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Featured Catch-22 of Autism ?

Discussion in 'Friends, Family & Social Skills' started by Judge, Mar 12, 2018.

  1. Judge

    Judge Well-Known Member

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    Catch-22. Where you're "damned if you do, damned if you don't". With two considerations of autism:

    Being mind-blind and essentially unaware or indifferent of the feelings or perception of others at most or all times.

    OR

    Being somewhat aware, even remorseful but seldom in real-time when you realize a social indiscretion in whole or in part, but only after the fact.

    It's just something I ponder from time to time, given how broad our traits and behaviors can be, and at different amplitudes. Though personally I find it difficult to really claim which condition is worse than the other. In essence, both can invite perpetual persecution and struggle for us on a daily basis.

    What say you?
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2018
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  2. Fridgemagnetman

    Fridgemagnetman I only have one V.I.P Member

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    Add a vote..

    A or b.
    But would an A know?

    C. Over reading, paranoia...

    Some of my realisations have been 10 years plus in arriving.

    But agreed.
     
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  3. Judge

    Judge Well-Known Member

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    Excellent point. -Item C.

    Where we dwell on what may also amount to be socially insignificant things to the other party involved to a point where it may become toxic to ourselves.
     
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  4. Fridgemagnetman

    Fridgemagnetman I only have one V.I.P Member

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    Leads to even more a difficulty into acting amd responding
     
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  5. Judge

    Judge Well-Known Member

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    I just recall the first time I came into this forum, where I mentioned something about the remorse of social indiscretions, though usually after the fact. Where I think at least two people posted their puzzlement over my remorse itself. At first it made me wonder if I was dealing with sociopaths rather than Aspies. I had to stick around to learn more and come to a different conclusion.

    Made me realize just how broad a spectrum of traits and behaviors this really is. But it did make me wonder if such a mentality is blissful, or fraught with more routine personal attacks from others ?

    Or if later coming to a conclusion you screwed up and stewing about it presents more problems? Where even if you explain yourself it isn't likely to absolve you in the eyes of most Neurotypicals anyways.
     
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  6. Fridgemagnetman

    Fridgemagnetman I only have one V.I.P Member

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    Where ignorance is bliss tis folly to be wise.

    But then, to have discord and not know the source of it.

    How does it affect the learning process a or b?
     
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  7. Progster

    Progster Gone sideways to the sun V.I.P Member

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    I experience both of these, at different times. I'm not very good at picking up on people's moods (so I've been told). I'm often not aware of something a person might be thinking or feeling at the time of speaking, but realise it later after playing back the interaction in my mind and thinking more about the situation to understand something better through the context.

    If I haven't picked up on a person's mood, or haven't understood how they might be feeling, it can leave me feeling very confused when they react in a way I don't expect.
     
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  8. Judge

    Judge Well-Known Member

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    That strikes me as yet another "Catch-22".

    There is likely no real learning process, remorse or rehabilitation if one is "mind blinded" to begin with. Yet even if one has the ability to be remorseful over a social indiscretion, it may involve a thought process or behavior that is "hard-wired". Where they can be conscious of it, yet not be able to refrain from repeating it either. Remorse without resolve.
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2018
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  9. ftfipps

    ftfipps Well-Known Member

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    I have to smoke weed or be drunk in order to not overthink myself into awkwardness or perceived awkwardness.

    Somebody in my family told me once that You don't need a lot of friends or well wishers to be happy.

    I have an extremely good memory so I remember every screw up ive ever done in my whole life. There is one upside to this, I can amend my behavior and not make the same mistakes in the future. My biggest fear is people using me. Sometimes I will do an activity with a person and when I think back on it..I was just being nice but they were using me and I didn't have a clue.
     
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  10. WereBear

    WereBear License to Weird V.I.P Member

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    I studied body language. I listened to voice tones. I studied people’s faces.

    I am better than most at picking up another person’s state of mind. So, can it be learned? Was it a special interest and that is how I can do it so well?
     
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  11. Judge

    Judge Well-Known Member

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    Good question. Though I suspect that's more indicative of your individual neurology.

    Which may reflect that not all our traits and behaviors are contrary to interacting with other human beings. Just as there are extroverts on the spectrum as well.

    Yet another example of just how broad the spectrum of autism can be.
     
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  12. Major Tom

    Major Tom Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    I tend to over read and be paranoid, but I'm working on it. ;) I think being less aware may have its uses, but would make me even more socially awkward.
     
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  13. LucyPurrs

    LucyPurrs NT, INFJ V.I.P Member

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    Hearing this just makes me really sad. It kind of hits hard to understand just how difficult and how painful this issue can be when struggling with it.
     
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  14. MysticEmber

    MysticEmber The Outsider Looking In

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    I tend to over read and get paranoia as well but I do also experience A and B too, and also like WereBear said, I had learned to read peoples facial expressions, body movements, tones of voice and can really read people well at times also... It's a big mixed bag for me and kind of odd but I guess I have been conditioned by the various environments I grew up in; which then caused different sets of reaction in me while interacting with various types of people. I've always been very observant and because of my past traumas, I am extremely hyper vigilant so that would account for me being able to read people at times, but I think depending on how I feel is how I receive the information from others, if that makes sense?
     
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  15. WereBear

    WereBear License to Weird V.I.P Member

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    This is an excellent point and one not nearly as well known as it should be. I keep running across articles where someone with some expertise cites reasons to think Newton or Einstein or pianist Glenn Gould would be on the Spectrum, and sure enough, someone with no special knowledge gets quoted as “Could not be! This person was capable of being a warm and wonderful human being!” Based on a prejudice about autistic people.

    Makes me very irritated indeed. If there is racism and sexism, maybe we should call this neurism.
     
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  16. Suzanne

    Suzanne Well-Known Member V.I.P Member

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    I add a C too, because overthinking and being too aware of things, is extremely disabling and I actually rather be blind to my surroundings, but perhaps if I was, I would rather be not lol :D
     
  17. Hidell

    Hidell New Member

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    I veer violently between the extremes depending on the state and content of my mind at the time of the interraction.
     
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  18. Judge

    Judge Well-Known Member

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    I'm inclined to think many of us do. Yeah, me too. Guilty as charged. :(
     
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  19. tducey

    tducey Well-Known Member

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    I can't tell if people are being sarcastic or not a lot of times.
     
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  20. Gracey

    Gracey Well-Known Member

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    Currently too weary to care.

    Try to avoid people because of that 'too weary to care'

    Too tired to constantly filter and consider and be always mindful and tiptoe around people's feelings using guesswork and listen to voice tones and look for clues in poise or gesture ...walking on eggshells I think is the term.

    I'm damned if I do and I'm damned if I don't.

    I'm digging deep but nope, haven't got the energy to try.

    Avoiding real time social situations, to date has never ended well when too weary.(for me or another)

    Do I feel remorse if I upset someone?
    I'd have to be told I've upset them at the moment. (Like I say, too weary to 'Sherlock')

    If not wanting to add a weeks worth of hassle and explanations and understandings and exchanges of opinion on to my work load, in order to smooth over a comment/ reach an understanding/ agree to disagree is remorse, then yes I feel that.

    If not, no.


    Ask me a question again in a couple of weeks time (in real time) and any answer I may give will probably be more considered.
     
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