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Existentialism

Discussion in 'Religion' started by Voltaic, Mar 8, 2018.

  1. Voltaic

    Voltaic Most likely a real person V.I.P Member

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    there are to many unknowns in this world. the thing with sticking to science is that we as humans simply do not know everything. most times the most important questions are left unanswered. yes, thier could be a god, because a god is beyond our understanding, we simply do not know enough to say that there is or is not a God.

    what is saying though, that there is a god like explination to this world that we simply do not know about? explanation to this world that is beyond what science can fathom.

    when even our understanding of the reality as we see it is broken down by mathmatics, and relativity. where what we know about this world tells us we shouldnt experiance it the way we do. where this world described by mathematics very different world in the world described by our eyes ears and other senses.

    we simply do not know enough about this world to make an accurate assumption on what the reality itself is real or not. this world can be very different place based on person to person. when we were first designing a guy systems to interpret information from the world, we realize that there’s an infinite amount of ways to experience and to compute reality.

    schizophrenic might hear voices, we see things that are not real in optical illusions. we can hear, see, feel, taste, things that are not real. the only ways we precive the world are not even reliable.



    what is saying that reality itself is not real? this world could be a simulation or some messed up guys play through of Sims. we know what we know and we know what we do not know. what we do not know could be something we do not want to know

    it does not matter if reality is real or not, it is still the world i live in. years of depresion has reduced me to a state that i question even the exsistence of others. all i know is that my mind is real, everything else can be fake. this world is confusing, so many questions left unknown. a world where evrything interacts in perfect mathmatical harmony, then there is life. this world as we know it should not exsist, i should not exsist, but i do. my exsistense was based on an infinite amount of things happening at the right time, in the right way, and in the right order. an infintecimaly small chance. yet i am here.

    i look to the skies and i see stars, and i look at the ground and i see trees. this world should not exsist, this universe should not exsit.

    does it?
     
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2018
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  2. Fridgemagnetman

    Fridgemagnetman I only have one V.I.P Member

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    Yes.
     
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  3. interim

    interim New Member

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    There was a very import question in the Matrix movie:

    "Have you ever had a dream, Neo, that you were so sure was real? What if you were unable to wake from that dream? How would you know the difference between the dream world and the real world?"

    In other words - if this is a simulation, like a program running on your computer, and you are playing an entity in that computer, as part of the program, how you can prove if there is anything beyond that program? It's a fundamental question, and the answer is - you can't. Anything that you do in the simulation, can only be part of this simulation, so there is no way to really know what is beyond it. This is why science will never really "prove" things like soul, or god, truth, these are metaphysical concepts. Surprising or not, this was stated by Kant 250 years ago, and people still don't get it. His idea to extend our understanding was to first understand how our mind is designed to work, like investigating concepts like space, time, math, causality. But there are also other factors to consider. For example - you can't know whether the world is a simulation, but can you know if you are just a simulation (i.e. the materialistic view, that you are just a machine). Do you exist outside the simulation? This is a question that can be answered. If you can perceive yourself beyond the simulation (i.e. - wake up), this is the only way to prove you exist in a simulation. However, this is not a scientific proof. It's just "remembering" that you are playing in a simulation, like you remember when you play a computer game.
     
  4. Rexi

    Rexi owo uwu owo SlightlyFilterless Atheist Science=<3

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    If youre sure you are real, then all we have is each other. Unless we're all computer programs that keep resetting. And the universe is like an intraweb that allows us to interact. Makes sense if we're a social thing that we're people. We might just be all the same if we all see each about the same dream.

    prove that your brain is real
     
  5. Tom

    Tom Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    Discussions like this just make me need to pee really bad.
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2019
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  6. Rexi

    Rexi owo uwu owo SlightlyFilterless Atheist Science=<3

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    Thank God you're not a cow in India. Those aliens really like them.
     
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  7. Clueless in Canada

    Clueless in Canada Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    I haven't got a link to the article but I recall something within the past year that was about proving the world is not a simulation. Of course someone could just say 'how do you know the proof isn't part of the simulation?' I prefer not to be mentally tied in knots so I just don't worry about whether or not the universe is real. I assume it is and I function the best I can within it.
     
  8. Rexi

    Rexi owo uwu owo SlightlyFilterless Atheist Science=<3

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    A sociopath once presented me the idea that, so to say, dragons are real, or as he said, the world does not exist because we can only perceive the world through our own brain perception of sensories, or that it may be a simulation Im a slave to. Needless to say the theory was believable but not too good, and it made my depression and motivation worse.
     
  9. Rexi

    Rexi owo uwu owo SlightlyFilterless Atheist Science=<3

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    If im gonna be unrooted from reality id rather believe in winged ponies and chocolate cows. Just dont bite them too hard. They, too, kick.
     
  10. Gracey

    Gracey Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    Gravity ?

    I’m never ill, or sweat or die in a dream either.
    (I’m not dead in real life ...just saying)

    :)
     
  11. Tesseract

    Tesseract Active Member

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    What you've essentially described here isn't Existentialism, but Phenomenology. Yes, I'm really fussy when it comes to using the correct terminology. As for whether or not our reality is actually fake, a part or the whole of some kind of 'simulation', I would have to say no, that cannot be the case. One simple reason for this rejection of the idea is the fact that all simulations are, by definition, an imprecise recreation of certain conditions present in our reality. They are attempts to take an aspect of that reality, and, given certain initial conditions, see what eventuates. We create them in order to better appreciate our reality from a new angle.

    This being the case, it stands to reason that there would have to be a reality out there somewhere for the simulator(s) to model. There are only two possibilities: their world is the real, original one, or it is not, and they are fake as well. If the former, then we are just one step away from them, and one has to wonder what the purpose of the simulator recreating this particular world, and not others, must be. What makes us so special, so important, so much the subject of so much interest? It seems all too egocentric, too much like the way we used to view the world before the Copernican Principle came along to shift our focus.

    If the latter, and there are many simulators, simulations and reality is lost somewhere among the jumble, then we come across the infinite regression issue. Our world is supposed to be fake, but what about the world of the ones who are simulating us? Are they fake too? How far does this go? Isn't this all rather inelegant? Isn't it just a little too messy to be how things really are? Why so much redundancy? Wouldn't the simpler explanation for our existence be that we are what we think we are (i.e. real)? You know, Ockham's Razor and all of that, which is a useful guide that has worked well enough for us not to ditch it now.

    Then of course there is the - no-so-subtle - issue of the problem of evil. Why do the simulators allow it? If they are powerful enough to prevent it, but choose not to, then they are malevolent, and we should both hate and fear them for doing this to us. If they are not powerful, we have to wonder how competent they are. Either way we should be EXTREMELY worried if this idea turns out to be true. If true, then we are nothing more than puppets, things to play with, an experiment being conducted by someone who is, at best, amoral. He/she/it could turn off the simulation at any moment, create havoc on purpose, torture us just for the fun of it.

    Elon Musk loves this idea. So do many others. In the name of all that is Holy, in God's name WHY?!
     
  12. Tesseract

    Tesseract Active Member

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    When I dream I experience gravity, and it feels exactly the same as in... let's refer to it as 'reality', for the sake of convenience. When you die in a dream you wake up, don't you? I know I do. Just at the moment when it is about to happen, the dream ends.
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2019
  13. Tesseract

    Tesseract Active Member

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    If a character within a simulation ever tried to leave that simulation, he/she would effectively be committing suicide. Any character or entity that exists within a computer game, for example, can only exist within it. For example, if you were playing a first-person shooter, and one of the N.P.C.'s became self-aware and sentient (I know this can't actually happen, this is hypothetical) somehow, attempting an escape would be futile, for reasons that are quite obvious (i.e. he/she isn't real from our perspective, the character is just a small part of a programme running on your computer that is sitting on your desk). All talk about "escaping from the Matrix" is just... well, silly. Being trapped within a fake reality, some kind of "Matrix", would be the ultimate prison, one from which no escape would be possible, for there would be nowhere to escape to.