About enduring life

[WolfSpirit]

Okay, I can't fall asleep until I say this. Some people's distress here is too much for me not to address tonight.

I'm creating a new thread since I've seen this issue raised in several threads and places, by multiple people. The issue of finding life too difficult and overwhelming to do anything but endure and wish for it to quit.

Tomorrow I'll add to this thread and post more direct and thorough stuff, but for tonight I just wanted to let people experiencing this feeling of being "trapped" into living, know that I hear you, I've been there, I get it, and also, it is possible to find your way out of this feeling and experience. It's hard, and a lot of work (I know, the last thing you want to do is hard work! Life is hard enough as it is), and may take waaay too long to achieve, but it is possible. I've done it.

For those who can't access support services, or find them in the first place, I think many people here can relate to your struggle and frustration. COVID has made things even more difficult than usual in this regard, as many places have restricted services, or hours, or are closed completely. Which is to say nothing of those who are too intimidated by the foreignness and complexity of autism to be taught how to help us. I don't have any answers for that, just empathy and compassion. I've had to fight for all the services I've gotten, and had to do as much teaching as I have received support. Most of the support I've received has been because someone has decided to go out of their way, and outside their job description. I wish I could explain what made them want to do that, but I can't.

Anyways, as I said, more later, but for now just know you've been heard, and you've been understood. There are many people here for you to help you keep taking that next step towards a brighter, better, worthwhile future.

Oh, and you matter.

 

[OkRad]

I should truncate this. I just wanted to say not everyone can dig themselves out for one reason or another...........

 

[WolfSpirit]

I should truncate this. I just wanted to say not everyone can dig themselves out for one reason or another...........

I'm not saying it's easy, by any stretch of the imagination. And it takes a lot of support, that not everyone has. A number of people in my life have commented, and continue to comment on how a large part of the reason my life has worked out as well as it has is because of the efforts I've put into it. While I'll agree that's true, I typically point out that I couldn't have done it without the support I've had. Some people think I'm negating the effort I've put into it when I do that, or at least minimizing it, but really, what I'm doing is recognizing that it has been a team effort. Without the amazing people I've found in my life, and their willingness to be patient with me (incredibly patient, really, in a number of cases), I never would've been able to make the changes I have. In some cases, (on some issues), it's taken years before some of what they were trying to teach me has sunk in. Sometimes not until after the relationship was over. As one friend likes to put it, "it's all about timing".

 

[OkRad]

I'm not saying it's easy, by any stretch of the imagination. And it takes a lot of support, that not everyone has. A number of people in my life have commented, and continue to comment on how a large part of the reason my life has worked out as well as it has is because of the efforts I've put into it. While I'll agree that's true, I typically point out that I couldn't have done it without the support I've had. Some people think I'm negating the effort I've put into it when I do that, or at least minimizing it, but really, what I'm doing is recognizing that it has been a team effort. Without the amazing people I've found in my life, and their willingness to be patient with me (incredibly patient, really, in a number of cases), I never would've been able to make the changes I have. In some cases, (on some issues), it's taken years before some of what they were trying to teach me has sunk in. Sometimes not until after the relationship was over. As one friend likes to put it, "it's all about timing".

Yes. I understand what you are saying, but i just want to point out that many people who are autistic have support and put all the same effort in and still fail. Others don't have support and make it.

Each of us is on our own path and what I have found more often than not is that our paths do not intersect. We are SO unique (you've met one autistic person, you've met one autistic person) that my exciting discoveries are my exciting discoveries. The reason you succeed are the reasons you succeed, etc.

I am only pointing this out because I have met too many people who did everything someone else did (and even more) and still did not make it.

Sadly, suicide is a leading cause of death for autistic people not people they just didn't bump into the right people or make enough of an effort or listen to a successful autistic. They didn't make it because their neuro-cognitive difference are insurmountable. However, because some can surmount them, it is a natural conclusion that they can be surmounted.

Yet, they often cannot be surmounted.

 

[WolfSpirit]

Sorry guys, I thought I'd be able to be more expansive on this topic today, but I couldn't find the files on my computer I wanted, and the rest of the day just hasn't gone to plan. Kinda crashing now, so may not get to it as planned.

 

[WolfSpirit]

Yes. I understand what you are saying, but i just want to point out that many people who are autistic have support and put all the same effort in and still fail. Others don't have support and make it.

Each of us is on our own path and what I have found more often than not is that our paths do not intersect. We are SO unique (you've met one autistic person, you've met one autistic person) that my exciting discoveries are my exciting discoveries. The reason you succeed are the reasons you succeed, etc.

I am only pointing this out because I have met too many people who did everything someone else did (and even more) and still did not make it.

Sadly, suicide is a leading cause of death for autistic people not people they just didn't bump into the right people or make enough of an effort or listen to a successful autistic. They didn't make it because their neuro-cognitive difference are insurmountable. However, because some can surmount them, it is a natural conclusion that they can be surmounted.

Yet, they often cannot be surmounted.

I guess it depends on your definition of 'making it', and 'failing'. You are right that everyone is different, and what is meaningful for one isn't necessarily for another. What works for one won't necessarily work for another either. (and that goes for NTs too.) That's why attention needs to be paid to the individual, rather than a 'one size fits all' model.

But just because we're different doesn't mean our lives necessarily have to be terrible or intolerable, or devoid of happiness or purpose. Being different, or being neurodiverse doesn't mean we automatically have to suffer from depression and other mental health issues. Yes, we are more likely to, and yes, people don't 'get it' often, and yes, it's difficult to be part of a minority and experience discrimination and oppression. All of that is true. And yes, hope can be hard to find under these circumstances. Especially if/when we have a society (or people in our own social circles) telling us we don't have the right to feel the way we feel, or to be disturbed by our difficult experiences. (been there, a lot, it sucks.).

Maybe what I'm trying to say is that those are all the more reasons we need to 'band together', and support each other. And not give up hope. I know it's hard when you're in the depths of depression, and the world seems to be against us, and sometimes these things get the better of us, no matter how hard we try, but it sounds like you've given up hope, and think other people should assume there is none either.

As a former lifelong cynic, I can understand why one would find it easier, or perhaps feel it's 'more realistic' to look at the downside of things, or to not hope too much, even to find it oppressive to have other people pushing hope or positivity on you. But I think the minute we give up hope is when life truly becomes impossible to bear. (though I read something in a book recently that says no matter how distant hope seems, it is always there to some degree as long as we have a pulse. so...)

I should also comment that there is no shame or disgrace in fighting as hard as one can against mental health issues and losing. It's a hard fight, and takes an incredible amount out of you. Some people succumb through no fault of their own.

As for the issue of 'surmounting' one's differences. IMO, our differences aren't meant to be 'surmounted', but our difficulties can be - some of the time, anyways. Expecting ourselves not to have the difficulties we have, at all, is unrealistic and a source of despair and a form of 'setting ourselves up for failure'. Holding ourselves to NT standards or expectations is a form of self-destructive behaviour. It can absolutely be hard to accept some of our differences, especially when they cause difficulty for us to do the things we want to do, but there is a big difference between fighting our difficulties, and fighting our differences.

I'm reminded of a quote from Jim Sinclair "the more deeply invested an autistic person is in being normal, the more likely it is that he or she suffers from anxiety, depression, and low self-esteem. It's a natural consequence of making one's top priority to become something other than oneself." (From xyr article "What Being Different Means".

I don't mean to contradict your experiences, or to argue with you, but I do argue with the notion you seem to be expressing that there is no hope for some members of our community, simply because of the nature, and extent of their differences.

 

[Raggamuffin]

I think a lot of people survive as opposed to thrive.

Ed

 

[OkRad]

Neuro-diversity is not a bad thing. It's the co-morbidities that often go along with it that destroys people.

There are many on here who succeed most gloriously. It is those who have dealt with homelessness, living in unstable, dangerous, or exhausting places with no alternatives, those who have attempted or have actually committed suicide.......

There is a substantial number who struggle beyond their NT counterparts -and they need to be acknowledged.

 

[SimonSays]

Acting out of anxiety.

I know how important it is to act out of excitement. Go towards what feels right rather than away from what is wrong. But I can’t seem to do it. I have been dealing with this for quite a while now.


Some of it comes out of the way the world is right now, and some of it is me. Choices I wanted to make are not available to me. I feel powerless and sometimes hopeless.


As the time came to leave my home all I could do was find a place to stay. I was about to experience homelessnes and for a moment, the street made more sense as it seemed less complicated somehow. But I found a bed at a hostel. It wasn’t easy to be there but it was somewhere. Go from there. I was there nearly 2 months, but I knew I had to find something better. I struggled. I looked for rooms in houses, sharing seemed the answer. Tried and tried. Contacted this one and that. Constantly under pressure to do it, constantly feeling overwhelmed by it all. Finally found something I knew wasn’t right but again the thought of it being another step. I had to take it. Better than before in many ways, far worse in others.


My choices are all anxiety driven. I’m not happy. Can’t choose what I could have chosen just this time last year. Have to accept it. Try not to dwell on it. Can’t help it though. It could be worse, a lot worse. I saw people on the street near the hostel. So difficult to see them there. There by the grace go I.


And yet all this has taken its toll, all this stress and anxiety. I am maintaining. Coping. Day by day. Sometimes hour by hour. I need a break.


Been waiting to hear back from mental health services, 3 weeks to receive a phone call is a long time. Because I’m living somewhere else, this matters more to them than helping me. More pressure.


I’m trying not to be all ‘doom and gloom’. I know things pass. Everything does. But the pressure keeps returning and I am not sure how to keep going with the little left in me. I don’t want to be here. I don’t want this hostile world. Yet here I am.


I will get my laptop back tomorrow so writing on my phone will finally be over. That should help. More possibilities to be creative. Easier to watch things. The journey to collect it will take 6 hours there and back. 4 of those are walking. Good exercise. A cold sunny day. The last of them for a while. Nice to be out with the sun in my face. Return to the past. Stay a while. It is something I can do. Motion brings balance.

 

[SimonSays]

I understand the law of attraction. I know if I focus on what I don’t want, I bring more of what I don’t want. But I am so aware of what isn’t right for me. It hurts. It overwhelms thoughts of change that might make me feel better, at peace, and yet I keep getting caught in those thoughts of resistance. I have brought all this to me. I need something to do. To give, to serve. Everything is closed. Can’t volunteer. Nothing accepting. So I dwell on me. Round and round. Accept it. Change it. Accept it. Change it. I want to accept it. I need to change it. It is what it is.

 

[WolfSpirit]

I think a lot of people survive as opposed to thrive.

Ed

Yes. And it doesn't matter whether you're NT or ND, or disabled in another fashion, or not. Especially as society tends to be so competitive, and ignores mental health. (in fact suggest everybody ignore their own too.) It's only recently that society has started to get a clue on that concept.

 

[WolfSpirit]

Neuro-diversity is not a bad thing. It's the co-morbidities that often go along with it that destroys people.

There are many on here who succeed most gloriously. It is those who have dealt with homelessness, living in unstable, dangerous, or exhausting places with no alternatives, those who have attempted or have actually committed suicide.......

There is a substantial number who struggle beyond their NT counterparts -and they need to be acknowledged.

I certainly wasn't trying to say otherwise, and I don't think I've seen anybody on this site who has. (though granted, it's a very large site, so I may have missed something.) It seems like a very friendly, compassionate group. I was simply trying to let those people who feel that they're caught in an endless loop of nothingness or meaninglessness know that they're not the only ones who've experienced this, and that there are others on here who can relate, and offer support and perhaps some wisdom or knowledge based on their own experiences, that can help one 'hold on', and/or take that next step to making life less crappy, if it's wanted. I wasn't trying to promise anything, or be overly optimistic or anything, simply 'reaching out'. Trying to provide a little hope.

 

[WolfSpirit]

Acting out of anxiety.

I know how important it is to act out of excitement. Go towards what feels right rather than away from what is wrong. But I can’t seem to do it. I have been dealing with this for quite a while now.


Some of it comes out of the way the world is right now, and some of it is me. Choices I wanted to make are not available to me. I feel powerless and sometimes hopeless.


As the time came to leave my home all I could do was find a place to stay. I was about to experience homelessnes and for a moment, the street made more sense as it seemed less complicated somehow. But I found a bed at a hostel. It wasn’t easy to be there but it was somewhere. Go from there. I was there nearly 2 months, but I knew I had to find something better. I struggled. I looked for rooms in houses, sharing seemed the answer. Tried and tried. Contacted this one and that. Constantly under pressure to do it, constantly feeling overwhelmed by it all. Finally found something I knew wasn’t right but again the thought of it being another step. I had to take it. Better than before in many ways, far worse in others.


My choices are all anxiety driven. I’m not happy. Can’t choose what I could have chosen just this time last year. Have to accept it. Try not to dwell on it. Can’t help it though. It could be worse, a lot worse. I saw people on the street near the hostel. So difficult to see them there. There by the grace go I.


And yet all this has taken its toll, all this stress and anxiety. I am maintaining. Coping. Day by day. Sometimes hour by hour. I need a break.


Been waiting to hear back from mental health services, 3 weeks to receive a phone call is a long time. Because I’m living somewhere else, this matters more to them than helping me. More pressure.


I’m trying not to be all ‘doom and gloom’. I know things pass. Everything does. But the pressure keeps returning and I am not sure how to keep going with the little left in me. I don’t want to be here. I don’t want this hostile world. Yet here I am.


I will get my laptop back tomorrow so writing on my phone will finally be over. That should help. More possibilities to be creative. Easier to watch things. The journey to collect it will take 6 hours there and back. 4 of those are walking. Good exercise. A cold sunny day. The last of them for a while. Nice to be out with the sun in my face. Return to the past. Stay a while. It is something I can do. Motion brings balance.

You have my compassion for all you're going through. You're right, things have changed a lot since last year at this time, and things are more difficult for many people. Still, you're right, one step forward at a time. Gratitude helps. (though it's damned hard to be grateful when life sucks hard!) If you keep making that next step 'up', then who knows where you might find yourself eventually, without even realizing it. An you're right, the kind of pressure you're under does take a lot out of a person. And sometimes it feels never ending. In such times we need to hold on to whatever hope and whatever bits of joy or happiness we can find, no matter how small.

And as much as we all want to go towards what feels right instead of just away from the bad, going away from the bad is a first step. I've had periods of time where I've forgotten that it's possible to avoid bad things, or make them stop. Growing up, there were so many bad things I couldn't avoid or was forced to endure, past my tolerance level... Recognizing that we have some power in our lives to make bad things stop is important. (even if we can't make them all stop, or stop as soon as we'd like.) Even if the only choice we have is in how we perceive a situation. Love that part of existentialism!

Keep reaching out for whatever support you can find. It might not feel like it's working, or is sufficient, but if you hang in there, life may just surprise you in a good way.

 

[Wolfsage]

You endure life by understanding yourself. Your strengths and limitations. That determines a lot.

 

[WolfSpirit]

You endure life by understanding yourself. Your strengths and limitations. That determines a lot.

Agreed. I would even go so far that it's also a key factor in thriving. (Not the only one, by far, but an important one.)

 

[N2k12]

Okay, I can't fall asleep until I say this. Some people's distress here is too much for me not to address tonight.

I'm creating a new thread since I've seen this issue raised in several threads and places, by multiple people. The issue of finding life too difficult and overwhelming to do anything but endure and wish for it to quit.

Tomorrow I'll add to this thread and post more direct and thorough stuff, but for tonight I just wanted to let people experiencing this feeling of being "trapped" into living, know that I hear you, I've been there, I get it, and also, it is possible to find your way out of this feeling and experience. It's hard, and a lot of work (I know, the last thing you want to do is hard work! Life is hard enough as it is), and may take waaay too long to achieve, but it is possible. I've done it.

For those who can't access support services, or find them in the first place, I think many people here can relate to your struggle and frustration. COVID has made things even more difficult than usual in this regard, as many places have restricted services, or hours, or are closed completely. Which is to say nothing of those who are too intimidated by the foreignness and complexity of autism to be taught how to help us. I don't have any answers for that, just empathy and compassion. I've had to fight for all the services I've gotten, and had to do as much teaching as I have received support. Most of the support I've received has been because someone has decided to go out of their way, and outside their job description. I wish I could explain what made them want to do that, but I can't.

Anyways, as I said, more later, but for now just know you've been heard, and you've been understood. There are many people here for you to help you keep taking that next step towards a brighter, better, worthwhile future.

Oh, and you matter.

You seem like a very nice person to be honest. Allot of what you say makes perfect sense

 

[OkRad]

I certainly wasn't trying to say otherwise, and I don't think I've seen anybody on this site who has. (though granted, it's a very large site, so I may have missed something.) It seems like a very friendly, compassionate group. I was simply trying to let those people who feel that they're caught in an endless loop of nothingness or meaninglessness know that they're not the only ones who've experienced this, and that there are others on here who can relate, and offer support and perhaps some wisdom or knowledge based on their own experiences, that can help one 'hold on', and/or take that next step to making life less crappy, if it's wanted. I wasn't trying to promise anything, or be overly optimistic or anything, simply 'reaching out'. Trying to provide a little hope.

I do understand and your posts are very valuable. I just have a terribly soft and protective spot for those who don't make it.

I had a dear friend kill himself and there was just so much of the idea that he just didn't try hard enough or let go or orient himself into the right theology/philosophy/friends/etc----an endless sea of if not outright blame then a complete lack of understanding or even worse, partial understanding.

I am sure most people on here have lost someone to suicide. It's such a complicated unraveling, probably different for each person. And you never forget how painful it is for everyone involved. And often it can be prevented with the right resources ---but those resources are not a given.

I am sure my sensitivities are partly to blame for my forcefulness on the matter. But I am not meaning to invalidate anything you are saying. Aspie to aspie, our thoughts are often going into the same place but from different and very circuitous routes............