Do others find your lifestyle and values baffling?

[DuckRabbit]

Just got off the phone with the bank (they phoned me but a mutually agreed phone call). The guy started out brightly enough, with all the well-trained PR accoutrements - every politeness and courtesy in the book, solicitous tone of voice, 'let me tell you our options' etc. I was very interested and eager and open to learning all I could as finance is not an area where I have a natural interest and aptitude. But at some point my lifestyle and values must have formed a larger picture in his mind because he lost interest and palmed me off on one of his junior colleagues at a later date. I realised I'd failed to match up to his expectations, that probably my lifestyle and values don't fit the profile they're after - the things they're used to hooking people with. I just felt the fizz go out of the phone call as chagrin and disillusionment set in on his part.

Have you ever felt that others are perplexed or bewildered by your values and lifestyle? Alternatively, do you get excited when you encounter someone who also isn't lured by the usual trappings?

P.S. This leaves aside the question of whether, if ASC values and lifestyles are indeed different from the mainstream, ASC individuals want them that way or they have no choice.

 

[Bolletje]

Yeah. At job interviews I regularly get negative remarks about how pretty much all of my hobbies are solitary hobbies. This often leads prospective employers to question whether I am able to function in a team. My parents also have question marks about the amount of time I spend alone in my house. My response generally is that I like being by myself, but that that’s not mutually exclusive with being a good team player or with having a fulfilling life.

 

[Wolfnox]

Less so now then it was. Lately ive noticed people mimicing some things i do in everyday life. And mot in a negative way.

 

[DuckRabbit]

Yeah. At job interviews I regularly get negative remarks about how pretty much all of my hobbies are solitary hobbies. This often leads prospective employers to question whether I am able to function in a team. My parents also have question marks about the amount of time I spend alone in my house. My response generally is that I like being by myself, but that that’s not mutually exclusive with being a good team player or with having a fulfilling life.

Yes, hobbies in solitude do tend to make people nervous. Notice how if the hobby involves other people - watching a football game, going to a club, going to the gym, baking or cooking to feed people - they are considered socially acceptable, nary an eyebrow raised. I'm convinced projection is involved in the question-mark placed over 'time spent on one's own'. Perhaps other people cannot handle doing stuff alone or entertaining themselves with their own company, so they project that onto ASC individuals and try to imply there's something wrong with you for being attracted to solitary pursuits. Or they view your affinity for 'time spent alone' as a rejection of them!

 

[Mia]

Recall talking to my bank manager about five years ago, who I like and get along with well. A very gentle, quiet individual. I think there was complete silence for ten minutes in his office, when I mentioned that I didn't wish to make money from investments that damage the planet. So no mining, forestry, petro-chemical investments, among others. It took him a year to come up with an eco-friendly investment plan.

And even then he looked at me at that initial moment as if I was crazy. "They'll be very little return." I don't care, was my reply. In the long run, the results will matter to me. Since that time, I've run into him in restaurants and various places locally. He smiles and whispers, you're doing okay and so are others. So I'm not the only one, who thinks in that way. If he hadn't agreed to do it, I would have done it on my own.

 

[DuckRabbit]

I think there was complete silence for ten minutes in his office, when I mentioned that I didn't wish to make money from investments that damage the planet.

Lol - exactly what I'm talking about. I imagine his brain neurons heating up with a fresh burst of oxygen/blood and rapidly re-wiring themselves in those 10 minutes of bewilderment, much like Bella Swan's in the Twilight stories when she transforms from a human to a vampire. Literally the brain boggling, if not rebooting: 'What have we here? Neither fish nor fowl..."

And you say he was already a quiet, decent individual; imagine how the brains of the more robust, rambunctious NTs would have fizzed and imploded. They might have even guffawed and ridiculed you for your crazy, nonsensical values - as I was sneered at this morning when I responded "Um, no" to the question "And will you be replacing your car in the near future?" The very thought of NOT upgrading your car!

An Asperger of my acquaintance had the following experience with his boss: “Years ago, X was talking to me after Y had asked me to return to [the company]. I told X I enjoyed design work, and was not in it for the money. About eight years later X told me that was not the right thing to say! We were on good terms then, so it was more a comment. But they always paid me less than others of my experience/ age.”

 

[Pats]

I perplex and bewilder even my family that SHOULD know me by now. I'm the type of person who wants to live comfortably and still be able to maybe take a trip or do things. But I tend to look at it differently - instead of trying to find ways to increase my income, I'd rather find ways to lower my living costs. I've never wanted a big house and a fancy car, etc. I'm happiest in a small apartment. Actually, too much makes me really uncomfortable.
My dad collected silver and when he died, everything was split 4 ways. (Oh, he collected silver but lived in an old camper). Well, I did get a vehicle, which I needed (not an expensive one - 2011 Mitsubishi Outlander Sport - manual transmission),was brand new and no payment and didn't hurt my back getting in and out of it . My brother kept finding more and more hidden silver and each time would divide it up. It was making me feel panicky having it, so I finally just divided it up between my kids and gave it to them. (I kept enough to cover my expenses when I die). But my kids were able to use it for down payment on their house, or help start up cost on their business - so it went to good use.
And I own a house, but told my ex that as long as he's living in it, making the payments and keeping it up, it's his to live in. If he should ever decide to move and we sell it, it'll be 50/50 up to a certain amount, than like 70/30 in his favor. My siblings get mad because I won't sell it out from under him, but my kids understand me. My siblings would go on and on that I need that money, but I don't. I have everything I need, anything more is luxury. They don't understand that I just don't want more than I already have.

 

[Mia]

"Um, no" to the question "And will you be replacing your car in the near future?" The very thought of NOT upgrading your car

Funny, I wouldn't either. It works just fine. I have no desire to buy new. When it becomes unreliable or requires a large outlay to repair something major, then I'll reconsider maybe a hybrid or electric car, although I don't think there are many on the used car market. I don't waste money on keeping up with others because I don't care all that much about what others think. Too often consumerism becomes a way of life. As if it holds a value beyond the marketplace and becomes equated with status, a societal construct.

 

[DuckRabbit]

I have everything I need, anything more is luxury. They don't understand that I just don't want more than I already have.

= It is this sort of mentality that's long made me think that ASC individuals are a natural counter-force to climate change - whereas the dominant types on this planet have a mentality of 'More is better' and 'Nothing is ever enough' - what Greta Thunberg called "fairy tales of eternal economic growth". I feel many Aspergers have an added measure of sanity and rationality that acknowledges 'What I have is enough', 'Less is more' and maybe 'Anything more might be at the expense of something/ someone else on this planet'. And some theories accuse ASC individuals of lacking bigger-picture thinking and focusing instead on trivial details!

My theory: Asperger social deficits and/or sensory atypicalities can make them come across as idiotic to insane in face-to-face social interaction situations, but in matters like managing the planet's resources, they far outstrip the dominant types (like the above bank manager etc) in terms of rationality, sanity and wisdom.

Many of the 'more is better' persuasion come across as sane, rational and sagacious in social-interaction situations but are in fact insane, and intellectually and emotionally inferior, when dealing with the planet's resources. Hopefully with climate-change issues becoming more pressing, ecological-environmental values will start to rival social-status values as the main currency on this planet.

 

[SDRSpark]

Just got off the phone with the bank (they phoned me but a mutually agreed phone call). The guy started out brightly enough, with all the well-trained PR accoutrements - every politeness and courtesy in the book, solicitous tone of voice, 'let me tell you our options' etc. I was very interested and eager and open to learning all I could as finance is not an area where I have a natural interest and aptitude. But at some point my lifestyle and values must have formed a larger picture in his mind because he lost interest and palmed me off on one of his junior colleagues at a later date. I realised I'd failed to match up to his expectations, that probably my lifestyle and values don't fit the profile they're after - the things they're used to hooking people with. I just felt the fizz go out of the phone call as chagrin and disillusionment set in on his part.

Have you ever felt that others are perplexed or bewildered by your values and lifestyle? Alternatively, do you get excited when you encounter someone who also isn't lured by the usual trappings?

P.S. This leaves aside the question of whether, if ASC values and lifestyles are indeed different from the mainstream, ASC individuals want them that way or they have no choice.

My first thought...and I could be off base here...is that he didn't find you baffling at all, but rather, he was there to make money off of you in some way, and you didn't fit the profile of a monetarily valuable customer. He passed you off to a junior colleague in order to move on to other calls in hopes of making a bigger sale.

I doubt it had anything whatsoever to do with you personally. He just realized that your lifestyle and values didn't line up with him (or the bank) making a lot of money.

 

[Judge]

Banks are not looking after your financial interest, but only their own. Seeking more ways of making money off your principal. Regardless of how your lifestyle is or isn't perceived.

These sort of inquiries were just the tip of the iceberg that landed Wells Fargo Bank into so much trouble with the government. Creatively thinking of ways to create new accounts that generated profits for them- not you.

Of course these days such inquiries may not even be coming from your bank, but rather some criminal scammer attempting identity theft. Be very careful over unsolicited phone calls from alleged financial institutions. Especially if they ask for all those forms of identifying your particular account that they should already have on record.

 

[Pats]

= It is this sort of mentality that's long made me think that ASC individuals are a natural counter-force to climate change - whereas the dominant types on this planet have a mentality of 'More is better' and 'Nothing is ever enough' - what Greta Thunberg called "fairy tales of eternal economic growth". I feel many Aspergers have an added measure of sanity and rationality that acknowledges 'What I have is enough', 'Less is more' and maybe 'Anything more might be at the expense of something/ someone else on this planet'. And some theories accuse ASC individuals of lacking bigger-picture thinking and focusing instead on trivial details!

My theory: Asperger social deficits and/or sensory atypicalities can make them come across as idiotic to insane in face-to-face social interaction situations, but in matters like managing the planet's resources, they far outstrip the dominant types (like the above bank manager etc) in terms of rationality, sanity and wisdom.

Many of the 'more is better' persuasion come across as sane, rational and sagacious in social-interaction situations but are in fact insane, and intellectually and emotionally inferior, when dealing with the planet's resources. Hopefully with climate-change issues becoming more pressing, ecological-environmental values will start to rival social-status values as the main currency on this planet.

But that's not the reason I have this attitude. lol

 

[Bolletje]

Perhaps other people cannot handle doing stuff alone or entertaining themselves with their own company, so they project that onto ASC individuals and try to imply there's something wrong with you for being attracted to solitary pursuits. Or they view your affinity for 'time spent alone' as a rejection of them!

Exactly! I once had an interview for a medical position on a transplant team (basically you're on call for when an organ transplant becomes available and you have to fly by helicopter to retrieve the organ from the donor and deliver it to the OR where a recipient is waiting). In the interview, the surgeon remarked that I wasn't in a sorority and I didn't do teamsports. His conclusion was that I must not have any friends. I told him I was perfectly capable of making friends on my own without team pursuits. Needlessly to say, I was rejected because he was worried I lacked communication skills due to my lack of social activities.
Which is silly, because my communication skills have always been praised during my years as a med student and now as a doctor as well.

 

[oregano]

I've always been a rather ascetic/monastic type. I collected old tube radios in HS and had my bedroom filled with junk that just sat there and rotted because my bedroom was my only sanctuary from rejection, and I hated to change it. After I moved out of the house I eventually got rid of all the junk. When I lived in apartments during college I always shied away from the fancy buildings with swimming pools and fitness rooms and blah, preferring smaller, older buildings with small apartments.

Today I have very little stuff. Over the last couple years as fires have ripped through California I've been pondering what exactly I would take if I had to flee my house and never be able to return except to a pile of ashes. I keep all my personal files on a USB thumb drive because I wouldn't be able to take my laptop with me. I would take a radio so I could be the guy in the shelter who actually knows what is really going on. And of course a box of important documents.

NT's don't seem to realize that they really don't need all the stuff that they think gives their lives meaning but really doesn't. As for climate change, I fully expect the poop to hit the fan in 10 years or so and am planning on living a self-sufficient hermit existence.

 

[Progster]

Possibly they do. I think some people find it strange that I didn't want kids, or that I don't spend much money on clothes or makeup or fashion items, but instead buy things like CDs and records, or that I'm not interested in popular music or TV shows or cooking or the other pop culture things that most people are into, that I do my own things that I like to do and because it is differerent from the majority of people, some people say that it's weird. Also, I'm a tomboy and don't dress or act like most women my age, I don't have a handbag (don't need one), don't wear makeup, etc.

 

[DuckRabbit]

My first thought...and I could be off base here...is that he didn't find you baffling at all, but rather, he was there to make money off of you in some way, and you didn't fit the profile of a monetarily valuable customer. He passed you off to a junior colleague in order to move on to other calls in hopes of making a bigger sale.

I doubt it had anything whatsoever to do with you personally. He just realized that your lifestyle and values didn't line up with him (or the bank) making a lot of money.

Agreed. I wasn't responding to his 'hooks': why wait till retirement age to retire? why not update your car? get a mortgage? etc - all the things he earns commission on. And I have no doubt he raised each one with me in descending order of commission-size for him. As he saw his commission dwindling, he went emotionally flat. I was transferred from the 'business' pile to the hopeless 'small fry' pile and he palmed me off on some junior colleague with a political lie that that was normal procedure - whereas he'd JUST SAID he'd go through all the options with me now; that was the point of the scheduled phone call. When I said "But I thought we were doing that now?", he wheeled out his palming-off, 'normal-procedure' lie.

My 'personality' or rather lifestyle and values, he soon came to see, were one and the same as 'bad news for him' - he saw he was wasting his time. Not because I was being difficult or resistant and rebuffing him but because my lifestyle and values just weren't conforming to what he was expecting or is used to. Hence baffling. 'Character is destiny' - so one's personality is inextricably wrapped up in one's lifestyle and values. I could take it personally or not personally at all. He was hoping to catch a nice fresh fish and reeled in a rusty tin can instead. His chagrin and disillusionment were palpable. He could not get off the phone fast enough - all their well-bred PR tactics shrivelling up before my eyes.

 

[DuckRabbit]

But that's not the reason I have this attitude. lol

I'm not actually assuming that you do. Whatever the reason, my theory is that 'eco-benefit' is a possible by-product of this attitude. I'm not assuming ASC individuals are necessarily more moral or ethical than other individuals, just that as a result of their hard-wiring - which bestows certain patterns of constraint and opportunity in their lifestyles and values - there may be a beneficial outcome for the planet i.e., 'I have enough', 'I don't need more' or 'I'm not pursuing social status through material consumption' is surely aligned with conserving planetary resources. Similarly, I'd argue that the NT brain is configured to bestow advantage in social situations. My assumption is that ASC hardwiring is not conducive to the pursuit of social status (however much ASC individuals may want to pursue social status), and that may give rise to the sort of lifestyle and values that you and others in this thread have described. Whether intentionally or not.

Do you have a reason for this attitude then? Or is it just unconscious? I'd be interested to know your thoughts.

 

[Streetwise]

Just got off the phone with the bank (they phoned me but a mutually agreed phone call). The guy started out brightly enough, with all the well-trained PR accoutrements - every politeness and courtesy in the book, solicitous tone of voice, 'let me tell you our options' etc. I was very interested and eager and open to learning all I could as finance is not an area where I have a natural interest and aptitude. But at some point my lifestyle and values must have formed a larger picture in his mind because he lost interest and palmed me off on one of his junior colleagues at a later date. I realised I'd failed to match up to his expectations, that probably my lifestyle and values don't fit the profile they're after - the things they're used to hooking people with. I just felt the fizz go out of the phone call as chagrin and disillusionment set in on his part.

Have you ever felt that others are perplexed or bewildered by your values and lifestyle? Alternatively, do you get excited when you encounter someone who also isn't lured by the usual trappings?

P.S. This leaves aside the question of whether, if ASC values and lifestyles are indeed different from the mainstream, ASC individuals want them that way or they have no choice.

no straight out hatred

 

[DuckRabbit]

Exactly! I once had an interview for a medical position on a transplant team (basically you're on call for when an organ transplant becomes available and you have to fly by helicopter to retrieve the organ from the donor and deliver it to the OR where a recipient is waiting). In the interview, the surgeon remarked that I wasn't in a sorority and I didn't do teamsports. His conclusion was that I must not have any friends. I told him I was perfectly capable of making friends on my own without team pursuits. Needlessly to say, I was rejected because he was worried I lacked communication skills due to my lack of social activities.
Which is silly, because my communication skills have always been praised during my years as a med student and now as a doctor as well.

What will it take for people/'society' to move away from such crude stereotyping? As Paul Goodman said: "Few great men would have got past personnel" - due to the neat, simplistic little models that evidently get taught in HR courses.

This stereotyping reminds me of a story I read in the newspaper a few years ago about a woman from Ireland being turned down for a teaching job in some country in East Asia - the reason given to her being "Irish people drink too much". The stereotyping you experienced is practically at that level.

 

[Streetwise]

What will it take for people/'society' to move away from such crude stereotyping? As Paul Goodman said: "Few great men would have got past personnel" - due to the neat, simplistic little models that evidently get taught in HR courses.

This stereotyping reminds me of a story I read in the newspaper a few years ago about a woman from Ireland being turned down for a teaching job in some country in East Asia - the reason given to her being "Irish people drink too much". The stereotyping you experienced is practically at that level.

I think it’s just from the banking world or the medical world I think it’s all humans, i’m sure the reaction I get on this forum is because of stereo typing.