do not understand. And they think I am just stupid or not talented at all.

By the way--- I feel that D is light blue, E is red, F is green, G is green, A is yellow, B is pink, C i dark blue. But I do not see the colours like those with Synesthesia- in front of me. Only in mye head.

 

[Echo]

By the way--- I feel that D is light blue, E is red, F is green, G is green, A is yellow, B is pink, C i dark blue. But I do not see the colours like those with Synesthesia- in front of me. Only in mye head.

Hi Merete! Nice to meet you. Most of us synesthetes do not see the colors in front of us... but in our heads. So you're definitely synesthetic.

And, even before you mentioned the colors of the letters/notes, I was going to respond YES, Me Too... Possibly BECAUSE of synesthesia.

The intervals, for me anyway, exist as complex architectural scaffolds of color and light in my head... and I follow them to create the music. General theory just irritates me because it conflicts with my native "knowledge" of music as this synesthetic construct.

 

[Graphin]

I do not have such perceptions, and am a rather entry level pianist. I have a huge problem translating between notes, chords and melodies from the way i do it to the way it usually gets expressed, in both way. Ignoring the fact that i'm too slow and worse with my fingers than people who've played less than me.

 

[Merete]

Hi Merete! Nice to meet you. Most of us synesthetes do not see the colors in front of us... but in our heads. So you're definitely synesthetic.

And, even before you mentioned the colors of the letters/notes, I was going to respond YES, Me Too... Possibly BECAUSE of synesthesia.

The intervals, for me anyway, exist as complex architectural scaffolds of color and light in my head... and I follow them to create the music. General theory just irritates me because it conflicts with my native "knowledge" of music as this synesthetic construct.

Wow! So.... Maybe I have learned the wrong way- for me? Did you have to be conscious of this to just play what you hear/see? I have had experiments were I write down what the different sounds "look" like, but I have stopped because I have been thinking I need to learn it in the correct way. (like ordinary music theory).

 

[Horsegirl]

I play the saxophone. I have always had difficulty with this... my band teacher embarrassed me in front of the whole class for it. I always have to write the names of the notes above them before I played a piece of music. I also can't tell notes apart from what they sound like. It's very annoying for me

 

[Echo]

Wow! So.... Maybe I have learned the wrong way- for me? Did you have to be conscious of this to just play what you hear/see? I have had experiments were I write down what the different sounds "look" like, but I have stopped because I have been thinking I need to learn it in the correct way. (like ordinary music theory).

I'm actually primarily a vocalist, although I used to play/compose piano by ear. I have "relative pitch," likely due to my synethesia. I tell myself I need to have a more solid relationship to theory, but every time I try, it's like attempting to automate that which comes naturally.... and all the magic goes out of the music for me.
Of course you're at a much higher level of proficiency already, so I assume your mastery of theory is well above mine. If I were to hazard a guess, though, I'd say to trust your synethetic and intuitive feeling about those intervals and you might just find you "know" exactly what they are.

 

[Merete]

I'm actually primarily a vocalist, although I used to play/compose piano by ear. I have "relative pitch," likely due to my synethesia. I tell myself I need to have a more solid relationship to theory, but every time I try, it's like attempting to automate that which comes naturally.... and all the magic goes out of the music for me.
Of course you're at a much higher level of proficiency already, so I assume your mastery of theory is well above mine. If I were to hazard a guess, though, I'd say to trust your synethetic and intuitive feeling about those intervals and you might find you "know" exactly what they are.

Yes, I think you are absolutely right. I need to trust what comes naturally for me. I will start experimenting and dwelling into that- instead of being confused by trying to making sense of the music theory (you know like: "sing a minor third, 5th, major 7th.... and so on... In Norwegian we have an even more confusing way of saying this").
Thank you so much Echo!

 

[Aeolienne]

I have always had difficulty identifying/naming notes. And it's so embarrassing! When I went to music school, my teachers were horrified of my poor skills in identifying intervals, chords and so on... I am a high level pianist (both jazz and classical) and am composing in-the-moment. SO.... WHY do I have that problem?
One teacher said I should quit music school, and take private lessons for it. That was just awful. And I have done a lot of ear training. A LOT. It just doesn't work. So after I got my diagnosis for ASD, I wondered: Is that maybe some traits of my ASD? Before I got my diagnosis, I just kept it for myself - trying to hide it as good as I could. My analysis was that I hade a different pathway from my auditory to (maybe language) area in my brain... heheh. Maybe it is so?
People on the spectrum have these "genius" musicians who had perfect pitch. Sometimes I feel I have perfect pitch, because I feel I see the notes like pictures in my head - and just know what they are. BUT - I can never NAME them... I can never do this when I am a little bit anxious, or trying to prove myself or others what I "think" (maybe) I can do.

I just wonder - are there any other musicians that feel like they have the same issue? (normal people usually cannot name an interval when they hear it - or a chord - but trained musicians should maybe have the skill when learned...It shouldn't be that hard....) I MEAN - EVERYONE IN MY CLASS COULD DO IT!!!!! It is embarrassing for me to explain to fellow musicians my problem - because I feel they do not understand. And they think I am just stupid or not talented at all.

By the way--- I feel that D is light blue, E is red, F is green, G is green, A is yellow, B is pink, C i dark blue. But I do not see the colours like those with synaesthesia- in front of me. Only in my head.

As a recorder player, I can recognise all notes on the stave (or at least work them out - I'm a bit slower with alto and tenor clefs ). I've learnt to recognise intervals by a series of mnemonics (e.g. opening bars of Chariots of Fire theme for perfect fifths) which was enough to get me through all the exams up to Grade VIII, but what I'm utterly unable to do is sight-sing. This surprises people who assume that as I'm into early music I should enjoy choral singing. Even more people say "Oh, I'm sure you could find a choir that doesn't require you to sight-sing" and I'm sure I could, but that's not the point. My attitude towards choirs is like Groucho Marx's towards clubs - I would only want to join the kind of choir that would attempt Spem in alium, no less.

I have been told that it is possible to learn to sight-sing via the Kodaly method of music tuition. There have been various posts about this on the ABRSM forums.

 

[the_tortoise]

SO.... WHY do I have that problem?

I don't know but I have a similar problem.

I went for my first piano lesson three years after I started playing....I confused the heck out of the teacher because he could set down a piece of music at about grade five level and I'd play it fine, but I couldn't name the bass clef notes (I could name treble clef notes before I started playing the piano). He kept naming them for me and it wouldn't stick. He was so frustrated by the end of the lesson, and we were both so confused (me about his reaction and what was going on, him about what was wrong with me, probably)...I just never went back. Decided music lessons weren't for me, if they were that horrible and I was that hopeless.

For the first ten years I played I was aware of the word "key" but didn't know what it meant....when a friend suggested we play together (improvise) and asked me what key I wanted to play in I asked them what a key was and, well....they were extremely confused. It took an hour of mounting frustration and bafflement and the (ultimately useless) retrieval of their old introductory music theory books before I finally asked if my friend could show me what they meant, and voila, problem solved (and I learned a new music word, haha).

For me, I think it's just part of not being a language-based thinker....for some, music is easily learned without learning the names of/words for anything you see or do or form concepts about, particularly if you are self-taught. I think that for some people (like me) the best (or only) way to learn by-passes language altogether.